There is one key mid-2010 model that is missing from this comparison:
$1699 dual-core 3.2GHz Core i3
$1899 dual-core 3.6GHz Core i5
$1999 quad-core 2.8GHz Core i5
$2199 quad-core 2.93GHz Core i7
Since the dual-core Core i5 is the one that fits in my budget (with 8 GB RAM), I would be curious to see how that one stacks up.
A person I work with built an i5 rig and says it's awesome. I have a feeling it would be the most practical route for someone who isn't doing process-intensive work on their machine, ya know what I mean?
I used to work on mainframes via a remote teletype timeshare,
Young whippersnappers.
Back in MY day, we had to carry boxes of punch cards around. Our backs got a workout as well as our brains.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SendMe
I'd say that nobody who buys the i7 will have any regrets whatsoever. The first time they want to convert a movie into Apple format to watch on their iPad, they will be amazed at how fast it goes.
I understand that. But what he doesn't take into account is that Mac computers are [often] for normal mom and pop type people, and he assumes that the typical Mac user is some sort of ubergeek who opens up the case.
And mom and pop users who spend money upgrading RAM and HD via Apple are throwing their money away.
I'd say that nobody who buys the i7 will have any regrets whatsoever. The first time they want to convert a movie into Apple format to watch on their iPad, they will be amazed at how fast it goes.
It's only 25% faster than the i5 though, which is $500 cheaper. For example the i7 would take 6 minutes to convert a 20 minute TV show and the dual i5 would take just under 8 minutes. Both machines perform to the point where you won't notice the difference between them outside of raw benchmarking so you are left thinking about the $500 difference, which might have bought that iPad to put movies onto.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SendMe
The dual core is never a better solution. It may be cheaper, but as a solution, it is inferior to the quad core.
We are talking about a 32nm 3.6GHz dual core (boosts to 3.86GHz) vs a 45nm 2.93GHz quad (boosts to 3.33GHz) though. Plus the dual core is hyper-threaded so shows up as 4 processors. The 32nm chips draw less power too so they run cooler.
Once they hit 22nm in 2011 with quads in the low end that hyper-thread to 8 virtual cores, it's game over for the high end models.
Let's say I could buy a low end model and sell it after 2 years or a high end model and sell it after 4 years.
The resale value of the high end model after 4 years is probably comparable to the low end model after 2 years, true. However, if you compare the high end model after 4 years to the low end model after 4 years, you'll still get more. Either comparison is a win, even if the first comparison is more likely.
I always buy the model I want for the intended purpose and after a few years I donate it to a worthy cause like a school. Trying to sell an older computer on Craigslist is just too much effort and risk for the small sum of money gained over the amount of the tax deduction.
I always buy the model I want for the intended purpose and after a few years I donate it to a worthy cause like a school. Trying to sell an older computer on Craigslist is just too much effort and risk for the small sum of money gained over the amount of the tax deduction.
That's OK, too, but it doesn't change things. You'll get a greater tax deduction in the end on the higher end system (or be able to use it longer before giving it up), so you get back at least some of the purchase price difference.
BTW, 'small sum of money' doesn't really apply to Macs. I've sold 4 year old Macs for over $1,000. Realistically, the resale value is so high that it would be impossible to claim a value higher than that, but even if I claimed $1400 or 1500, I still have a lot more in my pocket by selling it. Of course, you may be donating for other reasons than purely economic.
C'mon guys, these look like (or similar to) the same graphs and specs that were in yesterday's report, and there are still faux paux's! There is no mid-2010 2.66 Ghz i5!!!!! Get it right, will ya?
Well, it's good that you argue for "getting it right."
Before my family bought a C64, we had a Vic-20. Beat that.
But actually, the first computer I bought with my own money was a Performa 450 at Sears with my Sears card. The Performa 450 was a 25MHz LCIII minus the FPU sold in a package with an Apple 14" 640x480 monitor, but in a few months I went to Sonnet Technologies (yes, the same one that exists today) and bought the FPU for $19. It had 4MB of Ram, if I recall correctly.
Mine was a TRS80 I think, a computer my dad brought me home from TI.
Thanks for the tip. I agree that removes the risk, but not the effort. When I write code, I earn well over $100 an hour. Fiddling around with photographing, posting something, and then reposting on eBay, answering questions, packaging and shipping, insuring, etc, it doesn't profit me. Thanks for the suggestion though.
well, adding RAM and upgrading the hard drive through the Apple Store is throwing your money away.
Buying RAM through Apple Store: Never never never for anyone who has some tech knowledge
Hard drive through Apple Store in an *iMac*: Everyone should buy the biggest you can afford.Unless you have a couple of hours, two suction cups, and a clean room to keep the dust out from in between the glass and screen when you remove it, disassemble half the computer, and put it back on again.
Upgrading the hard drive in my MacBook Pro or a MacBook is super easy (just somewhat annoyed that you now have to remove 10 or 12 screws to do it, but it's a trade off given the awesome battery). A Mac Pro is insanely easy of course. The (new) mini isn't made for it, but it can be done easily. But an Al-iMac: I wouldn't upgrade the hard drive on it if you paid me, and I've replaced the screen and more on older MacBook Pros (2x) and iBooks (I'm a bit rough with em). Seriously I can't even comprehend someone who would replace their Alu-iMac's LCD screen. Just seems like PAIN! Well that and dust.
Maybe I'd do it four years in the future to put a 8TB drive in, but only then if I had 800 cans of air. =P
I would love to get a new iMac, but how come there's no matte, anti-glare screen? The 1,000+ petitions at the petition site http://macmatte.wordpress.com/comment-page-1/#comments shows there are a substantial percentage - around 20-40% depending on which survey you look at - that need matte screens.
Generally, these are:
- the percentage of the population that is susceptible to eye-strain and migraine headaches from the glossy screen;
- graphic artists
- photographers
- people who use their Macs in bright sun-lit areas
We're not saying matte screens are for everyone -- but there should be a choice.
Also are you sure that the i7, listed with the wrong speed, had 8GB of ram? That is NOT standard. it's a $200 or $400 upgrade depending on being 4 or 2 sticks.
And, the 2.8 Quad is an i5 not an i7... the chart shows i7 2.8Ghz with 8GB ram..
the i5 isn't 2.66Ghz either, as noted in first reply. Is the 2.66Ghz is a typo? Are you sure which i5 is being tested? the Dual core 3.6Ghz with 4MB L3 or the Quad core with 8MB L3?
Says Quad, but as far as typos' go 3.60 would be closer since 2.8 doesn't have a 6 anywhere in the spec.
I don't think any of this chart is legit.
But still no pro work. No pciexptess slot for say audio fx no nvidi card that mops fcp up by adobe premiere with nvidia and adobe working together. The standard is adobe after effects and now unless you build a hac, you can't even get nvidia in the mac pros. The new mac pro is not going to go over well in the studios at all. Terrible. Theyvare so afraid of adobe when Google is who they should worry about. As an IT person I am seeing a lot of Google apps being used. In the studis, it's going to stay avid hard drive bays and mac pros with nvidia cards. Maybe sosomeone will release a pci version with drivers.
The ProSumer, who spend millions, always get the shaft and now Apple is shafting the Pro markets. Unbeliveable.
Hard drive through Apple Store in an *iMac*: Everyone should buy the biggest you can afford.Unless you have a couple of hours, two suction cups, and a clean room to keep the dust out from in between the glass and screen when you remove it, disassemble half the computer, and put it back on again.
Agreed, in part. RAM and a larger HD can always be purchased later, and will likely be cheaper in the future. Processor speed, graphics cards, & bus speed, are all things that you would be stuck with (are not likely upgradeable).
So, I generally go with the Mac that has the best non-user replaceable components I can afford.
A side note... I was at the Apple Store the other day, helping a friend purchase a MacBook Pro. She wanted the 15" model. The salesman tried to talk her down to the 13". Then when she insisted on the 15", he tried to talk her down to the entry level model, when she wanted the mid-range one.
I was first surprised, then kinda annoyed... But I guess the salesman was just trying to save her some money.
Yeah, or they were trying to push a model they actually had in stock....
Comments
There is one key mid-2010 model that is missing from this comparison:
$1699 dual-core 3.2GHz Core i3
$1899 dual-core 3.6GHz Core i5
$1999 quad-core 2.8GHz Core i5
$2199 quad-core 2.93GHz Core i7
Since the dual-core Core i5 is the one that fits in my budget (with 8 GB RAM), I would be curious to see how that one stacks up.
A person I work with built an i5 rig and says it's awesome. I have a feeling it would be the most practical route for someone who isn't doing process-intensive work on their machine, ya know what I mean?
I used to work on mainframes via a remote teletype timeshare,
Young whippersnappers.
Back in MY day, we had to carry boxes of punch cards around. Our backs got a workout as well as our brains.
I'd say that nobody who buys the i7 will have any regrets whatsoever. The first time they want to convert a movie into Apple format to watch on their iPad, they will be amazed at how fast it goes.
QFT.
I understand that. But what he doesn't take into account is that Mac computers are [often] for normal mom and pop type people, and he assumes that the typical Mac user is some sort of ubergeek who opens up the case.
And mom and pop users who spend money upgrading RAM and HD via Apple are throwing their money away.
I'd say that nobody who buys the i7 will have any regrets whatsoever. The first time they want to convert a movie into Apple format to watch on their iPad, they will be amazed at how fast it goes.
It's only 25% faster than the i5 though, which is $500 cheaper. For example the i7 would take 6 minutes to convert a 20 minute TV show and the dual i5 would take just under 8 minutes. Both machines perform to the point where you won't notice the difference between them outside of raw benchmarking so you are left thinking about the $500 difference, which might have bought that iPad to put movies onto.
The dual core is never a better solution. It may be cheaper, but as a solution, it is inferior to the quad core.
We are talking about a 32nm 3.6GHz dual core (boosts to 3.86GHz) vs a 45nm 2.93GHz quad (boosts to 3.33GHz) though. Plus the dual core is hyper-threaded so shows up as 4 processors. The 32nm chips draw less power too so they run cooler.
Once they hit 22nm in 2011 with quads in the low end that hyper-thread to 8 virtual cores, it's game over for the high end models.
I guess it depends on what comparison you make.
Let's say I could buy a low end model and sell it after 2 years or a high end model and sell it after 4 years.
The resale value of the high end model after 4 years is probably comparable to the low end model after 2 years, true. However, if you compare the high end model after 4 years to the low end model after 4 years, you'll still get more. Either comparison is a win, even if the first comparison is more likely.
I always buy the model I want for the intended purpose and after a few years I donate it to a worthy cause like a school. Trying to sell an older computer on Craigslist is just too much effort and risk for the small sum of money gained over the amount of the tax deduction.
I always buy the model I want for the intended purpose and after a few years I donate it to a worthy cause like a school. Trying to sell an older computer on Craigslist is just too much effort and risk for the small sum of money gained over the amount of the tax deduction.
That's OK, too, but it doesn't change things. You'll get a greater tax deduction in the end on the higher end system (or be able to use it longer before giving it up), so you get back at least some of the purchase price difference.
BTW, 'small sum of money' doesn't really apply to Macs. I've sold 4 year old Macs for over $1,000. Realistically, the resale value is so high that it would be impossible to claim a value higher than that, but even if I claimed $1400 or 1500, I still have a lot more in my pocket by selling it. Of course, you may be donating for other reasons than purely economic.
. Of course, you may be donating for other reasons than purely economic.
Not having strangers come to my home or business to inspect and try out the computer, priceless.
C'mon guys, these look like (or similar to) the same graphs and specs that were in yesterday's report, and there are still faux paux's! There is no mid-2010 2.66 Ghz i5!!!!! Get it right, will ya?
Well, it's good that you argue for "getting it right."
It's "faux pas." It means, "false step."
Before my family bought a C64, we had a Vic-20. Beat that.
But actually, the first computer I bought with my own money was a Performa 450 at Sears with my Sears card. The Performa 450 was a 25MHz LCIII minus the FPU sold in a package with an Apple 14" 640x480 monitor, but in a few months I went to Sonnet Technologies (yes, the same one that exists today) and bought the FPU for $19. It had 4MB of Ram, if I recall correctly.
Mine was a TRS80 I think, a computer my dad brought me home from TI.
Mine was a TRS80 I think, a computer my dad brought me home from TI.
Mine was a Franklin Ace
... there are still faux paux's!
If you're going to use a term like "faux pas," it would be a good idea to learn how to spell it first.
It's "faux pas." It means, "false step."
What did you expect of someone from Germany using a French phrase in an English-speaking forum comprised mostly of illiterate Americans?
Not having strangers come to my home or business to inspect and try out the computer, priceless.
mstone, meet eBay. eBay, meet mstone.
mstone, meet eBay. eBay, meet mstone.
Thanks for the tip. I agree that removes the risk, but not the effort. When I write code, I earn well over $100 an hour. Fiddling around with photographing, posting something, and then reposting on eBay, answering questions, packaging and shipping, insuring, etc, it doesn't profit me. Thanks for the suggestion though.
well, adding RAM and upgrading the hard drive through the Apple Store is throwing your money away.
Buying RAM through Apple Store: Never never never for anyone who has some tech knowledge
Hard drive through Apple Store in an *iMac*: Everyone should buy the biggest you can afford. Unless you have a couple of hours, two suction cups, and a clean room to keep the dust out from in between the glass and screen when you remove it, disassemble half the computer, and put it back on again.
Upgrading the hard drive in my MacBook Pro or a MacBook is super easy (just somewhat annoyed that you now have to remove 10 or 12 screws to do it, but it's a trade off given the awesome battery). A Mac Pro is insanely easy of course. The (new) mini isn't made for it, but it can be done easily. But an Al-iMac: I wouldn't upgrade the hard drive on it if you paid me, and I've replaced the screen and more on older MacBook Pros (2x) and iBooks (I'm a bit rough with em). Seriously I can't even comprehend someone who would replace their Alu-iMac's LCD screen. Just seems like PAIN! Well that and dust.
Maybe I'd do it four years in the future to put a 8TB drive in, but only then if I had 800 cans of air. =P
Smacks BF upside the head with 11 watts of cpu crunching muscle that Geekbenchs more than the last quad g5 *smirks* Go Mini!
Generally, these are:
- the percentage of the population that is susceptible to eye-strain and migraine headaches from the glossy screen;
- graphic artists
- photographers
- people who use their Macs in bright sun-lit areas
We're not saying matte screens are for everyone -- but there should be a choice.
If you're in desperate need of a matte screen on your iMac, you might add your petition to the growing list at http://macmatte.wordpress.com/comment-page-1/#comments
Also are you sure that the i7, listed with the wrong speed, had 8GB of ram? That is NOT standard. it's a $200 or $400 upgrade depending on being 4 or 2 sticks.
And, the 2.8 Quad is an i5 not an i7... the chart shows i7 2.8Ghz with 8GB ram..
the i5 isn't 2.66Ghz either, as noted in first reply. Is the 2.66Ghz is a typo? Are you sure which i5 is being tested? the Dual core 3.6Ghz with 4MB L3 or the Quad core with 8MB L3?
Says Quad, but as far as typos' go 3.60 would be closer since 2.8 doesn't have a 6 anywhere in the spec.
I don't think any of this chart is legit.
But still no pro work. No pciexptess slot for say audio fx no nvidi card that mops fcp up by adobe premiere with nvidia and adobe working together. The standard is adobe after effects and now unless you build a hac, you can't even get nvidia in the mac pros. The new mac pro is not going to go over well in the studios at all. Terrible. Theyvare so afraid of adobe when Google is who they should worry about. As an IT person I am seeing a lot of Google apps being used. In the studis, it's going to stay avid hard drive bays and mac pros with nvidia cards. Maybe sosomeone will release a pci version with drivers.
The ProSumer, who spend millions, always get the shaft and now Apple is shafting the Pro markets. Unbeliveable.
Hard drive through Apple Store in an *iMac*: Everyone should buy the biggest you can afford. Unless you have a couple of hours, two suction cups, and a clean room to keep the dust out from in between the glass and screen when you remove it, disassemble half the computer, and put it back on again.
have you done it? it's really not that bad at all
Agreed, in part. RAM and a larger HD can always be purchased later, and will likely be cheaper in the future. Processor speed, graphics cards, & bus speed, are all things that you would be stuck with (are not likely upgradeable).
So, I generally go with the Mac that has the best non-user replaceable components I can afford.
A side note... I was at the Apple Store the other day, helping a friend purchase a MacBook Pro. She wanted the 15" model. The salesman tried to talk her down to the 13". Then when she insisted on the 15", he tried to talk her down to the entry level model, when she wanted the mid-range one.
I was first surprised, then kinda annoyed... But I guess the salesman was just trying to save her some money.
Yeah, or they were trying to push a model they actually had in stock....