Since buying a Mac in 2002 I can't remember visiting Apple's download page once for anything other than Dashboard widgets and, more recently, Safari Extensions. Eventually both of those ended up on Versiontracker and MacUpdate though so once again, it's irrelevant.
For me my app search goes something like this: 1) MacUpdate, 2) Versiontracker, 3) Google, 4) IRC or forums to see if such an app even exists for what I'm trying to accomplish, 5) Scour Sourceforge for some UNIX app I can compile and run in OS X, 6) See if a Windows app exists that will run acceptably under WINE.
What's changed is that I'll probably head to the App Store to purchase apps if I already know exactly what I need and the developer doesn't offer a way to purchase it online themselves.
I concur. BTW how are you finding CNET's handling of Version Tracker?
Since there is already a huge market for Mac apps, and they do not all instantly comply to the App Store guidelines, they could be alienating a very large portion of the developer community.
This needs to be a transition.
Do you even know what "Mac OS Download" page is?! It is basically a list of available Mac OS software. It links directly to the downloads file of third party software. I has nothing to do with developing software for Mac. It have no payment system, no hosting.. etc.
I concur. BTW how are you finding CNET's handling of Version Tracker?
(OK, so your comment was not directed to me... oh well... )
I think there are plus and minus of VT transfer.
The transition was badly done -- they kept my pro subscription money I had pre-paid with nothing given in return .
While their current interface of a VersionTracker 'list' that directs to Download.com is functional, there is a lot that Download.com never picked up from VersionTracker.
Missing is: (a) the version history details, which I used to make reference to a lot. (b) meaningful user comments. Yes, a few user comments are there, but all the detailed and in-depth comments that used to be on VT are gone. (then again, some of VT comments were getting spammed... )
Overall, I liked VT better than new VT/Download.com.
Progress forward is not always progress...
But, back to topic at hand.
In general, I am sad to see Apple Downloads disappear.
I have used it regularly over the years, and from the looks of things, a bunch of stuff will just not make the cut or will be dropped.
To the commenter that says in essense - who cares, just use google.
No, it is not the same at all.
The Apple Downloads was a site that I could trust had real, non-spam, non-scam product information. You just cannot say that about the search hit returns on google.
Looks like another some-get-scr____ transition in store...
Apple is basically saying "Give us a 30% cut of your Mac sales or go take a hike."
They're gonna make a bundle on all those free apps, too!
Wait. What?
Developers see some benefits if they sell their applications through the Mac App store:
- They pick the price
- They get 70% of sales revenue
- They Receive payments monthly
- No charge for free apps
- No credit card fees
- No hosting fees
- No marketing fees
You seem to think that it costs developers nothing to handle all the backside stuff themselves, not true.
Since pre-release and demo applications won't be carried in the app store, developers can, and are encouraged to distribute them from their own sites. Some applications (MS Office, etc) don't make sense in the mac app store, and there doesn't seem to be any requirement that if an application is carried in the app store, it can only be carried there.
Paranoia is fun and all, but not so much if you don't actually have enemies.
Exactly. Anyone willing to pay for their own bandwidth, not get creative about their margins, etc. ... stick with what you've got and pay Apple nothing. Everyone else who wants access to millions of users instantly, welcome.
Since there is already a huge market for Mac apps, and they do not all instantly comply to the App Store guidelines, they could be alienating a very large portion of the developer community.
This needs to be a transition.
There's plenty of transition: they told developers weeks ago to get ready to start giving Steve 30% of their income. Who needs more time than that to understand a very simple message?
Exactly. Anyone willing to pay for their own bandwidth, not get creative about their margins, etc. ... stick with what you've got and pay Apple nothing. Everyone else who wants access to millions of users instantly, welcome.
1. By what percentage do you imagine the Mac audience will grow because it has an App Store?
2. When your app is reduced to being one of half a million other records which all share a uniform layout in a database with one of the weakest search engines for actually finding things. exactly how will that do more for you than being able to market creatively and independently with the entire web at your disposal?
3. Will people really buy more software when they're not allowed to get demo versions of it? These aren't 99-cent toys like most of the busy-box gadgets for iOS; many great Mac apps cost $49, $99, $149, and more. No demo. Impulse buy for two hundred bucks? Hardly...
I stopped using the Apple Downloads page a couple of years ago when they redesigned it. It used to just have a flat list of all the new downloads, so you could check every day for new items at a glance.
But then they changed it up big time, all sorts of new categories and oversized icons. All very good looking and a lot less usable. I will not be sorry to see it go.
So what about those users who have a non-intel Mac? I know the number of users is dropping, but there are still a lot of machines around which cannot upgrade to Snow Leopard or above.
They won't be able to have the Mac App Store, and now losing the downloads page.
I good compromised by Apple would be keep the OS X downloads page for PPC versions of software only. There would obviously be the option for Intel users to run Rosetta to run the PPC apps, but I think over time, the convenience of the App Store would prevent this.
How will the App Store deal with Shareware? It will be free to download but users would then buy a license from the software developers website? Would this result in all software becoming shareware?
I can only speak about my own experience, but... I never buy software for my Mac. I'm an average user who uses a MacBook to surf the web, share photos, download media, whatever... but I don't have to buy software to do any of that. I guess I bought Office a while ago when I was in school, but other than that, I don't have a need for anything else.
But I buy LOTS of apps for my iPhone and iPad. LOTS. These are apps I don't really need, but they're so convenient to buy and easy to install, why not?
Do you see where I'm going with this? The real value of the Mac App Store isn't for power users who buy software from developers who wont make the margins to sacrafice 30% other revenue. It's for developers who can view the 30% as a marketing tool and get poor saps like me to notice their stuff.
It doesn't make any sense for Apple to maintain the current Mac OS X software site once the app store opens. Two sites for software is just confusing, which one is one supposed to use?
I also think developers who are worried about the 30% have bigger problems than this site closing. If extra exposure to more users with an easy, reliable, secure way to buy software doesn't improve your sales by more than enough to cover the 30%, you may just be making software with very limited appeal. (Or, you're serving a niche market and probably weren't helped by the current software site.)
... How will the App Store deal with Shareware? It will be free to download but users would then buy a license from the software developers website? Would this result in all software becoming shareware?
No, there won't be any shareware, demos, trials, etc. in the Mac App Store. It's either free or paid. If you want to distribute shareware, you'll need to do it through your own web site. The shareware model has rarely been financially viable anyway. (Yes, there are notable exceptions, but those few didn't succeed because they were shareware.) You're much better off distributing some sort of limited demo from your web site and selling the full version on your own or through the MAS.
I may just stop using Mac for good over this...now apple will control innovation on the mac just like they do on the iphone? no thanks, Steve and co make great hardware and OSes but I dont want them dictating what I can buy and not buy in top of their platform. I know 3rd party non app store apps are still possible, but if an app is not allowed into the store, it will be aleinated and not make enough money to continue, this app store idea on PCs and Macs is going to lead to fracturing, the suburbs of the app store and the indie devs who dont play ball will find themselves in the tech equivalent of the ghetto, all the shops around them closing up, and no new business coming in.
I am concerned because Apple has a nasty reputation of thought policing and banning apps that duplicate OS functionality. These factors are bad news for all.
So what about those users who have a non-intel Mac? I know the number of users is dropping, but there are still a lot of machines around which cannot upgrade to Snow Leopard or above.
They won't be able to have the Mac App Store, and now losing the downloads page.
I good compromised by Apple would be keep the OS X downloads page for PPC versions of software only.
The current downloads page is only links to software on the developers own sites. Apple is not hosting the software, and you can still find the software on MacUpdate.com, Download.com, Google etc.
Comments
Since buying a Mac in 2002 I can't remember visiting Apple's download page once for anything other than Dashboard widgets and, more recently, Safari Extensions. Eventually both of those ended up on Versiontracker and MacUpdate though so once again, it's irrelevant.
For me my app search goes something like this: 1) MacUpdate, 2) Versiontracker, 3) Google, 4) IRC or forums to see if such an app even exists for what I'm trying to accomplish, 5) Scour Sourceforge for some UNIX app I can compile and run in OS X, 6) See if a Windows app exists that will run acceptably under WINE.
What's changed is that I'll probably head to the App Store to purchase apps if I already know exactly what I need and the developer doesn't offer a way to purchase it online themselves.
I concur. BTW how are you finding CNET's handling of Version Tracker?
No! I mean what about devs that don't necessarily agree or want to be in the App store, but still wants to develop Mac apps?
They use a self owned site, macupdate etc
Since there is already a huge market for Mac apps, and they do not all instantly comply to the App Store guidelines, they could be alienating a very large portion of the developer community.
This needs to be a transition.
Do you even know what "Mac OS Download" page is?! It is basically a list of available Mac OS software. It links directly to the downloads file of third party software. I has nothing to do with developing software for Mac. It have no payment system, no hosting.. etc.
I concur. BTW how are you finding CNET's handling of Version Tracker?
I don't end up there often enough to judge. MU is usually sufficient.
I concur. BTW how are you finding CNET's handling of Version Tracker?
(OK, so your comment was not directed to me... oh well... )
I think there are plus and minus of VT transfer.
The transition was badly done -- they kept my pro subscription money I had pre-paid with nothing given in return
While their current interface of a VersionTracker 'list' that directs to Download.com is functional, there is a lot that Download.com never picked up from VersionTracker.
Missing is: (a) the version history details, which I used to make reference to a lot. (b) meaningful user comments. Yes, a few user comments are there, but all the detailed and in-depth comments that used to be on VT are gone. (then again, some of VT comments were getting spammed... )
Overall, I liked VT better than new VT/Download.com.
Progress forward is not always progress...
But, back to topic at hand.
In general, I am sad to see Apple Downloads disappear.
I have used it regularly over the years, and from the looks of things, a bunch of stuff will just not make the cut or will be dropped.
To the commenter that says in essense - who cares, just use google.
No, it is not the same at all.
The Apple Downloads was a site that I could trust had real, non-spam, non-scam product information. You just cannot say that about the search hit returns on google.
Looks like another some-get-scr____ transition in store...
No! I mean what about devs that don't necessarily agree or want to be in the App store, but still wants to develop Mac apps?
i am afraid they will have to go to other platform. why would not a dev agree with the app store?
Apple is basically saying "Give us a 30% cut of your Mac sales or go take a hike."
They're gonna make a bundle on all those free apps, too!
Wait. What?
Developers see some benefits if they sell their applications through the Mac App store:
- They pick the price
- They get 70% of sales revenue
- They Receive payments monthly
- No charge for free apps
- No credit card fees
- No hosting fees
- No marketing fees
You seem to think that it costs developers nothing to handle all the backside stuff themselves, not true.
Since pre-release and demo applications won't be carried in the app store, developers can, and are encouraged to distribute them from their own sites. Some applications (MS Office, etc) don't make sense in the mac app store, and there doesn't seem to be any requirement that if an application is carried in the app store, it can only be carried there.
Paranoia is fun and all, but not so much if you don't actually have enemies.
Host it on your own site or somewhere else, then.
Exactly. Anyone willing to pay for their own bandwidth, not get creative about their margins, etc. ... stick with what you've got and pay Apple nothing. Everyone else who wants access to millions of users instantly, welcome.
Since there is already a huge market for Mac apps, and they do not all instantly comply to the App Store guidelines, they could be alienating a very large portion of the developer community.
This needs to be a transition.
There's plenty of transition: they told developers weeks ago to get ready to start giving Steve 30% of their income. Who needs more time than that to understand a very simple message?
Exactly. Anyone willing to pay for their own bandwidth, not get creative about their margins, etc. ... stick with what you've got and pay Apple nothing. Everyone else who wants access to millions of users instantly, welcome.
1. By what percentage do you imagine the Mac audience will grow because it has an App Store?
2. When your app is reduced to being one of half a million other records which all share a uniform layout in a database with one of the weakest search engines for actually finding things. exactly how will that do more for you than being able to market creatively and independently with the entire web at your disposal?
3. Will people really buy more software when they're not allowed to get demo versions of it? These aren't 99-cent toys like most of the busy-box gadgets for iOS; many great Mac apps cost $49, $99, $149, and more. No demo. Impulse buy for two hundred bucks? Hardly...
But then they changed it up big time, all sorts of new categories and oversized icons. All very good looking and a lot less usable. I will not be sorry to see it go.
They won't be able to have the Mac App Store, and now losing the downloads page.
I good compromised by Apple would be keep the OS X downloads page for PPC versions of software only. There would obviously be the option for Intel users to run Rosetta to run the PPC apps, but I think over time, the convenience of the App Store would prevent this.
How will the App Store deal with Shareware? It will be free to download but users would then buy a license from the software developers website? Would this result in all software becoming shareware?
Phil
I guess you two need refreshers in reading comprehension.
How arrogant.
But I buy LOTS of apps for my iPhone and iPad. LOTS. These are apps I don't really need, but they're so convenient to buy and easy to install, why not?
Do you see where I'm going with this? The real value of the Mac App Store isn't for power users who buy software from developers who wont make the margins to sacrafice 30% other revenue. It's for developers who can view the 30% as a marketing tool and get poor saps like me to notice their stuff.
I also think developers who are worried about the 30% have bigger problems than this site closing. If extra exposure to more users with an easy, reliable, secure way to buy software doesn't improve your sales by more than enough to cover the 30%, you may just be making software with very limited appeal. (Or, you're serving a niche market and probably weren't helped by the current software site.)
... How will the App Store deal with Shareware? It will be free to download but users would then buy a license from the software developers website? Would this result in all software becoming shareware?
No, there won't be any shareware, demos, trials, etc. in the Mac App Store. It's either free or paid. If you want to distribute shareware, you'll need to do it through your own web site. The shareware model has rarely been financially viable anyway. (Yes, there are notable exceptions, but those few didn't succeed because they were shareware.) You're much better off distributing some sort of limited demo from your web site and selling the full version on your own or through the MAS.
I am concerned because Apple has a nasty reputation of thought policing and banning apps that duplicate OS functionality. These factors are bad news for all.
So what about those users who have a non-intel Mac? I know the number of users is dropping, but there are still a lot of machines around which cannot upgrade to Snow Leopard or above.
They won't be able to have the Mac App Store, and now losing the downloads page.
I good compromised by Apple would be keep the OS X downloads page for PPC versions of software only.
The current downloads page is only links to software on the developers own sites. Apple is not hosting the software, and you can still find the software on MacUpdate.com, Download.com, Google etc.