Google clamps down on handset makers to stem Android fragmentation

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  • Reply 81 of 144
    sennensennen Posts: 1,472member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Alfiejr View Post


    this is just the beginning.



    all major Android OEM's - and Facebook - will "fork" Android in the next year or so. coming up with their own unique versions of the OS. independent of Google control. just one sucker will be left as the "official" OEM.



    Whether it plays out like that, I'm not sure, but the thought definitely crossed my mind as I read this news today.
  • Reply 82 of 144
    addaboxaddabox Posts: 12,665member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Alfiejr View Post


    this is just thw beginning.



    all major Android OEM's - and Facebook - will "fork" Android in the next year or so. coming up with their own unique versions of the OS. independent of Google control. just one sucker will be left as the "official" OEM.



    Amazon made this possible. Google's real control point was the Android app store. now there is a better alternative, free of any customization limits.



    Google set up Android to work for the telcos, not the OEM's. now it's payback time.



    fragmentation? you ain't seen nothin' yet!



    Yeah, I was thinking the same thing. The Android store is one of the few choke points Google has, and if the Amazon store does well they've lost that. Think Amazon will care if your handset is running custom Android?



    Google isn't trying to exert control because they care about the "Android experience." They're trying to exert control because they can see a market where there are lots of Android phones sold that don't benefit Google because they're not tied to Google services. That's always going to be the difference between Android and iOS: Google isn't selling phones or giving away an OS, they're enabling a portal for their profitable services. Official Android will only ever be whatever serves that best.
  • Reply 83 of 144
    stourquestourque Posts: 364member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by sprockkets View Post


    They can still use Android, but they know it isn't worth much without the Google services part to it.



    It isn't worth much WITH it.
  • Reply 84 of 144
    alfiejralfiejr Posts: 1,524member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by addabox View Post


    Yeah, I was thinking the same thing. The Android store is one of the few choke points Google has, and if the Amazon store does well they've lost that. Think Amazon will care if your handset is running custom Android?



    Google isn't trying to exert control because they care about the "Android experience." They're trying to exert control because they can see a market where there are lots of Android phones sold that don't benefit Google because they're not tied to Google services. That's always going to be the difference between Android and iOS: Google isn't selling phones or giving away an OS, they're enabling a portal for their profitable services. Official Android will only ever be whatever serves that best.



    correct!
  • Reply 85 of 144
    mdriftmeyermdriftmeyer Posts: 7,503member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by MacRulez View Post


    Yep, everyone but Apple is just plain stupid.





    http://www.idc.com/getdoc.jsp?containerId=prUS22762811



    You show a projection and everyone else shows quarterly returns.



    I know where I place my bet on. It's definitely not on ``projections.''
  • Reply 86 of 144
    This is how Android has that all that market share.... they count all those bastardized versions of it floating around.
  • Reply 87 of 144
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by sprockkets View Post


    They can still use Android, but they know it isn't worth much without the Google services part to it.



    So you're saying 3rd-party Android apps are complete shit. It's good to see you finally admit that.
  • Reply 88 of 144
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by mdriftmeyer View Post


    You show a projection and everyone else shows quarterly returns.



    I know where I place my bet on. It's definitely not on ``projections.''



    He doesn't even acknowledge those projections were based on an "open" Android platform. But that probably never crossed his mind.
  • Reply 89 of 144
    MacProMacPro Posts: 19,773member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Swift View Post


    It remains to be seen. Adding a few interface flourishes isn't a meaningful fork.



    They can make a forking mess though.
  • Reply 90 of 144
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by MacTom View Post


    Seems like Google is learning that user experience becomes much more important than openness. There are always trade-offs, but keeping the customer happy should be the most important.



    "If it's free, then it ain't the product; you are."



    The end-users aren't Google's customers, the handset makers aren't Google's customers; Google's only paying customers are advertisers. They want to control the 'user experience' only so they can control the advertising channels.



    I have to agree with Google on one thing, however: Android is 'open'... in that it makes all of your information 'open' to advertisers.
  • Reply 91 of 144
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by newbee View Post


    [/B]



    Apple makes billions .... and it doesn't behave like Google in any way, shape or form. Do no evil, indeed !



    Yeah, sure.
  • Reply 92 of 144
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Logisticaldron View Post


    So you're saying 3rd-party Android apps are complete shit. It's good to see you finally admit that.



    It's good to see you make an ass out of yourself by posting a strawman argument or even worse, failing to comprehend what I posted.
  • Reply 93 of 144
    aquaticaquatic Posts: 5,602member
    What the heck does everyone here have against Android? What did it do to you!?



    It can only help you. It has lots stuff you don't have (yet) that will be good for you if Apple copies it. Like being able to return apps you don't like. Would you like that? Multitasking, Flash, etc.



    It's the same attacks I've seen against Flash. Lots of hateful posts against Flash. Most are just "I hate it", not even justification like it's slow, eats battery etc. Which by the way neither is true on my Droid 2, works smooth, lasts hours watching vids. I watched several Daily Shows on it yesterday. Right on the full-version website.



    I use Macs because for me they are better than Windows. Not because it's "cooler". Similarly, Android has proved great for me, in many ways doing things iOS can't.



    I hate MS because they are evil as well as having bad products. They crush (crushed) innovation with illegal business practices so it makes sense to root against them (kind of like rooting against the other evil empire, the Yankees). But Google, whether you like it or not, is at least more open than Apple. Maybe not 100% granola-eating GPL3 open. But, want to install an app not on the Market (their App Store)? Just uncheck a button in Prefs that says Only Allow Official Market App installations. More settings. More customization. Widgets. Multiple launchers. Custom ROMs (because it is open source unlike iOS). It's more customizable, that's a fact. There are downsides to this, sure. But I'm getting tired of seeing comment after comment at Apple sites mindlessly bashing Android. Does it have more lag sometimes? Yes. But jeez. The dire predictions for Android could be true. On the other hand it could be Windows of mobile devices. In which case I'll be glad I jumped on board early. YOU WILL BE ASSIMILATED.
  • Reply 94 of 144
    I'm not at all surprised by this. Allowing Microsoft and Facebook to mess around with things totally undermines the entire purpose behind Google's creation of Android. If I was Microsoft, I'd be throwing boatloads of cash at every major OEM to make Bing the default search because it undermines Android.
  • Reply 95 of 144
    charlitunacharlituna Posts: 7,217member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by TBell View Post


    Wow. Isn't that against the principle of open in Google's mind? Google claims the benefit is developers can do what they want with the OS.



    but not when someone wants to cut out Google as the default anything.
  • Reply 96 of 144
    swiftswift Posts: 436member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    I?m not sure I follow. Is WebKit closed in any way?



    Well, I believe source for Webkit is periodically disclosed after a few improvements are made.



    Right now, the Chrome browser is based on Webkit, but they have diverged on certain parts of HTML 5. To understand what Google has done, imagine the stink if Apple said they wanted to approve all changes to Webkit. Bad Hitler Jobs!
  • Reply 97 of 144
    swiftswift Posts: 436member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Mynameisjoe View Post


    I'm not at all surprised by this. Allowing Microsoft and Facebook to mess around with things totally undermines the entire purpose behind Google's creation of Android. If I was Microsoft, I'd be throwing boatloads of cash at every major OEM to make Bing the default search because it undermines Android.



    Isn't what Google just did monopolism? If, in fact, they pull the source access unless they make Google the default, that's using market power in one area to add to dominance in another. That's the core of what Microsoft did: they'd punish any computer maker who decided to manufacture a Linux computer by withdrawing all their Windows licenses.
  • Reply 98 of 144
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Swift View Post


    Isn't what Google just did monopolism? If, in fact, they pull the source access unless they make Google the default, that's using market power in one area to add to dominance in another. That's the core of what Microsoft did: they'd punish any computer maker who decided to manufacture a Linux computer by withdrawing all their Windows licenses.



    It sure sounds like it, but they have an out since they did it before they had a monopoly in the mobile OS market. What MS did was use their actual monopoly in Windows to force down competition with internet browsers. I can't imagine Google could get in trouble for this action.
  • Reply 99 of 144
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Swift View Post


    To understand what Google has done, imagine the stink if Apple said they wanted to approve all changes to Webkit. Bad Hitler Jobs!



    Isn't that why webkit was created in the first place???
  • Reply 100 of 144
    swiftswift Posts: 436member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Aquatic View Post


    What the heck does everyone here have against Android? What did it do to you!?



    It can only help you. It has lots stuff you don't have (yet) that will be good for you if Apple copies it. Like being able to return apps you don't like. Would you like that? Multitasking, Flash, etc.



    It's the same attacks I've seen against Flash. Lots of hateful posts against Flash. Most are just "I hate it", not even justification like it's slow, eats battery etc. Which by the way neither is true on my Droid 2, works smooth, lasts hours watching vids. I watched several Daily Shows on it yesterday. Right on the full-version website.



    I use Macs because for me they are better than Windows. Not because it's "cooler". Similarly, Android has proved great for me, in many ways doing things iOS can't.



    I hate MS because they are evil as well as having bad products. They crush (crushed) innovation with illegal business practices so it makes sense to root against them (kind of like rooting against the other evil empire, the Yankees). But Google, whether you like it or not, is at least more open than Apple. Maybe not 100% granola-eating GPL3 open. But, want to install an app not on the Market (their App Store)? Just uncheck a button in Prefs that says Only Allow Official Market App installations. More settings. More customization. Widgets. Multiple launchers. Custom ROMs (because it is open source unlike iOS). It's more customizable, that's a fact. There are downsides to this, sure. But I'm getting tired of seeing comment after comment at Apple sites mindlessly bashing Android. Does it have more lag sometimes? Yes. But jeez. The dire predictions for Android could be true. On the other hand it could be Windows of mobile devices. In which case I'll be glad I jumped on board early. YOU WILL BE ASSIMILATED.



    Well, I agree. I don't hate Android, or Google, but the alarm bells went off during the I/O conference, when they went on and on about the evil, despotic Apple.



    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=89xc_1Vv69k



    And then, I have serious questions about the monopolistic possibilities of their business model. Yes, giving the system for free (except, uh, "not") to any manufacturer is great -- but the hardware companies should start looking at the "free OS" for what it is: a monopolistic model designed to pull the profits from any of Google's competitors. Will HTC pay for engineers to really make an Android branch, turning it into a compatible but separate OS? Of course not. When you take free gifts, the giver is in total control. So sure, the majority of smartphones is or will become Android very shortly. And the handset makers will be like the computer makers under the thumb of Microsoft. Google will have won this market with a minimal effort in software, and no hardware hassles at all because they don't make it themselves.



    Google has gotten to monopoly status in search, and they're acting, predictably, like Microsoft did, extending that monopoly to other areas to keep all that ad revenue coming in.



    I distrust Google as I distrust any advertising seller. (96% of their revenue is from ads.)



    I frankly prefer Apple's model, of making both the hardware and the OS. I think we'd be much better off if other people imitated that model -- it's called design. One guitar maker makes theirs, and another guitar maker makes another, and you decide which to buy. That's actual competition.



    I know that most techies just luv Google, but I think they're being misled. We'll have to confront a real Dracula in the industry sooner or later.



    But yeah, there are some good Android phones out there.
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