Apple still pushing for $1.5 trillion US overseas profit tax holiday

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  • Reply 121 of 161
    inkswampinkswamp Posts: 337member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Orangeoutsider View Post


    Written like a true pinko, commie, socialist.



    You forgot "gay," "godless" and "pot-smoking."
  • Reply 122 of 161
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post


    With an estimated $1.5 trillion in foreign profits at stake, Apple and other tech companies have continued to show support for an overseas profit tax holiday for U.S. corporations.








    Pay your goddamned taxes, Apple. Just like The Rest Of Us.
  • Reply 123 of 161
    There is so much vicious hatred for corporations and rich people.



    Look through these posts in this thread and see all the threats to confiscate 70% of this money, imprison executives, "...stick it to..." corporations, etc. This is not the dialog of a free and peace loving people. It is the venom of hateful, selfish, and mis-informed individuals.
  • Reply 124 of 161
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    What supporting evidence does one require for a personal opinion?



    Some opinions are based upon a careful analysis of facts. Others are based upon mistaken misapprehensions of total and complete bullshit, lies and propaganda.



    Without supporting evidence, an opinion is best ignored.
  • Reply 125 of 161
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by huntercr View Post




    Senator Bernie Sander's list of top 10 companies who are cheating and avoiding income tax:




    But isn't he a socialist? We don't even have to consider the facts he cites, given his political party.



    </sarcasm>
  • Reply 126 of 161
    scafe2scafe2 Posts: 61member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by studiomusic View Post


    What's 5% of $1.5 trillion?

    Much better than 0% of $1.5 trillion.



    I agree, a little bit of something is a lot better than a lot of nothing
  • Reply 127 of 161
    ahmlcoahmlco Posts: 432member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by MDCragg View Post


    This is not the dialog of a free and peace loving people. It is the venom of hateful, selfish, and mis-informed individuals.



    Or the dialog of people who are sick and tired of having jobs off-shored, pay cut, benefits slashed, and watching unemployment numbers skyrocket while the top US corporations enjoy record year-over-year profits, all while paying no taxes. (Exxon)



    Or the dialog of people who are tired of watching a few at the very top walk away with a multi-million dollar golden parachute after basically destroying the companies they were hired with great fanfare to run. (Carly, Lee, et al)



    Or the dialog of people tired of watching corporations beg to be deregulated, and then begging to be bailed out by the government after they've screwed up the world economy, all because they're "too big to fail." (Goldman, BA)



    Or the dialog of people tired of watching corporations bitch and moan about having to comply with clean air and water laws, or complaining about having to clean up their mess after spilling oil all through the Gulf of Mexico. (Koch, BP)



    Or the dialog of people tired of having their "leaders' bought and paid for by multi-national corporations and lobbyists.



    Or... you get the idea.
  • Reply 128 of 161
    The sad part is that looks like the Democrates will cave AGAIN on this soon. The Republicans, they're always opposing taxes, right or wrong, so no surprise they'd want to support this tax holiday for the big corporations thing. But the Democrates, these guys have become slaves of the big corporations. There's nobody who's looking for the people.



    Now before those who come and tell me that these companies will invest in US if they get this tax holiday, this is the biggest pile of BS and we all know it. Just look at the treasury yields nowadays, these guys are piling all thier cash in US onto treasuries right now, why would they suddenly 'invest' if they're allowed to bring the overseas money in?
  • Reply 129 of 161
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by ahmlco View Post


    Or the dialog of people who are sick and tired of having jobs off-shored, pay cut, benefits slashed, and watching unemployment numbers skyrocket while the top US corporations enjoy record year-over-year profits, all while paying no taxes. (Exxon)



    Or the dialog of people who are tired of watching a few at the very top walk away with a multi-million dollar golden parachute after basically destroying the companies they were hired with great fanfare to run. (Carly, Lee, et al)



    Or the dialog of people tired of watching corporations beg to be deregulated, and then begging to be bailed out by the government after they've screwed up the world economy, all because they're "too big to fail." (Goldman, BA)



    Or the dialog of people tired of watching corporations bitch and moan about having to comply with clean air and water laws, or complaining about having to clean up their mess after spilling oil all through the Gulf of Mexico. (Koch, BP)



    Or the dialog of people tired of having their "leaders' bought and paid for by multi-national corporations and lobbyists.



    Or... you get the idea.



    Okay lets stop the off-shoring by turning the US into a bastion of anti-corporate vitriol and heavy-handed regulation. That will get them to create jobs here. How ridiculous.



    As far as people walking away with golden parachutes...it's the business of the shareholders and nobody else. If you don't like the way a corporation pays its executives either buy their stock and vote against the current leaders or just stop buying goods or services from them...enrich their competitors.



    Yeah right...companies like Apple are "screwing up the world" and letting leftists dominate them is what will work. Please. For you to even say that corporations are "screwing up the world" proves my point that your beliefs are based on nothing but irrational hatred.



    Reasonable levels of environmental regulation are fine but it gets out of hand and you and I end up paying for it in the end when the costs are passed on to us. Leftists use the desire for a clean environment as a reason to regulate practically everything everybody does. You let irresponsible sensationalist "journalism" about things like the BP oil spill make you believe things are much worse than they really were and thus you make yourself vulnerable to all this mindless anti-corporate leftist ideology. That spill was no way near as bad as what it was made out to be and BP cleaned it up...yet you still sit around spewing hatred for them for the whole thing. For God's sake let it go.



    The fact that leaders can and do get bought and paid for by corporations is one of the best arguments I know of for limited government that requires and receives far smaller amounts of tax "revenue" than what we currently have. If our leaders really don't have much power then there really isn't that much there to "buy" if you are an unscrupulous corporation then is there. It's only through massive nearly-all-powerful government that unscrupulous corporations have a "vehicle" for cronyism and bailouts and stimulus funds and what have you. Shrink government and shrink their life-blood in tax revenues and then corporations will have to earn their money...which is a good thing.



    You are motivated by irrational hatred for corporations and the rich. There are excellent arguments in opposition to everything you stated but you choose to reject them all in favor of hatred and misinformation.
  • Reply 130 of 161
    msm859msm859 Posts: 18member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by MDCragg View Post


    That is a very good point...America has been sliding more and more toward a more socialist model over the last 30 or 40 years. Which proves my point...because we have also been sliding further and further into debt.



    I would hardly call European health care systems economically efficient ones though that provide excellent care and should thus serve as a model for ours. Keep in mind that all across Europe there is a growing wave of government spending shortfalls to the point where citizens are rioting in the streets at proposed austerity measures.



    I would disagree that we have been moving towards a more socialist model OR that is why we are sliding further into debt. In 2000 we had a budget surplus. If we had truly conservative republicans in power they would have wisely used that to start paying down the debt. Instead we had fools who wanted to "starve the beast" - the government - and in response to the CBO saying the Bush tax cuts would add a trillion dollars to the deficit said "deficits don't matter". Along with these expensive and unnecessary wars IS WHY we are sliding further into debt. Taxes are TOO low. Let ALL of the Bush tax cuts expire, and end these wars. That is what we need to do to start turning things around.
  • Reply 131 of 161
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by drobforever View Post


    The sad part is that looks like the Democrates will cave AGAIN on this soon. The Republicans, they're always opposing taxes, right or wrong, so no surprise they'd want to support this tax holiday for the big corporations thing. But the Democrates, these guys have become slaves of the big corporations. There's nobody who's looking for the people.



    Now before those who come and tell me that these companies will invest in US if they get this tax holiday, this is the biggest pile of BS and we all know it. Just look at the treasury yields nowadays, these guys are piling all thier cash in US onto treasuries right now, why would they suddenly 'invest' if they're allowed to bring the overseas money in?



    They're not investing in America and in jobs here because they are afraid of draconian federal regulations like Obamacare. All this anti-corporate, pro-leftist, heavy-handed regulation, and pro-tax policy has created an America where no sane business would want to invest its capital. Is this so hard to see or understand?



    If you want to understand the economy always try to understand the incentives or dis-incentives that are created by things like government policies.
  • Reply 132 of 161
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by msm859 View Post


    I would disagree that we have been moving towards a more socialist model OR that is why we are sliding further into debt. In 2000 we had a budget surplus. If we had truly conservative republicans in power they would have wisely used that to start paying down the debt. Instead we had fools who wanted to "starve the beast" - the government - and in response to the CBO saying the Bush tax cuts would add a trillion dollars to the deficit said "deficits don't matter". Along with these expensive and unnecessary wars IS WHY we are sliding further into debt. Taxes are TOO low. Let ALL of the Bush tax cuts expire, and end these wars. That is what we need to do to start turning things around.



    Nonsense...higher taxes depress economic activity which leads to LESS tax revenue flowing into the government. Yes, the Republicans under Bush spent way to much but that is a spending problem not a "revenue" problem.



    The Democrats just rammed Obamacare down the throats of the American people through sickening parliamentary tricks and you say we are not sliding toward socialism? Are you kidding me?



    Granted...the wars were expensive but to say they were unnecessary is naive as hell. What would YOU have done to defend the US? This is a whole rat-hole of dialog we can agree to disagree on though because we will be here all week. The wars though are not the major driving cause of our massive levels of debt...maybe try to trillions of "stimulus" and bailout dollars that were wasted in the last few years.



    You will not create a flourishing business economy in America through massive taxation and draconian anti-corporate regulation. Period. All you create is a bloated and overly-powerful federal government with a bunch of corrupt crony'ists and a business climate that our job creators will flee en masse.
  • Reply 133 of 161
    msm859msm859 Posts: 18member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by MDCragg View Post


    Germany is a successful country but even in your post you had to agree that it is largely a capitalist economy and arguments to that effect "have merit". I appreciate that you offered an apparently reasoned opinion but if all you can name is one successful country that is largely capitalist but with a fair number of socialist programs it's hardly much of a defense of socialism.



    Your original post said, "name one" so I did.

    Actually the larger point I was trying to make had to do with the label "socialism" that most people misuse. I am not against capitalism -- I am against unbridled/unregulated capitalism. Remember capitalist believe "Greed" is good. While it is certainly a motivator, it is a two edged sword that is also bad. I believe capitalism has to be checked. I believe is Bad for society to have a CEO who makes 500 times what his average employ makes -- in a public corporation. I believe universal health care would be good for society. 50 years ago we were the nation that said we were going to put a man on the moon - and did it! Today we can't agree on whether we should pay our past debt. The rest of the world is leaving us behind on health care, education, fighting climate change, transportation, etc.

    RIP the Empire of the United States 2001.
  • Reply 134 of 161
    kerrybkerryb Posts: 270member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by BenRoethig View Post


    It brings the money home and gives it to people like Steve Jobs who aren't hurting for money instead of the people now struggling to feed their families because their jobs are being shipped overseas to slave labor factories.



    which have proven over the last 15 years that there is more profit to made by investing in factories oversees and not in the USA. I wish our government would invest in small businesses, time after time new jobs come from grassroots economic growth. Corporations are mature, go where labor is cheaper and taxes are lower. A small business immediately pumps tax money into a local economy and will hire within that community. Congress has got this all backwards and either has no knowledge of economic history or more sadly in the pockets of such international corporation.
  • Reply 135 of 161
    ahmlcoahmlco Posts: 432member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by MDCragg View Post


    Japan but they are struggling with their "lost decade" due to their socialist programs.



    Lost Decade (Japan)



    The strong economic growth of the 1980s ended abruptly at the start of the 1990s. In the late 1980s, abnormalities within the Japanese economic system had fueled a massive wave of speculation by Japanese companies, banks and securities companies. A combination of exceptionally high land values and exceptionally low interest rates briefly led to a position in which credit was both easily available and extremely cheap. This led to massive borrowing, the proceeds of which were invested mostly in domestic and foreign stocks and securities.



    Recognizing that this bubble was unsustainable, the Finance Ministry sharply raised interest rates in late 1989. This abruptly terminated the bubble, leading to a massive crash in the stock market. It also led to a debt crisis; a large proportion of the debts that had been run up turned bad, which in turn led to a crisis in the banking sector, with many banks being bailed out by the government.

    Michael Schuman of Time magazine noted that banks kept injecting new funds into unprofitable "zombie firms" to keep them afloat, arguing that they were too big to fail. However, most of these companies were too debt-ridden to do much more than survive on further bailouts, which led to an economist describing Japan as a "loser's paradise." Schuman states that Japan's economy did not begin to recover until this practice had ended.



    Eventually, many became unsustainable, and a wave of consolidation took place, resulting in only four national banks in Japan. Critically for the long-term economic situation, it meant many Japanese firms were burdened with massive debts, affecting their ability for capital investment. It also meant credit became very difficult to obtain, due to the beleaguered situation of the banks; even now the official interest rate is at 0.1%[3] and has been for several years. Many borrowers turned to Sarakin for loans.



    This led to the phenomenon known as the "lost decade", when economic expansion came to a total halt in Japan during the 1990s. The impact on everyday life was muted, however. Unemployment ran rather high, but not at crisis levels. This has combined with the traditional Japanese emphasis on frugality and saving to produce a quite limited impact on the average Japanese family, which continues much as it did in the period of the miracle.



    ***



    Looks to me that it was massive over-speculation by Japanese companies, banks and securities companies. (Ring any bells?) Not "socialist programs."
  • Reply 136 of 161
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by msm859 View Post


    Your original post said, "name one" so I did.

    Actually the larger point I was trying to make had to do with the label "socialism" that most people misuse. I am not against capitalism -- I am against unbridled/unregulated capitalism. Remember capitalist believe "Greed" is good. While it is certainly a motivator, it is a two edged sword that is also bad. I believe capitalism has to be checked. I believe is Bad for society to have a CEO who makes 500 times what his average employ makes -- in a public corporation. I believe universal health care would be good for society. 50 years ago we were the nation that said we were going to put a man on the moon - and did it! Today we can't agree on whether we should pay our past debt. The rest of the world is leaving us behind on health care, education, fighting climate change, transportation, etc.

    RIP the Empire of the United States 2001.



    If the rest of the world is leaving us behind on things like wasting money on phantom things like climate change (which has been thoroughly debunked) then that is a good thing.
  • Reply 137 of 161
    ahmlcoahmlco Posts: 432member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by MDCragg View Post


    Nonsense...higher taxes depress economic activity which leads to LESS tax revenue flowing into the government. Yes, the Republicans under Bush spent way to much but that is a spending problem not a "revenue" problem.



    Spending is spending is spending. Going into debt to finance spending is a problem, "revenue" or not.

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by MDCragg View Post


    The Democrats just rammed Obamacare down the throats of the American people through sickening parliamentary tricks...



    Wisconsin, anyone? Then there the minor matter of holding the entire country ransom over the debt issue. (Kind of like a child throwing a tantrum until his demands are met.)



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by MDCragg View Post


    Granted...the wars were expensive but to say they were unnecessary is naive as hell. What would YOU have done to defend the US?



    I wasn't aware Iraq was invading the US. The towers came down and very nearly the first thing out of Bush's mouth was (and I paraphrase), "How can we pin this on Iraq?" 9/11 was a tragedy, but nearly every other civilized country on the planet treats terrorism as criminal issue. We drop bombs.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by MDCragg View Post


    ...maybe try to trillions of "stimulus" and bailout dollars that were wasted in the last few years.



    Like the stimulus dollars wasted by the Bush Tax cuts? Or the TARP funds that were signed into law by U.S. President George W. Bush on October 3, 2008, and 99% of which have been repaid?



    Selective memory is a wonderful thing...
  • Reply 138 of 161
    ahmlcoahmlco Posts: 432member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by MDCragg View Post


    If the rest of the world is leaving us behind on things like wasting money on phantom things like climate change (which has been thoroughly debunked) then that is a good thing.



    Was going to continue, but that changed my mind. There's political discussion, and then there's political fanaticism...
  • Reply 139 of 161
    In response to ahmlco...



    Spending is spending is spending. Going into debt to finance spending is a problem, "revenue" or not.

    ...okay...so lets cut spending...for real...not just cut the rate of growth in spending.





    Wisconsin, anyone? Then there the minor matter of holding the entire country ransom over the debt issue. (Kind of like a child throwing a tantrum until his demands are met.)

    ...In the last paragraph you said spending is a problem yet in this paragraph you say those who wanted to cut spending were "holding the country ransom" or "throwing a tantrum". So which is it? Do you want somebody to really fight for spending cuts or not?





    I wasn't aware Iraq was invading the US. The towers came down and very nearly the first thing out of Bush's mouth was (and I paraphrase), "How can we pin this on Iraq?" 9/11 was a tragedy, but nearly every other civilized country on the planet treats terrorism as criminal issue. We drop bombs.

    ...Germany didn't attack us at Pearl Harbor but they needed to be taken down along with Japan. You see, we had to provoke the enemy into a fight with our military somewhere "over there" than have them continue their terrorist attacks on the US unabated. Iraq was a good choice given Hussein's long history of belligerence and use of WMD. Where did you get that "...pin this on Iraq..." quote anyways?





    Like the stimulus dollars wasted by the Bush Tax cuts? Or the TARP funds that were signed into law by U.S. President George W. Bush on October 3, 2008, and 99% of which have been repaid?

    ...so a tax cut...which leaves money in the hands of the private sector is somehow wrong but for the government to take the money via taxes but turn around and put it back into the economy via stimulus is somehow good? That is oxymoronic.
  • Reply 140 of 161
    Hey all...I am getting tired of this reading and typing. We will have to agree to disagree. The points made in response to me about Germany and Japan were about the best but I don't think they are an indictment of capitalism. If I don't respond it doesn't mean I am conceding anything...it just means I have other things to do.



    If you are Apple fans you may find it amusing to know that I got so much into these comments today because my work computer which runs on Windows XP was freezing up repeatedly today so I had time on my hands to argue in this forum.
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