Apple planning third campus after 'spaceship' is finished in 2015

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  • Reply 21 of 71
    Quote:

    Apple planning third campus after 'spaceship' is finished in 2015



    Rapid growth at Apple has the company already planning for a third corporate campus after it finishes work on its second, circular "spaceship" facility in Cupertino, Calif., by 2015.



    Cupertino Mayor Gilbert Wong said an interview with the Mercury News that Apple executives told him the company is expanding so fast, they expect to begin working on a third campus after work is completed on their second in 2015. The new campus would reportedly be at a currently unknown location.





    Apple should plan right now for the right size of corporate headquarters. The new, spaceship corporate campus should have two more floors, for a total of six floors, and be of a wider diameter to increase the size of the circle, bringing it slightly closer to Cupertino City streets.



    There are a number of advantages to right-sizing the building when the plans are drawn by the architects and approved by the City of Cupertino. The right-sizing of the building, instead of planning for a future on-site expansion by adding new floors or new buildings, or a future expansion on a third, unknown location, allows architects to plan for a bigger indoor parking lot, including space for 10 speed bikes with showers and a locker room, two or more cafeterias, complete indoor sport facilities including an olympic size swimming pool, a Nautilus weight room, gymnasiums with showers and locker rooms, an adequate number of elevators, escalators and stairs, service entrances, and a new, cross-shaped, system of indoor hallways linking the different floors of the underground parking lot to the ground floor of the building, providing also a convenient way to walk from one side of the building to the opposite side.



    Planning an inadequate, second corporate campus, with a view of expanding on a third, unknown location, seems to me to be very bad planning. I could possibly understand better if Apple was a new, small and just established company, or a cash strapped company, barely making it to the next pay day. But, as we all know, such is not the case.





  • Reply 22 of 71
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by rtdunham View Post


    "Such plants, being heavily automated, might not create that many jobs." Oh, so you answered your own question? Things are never so simple as they first seem.



    To repeat a previous reply, the automotive plants I mentioned are all highly automated, and still manage to employ hundreds of people each, and they do it here in the US.



    Those people, in turn, support and help maintain many local businesses buying groceries, clothing, furniture and appliances, by going out to restaurants, and so on. They buy homes. They pay local and state and property taxes, which, in addition to the factory itself, could have a major impact on the local tax base.



    So while they may not employ tens of thousands of people directly, they could well end up supporting that many.



    Things are never so simple as they first seem, are they?
  • Reply 23 of 71
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by sheff View Post


    It will be called a spacebar or as someone said previously genius bar.



    Also I dig the statue idea, though I don't know if Jobs would approve.



    I like SpaceBar, but I also suggest Bowen's as an alternative.
  • Reply 24 of 71
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by stuffe View Post


    Exactly what sort of spillover be expected from a practically lights out automated factory that you envisage? It's not as though they will start to source parts locally... I'm sure they know the figures far better than you or I do, and frankly a Campus the size of the pentagon (with the people required to plan build and fit) and 13,000 salaried Americans has to be worthwhile.



    I find it bizarre that more and more people are required to work for a company that manufactures computing products that should logically enable fewer people to do more with less... I guess I expect too much of computers.
  • Reply 25 of 71
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by ahmlco View Post


    The automotive plants I mentioned are all highly automated, and still manage to employ hundreds of people each, and they do it here in the US. Those people, in turn, support and help maintain many local businesses buying groceries, clothing, furniture and appliances, by going out to restaurants, and so on. They buy homes and pay local and state and property taxes.



    Spillover effects, indeed.



    Apple is one of the companies lobbying for a corporate tax "holiday" in which to bring tons of offshore cash back to the US. I say we give it to them, on the condition they build more iStuff here in the US.



    Not just designed here. Made here.



    You mean the automotive plants that required a massive government bailout just to keep from going under? Sorry, in the REAL business world there is no such thing as too big to fail.
  • Reply 26 of 71
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by AjitMD View Post


    Hi payroll and other taxes. The government taxes employers for providing jobs!



    You realize that the two sentences above, coupled with your inability to properly spell and use a simple four letter word, speaks volumes about your probable education level and worldview?



    Turn off Fox and try reading an actual book.
  • Reply 27 of 71
    matrix07matrix07 Posts: 1,993member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by ouragan View Post


    Planning an inadequate, second corporate campus, with a view of expanding on a third, unknown location, seems to me to be very bad planning. I could possibly understand better if Apple was a new, small and just established company, or a cash strapped company, barely making it to the next pay day. But, as we all know, such is not the case.









    They want the perfect building. They don't want to put everything there. It's not hard to understand if you look at it from the aesthetic perspective.
  • Reply 28 of 71
    tenobelltenobell Posts: 7,014member
    I disagree I don't think we need to fight to bring manufacturing back here.



    We need to fund education to nurture the next Steve Jobs and the next Bill Gates. We need to be investing in the next Apple the next Facebook, the next Twitter.



    That is where the future is not in fighting for manufacturing jobs.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by ahmlco View Post


    Apple is one of the companies lobbying for a corporate tax "holiday" in which to bring tons of offshore cash back to the US. I say we give it to them, on the condition they build more iStuff here in the US.



    Not just designed here. Made here.



  • Reply 29 of 71
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by leesmith View Post


    You mean the automotive plants that required a massive government bailout just to keep from going under? Sorry, in the REAL business world there is no such thing as too big to fail.



    Nope. Read the original post:



    "If Hyundai and Honda and Toyota can build cars here in the US -- and make a profit doing so -- then Apple could build computers here and do the same."



    Now, did we give Hyundai and Honda and Toyota a massive government bailout?



    Let's see... that would be... No.



    In the future, it might help if you learned to read for comprehension so you can make a sound and well-reasoned argument... and not look like an idiot.



    I mean, that sort of thing is often rewarded out here in the REAL business world....
  • Reply 30 of 71
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by ahmlco View Post


    Nope. Read the original post:



    "If Hyundai and Honda and Toyota can build cars here in the US -- and make a profit doing so -- then Apple could build computers here and do the same."



    Now, did we give Hyundai and Honda and Toyota a massive government bailout?



    Let's see... that would be... No.



    In the future, it might help if you learned to read for comprehension so you can make a sound and well-reasoned argument... and not look like an idiot.



    I mean, that sort of thing is often rewarded out here in the REAL business world....



    1) Not getting a "massive government bailout" doesn't mean they don't get government concessions for building in the US.



    2) Not every part is created in the US. From what I've read the electronics — what Apple sells — are built overseas, shipped to the US, and then assembled in the final product that made of large and heavy pieces that are costly to ship overseas.



    3) You're argument fails by thinking there is some altruistic reason for assembling something in the US. It's done when it's deemed more profitable. It's all about the bottom line!
  • Reply 31 of 71
    ahmlcoahmlco Posts: 432member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by TenoBell View Post


    I disagree I don't think we need to fight to bring manufacturing back here. We need to fund education to nurture the next Steve Jobs and the next Bill Gates. We need to be investing in the next Apple the next Facebook, the next Twitter.



    That is where the future is not in fighting for manufacturing jobs.



    It's not just "manufacturing" jobs. It's engineering and technical jobs, which translates into engineering and technical expertise. And if we let that go overseas, we're in deep trouble.



    Because then it's extremely likely that the next Jobs and Gates will be named Mu Li and Siddharth Rajam...
  • Reply 32 of 71
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Aizmov View Post


    Why not just double the floor count?



    And risk starting another argument here about how Apple is 'completely ruining the city', and 'not building to human scale' and all that nonsense?
  • Reply 33 of 71
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by ahmlco View Post


    Because then it's extremely likely that the next Jobs and Gates will be named Mu Li and Siddharth Rajam...



    Someone is letting their bigotry show.





    PS: Jobs' biological father is a Syrian Muslim. Oh no¡¡
  • Reply 34 of 71
    Quote:

    Reasons not to manufacture in the US, especially CA:

    1. Hi wages especially if unions are involved

    2. Hi payroll and other taxes. The government taxes employers for providing jobs!

    3. Property taxes, insurance costs, workman's comp

    4. Law suits and vulture lawyers

    5. Hi corporate, state and local income taxes in excess of 40%.



    How is this different for manufacturing than for the 12,000 current Apple employees? To the best of my knowledge Apple employees do not work pro bono, and they pay taxes as does Apple. Also, software engineers make more than manufacturing workers, even unionized ones.



    Your logic on this is fundamentally flawed.
  • Reply 35 of 71
    tenobelltenobell Posts: 7,014member
    I don't agree with that. Steve Jobs and Bill Gates are not engineers. They are visionary entrepreneurs. So far America has provided the best environment for nurturing these types of talents. Those are the people who create the ideas that create the products that create the jobs.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by ahmlco View Post


    It's not just "manufacturing" jobs. It's engineering and technical jobs, which translates into engineering and technical expertise. And if we let that go overseas, we're in deep trouble.



    Because then it's extremely likely that the next Jobs and Gates will be named Mu Li and Siddharth Rajam...



  • Reply 36 of 71
    ahmlcoahmlco Posts: 432member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    1) Not getting a "massive government bailout" doesn't mean they don't get government concessions for building in the US.



    Yes, they got concessions in Alabama and Texas and Kentucky. They've also, as I said, created thousands of jobs, which in turn have been a major boon to the local economies. Ask the governors involved why they fought so hard to get them to build in their states, and if they'd do it again.



    Oh, and that was a very nice attempt to switch attention from your "massive government bailout" mistake. Didn't work, of course. But nice try.



    And, "You're argument fails..."? That would be, "Your argument fails...", since you're is a contraction of ?you are.? Your is the possessive case. English 101.



    Where was I? Ah, yes, failing arguments.



    Which isn't. Failing, that is. There are many offsets to consider: The aforementioned tax holiday. Tax breaks. R&D credits. Faster turnaround times. Fast and cheaper shipping of finished goods to stores and customers. Faster BTO times. Faster turnaround for design changes.



    And try looking up the differences in import duties bringing in finished goods vs assemblies and parts.



    Then there's the political goodwill such a move might create. The economic benefit a "Made in the USA" sticker might create. The goodwill a disassociation with Foxconn might engender.



    And on, and on. There are many things to consider, and they ALL impact the bottom line.
  • Reply 37 of 71
    ahmlcoahmlco Posts: 432member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by cvaldes1831 View Post


    Plus, 95%+ of the components are coming from factories in the region. From a supply chain management perspective, it makes more sense to keep final assembly in the region. Foxconn can get touchscreen panel deliveries via rail or truck. If manufacturing was in Round Rock, TX, it would have to go via sea (slow) or air freight (very expensive).



    Foxconn has large factories in China and Mexico, and very likely will open a plant in Brazil.



    Last time I checked, neither Mexico nor Brazil were reachable by rail from Asian suppliers.



    If it can be done there, it can be done here.
  • Reply 38 of 71
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by ahmlco View Post


    It's not just "manufacturing" jobs. It's engineering and technical jobs, which translates into engineering and technical expertise. And if we let that go overseas, we're in deep trouble.



    Because then it's extremely likely that the next Jobs and Gates will be named Mu Li and Siddharth Rajam...



    With all the experience I have in Engineering and Computer Science there is one end result--those jobs will not translate to overseas leaving Apple dependent upon Asia for it's Engineering and Design talent.



    It will never happen and a lot of that has to do with the quality of engineering isn't there in Asia. It's just not there.
  • Reply 39 of 71
    ahmlcoahmlco Posts: 432member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    Someone is letting their bigotry show. PS: Jobs' biological father is a Syrian Muslim. Oh no¡¡



    It's not bigotry. It's a simple acknowledgment of what's likely to happen when you continue to export your expertise offshore.
  • Reply 40 of 71
    ahmlcoahmlco Posts: 432member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by TenoBell View Post


    I don't agree with that. Steve Jobs and Bill Gates are not engineers. They are visionary entrepreneurs. So far America has provided the best environment for nurturing these types of talents. Those are the people who create the ideas that create the products that create the jobs.



    Jobs built off of Woz, who WAS an engineer. Gates studied and wrote software.



    Those people grew up immersed in the Silicon Valley culture. They were surrounded by DEC and HP and Bell Telephone Laboratories. By Shockley Semiconductor, Fairchild Semiconductor, and Xerox PARC.



    It's the nature vs. nurture argument, and those people were created deep in our technological womb...



    Which is vanishing...
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