What's ironic about Netflix raising the price for streaming is they have cut out the US Post Office which was costing them > $400 Million to distribute the DVDs, annually.
So Netflix reclaims that profit loss and then raises the prices to offset the bandwidth fees to companies like Akamai.
In short, Netflix is making a killing since moving to Digital. That 30% means they will be down to a +$280 million this year in increased profits without having to do anything more than distribute digitally.
I didn't know they cut out the post office? I get Netflix delivery within one day by the post office. The streaming do not have many good movies to watch.
This will not affect Kindle because Apple in their announcement was clear that this is a subscription service an that it applies to "Subscriptions purchased".
When you purchase a book in your Kindle app you are purchasing a digital asset, not a subscription. To be more technical, the purchase is actually happening on amazons site an not in the app to begin with.
How this affects Netflix on the other hand is yet to be seen.
This will not affect Kindle because Apple in their announcement was clear that this is a subscription service an that it applies to "Subscriptions purchased".
When you purchase a book in your Kindle app you are purchasing a digital asset, not a subscription. To be more technical, the purchase is actually happening on amazons site an not in the app to begin with.
How this affects Netflix on the other hand is yet to be seen.
And if you read their updated guidelines this applies to ALL content purchased, not just subscriptions.
Specifically: 11.13 Apps can read or play approved content (magazines, newspapers, books, audio, music, video) that is sold outside of the app, for which Apple will not receive any portion of the revenues, provided that the same content is also offered in the app using IAP at the same price or less than it is offered outside the app. This applies to both purchased content and subscriptions.
Just this morning Rhapsody told Apple to smarten the fuck up or they are pulling their app.
Netflix will leave Apple in a heartbeat. They don't need Apple or their platform at all. No content producer does.
It blows my mind how so many believe that Apple has all the cards here. Consumers who want publications, movies, music or any other service will find that service. It's insane to think people are just going to throw up their arms and say "oh well - guess I'll just stay stuck on my iPad with no content or services".
All businesses make mistakes. It's irrational to think that Apple is somehow a Borg entity - with all these geniuses working as a hive mind, calculating every outcome to perfection... Yet 90% of the posters here actually believe that.
Well, if I recall, resistance was not futile. In fact, I believe the Borg were defeated.
Get ready for the massive blowback. Apple is about to be humbled.
So, summing up, Apple is not borg, and because the borg were defeated, apple is in the wrong?
No, I'm not ssuming nothing, someone said that the installed iOS base is so high that they won't leave and I have asked why can't they leave if the cut Apple will make is greater than their margins.
Given that you have no facts to offer to support your hypothetical, the very nature and wording of your original post and this reply are entirely disingenuous. In other words, it would seem you are trolling and trying to be dodgy enough in your posts to be able to deny you claimed anything.
In fact, you're in the company of quite a number who have come here to raise a stink about something that they have absolutely no knowledge of how it will affect anyone, or how it will play out, making stuff up, spreading FUD, and being generally dishonest in their posts.
Yes, there are a lot of good things that in-app payments bring for consumers, but the only thing they are providing app developers with is assistance in processing the payment, yet they are are charging 30% for it, making it mandatory in any app that accesses paid content online, and regulating the prices. In the end us consumers still lose if prices go up or if apps are pulled because developers and content providers refuse to meet Apples demands.
Go read some of my other posts unrelated to this topic before calling me a troll. I've defended Apple's actions more than I've criticized them, but I'm not blind and it's not my fault you choose to walk with blinders on.
If my characterization of you as a troll is unwarranted, I apologize. I'll take you at your word that the balance of your posts bare this out.
However, I still take issue with your statement that Apple is providing nothing more than assistance with payment processing. And this is in regards to the topic of this thread, which is subscription policies for digital content. As for apps, I don't get the beef here. Apple has always asked for 30% and the developer sets the price. Seems fair to me. Apple provides a whole lot more than just payment processing. They provide that, plus the best smartphone ever made, a boatload of customers hungry for apps, the entire marketplace infrastructure, and the developer tools. Remember, this is a huge market that essentially didn't even exist 5 years ago. It's all new money.
Apple will lose this battle and quickly. And it might even be the war. I'm thinking of Amazon in particular. For me, Kindle is the key app and if Amazon pulls Kindle from the app store the iPad becomes a doorstop.
Apples Bookstore is a joke, and Apple doesn't have the clout to get the same of books on to their site that Amazon has.
There is no way Apple can now save face either. It will be seen as an emperor with no clothes.
I did spend couple of hours googling for "Apple, Amazon, Sony, subscription" and, reading through various threads, was surprised about the number of people who plainly said what you did - if iOS looses Kindle App, they will switch from iPad/iPhone to Android devices in a blink.
In fact, this is the only forum (I have came across so far) where majority is convinced Amazon will blink. And bow.
It will be darn interesting to see how this unfolds
If my characterization of you as a troll is unwarranted, I apologize. I'll take you at your word that the balance of your posts bare this out.
However, I still take issue with your statement that Apple is providing nothing more than assistance with payment processing. And this is in regards to the topic of this thread, which is subscription policies for digital content. As for apps, I don't get the beef here. Apple has always asked for 30% and the developer sets the price. Seems fair to me. Apple provides a whole lot more than just payment processing. They provide that, plus the best smartphone ever made, a boatload of customers hungry for apps, the entire marketplace infrastructure, and the developer tools. Remember, this is a huge market that essentially didn't even exist 5 years ago. It's all new money.
Besides that there are a TON of Netflix/Amazon/Etc customers who would use those programs even if they weren't available on iOS. Offering on iOS is just a benefit for those consumers. Yes, it can bring in some additional revenue, but look at it this way: How many people do you think purchased iOS devices because it integrated with services they already used?
I've sold COUNTLESS phones because they had Pandora alone. Is apple paying those companies anything for bringing customers to their platform? How many ipad customers justified the high cost of an ipad because it could double as an ereader/Movie device? Apple's primary marketing push about iOS is the app market it brings. Just watch their ads. They let (and most likely encouraged) companies like Netflix to port their services to iOS, using these exclusive apps as marketing tools. Now they're basically screwing over these content distributors, companies that helped iOS become the powerhouse it is today.
Furthermore, these changes hit content stores like Kindle and Netflix the worst. These services are ones directly in "competition" with iBooks and iTunes. To me this smacks of Apple trying to pressure other services out of their market so if content producers want to get the eyeballs of ios users, they MUST go through apple's offerings alone.
Maybe you think it's a good idea to have Apple as a middleman between you and the content deliverer. I don't. I see this as great for consumers. A lower cut to Google may translate into a better rate for me. A direct contact with the content provider may result into a discount on the rate for a good customer. Now if you do want to put in a wall, you can always opt-out. With Apple, there is no way to opt-in.
So in the end, like always with Android, it's all about Choice.
Looks like you can opt-in with Apple if you want to. That's good.
Given that you have no facts to offer to support your hypothetical, the very nature and wording of your original post and this reply are entirely disingenuous. In other words, it would seem you are trolling and trying to be dodgy enough in your posts to be able to deny you claimed anything.
In fact, you're in the company of quite a number who have come here to raise a stink about something that they have absolutely no knowledge of how it will affect anyone, or how it will play out, making stuff up, spreading FUD, and being generally dishonest in their posts.
Really. The people arguing against Apple are actually producing statistics. You then reply to those arguments with a whiny " you have no facts to offer to support your hypothetical".
What he said was
No, I'm not ssuming nothing, someone said that the installed iOS base is so high that they won't leave and I have asked why can't they leave if the cut Apple will make is greater than their margins.
This is an utterly simple argument. It doesn't matter how big the iOS market is ( smaller than Android as it happens) because if you make no money per transaction the bigger the market the bigger your loss.
Apparantly Sony and Rhapsody have pulled out of the iOS platform, and Google have made some clever marketing moves by differentiating themselves from Apple's theft. European publishers are annoyed and talking to the European commission, and there are rumours of antitrust.
And then there is you. Reacting to statistics with ad homimens. Convinced that there is nothing wrong.
Really. The people arguing against Apple are actually producing statistics. You then reply to those arguments with a whiny " you have no facts to offer to support your hypothetical".
Apparantly Sony and Rhapsody have pulled out of the iOS platform, and Google have made some clever marketing moves by differentiating themselves from Apple's theft. European publishers are annoyed, and there are rumours of antitrust.
And then there is you. Reacting to statistics with ad homimens.
It is not worth replying to the ignorant and brain dead troll.
This will not end well for Apple unless they change their tune before it is too late. They will figure it out soon enough and they certain idiots on this board who cheer when Apple tries to steal from them will cheer again at Steve's brilliant change in policy.
I did spend couple of hours googling for "Apple, Amazon, Sony, subscription" and, reading through various threads, was surprised about the number of people who plainly said what you did - if iOS looses Kindle App, they will switch from iPad/iPhone to Android devices in a blink.
In fact, this is the only forum (I have came across so far) where majority is convinced Amazon will blink. And bow.
It will be darn interesting to see how this unfolds
Really. The people arguing against Apple are actually producing statistics. You then reply to those arguments with a whiny " you have no facts to offer to support your hypothetical".
Apparantly Sony and Rhapsody have pulled out of the iOS platform, and Google have made some clever marketing moves by differentiating themselves from Apple's theft. European publishers are annoyed, and there are rumours of antitrust.
And then there is you. Reacting to statistics with ad homimens.
That's because anonymouse doesn't have a browser capable of clicking on the links given to him pointing out Netflix financials. His browser must hate yahoo finance.
While there are 100s of millions of iOS devices, the majority of them aren't iPads. That's where I think these subscriptions actually matter - for newspapers, magazines and the like. And Apple doesn't have as big of a lead as some seem to think.
So while this decision doesn't necessarily matter for companies like Netflix, it may do for the Economist, the Times etc. I bought my subscription in anticipation of this announcement.
It'll be interesting to see if iOS apps end up being more expensive than those on other platforms. HP is already sorting out content as well as Google of course. Apple won't be the only game in town for long.
IRemember, this is a huge market that essentially didn't even exist 5 years ago. It's all new money.
That is true for apps, but not even remotely true for content. When it comes to books, news, magazines, movies, music, TV shows and whatever else, Apple has not created additional demand. Consumers have chosen to use Apple's product as an alternate consumption vehical, but they are going after content they previously consumed in other ways and would have consumed anyway.
The iOS market represents a tiny fraction of sales to most of these providers. The iPad is a huge success for a tablet, but it does not produce significant profits to any major media providers yet. If they all pull out, the iPad will be hurt much more than the news companies, movies studios, TV studios, book publishers and other content owners. Consumers will follow the content, and I imagine once they are gone Apple will have a hell of a time getting any of them to come back. In fact I think as of Tuesday, Apple's ability to negotiate content deals has been setback for years. They can't be trusted and that means the big players will play elsewhere.
While there are 100s of millions of iOS devices, the majority of them aren't iPads. That's where I think these subscriptions actually matter - for newspapers, magazines and the like. And Apple doesn't have as big of a lead as some seem to think.
So while this decision doesn't necessarily matter for companies like Netflix, it may do for the Economist, the Times etc. I bought my subscription in anticipation of this announcement.
It'll be interesting to see if iOS apps end up being more expensive than those on other platforms. HP is already sorting out content as well as Google of course. Apple won't be the only game in town for long.
Comments
What's ironic about Netflix raising the price for streaming is they have cut out the US Post Office which was costing them > $400 Million to distribute the DVDs, annually.
So Netflix reclaims that profit loss and then raises the prices to offset the bandwidth fees to companies like Akamai.
In short, Netflix is making a killing since moving to Digital. That 30% means they will be down to a +$280 million this year in increased profits without having to do anything more than distribute digitally.
I didn't know they cut out the post office? I get Netflix delivery within one day by the post office. The streaming do not have many good movies to watch.
Good bye Kindle, Netflix for iPad.
This will not affect Kindle because Apple in their announcement was clear that this is a subscription service an that it applies to "Subscriptions purchased".
When you purchase a book in your Kindle app you are purchasing a digital asset, not a subscription. To be more technical, the purchase is actually happening on amazons site an not in the app to begin with.
How this affects Netflix on the other hand is yet to be seen.
Apple Announcement:
http://www.apple.com/pr/library/2011/02/15appstore.html
I can see Apple blinking on this one... but I don't see 10%... maybe 20%... just enough of a cut to keep a few more publishers happy.
I think they will adjust their rate too. I'm thinking instead of 30% they might to 15%?
Unlike with App and iAds, Apple doesn't have the overhead from storage and bandwidth costs. They can reduce that 30%.
This will not affect Kindle because Apple in their announcement was clear that this is a subscription service an that it applies to "Subscriptions purchased".
When you purchase a book in your Kindle app you are purchasing a digital asset, not a subscription. To be more technical, the purchase is actually happening on amazons site an not in the app to begin with.
How this affects Netflix on the other hand is yet to be seen.
Apple Announcement:
http://www.apple.com/pr/library/2011/02/15appstore.html
And if you read their updated guidelines this applies to ALL content purchased, not just subscriptions.
Specifically: 11.13 Apps can read or play approved content (magazines, newspapers, books, audio, music, video) that is sold outside of the app, for which Apple will not receive any portion of the revenues, provided that the same content is also offered in the app using IAP at the same price or less than it is offered outside the app. This applies to both purchased content and subscriptions.
Seems pretty explicit to me
Sorry, but your the delusional one.
Just this morning Rhapsody told Apple to smarten the fuck up or they are pulling their app.
Netflix will leave Apple in a heartbeat. They don't need Apple or their platform at all. No content producer does.
It blows my mind how so many believe that Apple has all the cards here. Consumers who want publications, movies, music or any other service will find that service. It's insane to think people are just going to throw up their arms and say "oh well - guess I'll just stay stuck on my iPad with no content or services".
All businesses make mistakes. It's irrational to think that Apple is somehow a Borg entity - with all these geniuses working as a hive mind, calculating every outcome to perfection... Yet 90% of the posters here actually believe that.
Well, if I recall, resistance was not futile. In fact, I believe the Borg were defeated.
Get ready for the massive blowback. Apple is about to be humbled.
So, summing up, Apple is not borg, and because the borg were defeated, apple is in the wrong?
Your entire argument didn't make any sense!
No, I'm not ssuming nothing, someone said that the installed iOS base is so high that they won't leave and I have asked why can't they leave if the cut Apple will make is greater than their margins.
Given that you have no facts to offer to support your hypothetical, the very nature and wording of your original post and this reply are entirely disingenuous. In other words, it would seem you are trolling and trying to be dodgy enough in your posts to be able to deny you claimed anything.
In fact, you're in the company of quite a number who have come here to raise a stink about something that they have absolutely no knowledge of how it will affect anyone, or how it will play out, making stuff up, spreading FUD, and being generally dishonest in their posts.
Apple has released their pricing model AFTER discussing a variety of options with the Content Providers.
The model has been flushed out with the various markets of digital content.
This isn't a pull it out of your rear solution.
You honestly think Apple went to the publishers and said "Hey, you're OK with this right"?
Rhapsody publicly announced they are pulling their app if the terms don't change. Perhaps they misplaced their Apple tax meeting invite?
Yes, there are a lot of good things that in-app payments bring for consumers, but the only thing they are providing app developers with is assistance in processing the payment, yet they are are charging 30% for it, making it mandatory in any app that accesses paid content online, and regulating the prices. In the end us consumers still lose if prices go up or if apps are pulled because developers and content providers refuse to meet Apples demands.
Go read some of my other posts unrelated to this topic before calling me a troll. I've defended Apple's actions more than I've criticized them, but I'm not blind and it's not my fault you choose to walk with blinders on.
If my characterization of you as a troll is unwarranted, I apologize. I'll take you at your word that the balance of your posts bare this out.
However, I still take issue with your statement that Apple is providing nothing more than assistance with payment processing. And this is in regards to the topic of this thread, which is subscription policies for digital content. As for apps, I don't get the beef here. Apple has always asked for 30% and the developer sets the price. Seems fair to me. Apple provides a whole lot more than just payment processing. They provide that, plus the best smartphone ever made, a boatload of customers hungry for apps, the entire marketplace infrastructure, and the developer tools. Remember, this is a huge market that essentially didn't even exist 5 years ago. It's all new money.
Apple will lose this battle and quickly. And it might even be the war. I'm thinking of Amazon in particular. For me, Kindle is the key app and if Amazon pulls Kindle from the app store the iPad becomes a doorstop.
Apples Bookstore is a joke, and Apple doesn't have the clout to get the same of books on to their site that Amazon has.
There is no way Apple can now save face either. It will be seen as an emperor with no clothes.
I did spend couple of hours googling for "Apple, Amazon, Sony, subscription" and, reading through various threads, was surprised about the number of people who plainly said what you did - if iOS looses Kindle App, they will switch from iPad/iPhone to Android devices in a blink.
In fact, this is the only forum (I have came across so far) where majority is convinced Amazon will blink. And bow.
It will be darn interesting to see how this unfolds
If my characterization of you as a troll is unwarranted, I apologize. I'll take you at your word that the balance of your posts bare this out.
However, I still take issue with your statement that Apple is providing nothing more than assistance with payment processing. And this is in regards to the topic of this thread, which is subscription policies for digital content. As for apps, I don't get the beef here. Apple has always asked for 30% and the developer sets the price. Seems fair to me. Apple provides a whole lot more than just payment processing. They provide that, plus the best smartphone ever made, a boatload of customers hungry for apps, the entire marketplace infrastructure, and the developer tools. Remember, this is a huge market that essentially didn't even exist 5 years ago. It's all new money.
Besides that there are a TON of Netflix/Amazon/Etc customers who would use those programs even if they weren't available on iOS. Offering on iOS is just a benefit for those consumers. Yes, it can bring in some additional revenue, but look at it this way: How many people do you think purchased iOS devices because it integrated with services they already used?
I've sold COUNTLESS phones because they had Pandora alone. Is apple paying those companies anything for bringing customers to their platform? How many ipad customers justified the high cost of an ipad because it could double as an ereader/Movie device? Apple's primary marketing push about iOS is the app market it brings. Just watch their ads. They let (and most likely encouraged) companies like Netflix to port their services to iOS, using these exclusive apps as marketing tools. Now they're basically screwing over these content distributors, companies that helped iOS become the powerhouse it is today.
Furthermore, these changes hit content stores like Kindle and Netflix the worst. These services are ones directly in "competition" with iBooks and iTunes. To me this smacks of Apple trying to pressure other services out of their market so if content producers want to get the eyeballs of ios users, they MUST go through apple's offerings alone.
Maybe you think it's a good idea to have Apple as a middleman between you and the content deliverer. I don't. I see this as great for consumers. A lower cut to Google may translate into a better rate for me. A direct contact with the content provider may result into a discount on the rate for a good customer. Now if you do want to put in a wall, you can always opt-out. With Apple, there is no way to opt-in.
So in the end, like always with Android, it's all about Choice.
Looks like you can opt-in with Apple if you want to. That's good.
Given that you have no facts to offer to support your hypothetical, the very nature and wording of your original post and this reply are entirely disingenuous. In other words, it would seem you are trolling and trying to be dodgy enough in your posts to be able to deny you claimed anything.
In fact, you're in the company of quite a number who have come here to raise a stink about something that they have absolutely no knowledge of how it will affect anyone, or how it will play out, making stuff up, spreading FUD, and being generally dishonest in their posts.
Really. The people arguing against Apple are actually producing statistics. You then reply to those arguments with a whiny " you have no facts to offer to support your hypothetical".
What he said was
No, I'm not ssuming nothing, someone said that the installed iOS base is so high that they won't leave and I have asked why can't they leave if the cut Apple will make is greater than their margins.
This is an utterly simple argument. It doesn't matter how big the iOS market is ( smaller than Android as it happens) because if you make no money per transaction the bigger the market the bigger your loss.
Apparantly Sony and Rhapsody have pulled out of the iOS platform, and Google have made some clever marketing moves by differentiating themselves from Apple's theft. European publishers are annoyed and talking to the European commission, and there are rumours of antitrust.
And then there is you. Reacting to statistics with ad homimens. Convinced that there is nothing wrong.
This is all good for Apple.
Really. The people arguing against Apple are actually producing statistics. You then reply to those arguments with a whiny " you have no facts to offer to support your hypothetical".
Apparantly Sony and Rhapsody have pulled out of the iOS platform, and Google have made some clever marketing moves by differentiating themselves from Apple's theft. European publishers are annoyed, and there are rumours of antitrust.
And then there is you. Reacting to statistics with ad homimens.
It is not worth replying to the ignorant and brain dead troll.
This will not end well for Apple unless they change their tune before it is too late. They will figure it out soon enough and they certain idiots on this board who cheer when Apple tries to steal from them will cheer again at Steve's brilliant change in policy.
I did spend couple of hours googling for "Apple, Amazon, Sony, subscription" and, reading through various threads, was surprised about the number of people who plainly said what you did - if iOS looses Kindle App, they will switch from iPad/iPhone to Android devices in a blink.
In fact, this is the only forum (I have came across so far) where majority is convinced Amazon will blink. And bow.
It will be darn interesting to see how this unfolds
Quite the free time we have, don't we?
Really. The people arguing against Apple are actually producing statistics. You then reply to those arguments with a whiny " you have no facts to offer to support your hypothetical".
Apparantly Sony and Rhapsody have pulled out of the iOS platform, and Google have made some clever marketing moves by differentiating themselves from Apple's theft. European publishers are annoyed, and there are rumours of antitrust.
And then there is you. Reacting to statistics with ad homimens.
That's because anonymouse doesn't have a browser capable of clicking on the links given to him pointing out Netflix financials. His browser must hate yahoo finance.
Looks like you can opt-in with Apple if you want to. That's good.
The opt-in ?
I dont see it. I am not seeing it.
So while this decision doesn't necessarily matter for companies like Netflix, it may do for the Economist, the Times etc. I bought my subscription in anticipation of this announcement.
It'll be interesting to see if iOS apps end up being more expensive than those on other platforms. HP is already sorting out content as well as Google of course. Apple won't be the only game in town for long.
IRemember, this is a huge market that essentially didn't even exist 5 years ago. It's all new money.
That is true for apps, but not even remotely true for content. When it comes to books, news, magazines, movies, music, TV shows and whatever else, Apple has not created additional demand. Consumers have chosen to use Apple's product as an alternate consumption vehical, but they are going after content they previously consumed in other ways and would have consumed anyway.
The iOS market represents a tiny fraction of sales to most of these providers. The iPad is a huge success for a tablet, but it does not produce significant profits to any major media providers yet. If they all pull out, the iPad will be hurt much more than the news companies, movies studios, TV studios, book publishers and other content owners. Consumers will follow the content, and I imagine once they are gone Apple will have a hell of a time getting any of them to come back. In fact I think as of Tuesday, Apple's ability to negotiate content deals has been setback for years. They can't be trusted and that means the big players will play elsewhere.
While there are 100s of millions of iOS devices, the majority of them aren't iPads. That's where I think these subscriptions actually matter - for newspapers, magazines and the like. And Apple doesn't have as big of a lead as some seem to think.
So while this decision doesn't necessarily matter for companies like Netflix, it may do for the Economist, the Times etc. I bought my subscription in anticipation of this announcement.
It'll be interesting to see if iOS apps end up being more expensive than those on other platforms. HP is already sorting out content as well as Google of course. Apple won't be the only game in town for long.
Read the terms of the agreement then come back.