If Apple does that, then they might as well name it Logic Amateur X. You're right that the average person won't notice the difference between a 256 AAC and a non compressed audio file, but anybody with Pro ears would notice it right away
Ever tried A/B testing between the too?
If not, then you are not qualified to speak of what a "professional" will notice.
If Apple does that, then they might as well name it Logic Amateur X. You're right that the average person won't notice the difference between a 256 AAC and a non compressed audio file, but anybody with Pro ears would notice it right away, and Logic is supposed to be for professionals, hence the word "Pro" in Logic Pro.
It's entirely possible that Apple would implement a system like that in place for Garageband right now: if your system doesn't have the loops/samples, it pops up and tells you that (and how big the download'll be), whereupon you can click a button and the catalog of audio downloads in the background. You can go about your merry way recording stuff or doing other things on your computer, and it'll populate as files download.
If Apple does that, then they might as well name it Logic Amateur X. You're right that the average person won't notice the difference between a 256 AAC and a non compressed audio file, but anybody with Pro ears would notice it right away, and Logic is supposed to be for professionals, hence the word "Pro" in Logic Pro.
Don't forget THE LISTENERS ARE AMATEURS! Who do you compose for? Professionals? No. We do music for PEOPLE, and they listen to music via iPod or iPhone with 128k MP3 ~ 256k AAC.
A/B testing won't uncover differences that appear when you apply EQ, compression, time/pitch stretch and other processing. 256 AAC is a great consumer delivery format but a professional composer does NOT want it for source material.
I hope that they don't make it more iOS like, so common amateurs and everyday fools can use it. There had better not be "smart instruments" like iOS garageband has. I guess I'll just have to wait and see what it looks like when details get released, but I just might be sticking with Logic 9 for awhile.
Yeah I hate it when Apple makes stuff easier to use. Umm hello Apple, real tools make work harder not easier! That's why we make tools, to limit fields to only people that can manage to overcome the extra challenge!
Don't forget THE LISTENERS ARE AMATEURS! Who do you compose for? Professionals? No. We do music for PEOPLE, and they listen to music via iPod or iPhone with 128k MP3 ~ 256k AAC.
Actually, the only person I have to please is myself. I couldn't give two craps about the listeners. People shouldn't make products and art solely based on what the average person wants and Pros shouldn't sacrifice quality because the average person doesn't know what quality is. Somebody might as well become a prostitute if they sacrifice quality in their productions, because that's exactly what somebody is if they choose to go that route, they're a whore, a sellout and a streetwalker with HIV would be making a more honorable living.
A/B testing won't uncover differences that appear when you apply EQ, compression, time/pitch stretch and other processing. 256 AAC is a great consumer delivery format but a professional composer does NOT want it for source material.
That is true. When manipulating audio, you want to work from the best source material that you can get your hands on, in other words, uncompressed audio.
Yeah I hate it when Apple makes stuff easier to use. Umm hello Apple, real tools make work harder not easier! That's why we make tools, to limit fields to only people that can manage to overcome the extra challenge!
And if they dumb it down so much that a bunch of essential features are missing that nobody can no longer access, then that would count as an epic fail.
Certain things aren't meant to be easy. If somebody is dumb or has a hard time learning, then there are plenty of more amateurish apps and easier to use apps which would suit their needs and their 'talent' much better.
I think the comments that they will do the same as they did with FC are way off base.
In the case of FCX they had to go to 64 bit but it's obvious they couldn't do it without throwing much of the code out and starting from scratch. There are a few exceptions, but for the most part it seems like features dropped in FCX were done because they couldn't get them recreated in the new code base, and many are planned to return eventually when they have time to get around to it.
Logic has been 64 bit for a year and a half. A few features are missing in the 64 bit version (and hopefully those will be back in Logic 10), but there's no reason for more features to go away like happened with FC. FC can't run 32 bit plugins, Logic has a 32 bit bridge. The ugly 64 bit transition already happened to Logic. And it really wasn't that ugly.
And from what I've heard, the next major Logic update is not any time soon. Definitely in the works, but nowhere near completion.
The fact that FCPX is even mentioned here as some sore to corollary scenario makes it very evident that people don't even understand the context that led to FCPX being created. Logic, being based on Core Audio a now 64-bit API, doesn't need a mass upheaval. In fact I presume the UI will stay pretty much the same since it already is a Single Window Interface as of version 8.
Logic X likely needs little more than spit polish and a nice beefy upgrade to the engine below.
And if they dumb it down so much that a bunch of essential features are missing that nobody can no longer access, then that would count as an epic fail.
Certain things aren't meant to be easy. If somebody is dumb or has a hard time learning, then there are plenty of more amateurish apps and easier to use apps which would suit their needs and their 'talent' much better.
You're going to be so miffed when they make tools that directly realize thought.
The fact that FCPX is even mentioned here as some sore to corollary scenario makes it very evident that people don't even understand the context that led to FCPX being created. Logic, being based on Core Audio a now 64-bit API, doesn't need a mass upheaval. In fact I presume the UI will stay pretty much the same since it already is a Single Window Interface as of version 8.
Logic X likely needs little more than spit polish and a nice beefy upgrade to the engine below.
how do you explain the permanent loss of video out support
Final Cut Studio on disc is over 30GB. The best idea for samples and instruments is to have an online library with previews - like how iTunes works. Then you just play a 30 second preview and decide which you want. They can grow the database when they want and you only have to download what you use.
This.
I really don't see massive amounts of samples being an issue here. I mean, look at what they're doing with iTunes in the Cloud. You have access to all the music you purchased in iTunes and can download individual tracks with a touch of your finger.
I wouldn't be at all surprised if users who bought the New Logic Pro from the Mac App store were given access to an online library of samples which is tied to the users Apple ID. They can then peruse and download to their hearts content.
Ubillos was then charged with handling the refresh of Final Cut Pro, which required an extensive update to bring it up to date as a modern 64-bit Cocoa app for Mac OS X and its new QuickTime X architecture. Final Cut was originally written for PowerPC Macs running the Classic Mac OS and its earlier QuickTime video architecture, long before modern frameworks such as Core Video and Grand Central Dispatch had developed.
I think that this project went wrong under the thrall of new features and new work methods. They could have turned Final Cut Pro 7 into a fully functioning 64-bit version and had the new features as options, to be accessed on demand, rather than being the only choice.
The major screwup was not respecting the billion man-hours of experience that Final Cut Pro 7 represented in the professional world. Ubillos deserves unilateral condemnation for that.
Final Cut Pro X is a shining example of the "irresistible pull of self-delusion" that often shows up when people start believing themselves to be way ahead of everybody else. Ubillos has never made a mortgage payment from being a video editor in a long, long time.
There are a HUGE number of deficiencies in FCPX. And a large, but not huge, number of improvements, too.
FCPX is a great improvement over Final Cut Express.
Comments
If Apple does that, then they might as well name it Logic Amateur X. You're right that the average person won't notice the difference between a 256 AAC and a non compressed audio file, but anybody with Pro ears would notice it right away
Ever tried A/B testing between the too?
If not, then you are not qualified to speak of what a "professional" will notice.
Not satisfied with pissing off the professional video market... Apple now has its eyes set on the professional audio market.
I so agree with your prediction, and regret it at the same time.
Ever tried A/B testing between the too?
If not, then you are not qualified to speak of what a "professional" will notice.
Of course I can tell the difference, I am more 'Pro' than 99.9% of people, and my work has been featured on many millions of CD's sold.
If Apple does that, then they might as well name it Logic Amateur X. You're right that the average person won't notice the difference between a 256 AAC and a non compressed audio file, but anybody with Pro ears would notice it right away, and Logic is supposed to be for professionals, hence the word "Pro" in Logic Pro.
It's entirely possible that Apple would implement a system like that in place for Garageband right now: if your system doesn't have the loops/samples, it pops up and tells you that (and how big the download'll be), whereupon you can click a button and the catalog of audio downloads in the background. You can go about your merry way recording stuff or doing other things on your computer, and it'll populate as files download.
If Apple does that, then they might as well name it Logic Amateur X. You're right that the average person won't notice the difference between a 256 AAC and a non compressed audio file, but anybody with Pro ears would notice it right away, and Logic is supposed to be for professionals, hence the word "Pro" in Logic Pro.
Don't forget THE LISTENERS ARE AMATEURS! Who do you compose for? Professionals? No. We do music for PEOPLE, and they listen to music via iPod or iPhone with 128k MP3 ~ 256k AAC.
Adobe, Autodesk, and Steinberg, thank you for continuing to support the professional community as professionals.
Ever tried A/B testing between the too?
A/B testing won't uncover differences that appear when you apply EQ, compression, time/pitch stretch and other processing. 256 AAC is a great consumer delivery format but a professional composer does NOT want it for source material.
I hope that they don't make it more iOS like, so common amateurs and everyday fools can use it. There had better not be "smart instruments" like iOS garageband has. I guess I'll just have to wait and see what it looks like when details get released, but I just might be sticking with Logic 9 for awhile.
Yeah I hate it when Apple makes stuff easier to use. Umm hello Apple, real tools make work harder not easier! That's why we make tools, to limit fields to only people that can manage to overcome the extra challenge!
Don't forget THE LISTENERS ARE AMATEURS! Who do you compose for? Professionals? No. We do music for PEOPLE, and they listen to music via iPod or iPhone with 128k MP3 ~ 256k AAC.
Actually, the only person I have to please is myself. I couldn't give two craps about the listeners. People shouldn't make products and art solely based on what the average person wants and Pros shouldn't sacrifice quality because the average person doesn't know what quality is. Somebody might as well become a prostitute if they sacrifice quality in their productions, because that's exactly what somebody is if they choose to go that route, they're a whore, a sellout and a streetwalker with HIV would be making a more honorable living.
A/B testing won't uncover differences that appear when you apply EQ, compression, time/pitch stretch and other processing. 256 AAC is a great consumer delivery format but a professional composer does NOT want it for source material.
That is true. When manipulating audio, you want to work from the best source material that you can get your hands on, in other words, uncompressed audio.
Yeah I hate it when Apple makes stuff easier to use. Umm hello Apple, real tools make work harder not easier! That's why we make tools, to limit fields to only people that can manage to overcome the extra challenge!
And if they dumb it down so much that a bunch of essential features are missing that nobody can no longer access, then that would count as an epic fail.
Certain things aren't meant to be easy. If somebody is dumb or has a hard time learning, then there are plenty of more amateurish apps and easier to use apps which would suit their needs and their 'talent' much better.
Not satisfied with pissing off the professional video market... Apple now has its eyes set on the professional audio market.
But unlike FCP X, where Apple has no real competition, Logic has a serious rival: Pro Tools 9. And it just gets better and better and more open.
I use them both, but it?s the matter of where the source material came from or pre-considerations if its going to be mostly MIDI or recording project.
Two icons sits together side by side in my dock.
And if Apple screw it this time, like with FCP X - I will stick to Pro Tools, that?s all.
I think the comments that they will do the same as they did with FC are way off base.
In the case of FCX they had to go to 64 bit but it's obvious they couldn't do it without throwing much of the code out and starting from scratch. There are a few exceptions, but for the most part it seems like features dropped in FCX were done because they couldn't get them recreated in the new code base, and many are planned to return eventually when they have time to get around to it.
Logic has been 64 bit for a year and a half. A few features are missing in the 64 bit version (and hopefully those will be back in Logic 10), but there's no reason for more features to go away like happened with FC. FC can't run 32 bit plugins, Logic has a 32 bit bridge. The ugly 64 bit transition already happened to Logic. And it really wasn't that ugly.
And from what I've heard, the next major Logic update is not any time soon. Definitely in the works, but nowhere near completion.
The fact that FCPX is even mentioned here as some sore to corollary scenario makes it very evident that people don't even understand the context that led to FCPX being created. Logic, being based on Core Audio a now 64-bit API, doesn't need a mass upheaval. In fact I presume the UI will stay pretty much the same since it already is a Single Window Interface as of version 8.
Logic X likely needs little more than spit polish and a nice beefy upgrade to the engine below.
But unlike FCP X, where Apple has no real competition, Logic has a serious rival: Pro Tools 9. And it just gets better and better and more open.
Avid?
It's funny that Avid and Pro Tools are made by the same company. I bet they're loving what Apple is doing lately...
And if they dumb it down so much that a bunch of essential features are missing that nobody can no longer access, then that would count as an epic fail.
Certain things aren't meant to be easy. If somebody is dumb or has a hard time learning, then there are plenty of more amateurish apps and easier to use apps which would suit their needs and their 'talent' much better.
You're going to be so miffed when they make tools that directly realize thought.
Not satisfied with pissing off the professional video market... Apple now has its eyes set on the professional audio market.
can you believe it!!!!!!!
The fact that FCPX is even mentioned here as some sore to corollary scenario makes it very evident that people don't even understand the context that led to FCPX being created. Logic, being based on Core Audio a now 64-bit API, doesn't need a mass upheaval. In fact I presume the UI will stay pretty much the same since it already is a Single Window Interface as of version 8.
Logic X likely needs little more than spit polish and a nice beefy upgrade to the engine below.
how do you explain the permanent loss of video out support
Final Cut Studio on disc is over 30GB. The best idea for samples and instruments is to have an online library with previews - like how iTunes works. Then you just play a 30 second preview and decide which you want. They can grow the database when they want and you only have to download what you use.
This.
I really don't see massive amounts of samples being an issue here. I mean, look at what they're doing with iTunes in the Cloud. You have access to all the music you purchased in iTunes and can download individual tracks with a touch of your finger.
I wouldn't be at all surprised if users who bought the New Logic Pro from the Mac App store were given access to an online library of samples which is tied to the users Apple ID. They can then peruse and download to their hearts content.
But unlike FCP X, where Apple has no real competition...
It's called Avid, and the more accurate statement would be "Avid no longer has real competition."
Ubillos was then charged with handling the refresh of Final Cut Pro, which required an extensive update to bring it up to date as a modern 64-bit Cocoa app for Mac OS X and its new QuickTime X architecture. Final Cut was originally written for PowerPC Macs running the Classic Mac OS and its earlier QuickTime video architecture, long before modern frameworks such as Core Video and Grand Central Dispatch had developed.
[ View this article at AppleInsider.com ]
I think that this project went wrong under the thrall of new features and new work methods. They could have turned Final Cut Pro 7 into a fully functioning 64-bit version and had the new features as options, to be accessed on demand, rather than being the only choice.
The major screwup was not respecting the billion man-hours of experience that Final Cut Pro 7 represented in the professional world. Ubillos deserves unilateral condemnation for that.
Final Cut Pro X is a shining example of the "irresistible pull of self-delusion" that often shows up when people start believing themselves to be way ahead of everybody else. Ubillos has never made a mortgage payment from being a video editor in a long, long time.
There are a HUGE number of deficiencies in FCPX. And a large, but not huge, number of improvements, too.
FCPX is a great improvement over Final Cut Express.