Why can't they stack these together and be announcing SSD drives with TB-type sizing?
These are basically just the same tech as in a thumb drive right? What exactly is the innovation here?
Stick them together and get rid of the optical drives for good.
1> You will probably balk at the price. Flash is not cheap at those sizes.
2> SSD != Thumb Drive.
3> This form factor is obviously designed by Apple. It is fully custom. No one introduces this on their own because they're not sure people will use/buy and pay extra.
I picked one of the new MBA's up in PC world at the weekend and was impressed at how neat and tidy they are. However, it felt really fragile in your hands, and if i dare say it, cheap.
Never thought i'd ever say that about an Apple product as i'm a die hard fanman.
I'm sure they are fairly robust but anybody else get the same impressions?
3> This form factor is obviously designed by Apple. It is fully custom. No one introduces this on their own because they're not sure people will use/buy and pay extra.
I don’t think anyone has used an SSD card of the length used in the new MBAs, but the idea is not new, as I stated in my post above. Again, RunCore’s crap SSD cards for cheap notebooks.
I doubt they are fully custom. They look to use a standard mini-PCIe connector. This may seem like a gimmie, but Apple has used connectors that are electrically identical but harwareally* dissimilar in the past. For example, the mini-PCIe-based AirPort Extreme cards from the PowerBook days.
On top of that, Toshiba has already announced these cards to be available on the market without Apple branding but using what looks to be the exact same part numbers. I believe there was some other party who announced such cards to be coming shortly. I would bet it’s only a matter of time before the next run of MBA copycats jump on these cards and we start seeing a great many of these on the market.
The bottom line: Once the need to retain the HDD’s form factor is removed then a new world of possibilities opens up. Same goes for the ODD.
* Yeah, I know it’s not a ‘real’ word.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Underhill
I picked one of the new MBA's up in PC world at the weekend and was impressed at how neat and tidy they are. However, it felt really fragile in your hands, and if i dare say it, cheap.
Never thought i'd ever say that about an Apple product as i'm a die hard fanman.
I'm sure they are fairly robust but anybody else get the same impressions?
I got the opposite impression. The casing was rigid for it’s weight. Even the lid was considerably more rigid feeling now that it’s milled.
I picked one of the new MBA's up in PC world at the weekend and was impressed at how neat and tidy they are. However, it felt really fragile in your hands, and if i dare say it, cheap.
Never thought i'd ever say that about an Apple product as i'm a die hard fanman.
I'm sure they are fairly robust but anybody else get the same impressions?
Really? I had the opposite reaction: I was completely shocked at how durable it felt picking it up, in complete contrasts to how I thought it would be when I first looked at it.
I also would never have considered the 11" version, that is until I first started typing on it.
Really? I had the opposite reaction: I was completely shocked at how durable it felt picking it up, in complete contrasts to how I thought it would be when I first looked at it.
I also would never have considered the 11" version, that is until I first started typing on it.
Thanks for the feedback. I must have big hands
Maybe cheap wasn't the right word. Cheaper feel than say my MBP or iPad. Not cheap as in nasty PC notebook cheap.
Still felt different from usual Apple product. Keyboard perhaps? Still, first impressions count I guess.
I'll have to go back this weekend and have another go. Still very nice bit of kit.
So the 256GB is thicker. It must be double-sided. That presumably answers the question of why it wasn't offered as an option on the 11"
Maybe. Apple often doesn't offer the highest option on lessor machines, but they can take them if third parties make them. It may be possible here. It would be nice, but it might simply be too expensive from Apple's point of view.
It's $200 more for the extra 64GB for the 11.6" model, and $300 more in going from 128 to 256 in the 13".
Maybe. Apple often doesn't offer the highest option on lessor machines, but they can take them if third parties make them. It may be possible here. It would be nice, but it might simply be too expensive from Apple's point of view.
There is some concern whether the slightly thicker 256GB SSD card will fit inside the 11" MBA.
Regardless, it wouldn't be the first time the prudent choice would be to buy the stock Apple MacBook, then do the upgrade yourself.
I don?t think anyone has used an SSD card of the length used in the new MBAs, but the idea is not new, as I stated in my post above. Again, RunCore?s crap SSD cards for cheap notebooks.
I doubt they are fully custom. They look to use a standard mini-PCIe connector. This may seem like a gimmie, but Apple has used connectors that are electrically identical but harwareally* dissimilar in the past. For example, the mini-PCIe-based AirPort Extreme cards from the PowerBook days.
On top of that, Toshiba has already announced these cards to be available on the market without Apple branding but using what looks to be the exact same part numbers. I believe there was some other party who announced such cards to be coming shortly. I would bet it?s only a matter of time before the next run of MBA copycats jump on these cards and we start seeing a great many of these on the market.
I believe that the SSD cards lack the hardware to perform block management and wear leveling found in some SSD's like OWC's. Apple's present OS still does not have TRIM and not sure if it will appear in later 10.6 updates or in Lion (10.7). If Apple adds TRIM hope that they will make it backward compatible with older SSD's that they offered as an option in the ubMBP's.
I believe that the SSD cards lack the hardware to perform block management and wear leveling found in some SSD's like OWC's. Apple's present OS still does not have TRIM and not sure if it will appear in later 10.6 updates or in Lion (10.7). If Apple adds TRIM hope that they will make it backward compatible with older SSD's that they offered as an option in the ubMBP's.
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross
What makes you think that? The Toshiba controller found on these is said to be similar to the Sandforce.
To add what Melgross stated, AnandTech reported that the Toshiba controllers were great in handling garbage collection, which may be why Apple uses them.
PS: In System Profile, these cards show up under Serial-ATA as an ?Apple SSD?.
Maybe. Apple often doesn't offer the highest option on lessor machines, but they can take them if third parties make them. It may be possible here. It would be nice, but it might simply be too expensive from Apple's point of view.
It's $200 more for the extra 64GB for the 11.6" model, and $300 more in going from 128 to 256 in the 13".
Ultimately we'll have to wait and see until someone buys one and tries it.
To add what Melgross stated, AnandTech reported that the Toshiba controllers were great in handling garbage collection, which may be why Apple uses them.
The Toshiba controller Apple picked is good at garbage collection in the absence of TRIM. TRIM would be preferable, but OS X doesn't support it yet.
That may be why Apple is using this Toshiba controller.
Ultimately we'll have to wait and see until someone buys one and tries it.
Of course, unless OWC or some other company offers these. There is one small company from Asia that is supposed to be offering these, but who knows with them?
The Toshiba controller Apple picked is good at garbage collection in the absence of TRIM. TRIM would be preferable, but OS X doesn't support it yet.
That may be why Apple is using this Toshiba controller.
That's the same reason why Sandforces' (expensive) controllers are being used; you don't need TRIM as much (some say not at all). And these drives are pretty fast. Not the fastest, but closer to the fastest than to the slowest.
That's the same reason why Sandforces' (expensive) controllers are being used; you don't need TRIM as much (some say not at all). And these drives are pretty fast. Not the fastest, but closer to the fastest than to the slowest.
I wonder if TRIM really is that important. I?ve been using an Intel X-25 G2 SSD since late April in a machine I use heavily.
I first tested the drive after installation and a fresh build on Mac OS X 10.6.3. I tested it again after 10.6.4 update and it was marginally faster. Certainly no dramatic drop is speed as I keep being told will occur without TRIM.
I have no idea how good the Intel PC29AS21BA0 is in comparison to other SSD controllers, but it seems damn good at keeping my drive zippy.
Comments
Why can't they stack these together and be announcing SSD drives with TB-type sizing?
These are basically just the same tech as in a thumb drive right? What exactly is the innovation here?
Stick them together and get rid of the optical drives for good.
1> You will probably balk at the price. Flash is not cheap at those sizes.
2> SSD != Thumb Drive.
3> This form factor is obviously designed by Apple. It is fully custom. No one introduces this on their own because they're not sure people will use/buy and pay extra.
Never thought i'd ever say that about an Apple product as i'm a die hard fanman.
I'm sure they are fairly robust but anybody else get the same impressions?
3> This form factor is obviously designed by Apple. It is fully custom. No one introduces this on their own because they're not sure people will use/buy and pay extra.
I don’t think anyone has used an SSD card of the length used in the new MBAs, but the idea is not new, as I stated in my post above. Again, RunCore’s crap SSD cards for cheap notebooks.
I doubt they are fully custom. They look to use a standard mini-PCIe connector. This may seem like a gimmie, but Apple has used connectors that are electrically identical but harwareally* dissimilar in the past. For example, the mini-PCIe-based AirPort Extreme cards from the PowerBook days.
On top of that, Toshiba has already announced these cards to be available on the market without Apple branding but using what looks to be the exact same part numbers. I believe there was some other party who announced such cards to be coming shortly. I would bet it’s only a matter of time before the next run of MBA copycats jump on these cards and we start seeing a great many of these on the market.
The bottom line: Once the need to retain the HDD’s form factor is removed then a new world of possibilities opens up. Same goes for the ODD.
* Yeah, I know it’s not a ‘real’ word.
I picked one of the new MBA's up in PC world at the weekend and was impressed at how neat and tidy they are. However, it felt really fragile in your hands, and if i dare say it, cheap.
Never thought i'd ever say that about an Apple product as i'm a die hard fanman.
I'm sure they are fairly robust but anybody else get the same impressions?
I got the opposite impression. The casing was rigid for it’s weight. Even the lid was considerably more rigid feeling now that it’s milled.
I picked one of the new MBA's up in PC world at the weekend and was impressed at how neat and tidy they are. However, it felt really fragile in your hands, and if i dare say it, cheap.
Never thought i'd ever say that about an Apple product as i'm a die hard fanman.
I'm sure they are fairly robust but anybody else get the same impressions?
Really? I had the opposite reaction: I was completely shocked at how durable it felt picking it up, in complete contrasts to how I thought it would be when I first looked at it.
I also would never have considered the 11" version, that is until I first started typing on it.
Really? I had the opposite reaction: I was completely shocked at how durable it felt picking it up, in complete contrasts to how I thought it would be when I first looked at it.
I also would never have considered the 11" version, that is until I first started typing on it.
Thanks for the feedback. I must have big hands
Maybe cheap wasn't the right word. Cheaper feel than say my MBP or iPad. Not cheap as in nasty PC notebook cheap.
Still felt different from usual Apple product. Keyboard perhaps? Still, first impressions count I guess.
I'll have to go back this weekend and have another go. Still very nice bit of kit.
So the 256GB is thicker. It must be double-sided. That presumably answers the question of why it wasn't offered as an option on the 11"
Maybe. Apple often doesn't offer the highest option on lessor machines, but they can take them if third parties make them. It may be possible here. It would be nice, but it might simply be too expensive from Apple's point of view.
It's $200 more for the extra 64GB for the 11.6" model, and $300 more in going from 128 to 256 in the 13".
For those MBA buyers, Monoprice has a USB-A 2.0 to Ethernet adapter for under $5.
For those of us whose employers block social networking sites, here's the direct link:
http://www.monoprice.com/products/product.asp?p_id=6150
Does anyone know for sure if this works with Macs?
Maybe. Apple often doesn't offer the highest option on lessor machines, but they can take them if third parties make them. It may be possible here. It would be nice, but it might simply be too expensive from Apple's point of view.
There is some concern whether the slightly thicker 256GB SSD card will fit inside the 11" MBA.
Regardless, it wouldn't be the first time the prudent choice would be to buy the stock Apple MacBook, then do the upgrade yourself.
I was completely shocked at how durable it felt picking it up ...
I felt the same. All MBPs (13,15,17) feel just as durable. In comparison, the 13" MB feel cheap ... although it used to feel reasonably good before
I felt the same. All MBPs (13,15,17) feel just as durable. In comparison, the 13" MB feel cheap ... although it used to feel reasonably good before
I don?t think anyone has used an SSD card of the length used in the new MBAs, but the idea is not new, as I stated in my post above. Again, RunCore?s crap SSD cards for cheap notebooks.
I doubt they are fully custom. They look to use a standard mini-PCIe connector. This may seem like a gimmie, but Apple has used connectors that are electrically identical but harwareally* dissimilar in the past. For example, the mini-PCIe-based AirPort Extreme cards from the PowerBook days.
On top of that, Toshiba has already announced these cards to be available on the market without Apple branding but using what looks to be the exact same part numbers. I believe there was some other party who announced such cards to be coming shortly. I would bet it?s only a matter of time before the next run of MBA copycats jump on these cards and we start seeing a great many of these on the market.
I believe that the SSD cards lack the hardware to perform block management and wear leveling found in some SSD's like OWC's. Apple's present OS still does not have TRIM and not sure if it will appear in later 10.6 updates or in Lion (10.7). If Apple adds TRIM hope that they will make it backward compatible with older SSD's that they offered as an option in the ubMBP's.
There is some concern whether the slightly thicker 256GB SSD card will fit inside the 11" MBA.
Regardless, it wouldn't be the first time the prudent choice would be to buy the stock Apple MacBook, then do the upgrade yourself.
There's concern from two people posting here, but that doesn't mean it's true. We don't know.
I believe that the SSD cards lack the hardware to perform block management and wear leveling found in some SSD's like OWC's.
What makes you think that? The Toshiba controller found on these is said to be similar to the Sandforce.
I believe that the SSD cards lack the hardware to perform block management and wear leveling found in some SSD's like OWC's. Apple's present OS still does not have TRIM and not sure if it will appear in later 10.6 updates or in Lion (10.7). If Apple adds TRIM hope that they will make it backward compatible with older SSD's that they offered as an option in the ubMBP's.
What makes you think that? The Toshiba controller found on these is said to be similar to the Sandforce.
To add what Melgross stated, AnandTech reported that the Toshiba controllers were great in handling garbage collection, which may be why Apple uses them.
PS: In System Profile, these cards show up under Serial-ATA as an ?Apple SSD?.
Maybe. Apple often doesn't offer the highest option on lessor machines, but they can take them if third parties make them. It may be possible here. It would be nice, but it might simply be too expensive from Apple's point of view.
It's $200 more for the extra 64GB for the 11.6" model, and $300 more in going from 128 to 256 in the 13".
Ultimately we'll have to wait and see until someone buys one and tries it.
To add what Melgross stated, AnandTech reported that the Toshiba controllers were great in handling garbage collection, which may be why Apple uses them.
The Toshiba controller Apple picked is good at garbage collection in the absence of TRIM. TRIM would be preferable, but OS X doesn't support it yet.
That may be why Apple is using this Toshiba controller.
Ultimately we'll have to wait and see until someone buys one and tries it.
Of course, unless OWC or some other company offers these. There is one small company from Asia that is supposed to be offering these, but who knows with them?
The Toshiba controller Apple picked is good at garbage collection in the absence of TRIM. TRIM would be preferable, but OS X doesn't support it yet.
That may be why Apple is using this Toshiba controller.
That's the same reason why Sandforces' (expensive) controllers are being used; you don't need TRIM as much (some say not at all). And these drives are pretty fast. Not the fastest, but closer to the fastest than to the slowest.
That's the same reason why Sandforces' (expensive) controllers are being used; you don't need TRIM as much (some say not at all). And these drives are pretty fast. Not the fastest, but closer to the fastest than to the slowest.
I wonder if TRIM really is that important. I?ve been using an Intel X-25 G2 SSD since late April in a machine I use heavily.
I first tested the drive after installation and a fresh build on Mac OS X 10.6.3. I tested it again after 10.6.4 update and it was marginally faster. Certainly no dramatic drop is speed as I keep being told will occur without TRIM.
I have no idea how good the Intel PC29AS21BA0 is in comparison to other SSD controllers, but it seems damn good at keeping my drive zippy.