... I never understood this sentiment that Apple users have. Yes, Apple makes a very polished product, I don't deny that at all, but I'm pretty sure I know what I want in my device better than steve jobs.
That's because you're confusing the individual with the collective in the statements.
Yes, you as an individual (esp. if you are an engineer), "know what you want in your device." Collectively though, consumers have no idea what should or should not be in the device and shouldn't be allowed to decide, (if said device is ever going to be efficiently designed).
This is why Apple never uses "focus groups" (to gather consumer opinion), for anything to do with design even though this is the standard technique that every other manufacturer uses. Apple argues that housewives, farmers, lawyers, etc. don't really have the skills to do industrial design and they are generally right.
I always found it kind of funny that no other manufacturers do this considering both how successful it has been, and also it's very much in line with the beliefs of the advertising industry who has to sell the products in the end. The first thing you learn in advertising is that you can sell anyone anything (with the right ads), and that people will generally like and buy, what they are told to like and buy. So the idea of the manufacturers carefully asking focus groups "what they think," about their product seems fairly silly and rather naive in comparison.
The trolls will claim that Apple/Jobs said that you should never use a stylus with a touch-based deivce, even though Jobs comments on that were clear. It shouldn’t be the primary way you interact with the device.
thank you. It irks me to no end that folks keep quoting only half the statement in order to make Jobs look bad.
The first half was about the state of tech at the time and how other mini-tablet/PDAs required their stylus or they wouldn't work. If you lost it, you were hosed. Which is what Jobs thought was dumb.
So they made the iPhone etc to allow for more that a stylus by making your finger all you need. NOT all you can use.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody
Apple argues that housewives, farmers, lawyers, etc. don't really have the skills to do industrial design and they are generally right.
It's not so much that consumers suck at design. That is part of it. But it is just as much about the needs and desires of various groups being so diverse that it would be impossible to meet every need with one design and making a thousand different designs is not economically sound.
Even in this board, the 'if it does X, it is junk' statements see all over the place. Multiply that several times over if you went to the average consumer.
And we know that until it reaches the point that the courts etc say they have no choice, Apple is not going to allow clones. So there goes that game idea
As an engineering student, I won't consider buying a tablet without stylus support. Fingers may be nature's pointing device, but there no where near precised enough. Funny how when I first mentioned this, I was laughed at by Apple/iPad fans for being out of touch, or living in the last decade.
I've used those pen based tablets extensively before; yes they were bulky, yes they were ugly, yes the touch support on the OS was hacked on (WinXP back then, I don't know how Vista and Win7 handle touch now), but they worked extremely well for note taking, and I don't see how the iPad can even come close in this regard until they get integrated stylus support, and something akin to Microsoft onenote.
I never understood this sentiment that Apple users have. Yes, Apple makes a very polished product, I don't deny that at all, but I'm pretty sure I know what I want in my device better than steve jobs.
I am so happy that you know what you want but don't understand your 'sentiment that Apple users have' statement at all.
For educational purposes, it's far more important to not be ignorant and tied into an obsolete paradigm, dont'cha think?
Lets stick to the content. In Europe a lot of Universities are trying this magnificent surving device in a pilot: does it add a value for students or teachers. For now the results are: just for mailing and still than you need a filesystem to organise attached files locally. The (free) internet or Dropbox is not permanent available: train, plain, car. Nor is it always reliable. My USB-stick is.
Do I want to use my Ipad as a netbook? Yes, please. Why not?
I found it was preferable to use a stylus for drawing in SketchBook, so I tried a few thing around the house and found a sharpend carrot worked the best. I don't think you can patent a carrot...
When I went to buy something at the Apple Store in Boston, the Apple staff asked me to sign my name with my finger on the small mobile cashier they now used at Apple Stores. I found that ridiculous. And, I told the Apple staff, they really need a stylus for these purposes.
Since styluses can be mass produced, they would be more uniform compared to all the different variations in human fingers. So a stylus could work more consistently. Or we can pull a Steve and just blame the customer: "just don't point your finger that way".
Also, capacitive styluses continue to persist in the 3rd party market and they are all terrible.
I disagree- I just purchased a stylus made by Targus for $15 and it's excellent. I had first bought one from eBay for a few dollars and THAT was terrible. With the Targus one, I can write in a notes application like writing with a pen. It's incredibly response without having to be pushed to hard or forced to move across the surface.
If Apple withholds tech from a product, there's good reason for it. Learn to trust their judgment call and you'll be happier for it in the long run.
Yikes, I wouldn't be placing that sort of trust in a company whose main aim is to get hold of as much of my money as possible. That's a very complacent attitude to have, and I'm sure the salemen rub their hands with glee when they see someone like you coming!
Comments
... I never understood this sentiment that Apple users have. Yes, Apple makes a very polished product, I don't deny that at all, but I'm pretty sure I know what I want in my device better than steve jobs.
That's because you're confusing the individual with the collective in the statements.
Yes, you as an individual (esp. if you are an engineer), "know what you want in your device." Collectively though, consumers have no idea what should or should not be in the device and shouldn't be allowed to decide, (if said device is ever going to be efficiently designed).
This is why Apple never uses "focus groups" (to gather consumer opinion), for anything to do with design even though this is the standard technique that every other manufacturer uses. Apple argues that housewives, farmers, lawyers, etc. don't really have the skills to do industrial design and they are generally right.
I always found it kind of funny that no other manufacturers do this considering both how successful it has been, and also it's very much in line with the beliefs of the advertising industry who has to sell the products in the end. The first thing you learn in advertising is that you can sell anyone anything (with the right ads), and that people will generally like and buy, what they are told to like and buy. So the idea of the manufacturers carefully asking focus groups "what they think," about their product seems fairly silly and rather naive in comparison.
The trolls will claim that Apple/Jobs said that you should never use a stylus with a touch-based deivce, even though Jobs comments on that were clear. It shouldn’t be the primary way you interact with the device.
thank you. It irks me to no end that folks keep quoting only half the statement in order to make Jobs look bad.
The first half was about the state of tech at the time and how other mini-tablet/PDAs required their stylus or they wouldn't work. If you lost it, you were hosed. Which is what Jobs thought was dumb.
So they made the iPhone etc to allow for more that a stylus by making your finger all you need. NOT all you can use.
Apple argues that housewives, farmers, lawyers, etc. don't really have the skills to do industrial design and they are generally right.
It's not so much that consumers suck at design. That is part of it. But it is just as much about the needs and desires of various groups being so diverse that it would be impossible to meet every need with one design and making a thousand different designs is not economically sound.
Even in this board, the 'if it does X, it is junk' statements see all over the place. Multiply that several times over if you went to the average consumer.
And we know that until it reaches the point that the courts etc say they have no choice, Apple is not going to allow clones. So there goes that game idea
As an engineering student, I won't consider buying a tablet without stylus support. Fingers may be nature's pointing device, but there no where near precised enough. Funny how when I first mentioned this, I was laughed at by Apple/iPad fans for being out of touch, or living in the last decade.
I've used those pen based tablets extensively before; yes they were bulky, yes they were ugly, yes the touch support on the OS was hacked on (WinXP back then, I don't know how Vista and Win7 handle touch now), but they worked extremely well for note taking, and I don't see how the iPad can even come close in this regard until they get integrated stylus support, and something akin to Microsoft onenote.
I never understood this sentiment that Apple users have. Yes, Apple makes a very polished product, I don't deny that at all, but I'm pretty sure I know what I want in my device better than steve jobs.
I am so happy that you know what you want but don't understand your 'sentiment that Apple users have' statement at all.
AppleInsider was first to discover the patent in January 2010, two weeks before the unveiling of the iPad.
You may claim you were first to discover, but definitely not first to publish:
http://www.macrumors.com/2010/01/14/...ring-a-stylus/
A permanent filesystem, independent from the cloud or from pages.
And also an USB-port ,.. or two.
For students and teachers who want more than surfing the internet or playing games.
But for educational purposes far more important than a stylus is a filesystem.
A permanent filesystem, independent from the cloud or from pages.
And also an USB-port ,.. or two.
For students and teachers who want more than surfing the internet or playing games.
What an absurd thing to write.
But for educational purposes far more important than a stylus is a filesystem.
A permanent filesystem, independent from the cloud or from pages.
And also an USB-port ,.. or two.
For students and teachers who want more than surfing the internet or playing games.
Yeah, this is very narrow thinking.
But for educational purposes far more important than a stylus is a filesystem.
A permanent filesystem, independent from the cloud or from pages.
And also an USB-port ,.. or two.
For students and teachers who want more than surfing the internet or playing games.
For educational purposes, it's far more important to not be ignorant and tied into an obsolete paradigm, dont'cha think?
For educational purposes, it's far more important to not be ignorant and tied into an obsolete paradigm, dont'cha think?
Lets stick to the content. In Europe a lot of Universities are trying this magnificent surving device in a pilot: does it add a value for students or teachers. For now the results are: just for mailing and still than you need a filesystem to organise attached files locally. The (free) internet or Dropbox is not permanent available: train, plain, car. Nor is it always reliable. My USB-stick is.
Do I want to use my Ipad as a netbook? Yes, please. Why not?
And education is a huge market.
And education is a huge market.
When I went to buy something at the Apple Store in Boston, the Apple staff asked me to sign my name with my finger on the small mobile cashier they now used at Apple Stores. I found that ridiculous. And, I told the Apple staff, they really need a stylus for these purposes.
Since styluses can be mass produced, they would be more uniform compared to all the different variations in human fingers. So a stylus could work more consistently. Or we can pull a Steve and just blame the customer: "just don't point your finger that way".
Also, capacitive styluses continue to persist in the 3rd party market and they are all terrible.
I disagree- I just purchased a stylus made by Targus for $15 and it's excellent. I had first bought one from eBay for a few dollars and THAT was terrible. With the Targus one, I can write in a notes application like writing with a pen. It's incredibly response without having to be pushed to hard or forced to move across the surface.
If Apple withholds tech from a product, there's good reason for it. Learn to trust their judgment call and you'll be happier for it in the long run.
Yikes, I wouldn't be placing that sort of trust in a company whose main aim is to get hold of as much of my money as possible. That's a very complacent attitude to have, and I'm sure the salemen rub their hands with glee when they see someone like you coming!