1) Technically 3Mbps is two DS-1(T1 lines) and is slightly over 3Mbps. This is a solid connection and the not the shared, burst connections of consumer DSL, cable, or cellular.
2) Lion is 3.6 gigabytes which is 29491.20 megabits. Divide that by 3 equals 9,830.40 seconds; divide that by 60 equals 163.84 minutes; divide that by 60 equals is under 3 hours.
3) Now that you have the file you can follow any one of the many simple instructions to create a bootable installer.
My real world experience is different from your theoretical. My Comcast at home is multiple times faster than any of my clients with T1s. Many is the time I've been at a client's downloading updates after midnight wishing I had the connection I enjoy at home.
Consultants are usually $100 or more. Who wants to sit around for three hours while the client is looking at you and their watch.
So I burned the Lion installer to a DVD as it won't fit on a formatted 4GB USB flash drive. It seems Apple has also eliminated the Password reset utility one of the reasons I rely on DVDs.
To the person who said my client didn't try very hard to get a faster Internet connection than the T1, which also tees off to provide phone capability, you're right. Unfortunately, Comcast wanted $20,000 for the install. That was a deal breaker.
Not a fan. I know it's the 'way of the future' but we are too reliant on the internet and this software distribution model. I prefer to have the software on a format that is unlikely to fail.
Unfortunately, Comcast wanted $20,000 for the install. That was a deal breaker.
?? Where the heck are you? At the top of a granite mountain? I switched a non profit I support from a $1300 a month fractional T1 where their Internet would cut in half as more phone lines were used to a $300 a month Comcast account with the same number of phone lines and 20Mbits symmetrical.
They were prepared to trench, but since the building was new (as was the parking lot!) I worked with the facilities person and the Comcast line techs to find the conduit that was there, waiting to be used.
Mind you, if they had to they would have trenched - at no cost.
Retail stores have had 2 options for an office suite. Microsoft Office, or iWork. While iWork can be purchased from the App store, when a sales person is selling a machine, they are likely going to recommend an office suite for you. Your boxed choices, that the sales rep could make money on, were iWork or Office. Now, the only choice they have to push is Office. Once someone buys Office, they have little incentive to shell out extra cash at the app store for iWork pieces. This is a likely step backwards for adoption of the Apple software, even if only by a few points.
I totally agree. But in spite of the fact that they're pushing iPads, iPods and iPhones into every retail environment possible, they're helping to kill retail by taking software away from them. I don't mind the presence of the app store, but especially for large apps, I would still like the option of buying a CD at retail, even if its only 3rd party retail. It also raises my cost because many third parties slightly discount Apple software, which they'll no longer be able to do since they won't have it.
In many ways, this is a step backwards IMO and another reflection of Apple's arrogance. Although off-topic, I think Apple's decision not to support the MDP in the new monitor is completely absurd. It's not like the MDP was some industry legacy standard - it was Apple's (for all practical purposes) proprietary video output. Apple only wants to sell new monitors to its newest customers? Couldn't they at least come up with a conversion cable?
Yup - paying less, getting a product faster and cutting out unnecessary middle-men is definitely a step backwards!
Quote:
IMO and another reflection of Apple's arrogance.
Huh? Improving your service and charging less is arrogance? We need more arrogance then!
Quote:
Although off-topic, I think Apple's decision not to support the MDP in the new monitor is completely absurd. It's not like the MDP was some industry legacy standard - it was Apple's (for all practical purposes) proprietary video output. Apple only wants to sell new monitors to its newest customers? Couldn't they at least come up with a conversion cable?
You do realize that Apple isn't the only purveyor of monitors, right? I think the way to look at the new Thunderbolt monitor isn't so much as an Apple display but a docking station. I doubt any vendor other than Apple would have aggressively released such a display right now - probably the only reason they are still in the monitor biz.
Your boxed choices, that the sales rep could make money on, were iWork or Office. Now, the only choice they have to push is Office. .
Not at all. They can certainly push iWork, which you would get via the MAS. Okay so it means that the sales person at Best Buy just lost $60 in sales but they can make up for it with a nice overpriced HDMI cable or something,
I think this could have downsides from a strategic perspective, and I hope Apple took them into account.
The biggest one I am thinking of is that this could adversely influence sales. Specifically, it could hurt conversions to Mac. Buyers are often not technologically sophisticated, and the concept of having to download your software can be quite daunting to them. In addition, many people don't have decent high-speed internet, especially rural areas. My wife's mother, for instance, lives across the puget sound from Seattle, yet cannot get a major provider for high speed internet. Her only option is from a regional provider who wants to charge $59 a month for what most providers sell for $19.95... so she is still using dial-up. For users like this - those who have poor or no high-speed service, and for those who are simply unsophisticated... this will be a major turn-off. Many will be swayed by the lack of any software on shelves, many will be frustrated at the prospect of paying for software and then having to pay to download it - in both time and service charges. I would predict that the average PC user would view this as a deterrent for switching, and many first time buyers would see it as daunting.
Overall, I think it isn't the safest direction at the moment.
I thought the same when music downloads first came along - absolutely hated the idea of not owning something physical.
Once I got over that, it's given me no problems at all. In practice, my music is much safer now than it was, in that I have it on the hard drive of my Mac, and the Time Machine drive, whereas I only used to have one copy of a very damageable CD.
The thing I will miss is mindless browsing of the shelves in a software shop, but I'll get over that as well.
- I still hate the idea of not owning something physical (98 per cent of my music is bought on CD) and all software for my mac were until now bought at the apple retail store close to where I live.
I would certainly be willing to pay extra to get a physical support for my mac software, including Mac OS lion. I am disappointed that that option will no longer be available.
- I HATE the trend of the new mac without, at least, an internal optical drive option. I still user my optical drive a lot and I can't believe I am the only one. I hope that the Macbook pro will have that option for internal drive (not looking forward to have to buy an external drive).
Apple assumes that everyone has a decent internet connection with limitless download package.
It looks like media-less software and content model is forced down our throat.
At least with music and films, we still have the option of buying physical media (lets hope it is not going to stop).
People don't appreciate software out-dating their hardware, especially those that don't wish to upgrade (eg. Seniors). The "dwindling few" get created everytime that happens, and I think Apple thinks three years is being generous. If you bought the last PowerPC, SL left you in the dust. now Lion is leaving Leopard in the dust. In PC world, you could still run stuff, it would just be slower, but Apple moves much faster. If they move too fast, they essentially need to rewin their customers every 3 years. "Switch to PC" campaigns would probably work as easily as "Switch to Mac".
As much as I hate Windows, if it is the only alternative to have an internal optical drive on my future laptop, I will be seriously tempted to switch back.
Not a fan. I know it's the 'way of the future' but we are too reliant on the internet and this software distribution model. I prefer to have the software on a format that is unlikely to fail.
I agree with you and what if the person does not own a credit card they are screwed completely like myself.This procedure of Apple stinks!
This sort of thing has happened before. First the floppy drive, people were so upset with that.
Packaged software may have its audience for a while but it will be the minority and since it will cost more, they will eventually be eclipsed.
It is very costly to everyone to buy software in a box only to have to download tons of updates shortly after. Not to mention the convenience and instant gratification of downloaded software, music etc.
What is your deal with CDs? CDs have always been problem free for me unless someone badly scratched it up. I've had more issues with DVDs than CDs. CDs have a lot more redundancy on it than a DVD does. Now 3.5" floppies (not 5.25") back in the day used to be very problematic for me.
If it's that big of a deal get the USB stick edition of Lion then.
It's not a deal to me, I intend to download, and make copies of the installer, I don't want to be reliant on having a internet connection to reload my computer. And to let you know, I've had more USB sticks fail than DVD's.
And I don't care how people want to get their copy, download, USB stick what ever. I just don't like wildy incorrect statements like the internet being more reliable
Comments
1) Technically 3Mbps is two DS-1(T1 lines) and is slightly over 3Mbps. This is a solid connection and the not the shared, burst connections of consumer DSL, cable, or cellular.
2) Lion is 3.6 gigabytes which is 29491.20 megabits. Divide that by 3 equals 9,830.40 seconds; divide that by 60 equals 163.84 minutes; divide that by 60 equals is under 3 hours.
3) Now that you have the file you can follow any one of the many simple instructions to create a bootable installer.
My real world experience is different from your theoretical. My Comcast at home is multiple times faster than any of my clients with T1s. Many is the time I've been at a client's downloading updates after midnight wishing I had the connection I enjoy at home.
Consultants are usually $100 or more. Who wants to sit around for three hours while the client is looking at you and their watch.
So I burned the Lion installer to a DVD as it won't fit on a formatted 4GB USB flash drive. It seems Apple has also eliminated the Password reset utility one of the reasons I rely on DVDs.
To the person who said my client didn't try very hard to get a faster Internet connection than the T1, which also tees off to provide phone capability, you're right. Unfortunately, Comcast wanted $20,000 for the install. That was a deal breaker.
Not a fan. I know it's the 'way of the future' but we are too reliant on the internet and this software distribution model. I prefer to have the software on a format that is unlikely to fail.
Same here.
CD's fail more often than the Internet.
Incorrect. The internet as a whole? Well, sure. The server you're trying to download from? Or Verizon DSL? No, they would lose.
Unfortunately, Comcast wanted $20,000 for the install. That was a deal breaker.
?? Where the heck are you? At the top of a granite mountain? I switched a non profit I support from a $1300 a month fractional T1 where their Internet would cut in half as more phone lines were used to a $300 a month Comcast account with the same number of phone lines and 20Mbits symmetrical.
They were prepared to trench, but since the building was new (as was the parking lot!) I worked with the facilities person and the Comcast line techs to find the conduit that was there, waiting to be used.
Mind you, if they had to they would have trenched - at no cost.
Retail stores have had 2 options for an office suite. Microsoft Office, or iWork. While iWork can be purchased from the App store, when a sales person is selling a machine, they are likely going to recommend an office suite for you. Your boxed choices, that the sales rep could make money on, were iWork or Office. Now, the only choice they have to push is Office. Once someone buys Office, they have little incentive to shell out extra cash at the app store for iWork pieces. This is a likely step backwards for adoption of the Apple software, even if only by a few points.
I totally agree. But in spite of the fact that they're pushing iPads, iPods and iPhones into every retail environment possible, they're helping to kill retail by taking software away from them. I don't mind the presence of the app store, but especially for large apps, I would still like the option of buying a CD at retail, even if its only 3rd party retail. It also raises my cost because many third parties slightly discount Apple software, which they'll no longer be able to do since they won't have it.
In many ways, this is a step backwards IMO and another reflection of Apple's arrogance. Although off-topic, I think Apple's decision not to support the MDP in the new monitor is completely absurd. It's not like the MDP was some industry legacy standard - it was Apple's (for all practical purposes) proprietary video output. Apple only wants to sell new monitors to its newest customers? Couldn't they at least come up with a conversion cable?
In many ways, this is a step backwards
Yup - paying less, getting a product faster and cutting out unnecessary middle-men is definitely a step backwards!
IMO and another reflection of Apple's arrogance.
Huh? Improving your service and charging less is arrogance? We need more arrogance then!
Although off-topic, I think Apple's decision not to support the MDP in the new monitor is completely absurd. It's not like the MDP was some industry legacy standard - it was Apple's (for all practical purposes) proprietary video output. Apple only wants to sell new monitors to its newest customers? Couldn't they at least come up with a conversion cable?
You do realize that Apple isn't the only purveyor of monitors, right? I think the way to look at the new Thunderbolt monitor isn't so much as an Apple display but a docking station. I doubt any vendor other than Apple would have aggressively released such a display right now - probably the only reason they are still in the monitor biz.
Your boxed choices, that the sales rep could make money on, were iWork or Office. Now, the only choice they have to push is Office. .
Not at all. They can certainly push iWork, which you would get via the MAS. Okay so it means that the sales person at Best Buy just lost $60 in sales but they can make up for it with a nice overpriced HDMI cable or something,
The biggest one I am thinking of is that this could adversely influence sales. Specifically, it could hurt conversions to Mac. Buyers are often not technologically sophisticated, and the concept of having to download your software can be quite daunting to them. In addition, many people don't have decent high-speed internet, especially rural areas. My wife's mother, for instance, lives across the puget sound from Seattle, yet cannot get a major provider for high speed internet. Her only option is from a regional provider who wants to charge $59 a month for what most providers sell for $19.95... so she is still using dial-up. For users like this - those who have poor or no high-speed service, and for those who are simply unsophisticated... this will be a major turn-off. Many will be swayed by the lack of any software on shelves, many will be frustrated at the prospect of paying for software and then having to pay to download it - in both time and service charges. I would predict that the average PC user would view this as a deterrent for switching, and many first time buyers would see it as daunting.
Overall, I think it isn't the safest direction at the moment.
I thought the same when music downloads first came along - absolutely hated the idea of not owning something physical.
Once I got over that, it's given me no problems at all. In practice, my music is much safer now than it was, in that I have it on the hard drive of my Mac, and the Time Machine drive, whereas I only used to have one copy of a very damageable CD.
The thing I will miss is mindless browsing of the shelves in a software shop, but I'll get over that as well.
- I still hate the idea of not owning something physical (98 per cent of my music is bought on CD) and all software for my mac were until now bought at the apple retail store close to where I live.
I would certainly be willing to pay extra to get a physical support for my mac software, including Mac OS lion. I am disappointed that that option will no longer be available.
- I HATE the trend of the new mac without, at least, an internal optical drive option. I still user my optical drive a lot and I can't believe I am the only one. I hope that the Macbook pro will have that option for internal drive (not looking forward to have to buy an external drive).
Apple assumes that everyone has a decent internet connection with limitless download package.
It looks like media-less software and content model is forced down our throat.
At least with music and films, we still have the option of buying physical media (lets hope it is not going to stop).
People don't appreciate software out-dating their hardware, especially those that don't wish to upgrade (eg. Seniors). The "dwindling few" get created everytime that happens, and I think Apple thinks three years is being generous. If you bought the last PowerPC, SL left you in the dust. now Lion is leaving Leopard in the dust. In PC world, you could still run stuff, it would just be slower, but Apple moves much faster. If they move too fast, they essentially need to rewin their customers every 3 years. "Switch to PC" campaigns would probably work as easily as "Switch to Mac".
As much as I hate Windows, if it is the only alternative to have an internal optical drive on my future laptop, I will be seriously tempted to switch back.
Not a fan. I know it's the 'way of the future' but we are too reliant on the internet and this software distribution model. I prefer to have the software on a format that is unlikely to fail.
I agree with you and what if the person does not own a credit card they are screwed completely like myself.This procedure of Apple stinks!
Packaged software may have its audience for a while but it will be the minority and since it will cost more, they will eventually be eclipsed.
It is very costly to everyone to buy software in a box only to have to download tons of updates shortly after. Not to mention the convenience and instant gratification of downloaded software, music etc.
CD's fail more often than the Internet.
What is your deal with CDs? CDs have always been problem free for me unless someone badly scratched it up. I've had more issues with DVDs than CDs. CDs have a lot more redundancy on it than a DVD does. Now 3.5" floppies (not 5.25") back in the day used to be very problematic for me.
If it's that big of a deal get the USB stick edition of Lion then.
It's not a deal to me, I intend to download, and make copies of the installer, I don't want to be reliant on having a internet connection to reload my computer. And to let you know, I've had more USB sticks fail than DVD's.
And I don't care how people want to get their copy, download, USB stick what ever. I just don't like wildy incorrect statements like the internet being more reliable
The boxed version of iLife '11 includes iDVD and iWeb. But these applications don't seem to be available on the App Store.
Boxed versions of Aperture included sample projects and photos. Does the App Store version of Aperture include these?