Why oh why can't Apple just not "be different" and bite the bullet on this one. Just have the OS X security update actually SCAN the bloody Mac, let you know what it has or hasn't found, and let you know WHEN it updated the latest malware definitions. And guess what, sorry, but your Mac will have to frequently (ie. daily) check for definitions and scan the Mac.
It was only a matter of time before the malicious hackers targeted the Mac and the time has come for Apple to mosey on up to the plate and "do" antivirus.
I was presented with a gentlemen's bet today that MS' stock would out perform Apple's in the next 12 months. His reasoning was that Macs aren't as configurable and when he wants to play a video game on a 'PC' he can turn off processes and adjust drivers to suit his needs. He's one of my oldest friends, works for Fortune 500 company in IT, and has absolutely no idea what the average consumer does with a computer.
My mentioning of MS' apex position for the major products, Apple's growth in all major product categories, Activity Monitor in Mac OS allowing you to delete processes (or the silliness of having to in Windows), or his preference for playing games on mostly a console, iPad or iPhone(WwF) couldn't make him reconsider his position that MS was ripe to outperform Apple. I guess we shall see. Note, he's made a killing off my AAPL recommendations years ago.
My goodness. The only thing preventing me from taking my Windows "gaming" PC and throwing it out the window is:
1. Even my two-year-old (mid-end at the time) GPU on my PC is still better than Xbox360 graphics
2. Xbox360 is not available officially in my country right now for whatever insane reason
3. PS3 has absolutely hideous graphics
4. My 21" screen has no HDMI
5. That is all
I can tell you there are definitely times when games crash on my PC, drivers don't work and cause gaming glitches, where I've been really close to just giving up and getting a grey-market Xbox360. I've been real close.
Not to mention all the poor PC porting jobs the big game publishers have done. The PC is such an afterthought in their grand scheme of things. And running an AMD CPU as well, there's been a few cases of lagginess because most of the PC "development" is done on Intel quad-core machines. Not that the horsepower is needed, it's just glitches or poor threading, etc. where they just assume every PC gamer has a quad-core *Intel* CPU.
Quote:
Originally Posted by snova
Besides, I personally prefer unprotected sex with someone I trust.
Good for you. I'm nowhere near trusting anyone that much. A lot of things can go wrong with contraceptive pills and so on. Then again, I've never been in a long-term relationship. May be related to the trust issue. *DING* *LIGHT BULB* So that's what I've been doing wrong!
"Honey, why do you always rub me down with alcohol wipes before we get nasty?"
Despite IVK's rant, he does have a point; MS is very good about reacting to security issues on windows (then again, they have to be). I think Apple can definitely take a page from MS in this regard.
Quote:
Originally Posted by nvidia2008
I can tell you there are definitely times when games crash on my PC, drivers don't work and cause gaming glitches, where I've been really close to just giving up and getting a grey-market Xbox360. I've been real close.
Not to mention all the poor PC porting jobs the big game publishers have done. The PC is such an afterthought in their grand scheme of things. And running an AMD CPU as well, there's been a few cases of lagginess because most of the PC "development" is done on Intel quad-core machines. Not that the horsepower is needed, it's just glitches or poor threading, etc. where they just assume every PC gamer has a quad-core *Intel* CPU.
Sounds like that PC might have some issues; I have an AMD based gaming rig that I've been using for the past 2 years, and its been pretty rock solid. I have to agree with you on the crappy console ports though. Its unfortunate, but you really can't blame them. The fact that the masses will happily pre-order a $60 game before even trying it doesn't help the situation either.
Sounds like that PC might have some issues; I have an AMD based gaming rig that I've been using for the past 2 years, and its been pretty rock solid. I have to agree with you on the crappy console ports though. Its unfortunate, but you really can't blame them. The fact that the masses will happily pre-order a $60 game before even trying it doesn't help the situation either.
What CPU exactly are you using? Quad core? Nvidia card?
Yeah I don't get the pre-ordering. I usually wait for reviews, even better, discounts on Steam. Starcraft2 was excellent, Portal2 was satisfying, as was DeadSpace2 (though quite disturbing)... NFS:Shift was poor, NFS:Hot Pursuit fairly trashy. I'll pass on Brink and Space Marine. Not too sure about Crysis2. Next up is Duke Nukem... Yes I'll be a sucker for that one just for nostalgia's sake even though it could be crap. But like I said, I might wait for some reviews. I hope Deus Ex lives up to at least most of it's hype.
so let me get this straight. You are saying Mac OS X users are more vulnerable to catching viruses then Windows users because they trust their OS environment more than Windows users?
sorry, looks like i forgot to ad, of all people that get the prompt, more * percent* of people who us OSX are likely to blindly push yes to install.
Do you have selective reading? Even if an vulnerability isn't exploited, Apple still leaves it open and slowly patches these problems. Stop being so defensive about Apple, it's healthy to admit they could take security more seriously. For a company that claims to have the most "secure operating system" they really don't if you look at the whole picture. Is that hard to comprehend?
I agree that everyone should take security more seriously. My point was to question the authority of the assumption that the only reason that Macs don't have the same problems PCs do is that there are fewer of them. You don't object to questioning authority do you? I think we should always question our assumptions.
Soooo....Apple used to be defined as better as it had better hardware (PPC)....but then with the switch to Intel it's now the same HW as PC's. Then they were defined as better because they didn't get viruses.....but now they do. Then they were defined as better because OS X offered a better experience. Perhaps for now. Although if I had a nickel for everytime Safari crashed... And Lion looks like another sub par release that will take 9 point upgrades to be what it should have been on the day of release.
I agree that everyone should take security more seriously. My point was to question the authority of the assumption that the only reason that Macs don't have the same problems PCs do is that there are fewer of them. You don't object to questioning authority do you? I think we should always question our assumptions.
There was a paper written back in 2008 that predicted Mac malware would start appearing once Apple's OS had 16% marketshare (or thereabouts). Eerily accurate with those market percentages just recently being realized in a few countries.
Soooo....Apple used to be defined as better as it had better hardware (PPC)....but then with the switch to Intel it's now the same HW as PC's. Then they were defined as better because they didn't get viruses.....but now they do. Then they were defined as better because OS X offered a better experience. Perhaps for now. Although if I had a nickel for everytime Safari crashed... And Lion looks like another sub par release that will take 9 point upgrades to be what it should have been on the day of release.
Hold up.
Does having the same CPU as your competitors make the HW equal? I personally don't think individual components define great HW. Great HW is the sum of its parts, the level of integration and the overall industrial design. For example, A Toyota Camry engine in a Lotus Evora sportscar, is not the same thing as a Toyota Camera family car.
The Mac is not better because it does not get virus. The Mac is better because the LIKELIHOOD of getting one is so small compared to a PC.
I am not sure what is up with your Mac OS X installation or if it is just me. However, my experience is quite different from yours. I use Safari all day long with dozens of tabs open and I don't honestly recall Safari ever crashing on me. Then again, to be fair, I have a flash blocker and Ad Block enabled to allow me to manage what content is rendered by Safari. I don't know if this difference from stock has anything to do with the issues you are experiencing. Perhaps other who run stock Safari can share their experience.
Not sure I am following your insight into why Lion will be a sub par release. However, I can tell you this. In this industry credibility means a lot. It is hard to build up and its is very easy to lose with sub-par product releases. Apple understands this and thus has a very good record. I cant say that about some of its competitors.
So the question to you is.. what would motivate Apple to risk its credibility and good record of producing solid products by releasing a sub par Lion release? Is it the imminent threat from competition like Windows 8?
What CPU exactly are you using? Quad core? Nvidia card?
Yeah I don't get the pre-ordering. I usually wait for reviews, even better, discounts on Steam. Starcraft2 was excellent, Portal2 was satisfying, as was DeadSpace2 (though quite disturbing)... NFS:Shift was poor, NFS:Hot Pursuit fairly trashy. I'll pass on Brink and Space Marine. Not too sure about Crysis2. Next up is Duke Nukem... Yes I'll be a sucker for that one just for nostalgia's sake even though it could be crap. But like I said, I might wait for some reviews. I hope Deus Ex lives up to at least most of it's hype.
Its a Phenom II X4 920 @ 3.2Ghz, so yea, quad core. Its mated with an ATi Radeon 4870 @ 815Mhz Core, 925Mhz Mem
Yeah, I pretty much only buy games when they go on discount on Steam these days. I felt that Starcraft 2 had a lackluster single player experience; multiplayer is great, but I got bored of it pretty fast. I'm actually looking forward to Space Marine; Relic has done a great job so far with the WH40K IP, so I want to see what they can do with that IP in this genre. Duke Nukem should be a nice refreshing change of pace in a sea of 'realistic warfare' shooters; I hope it lives up to the hype. Other than that, the only other games really on my radar are Diablo 3 and Mass Effect 3.
There was a paper written back in 2008 that predicted Mac malware would start appearing once Apple's OS had 16% marketshare (or thereabouts). Eerily accurate with those market percentages just recently being realized in a few countries.
"Eerily accurate" to you only. You seem to have an annoying habit of providing links or figures that are... interesting... but stretch the truth somewhat. ie. Eerily inaccurate.
Can you name even one country with a Mac installed base of 16% ?
"Eerily accurate" to you only. You seem to have an annoying habit of providing links or figures that are... interesting... but stretch the truth somewhat. ie. Eerily inaccurate.
Can you name even one country with a Mac installed base of 16% ?
Yup. Switzerland with over 17%. . .
followed by Luxembourg with 15.8, the US with 15.4 and Iceland with 15.2. All three of the latter meet my "thereabouts", which also still meets the figures mentioned in the linked article. With a quick Google search you could have found those yourself Piot.
Not the first time you've made accusations with nothing to back them up. But I'm sure you mean well.
There was a paper written back in 2008 that predicted Mac malware would start appearing once Apple's OS had 16% marketshare (or thereabouts). Eerily accurate with those market percentages just recently being realized in a few countries.
I'm not sure if you're trolling or if you really believe half the stuff you write but in case it's the latter you should realize that 1) all computers viruses are malware but not all malware are virus (in fact most aren't), 2) Apple's been fighting malware since the 70s, 3) the biggest change to Mac OS' radar the mindshare causing the "sky to fall" just like it did over the external antennae and consolidated.db when others with much larger marketshare get to skate on by.
If you're ignorant enough to install something on you computer that just 'pops up', then you deserve the outcome. What boggles my mind is how people get crap on their Macs ... YOU HAVE TO INSTALL IT! It's not like Window's where crap can seep through from many holes.
Don't EVER install anything you didn't initiate and all is good in the world of Mac.
Its not that they're ignorant, they just believe the endless claims of "you'll never ever never never never get a virus or spyware"
I'm not sure if you're trolling or if you really believe half the stuff you write but in case it's the latter you should realize that 1) all computers viruses are malware but not all malware are virus (in fact most aren't), 2) Apple's been fighting malware since the 70s, 3) the biggest change to Mac OS' radar the mindshare causing the "sky to fall" just like it did over the external antennae and consolidated.db when others with much larger marketshare get to skate on by.
Surprised to see that from you Solipsism. Where did I mention viruses? And why imply I don't know about hair of the dog logic? Not all malware is a virus? Really? I didn't write either of the articles. In fact I saw the first one featured in an article at a Mac site a couple weeks ago. Perhaps they were trolling as well.
I was presented with a gentlemen's bet today that MS' stock would out perform Apple's in the next 12 months.
Works in IT? Typical. I hope you took that bet.
I made a similar one with a friend who bet me his 100 shares of HP were set to pop last December. I bet him I'll make more money on a single share of AAPL. On that day HPQ was $42.70 and AAPL, $307. The bet was loser pays the difference 6 months later. He thought it would be the easiest money he'd ever make. I knew it would be like taking candy from a baby.
OK, so I only made $40 on my single lousy share. Meanwhile, he's lost $628 Which will be over $1250... once he pays me (I'm not holding my breath).
Edit, I forgot HP pays dividends. So he's only lost $620
followed by Luxembourg with 15.8, the US with 15.4 and Iceland with 15.2. All three of the latter meet my "thereabouts", which also still meets the figures mentioned in the linked article. With a quick Google search you could have found those yourself Piot.
The problem with your "quick Google search" is that you have failed (not for the first time) to understand or properly interpret the results. Web site stats is NOT the same as installed base.
Quote:
Not the first time you've made accusations with nothing to back them up. But I'm sure you mean well.
You're the one making the (frequent) claims "backed up" by unrelated links and vague figures. I am not the only person who has noticed this.
There are plenty of people with lots of common sense who get all flustered and make the wrong choice when computers are involved. I know many older people who are quite wise, and just want to use their computer for a few basic tasks like reading email, web browsing, and shopping a bit. When they encounter a PayPal phishing scam they sometimes fail to realize what's happening and make a mistake. Most of us geeks can recognize a phishing scam, but that doesn't mean that a less experienced person lacks common sense or is an idiot.
In any case, even people who are not smart don't deserve to be taken advantage of. I see so many posts that begin with "if you're stupid enough to...then you deserve..." People who can't see a problem with that attitude may lack a moral compass.
++++1 Well said, I'll add that I'll take Apple's garden any day!
Comments
It was only a matter of time before the malicious hackers targeted the Mac and the time has come for Apple to mosey on up to the plate and "do" antivirus.
I was presented with a gentlemen's bet today that MS' stock would out perform Apple's in the next 12 months. His reasoning was that Macs aren't as configurable and when he wants to play a video game on a 'PC' he can turn off processes and adjust drivers to suit his needs. He's one of my oldest friends, works for Fortune 500 company in IT, and has absolutely no idea what the average consumer does with a computer.
My mentioning of MS' apex position for the major products, Apple's growth in all major product categories, Activity Monitor in Mac OS allowing you to delete processes (or the silliness of having to in Windows), or his preference for playing games on mostly a console, iPad or iPhone(WwF) couldn't make him reconsider his position that MS was ripe to outperform Apple. I guess we shall see. Note, he's made a killing off my AAPL recommendations years ago.
My goodness. The only thing preventing me from taking my Windows "gaming" PC and throwing it out the window is:
1. Even my two-year-old (mid-end at the time) GPU on my PC is still better than Xbox360 graphics
2. Xbox360 is not available officially in my country right now for whatever insane reason
3. PS3 has absolutely hideous graphics
4. My 21" screen has no HDMI
5. That is all
I can tell you there are definitely times when games crash on my PC, drivers don't work and cause gaming glitches, where I've been really close to just giving up and getting a grey-market Xbox360. I've been real close.
Not to mention all the poor PC porting jobs the big game publishers have done. The PC is such an afterthought in their grand scheme of things. And running an AMD CPU as well, there's been a few cases of lagginess because most of the PC "development" is done on Intel quad-core machines. Not that the horsepower is needed, it's just glitches or poor threading, etc. where they just assume every PC gamer has a quad-core *Intel* CPU.
Besides, I personally prefer unprotected sex with someone I trust.
Good for you. I'm nowhere near trusting anyone that much. A lot of things can go wrong with contraceptive pills and so on. Then again, I've never been in a long-term relationship. May be related to the trust issue. *DING* *LIGHT BULB* So that's what I've been doing wrong!
"Honey, why do you always rub me down with alcohol wipes before we get nasty?"
I can tell you there are definitely times when games crash on my PC, drivers don't work and cause gaming glitches, where I've been really close to just giving up and getting a grey-market Xbox360. I've been real close.
Not to mention all the poor PC porting jobs the big game publishers have done. The PC is such an afterthought in their grand scheme of things. And running an AMD CPU as well, there's been a few cases of lagginess because most of the PC "development" is done on Intel quad-core machines. Not that the horsepower is needed, it's just glitches or poor threading, etc. where they just assume every PC gamer has a quad-core *Intel* CPU.
Sounds like that PC might have some issues; I have an AMD based gaming rig that I've been using for the past 2 years, and its been pretty rock solid. I have to agree with you on the crappy console ports though. Its unfortunate, but you really can't blame them. The fact that the masses will happily pre-order a $60 game before even trying it doesn't help the situation either.
Sounds like that PC might have some issues; I have an AMD based gaming rig that I've been using for the past 2 years, and its been pretty rock solid. I have to agree with you on the crappy console ports though. Its unfortunate, but you really can't blame them. The fact that the masses will happily pre-order a $60 game before even trying it doesn't help the situation either.
What CPU exactly are you using? Quad core? Nvidia card?
Yeah I don't get the pre-ordering. I usually wait for reviews, even better, discounts on Steam. Starcraft2 was excellent, Portal2 was satisfying, as was DeadSpace2 (though quite disturbing)... NFS:Shift was poor, NFS:Hot Pursuit fairly trashy. I'll pass on Brink and Space Marine. Not too sure about Crysis2. Next up is Duke Nukem... Yes I'll be a sucker for that one just for nostalgia's sake even though it could be crap. But like I said, I might wait for some reviews. I hope Deus Ex lives up to at least most of it's hype.
so let me get this straight. You are saying Mac OS X users are more vulnerable to catching viruses then Windows users because they trust their OS environment more than Windows users?
sorry, looks like i forgot to ad, of all people that get the prompt, more * percent* of people who us OSX are likely to blindly push yes to install.
thanks for catching that
Do you have selective reading? Even if an vulnerability isn't exploited, Apple still leaves it open and slowly patches these problems. Stop being so defensive about Apple, it's healthy to admit they could take security more seriously. For a company that claims to have the most "secure operating system" they really don't if you look at the whole picture. Is that hard to comprehend?
I agree that everyone should take security more seriously. My point was to question the authority of the assumption that the only reason that Macs don't have the same problems PCs do is that there are fewer of them. You don't object to questioning authority do you? I think we should always question our assumptions.
I agree that everyone should take security more seriously. My point was to question the authority of the assumption that the only reason that Macs don't have the same problems PCs do is that there are fewer of them. You don't object to questioning authority do you? I think we should always question our assumptions.
There was a paper written back in 2008 that predicted Mac malware would start appearing once Apple's OS had 16% marketshare (or thereabouts). Eerily accurate with those market percentages just recently being realized in a few countries.
http://www.securitymetrics.org/conte....0/j3attAO.pdf
Also a good read, from two years ago:
http://db.tidbits.com/article/10321
Soooo....Apple used to be defined as better as it had better hardware (PPC)....but then with the switch to Intel it's now the same HW as PC's. Then they were defined as better because they didn't get viruses.....but now they do. Then they were defined as better because OS X offered a better experience. Perhaps for now. Although if I had a nickel for everytime Safari crashed... And Lion looks like another sub par release that will take 9 point upgrades to be what it should have been on the day of release.
Hold up.
Does having the same CPU as your competitors make the HW equal? I personally don't think individual components define great HW. Great HW is the sum of its parts, the level of integration and the overall industrial design. For example, A Toyota Camry engine in a Lotus Evora sportscar, is not the same thing as a Toyota Camera family car.
The Mac is not better because it does not get virus. The Mac is better because the LIKELIHOOD of getting one is so small compared to a PC.
I am not sure what is up with your Mac OS X installation or if it is just me. However, my experience is quite different from yours. I use Safari all day long with dozens of tabs open and I don't honestly recall Safari ever crashing on me. Then again, to be fair, I have a flash blocker and Ad Block enabled to allow me to manage what content is rendered by Safari. I don't know if this difference from stock has anything to do with the issues you are experiencing. Perhaps other who run stock Safari can share their experience.
Not sure I am following your insight into why Lion will be a sub par release. However, I can tell you this. In this industry credibility means a lot. It is hard to build up and its is very easy to lose with sub-par product releases. Apple understands this and thus has a very good record. I cant say that about some of its competitors.
So the question to you is.. what would motivate Apple to risk its credibility and good record of producing solid products by releasing a sub par Lion release? Is it the imminent threat from competition like Windows 8?
Then they were defined as better because they didn't get viruses.....but now they do.
Really? OS X gets viruses? What are they?
What CPU exactly are you using? Quad core? Nvidia card?
Yeah I don't get the pre-ordering. I usually wait for reviews, even better, discounts on Steam. Starcraft2 was excellent, Portal2 was satisfying, as was DeadSpace2 (though quite disturbing)... NFS:Shift was poor, NFS:Hot Pursuit fairly trashy. I'll pass on Brink and Space Marine. Not too sure about Crysis2. Next up is Duke Nukem... Yes I'll be a sucker for that one just for nostalgia's sake even though it could be crap. But like I said, I might wait for some reviews. I hope Deus Ex lives up to at least most of it's hype.
Its a Phenom II X4 920 @ 3.2Ghz, so yea, quad core. Its mated with an ATi Radeon 4870 @ 815Mhz Core, 925Mhz Mem
Yeah, I pretty much only buy games when they go on discount on Steam these days. I felt that Starcraft 2 had a lackluster single player experience; multiplayer is great, but I got bored of it pretty fast. I'm actually looking forward to Space Marine; Relic has done a great job so far with the WH40K IP, so I want to see what they can do with that IP in this genre. Duke Nukem should be a nice refreshing change of pace in a sea of 'realistic warfare' shooters; I hope it lives up to the hype. Other than that, the only other games really on my radar are Diablo 3 and Mass Effect 3.
There was a paper written back in 2008 that predicted Mac malware would start appearing once Apple's OS had 16% marketshare (or thereabouts). Eerily accurate with those market percentages just recently being realized in a few countries.
"Eerily accurate" to you only. You seem to have an annoying habit of providing links or figures that are... interesting... but stretch the truth somewhat. ie. Eerily inaccurate.
Can you name even one country with a Mac installed base of 16% ?
"Eerily accurate" to you only. You seem to have an annoying habit of providing links or figures that are... interesting... but stretch the truth somewhat. ie. Eerily inaccurate.
Can you name even one country with a Mac installed base of 16% ?
Yup. Switzerland with over 17%. . .
followed by Luxembourg with 15.8, the US with 15.4 and Iceland with 15.2. All three of the latter meet my "thereabouts", which also still meets the figures mentioned in the linked article. With a quick Google search you could have found those yourself Piot.
Not the first time you've made accusations with nothing to back them up. But I'm sure you mean well.
There was a paper written back in 2008 that predicted Mac malware would start appearing once Apple's OS had 16% marketshare (or thereabouts). Eerily accurate with those market percentages just recently being realized in a few countries.
http://www.securitymetrics.org/conte....0/j3attAO.pdf
Also a good read, from two years ago:
http://db.tidbits.com/article/10321
So there was a paper written AFTER malware existed on Mac OS that claims malware will start appearing on Mac OS? That's a Nostradumbass
Here is one example (I only need one): OSX.RSPlug.A Trojan Horse, circa 2007.
I'm not sure if you're trolling or if you really believe half the stuff you write but in case it's the latter you should realize that 1) all computers viruses are malware but not all malware are virus (in fact most aren't), 2) Apple's been fighting malware since the 70s, 3) the biggest change to Mac OS' radar the mindshare causing the "sky to fall" just like it did over the external antennae and consolidated.db when others with much larger marketshare get to skate on by.
If you're ignorant enough to install something on you computer that just 'pops up', then you deserve the outcome. What boggles my mind is how people get crap on their Macs ... YOU HAVE TO INSTALL IT! It's not like Window's where crap can seep through from many holes.
Don't EVER install anything you didn't initiate and all is good in the world of Mac.
Its not that they're ignorant, they just believe the endless claims of "you'll never ever never never never get a virus or spyware"
So there was a paper written AFTER malware existed on Mac OS that claims malware will start appearing on Mac OS? That's a Nostradumbass
Here is one example (I only need one): OSX.RSPlug.A Trojan Horse, circa 2007.
I'm not sure if you're trolling or if you really believe half the stuff you write but in case it's the latter you should realize that 1) all computers viruses are malware but not all malware are virus (in fact most aren't), 2) Apple's been fighting malware since the 70s, 3) the biggest change to Mac OS' radar the mindshare causing the "sky to fall" just like it did over the external antennae and consolidated.db when others with much larger marketshare get to skate on by.
Surprised to see that from you Solipsism. Where did I mention viruses? And why imply I don't know about hair of the dog logic? Not all malware is a virus? Really? I didn't write either of the articles. In fact I saw the first one featured in an article at a Mac site a couple weeks ago. Perhaps they were trolling as well.
http://mobile.macworld.co.uk/mac/new...newsid=3279373
I was presented with a gentlemen's bet today that MS' stock would out perform Apple's in the next 12 months.
Works in IT? Typical. I hope you took that bet.
I made a similar one with a friend who bet me his 100 shares of HP were set to pop last December. I bet him I'll make more money on a single share of AAPL. On that day HPQ was $42.70 and AAPL, $307. The bet was loser pays the difference 6 months later. He thought it would be the easiest money he'd ever make. I knew it would be like taking candy from a baby.
OK, so I only made $40 on my single lousy share. Meanwhile, he's lost $628
Edit, I forgot HP pays dividends. So he's only lost $620
Making money on AAPL is easier than making toast.
Yup. Switzerland with over 17%. . .
followed by Luxembourg with 15.8, the US with 15.4 and Iceland with 15.2. All three of the latter meet my "thereabouts", which also still meets the figures mentioned in the linked article. With a quick Google search you could have found those yourself Piot.
The problem with your "quick Google search" is that you have failed (not for the first time) to understand or properly interpret the results. Web site stats is NOT the same as installed base.
Not the first time you've made accusations with nothing to back them up. But I'm sure you mean well.
You're the one making the (frequent) claims "backed up" by unrelated links and vague figures. I am not the only person who has noticed this.
Do I "mean well"? No, not really.
There are plenty of people with lots of common sense who get all flustered and make the wrong choice when computers are involved. I know many older people who are quite wise, and just want to use their computer for a few basic tasks like reading email, web browsing, and shopping a bit. When they encounter a PayPal phishing scam they sometimes fail to realize what's happening and make a mistake. Most of us geeks can recognize a phishing scam, but that doesn't mean that a less experienced person lacks common sense or is an idiot.
In any case, even people who are not smart don't deserve to be taken advantage of. I see so many posts that begin with "if you're stupid enough to...then you deserve..." People who can't see a problem with that attitude may lack a moral compass.
++++1 Well said, I'll add that I'll take Apple's garden any day!