Apple preparing to introduce Sandy Bridge iMacs early next week - sources

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  • Reply 81 of 122
    galto123galto123 Posts: 6member
    It's interesting to go to a conference and sit behind a row of people running Mac laptops.



    You see this wall of mirrors in their laps, and can watch 8 faces from behind, reflected in their screen, as they each bob and weave their heads from side to side to avoid the glare and make out what's on the screen ...



    But man, the colors are great ... at least if you can mentally subtract the reflected image of the room and face from each pixel...



    It illustrates the frivolousness of modern computers; showroom flash is more important than functionality.



    Now for the vigorous defense from Apple shareholders/tulip bulb salesmen:
  • Reply 82 of 122
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by galto123 View Post


    ?[F]lash is more important than functionality.



    I think you just found Adobe?s new slogan.
  • Reply 83 of 122
    tallest skiltallest skil Posts: 43,399member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by galto123 View Post


    FUD and pointless drivel followed by a statement that makes it evident that I couldn't care less what your position is, even though mine is completely and utterly subjective and irrelevant.



    See above.
  • Reply 84 of 122
    oldmacguyoldmacguy Posts: 151member
    I'm old and retired now. I still have a bunch of old OSX apps with limited use to me, and I'm sure as he'll that I'm not going to upgrade them at great cost. Like, my old FileMaker Pro houses my ham radio log of over 10,000 contacts, and I no longer have much use for it other than that. So, unless there is some Rosetta-like app available, I may just have bought my last iMac and OS upgrade.



    I went through this when OS 9 was killed off, and I really don't want to do it again.
  • Reply 85 of 122
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by OldMacGuy View Post


    I'm old and retired now. I still have a bunch of old OSX apps with limited use to me, and I'm sure as he'll that I'm not going to upgrade them at great cost. Like, my old FileMaker Pro houses my ham radio log of over 10,000 contacts, and I no longer have much use for it other than that. So, unless there is some Rosetta-like app available, I may just have bought my last iMac and OS upgrade.



    I went through this when OS 9 was killed off, and I really don't want to do it again.



    I think FMP went Universal as of version 8.5 back in the Summer of 2006. That means you have a version that is well over 5 years old. I don?t think the ?mad? emoticon is apropos when you are using such an old version of the software. They are now on version 11.



    Have you tried to find a cheap copy of version 8.5 or 9.x to allow you to make the transition if needed? Do you really expect Apple to support PPC apps when they announced the switch almost 6 years ago and have been using x86-based machine for over 5 years? How long should Apple support legacy tech and what cost?
  • Reply 86 of 122
    john galtjohn galt Posts: 960member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    I think FMP went Universal as of version 8.5 back in the Summer of 2006. That means you have a version that is well over 5 years old. I don’t think the ‘mad’ emoticon is apropos when you are using such an old version of the software. They are now on version 11.



    Have you tried to find a cheap copy of version 8.5 or 9.x to allow you to make the transition if needed? Do you really expect Apple to support PPC apps when they announced the switch almost 6 years ago and have been using x86-based machine for over 5 years? How long should Apple support legacy tech and what cost?



    Right! Five years old! Make that well over! Six versions out of date! Hurry up and die, old timer!



  • Reply 87 of 122
    sybariticsybaritic Posts: 340member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by mstone View Post


    You really can't depend on any monitor for accurate color when it comes to print. You need to just know color and always sample the ink densities and view the separations in Photoshop. What the composite image looks like can be deceiving especially in the really light and really dark areas. It is still an RGB representation of a CMYK image. The unfortunate thing about print these days is that you can't depend on ink jet proofing either. Because we are so picky about everything we print, I do press proofing. It can get really expensive if you have to start reburning plates. The old Match Print proofing was dead on, but it was slow, expensive and used some nasty chemicals.



    Bottom line is the glossy monitors are not ideal for print but should not be a problem if you know what you are doing.



    As you say, there are inherent limitations when moving from the screen to the page?limitations that entail more than the glossy versus matte issue. I wholeheartedly agree that getting accurate color is not necessarily an easy task. My point is that glossy screens add yet another hurdle to an already challenging endeavor. Your own words are "glossy monitors are not ideal for print." Indeed. For you, they "should not be a problem if you know what you are doing," but to say that they "should not be a problem" is not exactly a resounding endorsement. Case in point, have we ever heard of, read about, or talked to a print designer who clamoured for a lovely piece of glass in front of his or her screen? I know I haven't.
  • Reply 88 of 122
    This is one of the poorest articles I've ever read on this site. You make is sound as though Apple is competing with itself, while at the same time losing to itself. All the time you seem oblivious to the fact that the numbers of desktops sold has steadily been increasing. Look at the Net Income from each source. Sure... you're going to sell more iPads than $3K+ desktops on a unit basis....



    Both have INCREASED IN NUMBERS.



    BTW... BOTH GOOD FOR APPLE....
  • Reply 89 of 122
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Someone just got their 5yo account banned.
  • Reply 90 of 122
    houseleyhouseley Posts: 147member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by mstone View Post


    I used to do that too, however since acquiring my iPad, I rarely use my MBP now except when traveling or giving a presentation.



    My iPad is now my presentation tool of choice - much easier than lugging the MBP around. So I will be moving to an iMac to supplement the iPad very soon as the MBP is almost entirely desk-based these days.
  • Reply 91 of 122
    wizard69wizard69 Posts: 13,377member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by OldMacGuy View Post


    I'm old and retired now. I still have a bunch of old OSX apps with limited use to me, and I'm sure as he'll that I'm not going to upgrade them at great cost.



    I can understand the issues around the expense. Sometimes the software is just way to expensive to justify even using. However you can always roll your own software with SQLite and the programming language of your choosing.



    On the otherhand Apple has been very aggressive in driving down the cost of software. This will eventually impact other vendors, so maybe a suitable database will pop up that is inexpensive.

    Quote:

    Like, my old FileMaker Pro houses my ham radio log of over 10,000 contacts, and I no longer have much use for it other than that.



    Cool! But as you can see once you have only one use for an app it becomes hard to justify the expense. This is where writing your own can help.

    Quote:

    So, unless there is some Rosetta-like app available, I may just have bought my last iMac and OS upgrade.



    Frankly this bothered me a lot as I see this as a terrible attitude to have. You are really punishing yourself.

    Quote:

    I went through this when OS 9 was killed off, and I really don't want to do it again.



    This really isn't the same thing. At least not in my mind
  • Reply 92 of 122
    MarvinMarvin Posts: 14,790moderator
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by john galt View Post


    I think Apple is soon going to offer "cloud" storage for all your local content, which will reduce users' ever-growing mass storage needs.



    Upload speeds will have to get much faster for this to happen (it would take over 5 days straight to upload 60GB on a 1Mbps upload) and I don't think after the recent security breaches in online services that people would be too keen to commit their entire content collections to any company.



    I think Apple's cloud services will be closer to what Google offer e.g Pages, Keynote etc online, personal storage, personal web space. Mostly what they've been doing but this time done properly and more tightly integrated into the iOS devices. Essentially becoming the default filesystem so you'd save a Pages document there and access it on your Mac without the sync headache.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by john galt View Post


    5% may still be significant. The question to ask is when will their desktop segment represent Xserve's share when they dropped it - I'm guessing way less than 5%, probably less than 1%.



    Apple lumped Xserve sales together with "desktops" so I don't know.



    In any event I imagine iMacs and Mac Pros will continue to be sold for a long time.



    Looking back at what has happened until now shows a lot of interesting things.



    In 1999, Apple introduced the 450MHz G4 tower with 128MB RAM, 20GB HDD and 16MB Rage 128 graphics, 100Mbps ethernet, 802.11b wifi.



    All for $2500.



    In 2007, Apple introduced the iPhone with 400MHz CPU, 128MB RAM, 8-16GB storage, 802.11g wifi, 24MB PowerVR GPU.



    All for $500 with maybe 10% of the device being the computer and the rest a giant battery.



    That was just 8 years of progress. So if we assume that the graphics and CPU power of today's entry Mac Pro will make it into the iPhone in 8 years, that's going to make for some very interesting changes.



    It will have the equivalent of a quad 3GHz CPU, 4GB RAM, 512GB-1TB solid state storage, a GPU faster than the 6750M in the higher-end MBPs, all using passive cooling.



    It may be that computer parts become so inexpensive that Apple just end up selling a bunch of different monitors with computers inside because ultimately people will always need monitors - when you think about it, the display is the most important part of the machine as it's the part we engage with the most.



    What I certainly see happening when it comes to the iMac is a race to the bottom. They can't keep high performance parts out of the low-end forever and when the low-end gets quad cores with Ivy Bridge in Jan 2012, I suspect people will gravitate more and more to the lower-end machines and the Mini is going to look more and more attractive to people the more diverse their display requirements get.



    We haven't heard much about a Mini update but it can be updated alongside the iMac. Being so close to WWDC, I wonder if any updates will come before then. After all, they are introducing Lion so why bring out new products now when they have to update to a new OS in 4 weeks? They can just ship the machines with the new OS.
  • Reply 93 of 122
    mimacmimac Posts: 872member
    I do wish Apple would kill this constant debate over the reflective properties of the iMac screen and just install non-reflective museum glass on all iMacs.



    End of.
  • Reply 94 of 122
    john galtjohn galt Posts: 960member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Marvin View Post


    Upload speeds will have to get much faster for this to happen (it would take over 5 days straight to upload 60GB on a 1Mbps upload)



    Sure, but no one accumulates 60 GB worth of stuff all at once. The necessity to back up things like one's music collection and iMovie projects makes local storage unwieldy.



    I can see Apple offering an essentially expanded version of Mobile Me, combined with something that works in the background, like Time Machine. Offline storage can occur incrementally, like Time Machine, at a nominal cost (perhaps about 99¢/GB, annually?) It makes sense to me, and isn't far from what you envisioned either:



    Quote:

    Essentially becoming the default filesystem so you'd save a Pages document there and access it on your Mac without the sync headache.



    Exactly!



    Quote:

    It may be that computer parts become so inexpensive that Apple just end up selling a bunch of different monitors with computers inside because ultimately people will always need monitors - when you think about it, the display is the most important part of the machine as it's the part we engage with the most.



    In essence, that describes an iMac already. What you gain with an iMac is more power-hungry components, a full size monitor and keyboard. MacBooks and iMacs are little more than single-board computers plus some peripherals anyway.



    Basically, the purchase decision for an iMac vs. a MacBook becomes a choice of how big a display one needs. Of course higher performance is easier to achieve in a desktop that can consume 242W all day long. A laptop must be designed to run for most of a business day, all other design elements are secondary concerns.



    Quote:

    After all, they are introducing Lion so why bring out new products now when they have to update to a new OS in 4 weeks? They can just ship the machines with the new OS.



    They've done this routinely. New machines will come with a coupon for a free upgrade to Lion. The timing is right - graduation presents etc.
  • Reply 95 of 122
    ssquirrelssquirrel Posts: 1,196member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Marvin View Post


    Looking back at what has happened until now shows a lot of interesting things.



    In 1999, Apple introduced the 450MHz G4 tower with 128MB RAM, 20GB HDD and 16MB Rage 128 graphics, 100Mbps ethernet, 802.11b wifi.



    All for $2500.



    In 2007, Apple introduced the iPhone with 400MHz CPU, 128MB RAM, 8-16GB storage, 802.11g wifi, 24MB PowerVR GPU.



    All for $500 with maybe 10% of the device being the computer and the rest a giant battery.



    That was just 8 years of progress. So if we assume that the graphics and CPU power of today's entry Mac Pro will make it into the iPhone in 8 years, that's going to make for some very interesting changes.



    It will have the equivalent of a quad 3GHz CPU, 4GB RAM, 512GB-1TB solid state storage, a GPU faster than the 6750M in the higher-end MBPs, all using passive cooling.




    The graphics found in the iPhone 4 are way beyond those found in a 16MB Rage 128 GPU. GPU and CPU power have both increased in a massive way and while the megahertz numbers are close, I'm willing to bet that the 400MHz arm chip along with its RAM and GPU is getting more done than the 450MHz G4 system was. I think your assumption of mobile phone tech 8 years from now is also woefully undervalued. The next Snapdragon cpu is a dual core 2.5GHz and comes out later this year or early next year. Not saying Snapdragons are the equal of desktop CPUs, but the mobile area has some pretty insane competition and a high level of R&D right now.
  • Reply 96 of 122
    xsuxsu Posts: 401member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by MiMac View Post


    I do wish Apple would kill this constant debate over the reflective properties of the iMac screen and just install non-reflective museum glass on all iMacs.



    End of.



    Just apply a layer of anti-reflection coating should solve the problem nicely. I think people would willingly spend 50-100 more for it.
  • Reply 97 of 122
    mactacmactac Posts: 315member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by wizard69 View Post


    Second; I can actually see a resurgence in Mac sales, especially desktop machines when people start to realize that an iMac and an iPad make for an excellent combo. Laptops are extremely compromised on the desktop yet many people don't need a full blown laptop for their portable needs. For those people an iPad 2 is now enough machine ot handle their portable needs.



    In any event please get a grip, as long as the Mac line is profitable and out growing the market in general desktop machines will still be part of the line up.



    Without a mid range monitor-less Mac I'm close to saying goodbye to Apple after 18 years. No amount of portable/mobile products will make me want a glossy screen all in one. Apple needs a new cube with more features than what you get on an iMac or mini.
  • Reply 98 of 122
    hmurchisonhmurchison Posts: 12,354member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by MacTac View Post


    Without a mid range monitor-less Mac I'm close to saying goodbye to Apple after 18 years. No amount of portable/mobile products will make me want a glossy screen all in one. Apple needs a new cube with more features than what you get on an iMac or mini.



    No one wants a Cube anymore. Consumers want simplicity which is why the All in One shape whether it be laptop or desktop sales in bundles.



    Appreciate the 18 years but you are part of an infinitesimal niche in this area. Those that need a headless desktop get the Mac Pro
  • Reply 99 of 122
    mstonemstone Posts: 11,510member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by galto123 View Post


    I've been in computers since soldering together my first Heathkit H8 in 1976 ... hard-core users are now marginalized in Apple's profit margin as we move toward cartoon-like, grossly simplified interfaces. Hiding complexity from ignorant users with simple needs is the be-all and end-all.



    I know, sometimes it irritates me. For example the other day I needed to get a lot of emails out of the database to send a bulk email (legal kind to some select customers.) I wrote a script to format them the way I wanted with semicolon between the addresses. When I pasted them into Apple Mail.app I realized that Apple had modified my txt and put commas in between each address but didn't remove the semicolons so of course it didn't work and there is no control. So I had to go back to the list and remove the delimiters altogether so Apple could put their own commas in. What a nuisance. Stop helping me. If I want help I'll ask for it.
  • Reply 100 of 122
    tallest skiltallest skil Posts: 43,399member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by MacTac View Post


    Without a mid range monitor-less Mac I'm close to saying goodbye to Apple after 18 years. No amount of portable/mobile products will make me want a glossy screen all in one. Apple needs a new cube with more features than what you get on an iMac or mini.



    Eighteen years? So you've held on to your Quadra for that amount of time? Apple hasn't put out a "mid-range" monitor-less computer since Steve came back and axed the old lines.
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