1) Actually, Canada has the highest standard of living and currently has the strongest economy in North America. Our life expectancy is second only to Japan - It is now in the 80s while the American average is still approximately 77-78 or so.
2) Is a massacre considered intervention? I don't think I need to bring up Vietnam.
3) How can you claim that the system works if the man who won the elections is not your current president? You can't, because it does not work. It all depends on who can give better head to corporate America.
4) !!!NEWSFLASH!!!!
AMERICA HAS PEOPLE DYING AND STARVING IN THE STREETS! It also has a horrible, for profit healthcare system that helps no one and no social security net.
5) Having a larger and better military does not make your country better, it simply means that your government decides that it is wiser to spend more money on things to kill people than cure and educate them.
I would have to say that we actually didn't get to where we are just because of things "falling into place"... I do believe that there are certain qualities in the American tapestry of history and peoples that make it unique... as well, of course, as its political freedoms and its constitution. It is unique and will continue to be for a long time. Other countries could learn from us about many things, such as racial tolerance and freedoms of speech and rights etc. I think that we got here because of these things but also because of a history that was very brutal and involved many things that could be seen as unjust, if you believe in justice rather than might is right. But not all things in this history are unjust and I am still proud to be American. . .I think it is a more profound respect for a civilization when one sees the reality of all of that civilization's sides, not some rosy as$ kitch hallmark card sloganeering patriotism.
Don't get me wrong when I make fun of the idealistically-impaired. I just recognize that jingoism is debilitating for productive intelligent thought.
And yes Bounoroti . . . doesn't digix sound familiar . . .I'll wager Naim is back . . . .
who are the "puppetmasters"? digix? Are you afraid to name them? or are you just playing some empty meaningless game?
(rather than believing empty meaningless conspiracies)
<strong>1) Canadians live longer than Americans and we make more money too!
2) Your country massaacred poor helpless Vietnamese!! You bastards!
3) President Bush stole your elections! you Should have Al Goe as your president, we liked him better anyhow...
4) !!!NEWSFLASH!!!!
AMERICA IS A THIRD WORLD TOILET WITH PEOPLE DYING EVERYWHERE. Oh and your health care is too expensive, that is why we drive down there when our system fails us and we need the best health care that money can buy. Oh and social security is going bankrupt, as if you did not know.
5) Make love, not war!! Wouldn't it be nice if a school had all the funding it needed and the military needed to have a bake sale to buy a bomber?</strong><hr></blockquote>
Yeah, well we are still the best nation in the world whether you like it or not. It does not mean we are perfect, but your jealousy of us will not change anything. You know you want to be the 51st state. At least your taxes would be lower then. :eek:
(Sorry for the thrashing of your post, it just rubbed me all the wrong ways at once. I will likely never do it again. )
<strong>1) Actually, Canada has the highest standard of living and currently has the strongest economy in North America. Our life expectancy is second only to Japan - It is now in the 80s while the American average is still approximately 77-78 or so.
2) Is a massacre considered intervention? I don't think I need to bring up Vietnam.
3) How can you claim that the system works if the man who won the elections is not your current president? You can't, because it does not work. It all depends on who can give better head to corporate America.
4) !!!NEWSFLASH!!!!
AMERICA HAS PEOPLE DYING AND STARVING IN THE STREETS! It also has a horrible, for profit healthcare system that helps no one and no social security net.
5) Having a larger and better military does not make your country better, it simply means that your government decides that it is wiser to spend more money on things to kill people than cure and educate them.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Actually the man that won the election IS President. See, we have this thing called the ELECTORAL COLLEGE. The one with the most electoral votes wins. Bush won the electorate.
Actually, a strong military is very important for protecting a nation. This is exactly why many terrorists enter America through Canada. Canada has a weak military and law enforcement system, giving terrorists easy access to the US.
The American health care system is indeed screwed up. It's the fault of the damn HMO's and insurance companies. Our life expectancy is lower than yours cause the US is full of idiots that make bad decisions. Just watch Jerry Springer. If you got rid of the idiots, our average would be right up there with yours. <---weak argument. As for those "dying in the streets," GET A JOB!!! My tax money shouldn't go for feeding some damn drunk!
<strong>We all know there nations on earth, entire populations that hate the US. We can speculate that this is due to American dominance in economics, military, and culture to a certain extent. (I assume we can mostly agree on those reasons). We also know that some claim to hate us due to differences in religion. Having said that:
Dear nations that hate us:
If you resent us, I understand why. We have the best economy and overall standard of living in the whole world. You may say it's because we are imperalists. I think you are wrong. I think it is because we were the first modern democracy. We took a risk 225 years ago and, for the most part, it worked. We decided to let the people run our government, not the military. We decided to allow free speech. We decided to allow freedom of the press. We decided to allow government transparency. We tried out a new system of government, and as a result, we became the richest, most powerful nation in the world. Sure, we **** up too. We have corruption and crime just like you do, but we're working on it. Take our presedential election two years ago for example. Over 50 million people DID NOT get who they wanted for president. In fact, that happens almost every four years. We had controversy and debate. But did we have tanks rolling down the street? No. Did we have states leaving the union and forming their own tribal militias? No. You want to know why? Because with all its flaws, OUR SYSTEM OBVIOUSLY WORKS.
And now, after all we have been through, after we have defended nation after nation, intervened time and time again, literally saved the civilized world from evil facists, and defeated an oppressive superpower, you decide to hate us because we have what we have. You decide we are decadent, fat and lazy. You decide that we must be destroyed because we have abused our power and become an evil empire ourselves. You resent that we have troops on your soil and you have vowed to kill them, eventually. Never mind we saved your collective asses 11 years ago, from another mad man. Never mind that at all.
So I say this: If you hate that we have money, and power and might, and hate even more that you don't, why don't you try things our way for a while? Why not try modeling a constitution after ours? Why not hold free elections? I mean, ****, even YOU have to admit that what you are doing isn't working, right? You have people starving, dying in the streets. You have shitty, little pathetic militaries, the largest of which we could take out with a few 1980's era fighter/bombers.
Isn't it time to try something new? Isn't it worth a shot? It can't get worse than it is now, right? Just think, in the process you could even win world wide approval and aid for embracing civilized democracy. The way things are now you won't have any of those things. You'll just keep killing each other.
Why not try it out guys? How about laying off the US and trying what we did? You know what? We'll even help you set the whole thing up!!! All you have to do is come out say that you won't murder anymore civilian women and children, and that you want to to "try something new".
So, whadya think? Wanna try things OUR way...maybe just for few years to see what happens? No? Well....that's what I thought.
<strong>1) Actually, Canada has the highest standard of living and currently has the strongest economy in North America. Our life expectancy is second only to Japan - It is now in the 80s while the American average is still approximately 77-78 or so.
2) Is a massacre considered intervention? I don't think I need to bring up Vietnam.
3) How can you claim that the system works if the man who won the elections is not your current president? You can't, because it does not work. It all depends on who can give better head to corporate America.
4) !!!NEWSFLASH!!!!
AMERICA HAS PEOPLE DYING AND STARVING IN THE STREETS! It also has a horrible, for profit healthcare system that helps no one and no social security net.
5) Having a larger and better military does not make your country better, it simply means that your government decides that it is wiser to spend more money on things to kill people than cure and educate them.</strong><hr></blockquote>
1. WHAT??? The strongest economy? Check out the CIA world factbook, and you'll see that Canada's economy doesn't even begin to compare to the US. Try facts next time.
2. You think Bush didn't win? That is a whole other argument. IMO, if anyone tried to steal the election it was Gore, but I'm not getting into that debate again.
3. I agree we have starving, homeless people. But not the tens of millions that a nation such as Iraq, Iran or even North Korea has.
4. Military: And if it wasn't for the US, you wouldn't be here right now. Literally. Flag waiving aside. That is a fact.
<strong>"It can't get worse than it is now, right? Just think, in the process you could even win world wide approval and aid for embracing civilized democracy."
This is the most ridiculous thing I've ever hear. Civilized? The U.S. is civilized? I went into a Blimpies the other day to have lunch and Jerry Springer is on TV. There are people screaming at each other. This is little better than a cock fight. Then I go into the laundromat and there's Divorce Court. People are yelling at each other and right in front of a child too. One of the things I was taught was that an adult should never argue in front of a child.
Kids can go into a supermarket and see headlines like "Whitney Houston gets beaten up by drug dealer" or more pictures of JonBenet Ramsey. What kind of lowlife gets off on stories about a child that has been murdered and why is this in the supermarket? I'm not saying that pornography shoold be outlawed but it should only be sold in out of the way places.
Americans make more money and that's about it. To claim that we are civilized is ridiculous.</strong><hr></blockquote>
I will hereby dedicate myself to becoming as intelligent as you. But, being the flag waving, Bush voting person I am, I will need to become immortal, so that I might have the time required to overcome my supreme stupidity.
Oh, and this just in:
This thread I have started is beginning to prove a point I only heard put into words the other day: Patriotism is not being taught in our liberal schools, and is now considered to be "taboo" by many. The difference between you and I is that I LIKE being called a flag waiver. I think it is a good thing. I think being patriotic is a GOOD thing. I appreciate the nation I live in. I appreciate my freedoms and a nation that gives me the ability to speak and generally act as I want. I realize that not all places on earth are like this. We have problems, and I know that. But, I truly DO believe we are the "best" nation, so to speak.
The problem in this country is the people that have stopped believing in the greatness of America.
Oh, OK. I forgot how dumb I am. Thank you very much. Please enlighten us further with your superb academic snobbery.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Gladly.
See, you think people look down on the U.S for their superiority.
However,
You´re not superior.
No one will deny that the U.S isn´t the worst country in the world to live in.
However,
The majority of the people on this world hate arrogance. You say you´re a patriot but all you do is tell everyone how superior your country is. That´s not patriotism. If you were to tell me how you love democracy, freedom of speech, New York, your flag, the Grand Canyon, the Rockies etc. Now that would be patriotic.
However,
You tell me how much better your country is than mine. You tell me how much I should be like you and lose my own national pride.
And that, my friend, is what people look down on.
So all the things that you said is not why people poke fun at your country, it´s because you said them. That´s what I meant by you making the point by missing it.
If you want to know the reason for extremists flying planes in to your buildings. Look no further than your continued aid to Israel.
Trust me, the general population of the world does not hate or envy your country. I respect the United States, even if I don´t always agree with it´s policies, I respect them. But it´s Americans like you who confuse patriotism with blatant arrogance that make for the opportunity to have cheap shots at your country.
Finally,
I´m Dutch. We have a lower percentage of teenage pregnancy, poor people and drug addicts in our country than the U.S. Do you think the U.S should be more like the Netherlands in it´s policies regarding these issues?
<strong>It is trendy to be an American against America these days. Why try to make a difference when you can just bitch about it?</strong><hr></blockquote>
I think that´s a cheap comment.
People, Americans, sometimes don´t agree with what your government does. That doesn´t mean they don´t love their country. It actually means they love it enough to care when they see something they don´t agree with.
You can´t expect everyone´s nose to be in the same direction in a democracy. That´s the beauty of it. Everybody gets to disagree with each other so don´t get mad when someone says something you don´t like.
In stead of making the statement you just made why don´t you tell us what you find people shouldn´t complain about, why they shouldn´t and why it is the best way?
No Americans are against America. They would just like to see some changes.
I agree with you though that it´s a bit easy to say what is wrong without giving a proper alternative.
Patriotism is not being taught in our liberal schools, and is now considered to be "taboo" by many. The difference between you and I is that I LIKE being called a flag waiver. I think it is a good thing. I think being patriotic is a GOOD thing. I appreciate the nation I live in. I appreciate my freedoms and a nation that gives me the ability to speak and generally act as I want. I realize that not all places on earth are like this. We have problems, and I know that.</strong><hr></blockquote>
VERY well said. I experienced this kind of "liberal brainwashing" if you will, first hand. I couldn't stand my own teachers telling me that my country was completely wrong for going into Afghanistan!!! Damn hippies.
VERY well said. I experienced this kind of "liberal brainwashing" if you will, first hand. I couldn't stand my own teachers telling me that my country was completely wrong for going into Afghanistan!!! Damn hippies.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Patriotism is not something you teach.
Are you proud of your country because of what you like about it or are you proud of your country because of what someone tells you to be proud of?
The US is a great country to live in but it is not perfect. there is a lot of problems like the ones you mentioned but you cannot compare it to a small country like the netherlands.
US population: 278,212,552
Netherlands population: 15,983,682
The US has 17 times the population to contend with.
Actually I think it's trendy to be a lets pat ourselves on the back ( without looking at things ) american these days. Especially among young people.
People from the post Regan years don't ask enough questions about their government. Hell a lot of young kids think the Civil War happened in the 1920's so how would they ever get a clear perspective? A lot of back patting and not enough fact finding.
All they hear is " well if it's american it must be good. "
I'm not here to cut down America but, to think we are angels or something is just a lot of hogwash.
pfflam,
Also I didn't say we got here just because things fell into place. I said " A lot of things just fell into place. Like a country with vast natural resources as an example.
I don't hate the U.S. but, I would like to encourage it's future history to be better.
Don't kid youselves our past holds many dark passages. I'd just like people to remember them in the hopes that they don't repeat them. To blindly pat yourself on the back and ignore them almost guarantees their return.
Learn from your mistakes.
Ps. G4Dude,
The electoral college is a joke and they have been talking about revising it ( or doing away with it all together ) for years now. That's both the republicans and the democrats. The last election was a prime example of why. A lot of american's votes didn't account for anything.
[quote]Actually, a strong military is very important for protecting a nation. This is exactly why many terrorists enter America through Canada. Canada has a weak military and law enforcement system, giving terrorists easy access to the US.<hr></blockquote>
That is false. Your border security is your problem. Canada only has jurisdiction over people entering Canada, not leaving it. Of course the Canadian government assists the US in border security. Perhaps if you want more help, you can ask your government representatives to send us some money.
Canada has a weak military because of the small population, uncontested land, military alliances and limited foreign interests, and it has no bearing on terrorists or anyone else entering or leaving the country.
[quote]1. WHAT??? The strongest economy? Check out the CIA world factbook, and you'll see that Canada's economy doesn't even begin to compare to the US. Try facts next time. <hr></blockquote>
It shows stronger growth than yours, I believe, thanks in part to tight management of government finances (we run budget surpluses, not tremendous deficits) and new developments in natural resources.
[quote]4. Military: And if it wasn't for the US, you wouldn't be here right now. Literally. Flag waiving aside. That is a fact. <hr></blockquote>
That is speculation, actually.
The US has plenty of good points; you don't need to bash other countries to find them.
Comments
<strong>hehe..should be Bozo
no, it actually is supposed to be bonzo. Forgot what its from, though.....................................
2) Is a massacre considered intervention? I don't think I need to bring up Vietnam.
3) How can you claim that the system works if the man who won the elections is not your current president? You can't, because it does not work. It all depends on who can give better head to corporate America.
4) !!!NEWSFLASH!!!!
AMERICA HAS PEOPLE DYING AND STARVING IN THE STREETS! It also has a horrible, for profit healthcare system that helps no one and no social security net.
5) Having a larger and better military does not make your country better, it simply means that your government decides that it is wiser to spend more money on things to kill people than cure and educate them.
Don't get me wrong when I make fun of the idealistically-impaired. I just recognize that jingoism is debilitating for productive intelligent thought.
And yes Bounoroti . . . doesn't digix sound familiar . . .I'll wager Naim is back . . . .
who are the "puppetmasters"? digix? Are you afraid to name them? or are you just playing some empty meaningless game?
(rather than believing empty meaningless conspiracies)
<strong>1) Canadians live longer than Americans and we make more money too!
2) Your country massaacred poor helpless Vietnamese!! You bastards!
3) President Bush stole your elections! you Should have Al Goe as your president, we liked him better anyhow...
4) !!!NEWSFLASH!!!!
AMERICA IS A THIRD WORLD TOILET WITH PEOPLE DYING EVERYWHERE. Oh and your health care is too expensive, that is why we drive down there when our system fails us and we need the best health care that money can buy. Oh and social security is going bankrupt, as if you did not know.
5) Make love, not war!! Wouldn't it be nice if a school had all the funding it needed and the military needed to have a bake sale to buy a bomber?</strong><hr></blockquote>
Yeah, well we are still the best nation in the world whether you like it or not. It does not mean we are perfect, but your jealousy of us will not change anything. You know you want to be the 51st state. At least your taxes would be lower then. :eek:
(Sorry for the thrashing of your post, it just rubbed me all the wrong ways at once. I will likely never do it again.
<strong>1) Actually, Canada has the highest standard of living and currently has the strongest economy in North America. Our life expectancy is second only to Japan - It is now in the 80s while the American average is still approximately 77-78 or so.
2) Is a massacre considered intervention? I don't think I need to bring up Vietnam.
3) How can you claim that the system works if the man who won the elections is not your current president? You can't, because it does not work. It all depends on who can give better head to corporate America.
4) !!!NEWSFLASH!!!!
AMERICA HAS PEOPLE DYING AND STARVING IN THE STREETS! It also has a horrible, for profit healthcare system that helps no one and no social security net.
5) Having a larger and better military does not make your country better, it simply means that your government decides that it is wiser to spend more money on things to kill people than cure and educate them.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Actually the man that won the election IS President. See, we have this thing called the ELECTORAL COLLEGE. The one with the most electoral votes wins. Bush won the electorate.
Actually, a strong military is very important for protecting a nation. This is exactly why many terrorists enter America through Canada. Canada has a weak military and law enforcement system, giving terrorists easy access to the US.
The American health care system is indeed screwed up. It's the fault of the damn HMO's and insurance companies. Our life expectancy is lower than yours cause the US is full of idiots that make bad decisions. Just watch Jerry Springer. If you got rid of the idiots, our average would be right up there with yours. <---weak argument. As for those "dying in the streets," GET A JOB!!! My tax money shouldn't go for feeding some damn drunk!
<strong>
Yeah, well we are still the best nation in the world whether you like it or not. </strong><hr></blockquote>
<img src="graemlins/oyvey.gif" border="0" alt="[No]" />
<strong>We all know there nations on earth, entire populations that hate the US. We can speculate that this is due to American dominance in economics, military, and culture to a certain extent. (I assume we can mostly agree on those reasons). We also know that some claim to hate us due to differences in religion. Having said that:
Dear nations that hate us:
If you resent us, I understand why. We have the best economy and overall standard of living in the whole world. You may say it's because we are imperalists. I think you are wrong. I think it is because we were the first modern democracy. We took a risk 225 years ago and, for the most part, it worked. We decided to let the people run our government, not the military. We decided to allow free speech. We decided to allow freedom of the press. We decided to allow government transparency. We tried out a new system of government, and as a result, we became the richest, most powerful nation in the world. Sure, we **** up too. We have corruption and crime just like you do, but we're working on it. Take our presedential election two years ago for example. Over 50 million people DID NOT get who they wanted for president. In fact, that happens almost every four years. We had controversy and debate. But did we have tanks rolling down the street? No. Did we have states leaving the union and forming their own tribal militias? No. You want to know why? Because with all its flaws, OUR SYSTEM OBVIOUSLY WORKS.
And now, after all we have been through, after we have defended nation after nation, intervened time and time again, literally saved the civilized world from evil facists, and defeated an oppressive superpower, you decide to hate us because we have what we have. You decide we are decadent, fat and lazy. You decide that we must be destroyed because we have abused our power and become an evil empire ourselves. You resent that we have troops on your soil and you have vowed to kill them, eventually. Never mind we saved your collective asses 11 years ago, from another mad man. Never mind that at all.
So I say this: If you hate that we have money, and power and might, and hate even more that you don't, why don't you try things our way for a while? Why not try modeling a constitution after ours? Why not hold free elections? I mean, ****, even YOU have to admit that what you are doing isn't working, right? You have people starving, dying in the streets. You have shitty, little pathetic militaries, the largest of which we could take out with a few 1980's era fighter/bombers.
Isn't it time to try something new? Isn't it worth a shot? It can't get worse than it is now, right? Just think, in the process you could even win world wide approval and aid for embracing civilized democracy. The way things are now you won't have any of those things. You'll just keep killing each other.
Why not try it out guys? How about laying off the US and trying what we did? You know what? We'll even help you set the whole thing up!!! All you have to do is come out say that you won't murder anymore civilian women and children, and that you want to to "try something new".
So, whadya think? Wanna try things OUR way...maybe just for few years to see what happens? No? Well....that's what I thought.
.
[ 06-01-2002: Message edited by: SDW2001 ]
[ 06-02-2002: Message edited by: SDW2001 ]</strong><hr></blockquote>
My statement to you.
Mate,
By totally missing the point you have made it wonderfully.
<strong>
My statement to you.
Mate,
By totally missing the point you have made it wonderfully.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Oh, OK. I forgot how dumb I am. Thank you very much. Please enlighten us further with your superb academic snobbery.
<strong>1) Actually, Canada has the highest standard of living and currently has the strongest economy in North America. Our life expectancy is second only to Japan - It is now in the 80s while the American average is still approximately 77-78 or so.
2) Is a massacre considered intervention? I don't think I need to bring up Vietnam.
3) How can you claim that the system works if the man who won the elections is not your current president? You can't, because it does not work. It all depends on who can give better head to corporate America.
4) !!!NEWSFLASH!!!!
AMERICA HAS PEOPLE DYING AND STARVING IN THE STREETS! It also has a horrible, for profit healthcare system that helps no one and no social security net.
5) Having a larger and better military does not make your country better, it simply means that your government decides that it is wiser to spend more money on things to kill people than cure and educate them.</strong><hr></blockquote>
1. WHAT??? The strongest economy? Check out the CIA world factbook, and you'll see that Canada's economy doesn't even begin to compare to the US. Try facts next time.
2. You think Bush didn't win? That is a whole other argument. IMO, if anyone tried to steal the election it was Gore, but I'm not getting into that debate again.
3. I agree we have starving, homeless people. But not the tens of millions that a nation such as Iraq, Iran or even North Korea has.
4. Military: And if it wasn't for the US, you wouldn't be here right now. Literally. Flag waiving aside. That is a fact.
You are an idiot.
<strong>"It can't get worse than it is now, right? Just think, in the process you could even win world wide approval and aid for embracing civilized democracy."
This is the most ridiculous thing I've ever hear. Civilized? The U.S. is civilized? I went into a Blimpies the other day to have lunch and Jerry Springer is on TV. There are people screaming at each other. This is little better than a cock fight. Then I go into the laundromat and there's Divorce Court. People are yelling at each other and right in front of a child too. One of the things I was taught was that an adult should never argue in front of a child.
Kids can go into a supermarket and see headlines like "Whitney Houston gets beaten up by drug dealer" or more pictures of JonBenet Ramsey. What kind of lowlife gets off on stories about a child that has been murdered and why is this in the supermarket? I'm not saying that pornography shoold be outlawed but it should only be sold in out of the way places.
Americans make more money and that's about it. To claim that we are civilized is ridiculous.</strong><hr></blockquote>
More civilized than than the Mideast, my friend.
I will hereby dedicate myself to becoming as intelligent as you. But, being the flag waving, Bush voting person I am, I will need to become immortal, so that I might have the time required to overcome my supreme stupidity.
Oh, and this just in:
This thread I have started is beginning to prove a point I only heard put into words the other day: Patriotism is not being taught in our liberal schools, and is now considered to be "taboo" by many. The difference between you and I is that I LIKE being called a flag waiver. I think it is a good thing. I think being patriotic is a GOOD thing. I appreciate the nation I live in. I appreciate my freedoms and a nation that gives me the ability to speak and generally act as I want. I realize that not all places on earth are like this. We have problems, and I know that. But, I truly DO believe we are the "best" nation, so to speak.
The problem in this country is the people that have stopped believing in the greatness of America.
[ 06-03-2002: Message edited by: SDW2001 ]</p>
<strong>
Oh, OK. I forgot how dumb I am. Thank you very much. Please enlighten us further with your superb academic snobbery.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Gladly.
See, you think people look down on the U.S for their superiority.
However,
You´re not superior.
No one will deny that the U.S isn´t the worst country in the world to live in.
However,
The majority of the people on this world hate arrogance. You say you´re a patriot but all you do is tell everyone how superior your country is. That´s not patriotism. If you were to tell me how you love democracy, freedom of speech, New York, your flag, the Grand Canyon, the Rockies etc. Now that would be patriotic.
However,
You tell me how much better your country is than mine. You tell me how much I should be like you and lose my own national pride.
And that, my friend, is what people look down on.
So all the things that you said is not why people poke fun at your country, it´s because you said them. That´s what I meant by you making the point by missing it.
If you want to know the reason for extremists flying planes in to your buildings. Look no further than your continued aid to Israel.
Trust me, the general population of the world does not hate or envy your country. I respect the United States, even if I don´t always agree with it´s policies, I respect them. But it´s Americans like you who confuse patriotism with blatant arrogance that make for the opportunity to have cheap shots at your country.
Finally,
I´m Dutch. We have a lower percentage of teenage pregnancy, poor people and drug addicts in our country than the U.S. Do you think the U.S should be more like the Netherlands in it´s policies regarding these issues?
<strong>It is trendy to be an American against America these days. Why try to make a difference when you can just bitch about it?</strong><hr></blockquote>
I think that´s a cheap comment.
People, Americans, sometimes don´t agree with what your government does. That doesn´t mean they don´t love their country. It actually means they love it enough to care when they see something they don´t agree with.
You can´t expect everyone´s nose to be in the same direction in a democracy. That´s the beauty of it. Everybody gets to disagree with each other so don´t get mad when someone says something you don´t like.
In stead of making the statement you just made why don´t you tell us what you find people shouldn´t complain about, why they shouldn´t and why it is the best way?
No Americans are against America. They would just like to see some changes.
I agree with you though that it´s a bit easy to say what is wrong without giving a proper alternative.
[ 06-03-2002: Message edited by: macvasco ]</p>
<strong>
Patriotism is not being taught in our liberal schools, and is now considered to be "taboo" by many. The difference between you and I is that I LIKE being called a flag waiver. I think it is a good thing. I think being patriotic is a GOOD thing. I appreciate the nation I live in. I appreciate my freedoms and a nation that gives me the ability to speak and generally act as I want. I realize that not all places on earth are like this. We have problems, and I know that.</strong><hr></blockquote>
VERY well said. I experienced this kind of "liberal brainwashing" if you will, first hand. I couldn't stand my own teachers telling me that my country was completely wrong for going into Afghanistan!!! Damn hippies.
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VERY well said. I experienced this kind of "liberal brainwashing" if you will, first hand. I couldn't stand my own teachers telling me that my country was completely wrong for going into Afghanistan!!! Damn hippies.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Patriotism is not something you teach.
Are you proud of your country because of what you like about it or are you proud of your country because of what someone tells you to be proud of?
Teaching Patriotism...Hitler Jugend anyone?
US population: 278,212,552
Netherlands population: 15,983,682
The US has 17 times the population to contend with.
Actually I think it's trendy to be a lets pat ourselves on the back ( without looking at things ) american these days. Especially among young people.
People from the post Regan years don't ask enough questions about their government. Hell a lot of young kids think the Civil War happened in the 1920's so how would they ever get a clear perspective? A lot of back patting and not enough fact finding.
All they hear is " well if it's american it must be good. "
I'm not here to cut down America but, to think we are angels or something is just a lot of hogwash.
pfflam,
Also I didn't say we got here just because things fell into place. I said " A lot of things just fell into place. Like a country with vast natural resources as an example.
I don't hate the U.S. but, I would like to encourage it's future history to be better.
Don't kid youselves our past holds many dark passages. I'd just like people to remember them in the hopes that they don't repeat them. To blindly pat yourself on the back and ignore them almost guarantees their return.
Learn from your mistakes.
Ps. G4Dude,
The electoral college is a joke and they have been talking about revising it ( or doing away with it all together ) for years now. That's both the republicans and the democrats. The last election was a prime example of why. A lot of american's votes didn't account for anything.
That is false. Your border security is your problem. Canada only has jurisdiction over people entering Canada, not leaving it. Of course the Canadian government assists the US in border security. Perhaps if you want more help, you can ask your government representatives to send us some money.
Canada has a weak military because of the small population, uncontested land, military alliances and limited foreign interests, and it has no bearing on terrorists or anyone else entering or leaving the country.
[quote]1. WHAT??? The strongest economy? Check out the CIA world factbook, and you'll see that Canada's economy doesn't even begin to compare to the US. Try facts next time. <hr></blockquote>
It shows stronger growth than yours, I believe, thanks in part to tight management of government finances (we run budget surpluses, not tremendous deficits) and new developments in natural resources.
[quote]4. Military: And if it wasn't for the US, you wouldn't be here right now. Literally. Flag waiving aside. That is a fact. <hr></blockquote>
That is speculation, actually.
The US has plenty of good points; you don't need to bash other countries to find them.