I bought the Win 7 phone to replace my iPhone 3GS (which is now relegated to iPod Touch status). Android did not really seem that great; everything seemed so kludgy. The Win 7 OS is NOT in any way kludgy and unless all the naysayers here have taken a few hours to use one, they have no idea what they ate talking about. The hardware (samsung and HTC) is well built, but not up to iPhone 4 standards. I am not worried that it doesn't have all of the features of the iPhone; I walked into the purchase aware if what I was buying and am quite happy.
I bought the Win 7 phone to replace my iPhone 3GS (which is now relegated to iPod Touch status). Android did not really seem that great; everything seemed so kludgy. The Win 7 OS is NOT in any way kludgy and unless all the naysayers here have taken a few hours to use one, they have no idea what they ate talking about. The hardware (samsung and HTC) is well built, but not up to iPhone 4 standards. I am not worried that it doesn't have all of the features of the iPhone; I walked into the purchase aware if what I was buying and am quite happy. My biggest concern is not the phone OS, but Ballmer and the idiotic advertisements currently being run.
Will this phone beat the iPhone? No. Can it carve a good portion of the marketshare for itself? Definitely...IF Microsoft doesn't let Baller screw it up. Let's hope for the best.
Talk about damning with faint praise.
I spend my hard earned cash on a piece of tech, I want to be ecstatic.
Wasn't he talking about profit? As Google don't charge for android, doesn't this mean Microsoft has actually generated more revenue based on the fact they've sold 1.
I've had a wp7 phone since it came out and wouldn't say it is lacking. Aside from copy and paste its hard to think of anything it actually missing. What's more the other day I used my old iPhone and felt in comparison it was like a cheap toy. The smaller screen with everything crammed in made me wonder how I spent so long using it.
Overall competition is great for consumers and with MS and Google fighting it out with profit actually being a low priority we should see phones get better and better.
People DO change about, just to try new things. If you asked all iPhone users are they tired of the interface how many would you think would say yes? A hell of a lot I would imagine.
I often feel like I'm on another planet compared to "People". I bought an iPad the day it was available and think it's brilliant - it does things in a way that simply was not possible before. But all these people that change phones because they are "tired" of rows of icons or "bored" with the iOS interface - what does that actually mean? It implies that even if you designed the 'perfect' interface then after a couple of years it would become familiar and therefore boring and ripe for replacement. Does practicality or fitness for purpose actually come into this?
Imagine that on your stereo that you have a volume knob which you turn to increase or decrease the volume and buttons that you press to select between CD, radio, tape, etc. If you'd had it 3 years, say, would you think "This interface is so tired - I need to replace my stereo with one that has a knob to select between inputs and buttons for the volume." And then in three years time ... When digital HiFi tuners were introduced back in the 80s almost all manufacturers ditched the tuning knob for up/down tuning buttons (because the technology no longer required physical items to be moved inside the equipment to tune the stations) UK based QUAD Electroacoustics however kept the knob when they introduced the FM4 digital tuner because they said that "It was easier to tune a radio using a knob instead of buttons" and as anyone who has tried to use up/down buttons or a knob will know that they were right. A fine example of doing what's right instead of newness and change for its own sake.
Are people actually capable of saying to themselves "This works really well and does the job" or is it simply the sheer weight of tech reviews and advertising that has "People" going "Wow! Look at that (different) new model, I must junk my year old xxx because yyy is, well ... new and different". It's rather like processed food manufacturers that are always adding "New improved recipe" on the packaging - how do they know it's 'Improved'? It is obviously different (fact), but 'Improved' (opinion)? Manufactures have been 'Improving' shampoo to leave your hair silkier, softer, stronger, bouncier, .... for years - I mean you would have thought that after at least 40 years they would have managed to get it right, but no - they still continue to 'Improve' it. The strength, bounciness, silkiness and sheen of our hair now must surely be right off the scale! \
I'm not cheerleading for Apple and saying that their UI is perfect. I'm not saying that Microsoft's is perfect. Or Google's. But the idea that you should replace an iPhone with a Windows phone because its interface is new or different seems to put the cart before the horse. Surely it should be "Is this product actually better for what I need to do or is it simply a different way to do the same thing?". Or is it than most men just can't stop attempting to justify the planned purchase of the latest shiny thing to replace last year's shiny thing?
I often feel like I'm on another planet compared to "People". I bought an iPad the day it was available and think it's brilliant - it does things in a way that simply was not possible before. But all these people that change phones because they are "tired" of rows of icons or "bored" with the iOS interface - what does that actually mean? It implies that even if you designed the 'perfect' interface then after a couple of years it would become familiar and therefore boring and ripe for replacement. Does practicality or fitness for purpose actually come into this?
Practicality and fitness both come into this, up until the point that all the products are perfectly good. After that it's about style and taste. People buy new clothes not because there old ones have worn out, but because there's new ones that they like. We're at the same point with phones, it doesn't matter if you have an Android, WP7 or iPhone device. They all do basically the same thing, there all easy to use and they all have generally the same apps available. The iPhone may have 50 versions of the same app whereas the others have 2, but on all of them there's generally "an app for that".
So people will get board of their phone and change to another just for the sake of it, but there's nothing wrong in that.
WP7 is not going challenge iOS and Android in the app-centered smartphone market - and it's really not designed to (even tho all the pundits want to write their stories that way). Apple and Google will continue to dominate thanks to their huge head start and impressive ecosystems. at best WP7 might achieve Zune-like status with a modest share of this market, 10% or so (compared to the 30+% once held by WinMobile).
but ... there is a much bigger untapped market, which is the 70% of the world's cell phones that are still just featurephones. with its social emphasis, WP7 is a very attractive upgrade product for that market. someday soon, even featurephones will be at least a little "smart."
Nokia is the world's #1 featurephone company, but it is obvious its Symbian OS is fading rapidly. it has been abandoned by all the other OEM's, who are switching to Android or their own home brew OS.
The smart play will be for MS to make a deal with Nokia for new lines of Nokia phones running WP7 that target Nokia's current featurephone buyers. the prices will be low, MS won't get much per phone, and Nokia will require using Ovi, but there is big potential sales volume. this will also allow Nokia to gracefully phase out Symbian over the next couple of years, without the humiliation of switching to Android.
the key to making this deal of course is Elop, who left MS to take over Nokia a few months ago. you can see the handwriting on the wall ...
People buy new clothes not because there old ones have worn out, but because there's new ones that they like.
I buy clothes because the old ones wear out and I'm still using my first gen iPhone. People are dumb with their money...
But, I agree with your point. The cellphone space is a lot more fluid in terms of brand loyalty. By their nature phones need to be able to sync with a variety of sources, and aren't the primary repository of your data. This makes it pretty easy to move from one to the other.
That being said, the real edge that Apple has is their media infrastructure. Once you've bought into the iTunes world, you don't really want to leave. I'd consider something other than an iPhone for my next purchase, but I don't want to deal with some completely different media universe.
I buy clothes because the old ones wear out and I'm still using my first gen iPhone. People are dumb with their money...
But, I agree with your point. The cellphone space is a lot more fluid in terms of brand loyalty. By their nature phones need to be able to sync with a variety of sources, and aren't the primary repository of your data. This makes it pretty easy to move from one to the other.
That being said, the real edge that Apple has is their media infrastructure. Once you've bought into the iTunes world, you don't really want to leave. I'd consider something other than an iPhone for my next purchase, but I don't want to deal with some completely different media universe.
People mention iTunes as a lock in but I disagree. I loved iTunes for years but they ruined it when they removed all the colour from the interface. But more importantly...
1. Your music is in mp3 format, its easy to move to something else.
2. Your apps didn't cost that much. It doesn't matter if you can't use them on your new phone. The iPhone cost you £500 and the apps were most likely between 79p - £5. Just buy them all again on the new platform.
A lot of people don't like change so there is some merrit, but change really isn't that hard.
People mention iTunes as a lock in but I disagree. I loved iTunes for years but they ruined it when they removed all the colour from the interface. But more importantly...
1. Your music is in mp3 format, its easy to move to something else.
2. Your apps didn't cost that much. It doesn't matter if you can't use them on your new phone. The iPhone cost you £500 and the apps were most likely between 79p - £5. Just buy them all again on the new platform.
A lot of people don't like change so there is some merrit, but change really isn't that hard.
I wasn't saying its impossible to move to another media platform, just that it's a headache I'd rather not deal with.
Also, the cost of apps, while relatively small, is not insignificant, especially for a cheapskate like myself. I've spent perhaps $30 on apps total, so tack that onto the new phone's price tag. I'd need to re-search and re-purchase and re-learn all these apps if I switched. That's at least a couple hours of my time. Also, even now not all apps are available for the other platforms. Netflix streaming, for example, is still not available on Android.
Then, there's also the halo of the iPad. I personally don't own one, but if I did I would be more locked into the iPhone because of the ability to share media and apps. Apple has created this very nice synergy between all their products, and are taking it even farther (perhaps too far) with the next rev of Mac OS. Android can't match this. Maybe WP7 will be able to down the road.
That was really my point. Taken as an individual product the iPhone has plausible competition, but if you look at the bigger picture: the way the iPhone fits into the Apple line-up and media empire, no one comes close.
Totally agree with you about the color in the iTunes UI! It's a music app, not a spreadsheet.
Comments
I bought the Win 7 phone to replace my iPhone 3GS (which is now relegated to iPod Touch status). Android did not really seem that great; everything seemed so kludgy. The Win 7 OS is NOT in any way kludgy and unless all the naysayers here have taken a few hours to use one, they have no idea what they ate talking about. The hardware (samsung and HTC) is well built, but not up to iPhone 4 standards. I am not worried that it doesn't have all of the features of the iPhone; I walked into the purchase aware if what I was buying and am quite happy.
The problem being, they're late to a party they already attended earlier; WinMo 6 went home for a while, changed clothes, and came back as WP7.
Maybe they should rename it Windows Immobile.
I bought the Win 7 phone to replace my iPhone 3GS (which is now relegated to iPod Touch status). Android did not really seem that great; everything seemed so kludgy. The Win 7 OS is NOT in any way kludgy and unless all the naysayers here have taken a few hours to use one, they have no idea what they ate talking about. The hardware (samsung and HTC) is well built, but not up to iPhone 4 standards. I am not worried that it doesn't have all of the features of the iPhone; I walked into the purchase aware if what I was buying and am quite happy. My biggest concern is not the phone OS, but Ballmer and the idiotic advertisements currently being run.
Will this phone beat the iPhone? No. Can it carve a good portion of the marketshare for itself? Definitely...IF Microsoft doesn't let Baller screw it up. Let's hope for the best.
Talk about damning with faint praise.
I spend my hard earned cash on a piece of tech, I want to be ecstatic.
Too late for a return?
Walt asks "2 years?" and Joe says "maybe". Dunno, I'm not putting too much validity behind the answer.
To me his absolutel inability to respond is an answer by itself.
Copying apple's strategy could work for them.
Why not, it has for the past 30 years or so.
I've had a wp7 phone since it came out and wouldn't say it is lacking. Aside from copy and paste its hard to think of anything it actually missing. What's more the other day I used my old iPhone and felt in comparison it was like a cheap toy. The smaller screen with everything crammed in made me wonder how I spent so long using it.
Overall competition is great for consumers and with MS and Google fighting it out with profit actually being a low priority we should see phones get better and better.
People DO change about, just to try new things. If you asked all iPhone users are they tired of the interface how many would you think would say yes? A hell of a lot I would imagine.
I often feel like I'm on another planet compared to "People". I bought an iPad the day it was available and think it's brilliant - it does things in a way that simply was not possible before. But all these people that change phones because they are "tired" of rows of icons or "bored" with the iOS interface - what does that actually mean? It implies that even if you designed the 'perfect' interface then after a couple of years it would become familiar and therefore boring and ripe for replacement. Does practicality or fitness for purpose actually come into this?
Imagine that on your stereo that you have a volume knob which you turn to increase or decrease the volume and buttons that you press to select between CD, radio, tape, etc. If you'd had it 3 years, say, would you think "This interface is so tired - I need to replace my stereo with one that has a knob to select between inputs and buttons for the volume." And then in three years time ... When digital HiFi tuners were introduced back in the 80s almost all manufacturers ditched the tuning knob for up/down tuning buttons (because the technology no longer required physical items to be moved inside the equipment to tune the stations) UK based QUAD Electroacoustics however kept the knob when they introduced the FM4 digital tuner because they said that "It was easier to tune a radio using a knob instead of buttons" and as anyone who has tried to use up/down buttons or a knob will know that they were right. A fine example of doing what's right instead of newness and change for its own sake.
Are people actually capable of saying to themselves "This works really well and does the job" or is it simply the sheer weight of tech reviews and advertising that has "People" going "Wow! Look at that (different) new model, I must junk my year old xxx because yyy is, well ... new and different". It's rather like processed food manufacturers that are always adding "New improved recipe" on the packaging - how do they know it's 'Improved'? It is obviously different (fact), but 'Improved' (opinion)? Manufactures have been 'Improving' shampoo to leave your hair silkier, softer, stronger, bouncier, .... for years - I mean you would have thought that after at least 40 years they would have managed to get it right, but no - they still continue to 'Improve' it. The strength, bounciness, silkiness and sheen of our hair now must surely be right off the scale!
I'm not cheerleading for Apple and saying that their UI is perfect. I'm not saying that Microsoft's is perfect. Or Google's. But the idea that you should replace an iPhone with a Windows phone because its interface is new or different seems to put the cart before the horse. Surely it should be "Is this product actually better for what I need to do or is it simply a different way to do the same thing?". Or is it than most men just can't stop attempting to justify the planned purchase of the latest shiny thing to replace last year's shiny thing?
I often feel like I'm on another planet compared to "People". I bought an iPad the day it was available and think it's brilliant - it does things in a way that simply was not possible before. But all these people that change phones because they are "tired" of rows of icons or "bored" with the iOS interface - what does that actually mean? It implies that even if you designed the 'perfect' interface then after a couple of years it would become familiar and therefore boring and ripe for replacement. Does practicality or fitness for purpose actually come into this?
Practicality and fitness both come into this, up until the point that all the products are perfectly good. After that it's about style and taste. People buy new clothes not because there old ones have worn out, but because there's new ones that they like. We're at the same point with phones, it doesn't matter if you have an Android, WP7 or iPhone device. They all do basically the same thing, there all easy to use and they all have generally the same apps available. The iPhone may have 50 versions of the same app whereas the others have 2, but on all of them there's generally "an app for that".
So people will get board of their phone and change to another just for the sake of it, but there's nothing wrong in that.
but ... there is a much bigger untapped market, which is the 70% of the world's cell phones that are still just featurephones. with its social emphasis, WP7 is a very attractive upgrade product for that market. someday soon, even featurephones will be at least a little "smart."
Nokia is the world's #1 featurephone company, but it is obvious its Symbian OS is fading rapidly. it has been abandoned by all the other OEM's, who are switching to Android or their own home brew OS.
The smart play will be for MS to make a deal with Nokia for new lines of Nokia phones running WP7 that target Nokia's current featurephone buyers. the prices will be low, MS won't get much per phone, and Nokia will require using Ovi, but there is big potential sales volume. this will also allow Nokia to gracefully phase out Symbian over the next couple of years, without the humiliation of switching to Android.
the key to making this deal of course is Elop, who left MS to take over Nokia a few months ago. you can see the handwriting on the wall ...
People buy new clothes not because there old ones have worn out, but because there's new ones that they like.
I buy clothes because the old ones wear out and I'm still using my first gen iPhone. People are dumb with their money...
But, I agree with your point. The cellphone space is a lot more fluid in terms of brand loyalty. By their nature phones need to be able to sync with a variety of sources, and aren't the primary repository of your data. This makes it pretty easy to move from one to the other.
That being said, the real edge that Apple has is their media infrastructure. Once you've bought into the iTunes world, you don't really want to leave. I'd consider something other than an iPhone for my next purchase, but I don't want to deal with some completely different media universe.
I buy clothes because the old ones wear out and I'm still using my first gen iPhone. People are dumb with their money...
But, I agree with your point. The cellphone space is a lot more fluid in terms of brand loyalty. By their nature phones need to be able to sync with a variety of sources, and aren't the primary repository of your data. This makes it pretty easy to move from one to the other.
That being said, the real edge that Apple has is their media infrastructure. Once you've bought into the iTunes world, you don't really want to leave. I'd consider something other than an iPhone for my next purchase, but I don't want to deal with some completely different media universe.
People mention iTunes as a lock in but I disagree. I loved iTunes for years but they ruined it when they removed all the colour from the interface. But more importantly...
1. Your music is in mp3 format, its easy to move to something else.
2. Your apps didn't cost that much. It doesn't matter if you can't use them on your new phone. The iPhone cost you £500 and the apps were most likely between 79p - £5. Just buy them all again on the new platform.
A lot of people don't like change so there is some merrit, but change really isn't that hard.
People mention iTunes as a lock in but I disagree. I loved iTunes for years but they ruined it when they removed all the colour from the interface. But more importantly...
1. Your music is in mp3 format, its easy to move to something else.
2. Your apps didn't cost that much. It doesn't matter if you can't use them on your new phone. The iPhone cost you £500 and the apps were most likely between 79p - £5. Just buy them all again on the new platform.
A lot of people don't like change so there is some merrit, but change really isn't that hard.
I wasn't saying its impossible to move to another media platform, just that it's a headache I'd rather not deal with.
Also, the cost of apps, while relatively small, is not insignificant, especially for a cheapskate like myself. I've spent perhaps $30 on apps total, so tack that onto the new phone's price tag. I'd need to re-search and re-purchase and re-learn all these apps if I switched. That's at least a couple hours of my time. Also, even now not all apps are available for the other platforms. Netflix streaming, for example, is still not available on Android.
Then, there's also the halo of the iPad. I personally don't own one, but if I did I would be more locked into the iPhone because of the ability to share media and apps. Apple has created this very nice synergy between all their products, and are taking it even farther (perhaps too far) with the next rev of Mac OS. Android can't match this. Maybe WP7 will be able to down the road.
That was really my point. Taken as an individual product the iPhone has plausible competition, but if you look at the bigger picture: the way the iPhone fits into the Apple line-up and media empire, no one comes close.
Totally agree with you about the color in the iTunes UI! It's a music app, not a spreadsheet.