Apple working on a smaller, contract-free iPhone to combat Android - report

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  • Reply 61 of 132
    cameronjcameronj Posts: 2,357member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post


    This just sounds ridiculous on the face of it. It doesn't sound like a good product or a strategy Apple would pursue, and the given reason (if they were cheaper they'd sell better), is something that isn't actually true.



    Right. Apple REALLY wants to reduce its take on each phone sold from $600 to $200, just so it can sell many more phones because now, instead of paying $200 the consumer pays, wait for it... $200.



    Wow! It'll change the industry. Duh.
  • Reply 62 of 132
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by noirdesir View Post


    Sorry, how can a company exclude certain phones from their plans? You get a SIM and a plan and then put that SIM in any phone you want. Read through the fine print when you get a new plan + SIM, does it say anywhere in that fine print that this plan cannot be used on iPhones?



    I have used multiple SIMs in multiple iPhones in multiple countries, never did changing the phone change the underlying contract I had for that SIM card.



    They aren't excluding anything from your plan. They reserve the right to add to your plan.



    From AT&T's website:



    Quote:

    Please note: AT&T is Apple's exclusive carrier partner for iPhone in the United States. An eligible data plan for iPhone is required. If AT&T determines that you are using an iPhone on your account without an eligible data plan, AT&T reserves the right to add an eligible data plan to your account and bill the appropriate monthly fee.



    Click on any of the data plan names to see the text actually on their site. Of course if you're not in the USA, it may work differently for you.



    And obviously they will will have to revise that policy to some extent since they are no longer Apple's exclusive partner.
  • Reply 63 of 132
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by TenoBell View Post


    I think an MVNO business would make more sense when most of the worlds major markets have launched LTE. At that point everything will be consolidated.



    Right now everything is in a messy transition.



    Probably so. But I am thinking more and more that a good chunk of those enormous cash reserves will go towards an Apple-branded MVNO.
  • Reply 64 of 132
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by cameronj View Post


    True



    Fixed that for you. Check out my previous post.
  • Reply 65 of 132
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by cameronj View Post


    This makes little sense. Make that no sense.



    Why would Apple care whether their customers were signing a two year contract? Apple gets $600 per phone as a result. The alternative situation, proposed by this article, is that Apple would rather sell a $200 iPhone that customers can keep when going from one carrier to another rather than selling a $600 iPhone that must be scrapped (or resold) when they want to move from CDMA to GSM. How does this help Apple? Apple is not a cell provider, so what does Apple care if it has "more control" over customers?



    This will be a much lesser phone that will not compete directly against the current iPhone.



    But I think it will really come into play when Apple does become a wireless provider in the form of an MVNO. This low-cost phone removes any price umbrella due to having only expensive handsets available.
  • Reply 66 of 132
    asdasdasdasd Posts: 5,686member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post


    Yep.



    It makes little sense to say they need to have a cheaper model to draw customers in too. The phone isn't that expensive relative to other phones right now and it's selling like hotcakes at the current price as well.



    Also, if they wanted to make it cheaper they could just swallow some of the massive margin and profits they are making. They could probably reduce the non-contract price by several hundred without losing too much profit already, and they are rolling in cash right now anyway.



    The iPhone is not losing market share but not gaining much either. Apple probably thought that they had 5 years ahead of the competition but - with Android - they dont. And the iPhone is really a small computer, iOS is a mobile computer OS, a platform. To not repeat the 90's Apple needs to grow that platform. It has iOS on MP3 players locked down, it has the chance to do that with tablets.



    The future Smartphone owners are the 80%, or so, who dont own them now. Apple have to compete lower while maintaining their margins with higher end offerings. This is what they do with the iPod, which sells in the UK for £173 on Amazon. Thats a better machine than the 3GS, which is £400, unlocked.



    And iPhones are expensive compared to the competition here, and most everywhere. I believe this makes sense.
  • Reply 67 of 132
    I have prepay voice and a rolling one-month contract for 1GB data which costs £5.



    I'm really glad I don't live in America.
  • Reply 68 of 132
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by asdasd View Post


    The iPhone is not losing market share but not gaining much either.



    Your extrapolating the current quarter situation to a longer time period here. Apple will pull ahead quite dramatically with the new phone later this year.

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by asdasd View Post


    ... The future Smartphone owners are the 80%, or so, who dont own them now. Apple have to compete lower while maintaining their margins with higher end offerings. This is what they do with the iPod, which sells in the UK for £173 on Amazon. Thats a better machine than the 3GS, which is £400, unlocked.



    None of this means they have to make an iPhone nano.

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by asdasd View Post


    ... iPhones are expensive ... most everywhere. I believe this makes sense.



    I don't agree with this statement at all. Your overstating a small difference at best.
  • Reply 69 of 132
    samabsamab Posts: 1,953member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by anonymouse View Post


    samab, once again, your reply is deftly not to the point.



    Actually, I am on the point precisely.



    The US is the ONLY country where mobile carriers compete based on coverage/pricing. Verizon is the most expensive because of its coverage --- not because they offer you the highest handset subsidy. That's what real competition is.
  • Reply 70 of 132
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by RichL View Post


    Surely a smaller screen would mean a whole new UI? You couldn't keep the current UI controls with a smaller screen. What about 3rd party app compatibility?



    Why would it need a Retina display? The rumor says that this is a low-cost alternative. Just put a display with the same resolution as the pre-Retina iPhones and there is no need to change the software.
  • Reply 71 of 132
    noirdesirnoirdesir Posts: 1,027member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by cameronj View Post


    Right. Apple REALLY wants to reduce its take on each phone sold from $600 to $200, just so it can sell many more phones because now, instead of paying $200 the consumer pays, wait for it... $200.



    Wow! It'll change the industry. Duh.



    Except that basically everywhere outside the US, there is no standard price for a given iPhone model. On most carriers you can pay between 0 and full price (ie, 600 Euro) for the very same model, just select from your choice of plans. Even for the very same plan, how high your average monthly bill was in the last year and how long you have been a customer, affects how much you pay (I payed $550 for my iPhone 4 since I have been a low-volume customer).

    People know the full handset price and then look how much subsidy they can get from different carriers and different plans. In the US of course, there being only one carrier where you can use a given iPhone handset (with 3G speeds), there is no point in comparing carriers or plans, as there is only one carrier and very small choice of plans.
  • Reply 72 of 132
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by christopher126 View Post


    I don't see a problem...throw in a handful of Apple engineers, lead by a PHD, get a factory in China to manufacturer it, pay the Chinese workers $1/hr., let the factory wear out its equipment, get Fedex to use a dozen 747's to ship it, put it on your website and in your 300+ retail stores, pay your retail staff $8/hr and make a boatload!



    Sell each one for a $1, sell a billion....errr help me with the math!



    1.6 Billion phones sold last year compared to 40 million iPhones! (I think I have that right?)



    There will be way more than 300+ retail stores. Apple has been pretty aggressive in getting the iPhone into non-carrier retail stores like Wal-mart and Best Buy. I imagine they are doing the same in other countries. This will allow them to sell their handsets linked to a choice of service providers including an Apple MVNO option.
  • Reply 73 of 132
    noirdesirnoirdesir Posts: 1,027member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by TheWatchfulOne View Post


    They aren't excluding anything from your plan. They reserve the right to add to your plan.



    From AT&T's website:







    Click on any of the data plan names to see the text actually on their site. Of course if you're not in the USA, it may work differently for you.



    And obviously they will will have to revise that policy to some extent since they are no longer Apple's exclusive partner.



    And what if you get a pre-paid SIM card? How can they add to that?

    The point is, do they in the pre-paid SIM card contracts have a clause that it prevents you from using the SIM card in an iPhone?

    And if they are as anal about this, just go to a different carrier. Even in the US, you must have virtual network providers.
  • Reply 74 of 132
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by bcahill009 View Post


    $30 each for talk and text and $15 each for a lowered amount of data.



    Right now neither ATT or Verizon comes close to that.



    $45/mo for a Straight Talk phone at wally world. Unlimited voice, txt and data (with the usual caveats about what unlimited means now). And that phone is running on the same network that wants to charge you $90/mo for limited voice, unlimited txt and data. VZW likes their profit margins.



    If the phone described here actually exists, I would expect it may be destined for the MVNO market (not necessarily Apple being a MVNO). 75% of the people I know are on either Straight Talk or Boost. Sooner or later Apple must penetrate the cost conscious end of the phone market.
  • Reply 75 of 132
    asdasdasdasd Posts: 5,686member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post


    Your extrapolating the current quarter situation to a longer time period here. Apple will pull ahead quite dramatically with the new phone later this year.

    None of this means they have to make an iPhone nano.

    I don't agree with this statement at all. Your overstating a small difference at best.



    Actually Apple's worldwide install base was pretty static over the year - however I think myself that growth in China, and America will see them rise this year if they go multi-carrier in China and all carriers in America. However a reduction in prices, however achieved, would help.



    I dont know much about American pricing. A friend - working in IT - told me he wanted to update his boss from a blackberry to a touch screen phone in the UK but the iPhone was prohibitive ( even the 3GS)





    HTC desire - Free on all contracts



    http://shop.o2.co.uk/mobile_phone/HT...y_Monthly/page





    iPhone 3GS: Minimum contract = price is £131.74



    http://shop.o2.co.uk/promo/iphoneind...onthly/3GS_8GB





    PAYG is £400. Thats what needs to change. And this is last years model.





    http://shop.o2.co.uk/promo/iphoneind...And_Go/3GS_8GB
  • Reply 76 of 132
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by noirdesir View Post


    Even in the US, you must have virtual network providers.



    Well, we do. But generally, they supply their own line of handsets. I think there may be one MVNO out there that says any unlocked AT&T phone will work, but I don't know if an iPhone is one that they support.
  • Reply 77 of 132
    dunksdunks Posts: 1,254member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by mstone View Post


    Do the carriers charge you any less when your contract expires? No until they offer a reduced plan for people who own their phone all you are going to save is $200. Everyone know the real cost of having a cell phone is the minutes, data plan and txt, not so much the cost of the phone.



    Things work very differently in other parts of the world. I still can't believe you actually get charged for receiving calls and texts (it's free to receive on this side of the pond).



    You are 100% correct in saying the "real" cost of the phone is incorporated into the plan. It's in the phone companies best interest to have everyone locked into a contract. If you're not getting significantly better deal when you are outside of a contract then you are being taken for a sweet ride. Are there any start-ups undercutting the big guys?



    We have pay as you go plans from as little as US$12 a month if you bring your own handset. The same plan over 6 months (total cost US$72) even snags you a free basic, but very usable, nokia handset.
  • Reply 78 of 132
    This would be a great thing if true.



    I`m one of many many people who simply cannot or will not justify the insane expense of an iPhone data plan.

    It`s ludicrous to me.



    I`ll keep my Dumb Phone for the rest of my life, it does what I want it to do, text and call and it does it well.



    I would however appreciate a 3g 7" iPad with a hotspot for about $30.00 a month though.

    Regardless of the cost of the hardware.







    If an iPhone owner could get on MetroPCS for $20.00 cheaper than AT$T or Verizon many would do it in a heartbeat.
  • Reply 79 of 132
    noirdesirnoirdesir Posts: 1,027member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by c-ray View Post


    Well, we do. But generally, they supply their own line of handsets. I think there may be one MVNO out there that says any unlocked AT&T phone will work, but I don't know if an iPhone is one that they support.



    http://www.t-mobile.com/shop/phones/...&uid=Shop_1_10

    "Ready for your GSM device", read any GSM device. The problem is just the odd 3G frequency of T-Mobile US. But if you wanted a Wifi-iPhone, you could not care less about the data speed.

    I have to say though, that $40/month for 500 minutes as the cheapest plan is simply absurd.

    http://www.t-mobile.com/shop/plans/C...l&uid=Shop_2_3

    But if you go prepaid, it gets cheaper to $30/month for 1500 minutes (plus some data and texts)? That's weird.

    http://www.t-mobile.com/shop/plans/P...x?uid=Shop_2_5



    Compare that to the UK, where T-Mobile is not the cheapest, plans start at £10/month:

    http://www.t-mobile.co.uk/shop/mobile-tariffs/
  • Reply 80 of 132
    dunksdunks Posts: 1,254member
    For a retail price of US$200 outright it would be difficult to deliver a handset with enough compelling features without cannibalising their own price points.



    I'd say it's unlikely unless it's part of a bold move by Apple to have everyone using a near field chip connected to an iTunes account to make purchases, instead of their credit card. I wouldn't put it past Apple, but it would take a bold, and well coordinated, move.
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