Here's what I don't get about Microsoft's strategy: Microsoft had a proper low-power version of Windows that supported ARM and other low power CPUs (like Hitachi SH or the MIPS chips) for many, many years. It was Windows CE, later renamed Windows Mobile. And before iOS, this mobile OS was dominating Palm OS, their nearest competitor. Now their mobile strategy is: forget that code base, we are going to put Windows on a tablet, but "real Windows", which means it's x86 and can run real Windows applications, but there's also an ARM version that'll be "real Windows" except it can't run any programs written for "real Windows" because it only supports this new Metro UI. So how is it "real Windows" and why would it have any advantage over their lean and clean version of Windows for devices formerly known as Windows CE? And I'm using the term "real Windows" the way Paul Thuriott was using it in his quote above.
So the Metro UI is actually just a layer. What happened to the classic desktop won't load if the user don't want it?!
Quote:
Originally Posted by rtm135
If Microsoft were smart, they'd only charge 25% to try and undercut Apple.
(I know... BIG IF there)
Developers are not looking for bargaining deals. Developers want their apps to be available to as many customers are possible. It is the same situation as the iPad. If developers want to sell their apps to W8 tablet users they have no choice but to go through MS.
I think anything after XP is a joke. Pentium 4 with Hyper threading + XP is as good as computing gets.
This layer over 7 reminds me of OSX Lion. if 10.7.2 doesn't fix some things up, i'm downgrading back to Snow Leopard (and not because of the bugs) but because it has a lot of necessaries not to mention its killing my productivity.
Great to know windows is trying to take t he same path.
On yesterday's TWIT Windows show, I nearly spit my drink through my nose when Thurrott explained that iPads are not computers because they don't have a fan. (Apparently only a power sucking, heat producing behemoth capable of running full Windows is an actual 'computer', and more efficient machines are merely 'devices'.)
Thanks for the explanation Paul.
Can you provide a link to that quote? I tried searching for it and came up empty. Not that I don't believe you ? exactly the kind of nonsense Thurrott is famous for.
On yesterday's TWIT Windows show, I nearly spit my drink through my nose when Thurrott explained that iPads are not computers because they don't have a fan. (Apparently only a power sucking, heat producing behemoth capable of running full Windows is an actual 'computer', and more efficient machines are merely 'devices'.)
Thanks. This is an interesting and insightful article.
But it does sound like Apple could achieve the same effect if they let iOS apps run in a VM on the Mac. Unfortunately, if the wider distribution of the mobile operating systems into PCs matters, Apple will be dominated. One can imagine all the simpler apps eventually running in Metro, and as the power of the ARM chips increases, the billions of Windows users will have just one interface to deal with for everyday apps, rather than two interfaces for Apple users.
...Thurrott explained that iPads are not computers because they don't have a fan.
i guess by this definition they must be distributed supercomputers, at last count millions of fans worldwide for the ipad, in other news, Microsoft manages to build a sows ear out of a silk purse...
I absolutely understand WHY Microsoft would want their own app store. I think the way they're going about it is going to come back and bite them.
First, charging developers to rewrite their apps for "Metro" is going to drive SOME developers to consider other platforms. While MS still has the market, the inconvenience of cost of this transition is going to be a real wedge for developers.
Second, I think this might slow adoption. A lot of people weren't willing to upgrade on previous Windows OS updates because the programs they needed wouldn't work. I don't see why this would be any different.
Finally, because MS has the market, a move like this, which is so clearly aimed at boxing out competitors is MS walking right back into another anti competition suit. The same business model would work for Apple because the market share is so small.
I'm curious to see how this pans out. I'm putting my money on this not working out for MS.
Can you provide a link to that quote? I tried searching for it and came up empty. Not that I don't believe you ? exactly the kind of nonsense Thurrott is famous for.
It's in the first 5 minutes of the Windows Weekly TWiT podcast.
I wouldn't call it nonsense either. Frankly someone would need to be an idiot to disagree with what he was trying to say.
The Samsung tablet is a relatively hot, heavy and chunky device running a Intel Core i5. It even has a bloody fan. It's instantly obvious that it is a very different device to a cool, efficient ARM powered iPad.
Wouldn't it be cool if Microsoft actually made a better music and video store than Apple? It would cause Apple to redesign iTunes to work better and have a more user friendly interface. I do think iTunes could improve a lot.
Don't flame me but I really think that the Zune online interface was pretty good, though all the Flash stuff could cause it to slow a bit. MS should incorporate that into their next music store.
I think the public will give Metro a nickname: "incompatible mode"
I agree. I think many will get confused and frustrated as their one for everything Windows 8 will not run their desktop apps when they are using their tablets.
New Metro-style apps designed to run on Microsoft's forthcoming Windows 8 for tablets will copy Apple's App Store business model of charging a 30 percent fee from developers
So apps made by developers will turn around and charge their makers 30% ?
What will these apps do with their cash?
How about, "Microsoft will copy Apple's App Store business model of charging a 30 percent fee from developers of apps designed for Windows 8 Metro for tablets"
Comments
(I know... BIG IF there)
If Microsoft were smart, they'd only charge 25% to try and undercut Apple.
(I know... BIG IF there)
Developers are not looking for bargaining deals. Developers want their apps to be available to as many customers are possible. It is the same situation as the iPad. If developers want to sell their apps to W8 tablet users they have no choice but to go through MS.
This layer over 7 reminds me of OSX Lion. if 10.7.2 doesn't fix some things up, i'm downgrading back to Snow Leopard (and not because of the bugs) but because it has a lot of necessaries not to mention its killing my productivity.
Great to know windows is trying to take t he same path.
On yesterday's TWIT Windows show, I nearly spit my drink through my nose when Thurrott explained that iPads are not computers because they don't have a fan. (Apparently only a power sucking, heat producing behemoth capable of running full Windows is an actual 'computer', and more efficient machines are merely 'devices'.)
Thanks for the explanation Paul.
Can you provide a link to that quote? I tried searching for it and came up empty. Not that I don't believe you ? exactly the kind of nonsense Thurrott is famous for.
On yesterday's TWIT Windows show, I nearly spit my drink through my nose when Thurrott explained that iPads are not computers because they don't have a fan. (Apparently only a power sucking, heat producing behemoth capable of running full Windows is an actual 'computer', and more efficient machines are merely 'devices'.)
Thanks for the explanation Paul.
Just go ahead and misquote him.
So the Metro UI is actually just a layer. What happened to the classic desktop won't load if the user don't want it?
Metro is a layer on top of the Windows core in the same way the springboard is a layer on top of iOS.
The best way to think of it is that Metro is like iOS and the "classic" Windows desktop is like an app you launch from the springboard.
But it does sound like Apple could achieve the same effect if they let iOS apps run in a VM on the Mac. Unfortunately, if the wider distribution of the mobile operating systems into PCs matters, Apple will be dominated. One can imagine all the simpler apps eventually running in Metro, and as the power of the ARM chips increases, the billions of Windows users will have just one interface to deal with for everyday apps, rather than two interfaces for Apple users.
Not good.
Windows 8, a culmination of eights generations of PITA.
Guess the Apple ][ wasn't a computer, then.
Guess the Cube wasn't either. (I don't think it had a fan -- thought the whole point of the case was to cool the computer by upward airflow)
...Thurrott explained that iPads are not computers because they don't have a fan.
i guess by this definition they must be distributed supercomputers, at last count millions of fans worldwide for the ipad, in other news, Microsoft manages to build a sows ear out of a silk purse...
First, charging developers to rewrite their apps for "Metro" is going to drive SOME developers to consider other platforms. While MS still has the market, the inconvenience of cost of this transition is going to be a real wedge for developers.
Second, I think this might slow adoption. A lot of people weren't willing to upgrade on previous Windows OS updates because the programs they needed wouldn't work. I don't see why this would be any different.
Finally, because MS has the market, a move like this, which is so clearly aimed at boxing out competitors is MS walking right back into another anti competition suit. The same business model would work for Apple because the market share is so small.
I'm curious to see how this pans out. I'm putting my money on this not working out for MS.
Can you provide a link to that quote? I tried searching for it and came up empty. Not that I don't believe you ? exactly the kind of nonsense Thurrott is famous for.
It's in the first 5 minutes of the Windows Weekly TWiT podcast.
I wouldn't call it nonsense either. Frankly someone would need to be an idiot to disagree with what he was trying to say.
The Samsung tablet is a relatively hot, heavy and chunky device running a Intel Core i5. It even has a bloody fan. It's instantly obvious that it is a very different device to a cool, efficient ARM powered iPad.
Don't flame me but I really think that the Zune online interface was pretty good, though all the Flash stuff could cause it to slow a bit. MS should incorporate that into their next music store.
I think the public will give Metro a nickname: "incompatible mode"
and when you have a Windows 8 ARM Tablet, what do you call the Windows Desktop side? incompatible mode #2 or Remote Desktop Client mode?
I think the public will give Metro a nickname: "incompatible mode"
I agree. I think many will get confused and frustrated as their one for everything Windows 8 will not run their desktop apps when they are using their tablets.
and when you have a Windows 8 ARM Tablet, what do you call the Windows Desktop side? incompatible mode #2 or Remote Desktop Client mode?
How about mistake mode?
New Metro-style apps designed to run on Microsoft's forthcoming Windows 8 for tablets will copy Apple's App Store business model of charging a 30 percent fee from developers
So apps made by developers will turn around and charge their makers 30% ?
What will these apps do with their cash?
How about, "Microsoft will copy Apple's App Store business model of charging a 30 percent fee from developers of apps designed for Windows 8 Metro for tablets"