Apple may surprise with late-2011 MacBook Pro refresh

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  • Reply 101 of 135
    Cue the jeopardy music... any new news?
  • Reply 102 of 135
    messiahmessiah Posts: 1,689member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by kozchris View Post


    I have an ssd sitting here waiting for my MBP to arrive. I've heard that my crucial m4ssd will work fine. It better for that much money.



    Looks like the firmware updater 'quietly' fixes the SATA 3 issues.



    I've just ordered an M4 as well.



    Finally, my 17"MBP will be as fast as my 11" MBA...
  • Reply 103 of 135
    so is there any news according to this rumor?

    I almost have ordered a 15 MBP, but I just saw that rumor and since then I'm waiting for an update...
  • Reply 104 of 135
    wizard69wizard69 Posts: 13,377member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by hcrockso View Post


    so is there any news according to this rumor?

    I almost have ordered a 15 MBP, but I just saw that rumor and since then I'm waiting for an update...



    Nothing is floating to the surface. The MBPs getting small bump is dependent upon the real state of the Ivy Bridge processors. If they don't come until mid 2011 then the chances of a minor update are strong. The chips to do a bump are available so if anything where to happen it would be within a few weeks in my opinion.



    So it comes down to which rumors about Ivy Bridge do you believe.
  • Reply 105 of 135
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by wizard69 View Post


    Nothing is floating to the surface. The MBPs getting small bump is dependent upon the real state of the Ivy Bridge processors. If they don't come until mid 2011 then the chances of a minor update are strong. The chips to do a bump are available so if anything where to happen it would be within a few weeks in my opinion.



    So it comes down to which rumors about Ivy Bridge do you believe.



    I didn't want to wait. Picked up a 13" MBP and upgraded with an OCW SATA 3 SSD and 8GB of RAM. Who needs a minor spec bump when you can create some bad ass goodness at home?
  • Reply 106 of 135
    hmmhmm Posts: 3,405member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by endlessct9a View Post


    I didn't want to wait. Picked up a 13" MBP and upgraded with an OCW SATA 3 SSD and 8GB of RAM. Who needs a minor spec bump when you can create some bad ass goodness at home?



    It sounds like you came out fine. I've been waiting to see what they do (if anything) with the mac pros. I don't even think the Ivy Bridge update is supposed to really be that huge a boost to the processors. Wasn't it more about cutting power + boosting intel graphics? I'm also waiting to see if thunderbolt bandwidth is increased or we get a second port. I'd like to be able to put a display on one and storage on another. Daisy chaining has not currently been proven effective for such a thing, and display bandwidth requirements have been increasing recently anyway.
  • Reply 107 of 135
    wizard69wizard69 Posts: 13,377member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by endlessct9a View Post


    I didn't want to wait. Picked up a 13" MBP and upgraded with an OCW SATA 3 SSD and 8GB of RAM. Who needs a minor spec bump when you can create some bad ass goodness at home?



    That SSD should make for a huge difference. Your MBP will last a long time, even my early 2008 MBP is still viable.
  • Reply 108 of 135
    wizard69wizard69 Posts: 13,377member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by hmm View Post


    It sounds like you came out fine. I've been waiting to see what they do (if anything) with the mac pros. I don't even think the Ivy Bridge update is supposed to really be that huge a boost to the processors. Wasn't it more about cutting power + boosting intel graphics?



    Graphics appears to be getting a respectable boost, probably not as good as Intel would like us to believe but noticeable none the less. I haven't tracked CPU improvements in Ivy Bridge but remember lower power can enable much higher clock rates assuming the architecture can handle it. Some day soon we ought to see CPUs with a 4 GHz base clock frequency.

    Quote:

    I'm also waiting to see if thunderbolt bandwidth is increased or we get a second port. I'd like to be able to put a display on one and storage on another. Daisy chaining has not currently been proven effective for such a thing, and display bandwidth requirements have been increasing recently anyway.



    For Pro usage Apple will need to do something. Multiple ports seem to be an easy choice but I'm not sure how Apple/Intel would approach this. Most likely it would require another variant of the TB controller. It is interesting to realize how many of these controllers are already in production or already announced. If nothing else Intel has been busy hardware wise.
  • Reply 109 of 135
    bstodbstod Posts: 2member
    So I've been waiting to pick up a mbp bc this article says they were going to bring a slight upgrade by the end of sep. What happened to that? What sources are they using for this stuff and why not at least an update saying they were wrong?



    B
  • Reply 110 of 135
    tallest skiltallest skil Posts: 43,399member
    Quote:

    What sources are they using for this stuff and why not at least an update saying they were wrong?



    Because that's not how it works? If the story is passed and nothing happened, then nothing happened.



    Absolutely nothing here is a guarantee. You shouldn't base purchasing off of rumors, only facts (such as chip roadmaps).
  • Reply 111 of 135
    bstodbstod Posts: 2member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post


    Because that's not how it works? If the story is passed and nothing happened, then nothing happened.



    Absolutely nothing here is a guarantee. You shouldn't base purchasing off of rumors, only facts (such as chip roadmaps).



    thanks for the reply. i get there is obv no guarantee, i'm not claiming a class action suite here. just if the article says 'According to people with proven insight into Apple's future product plans'... and then it doesn't come true, dont you think we may want to re-evaluate the 'proven insight' qualifier?



    I guess the question is... is apple insider a true journal / news source? or something different? maybe its different, and i'm just missing that.
  • Reply 112 of 135
    tallest skiltallest skil Posts: 43,399member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Bstod View Post


    dont you think we may want to re-evaluate the 'proven insight' qualifier?



    Absolutely. Trust in rumor sites and rumor sources is built on a case-by-case basis.



    BGR, for example, has absolutely no credibility, nor do MacOSRumors.



    But when 9to5Mac says they got something from Mr. X, it's real. He's somewhere in Apple, and he does know things before they're revealed to us.



    You just have to know the established reputation of places.



    Quote:

    I guess the question is... is apple insider a true journal / news source? or something different? maybe its different, and i'm just missing that.



    Heavens, no. We're a rumor site. Stuff we get from analysts we post for laughs. Stuff we get from Foxconn workers, we post as potential future parts. Stuff we find on other sites, we post to get the word out.
  • Reply 113 of 135
    cubitcubit Posts: 846member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by mr O View Post


    Hopefully they keep the backlit keyboard



    I was suckered into buying a new MBA without it and then it came along soon after...
  • Reply 114 of 135
    hmmhmm Posts: 3,405member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by PeppWaves03 View Post


    Hummm well I am beginning to think there might not be an update. The back to school sale thing ended yesterday and the story lead me to believe that was a possible date. Now I am beginning to think either:



    A) update might come with the announcement of new iPhones; or



    B) no update.



    Hummm I think I will buy once I am in the 14 day window for being able to return my laptop...Need a calendar to see what 14 days before the October announcement is...



    Really? That's actually pretty silly. The iphone update is a much bigger one. Not everyone considered it to be huge, but it received a more significant hardware upgrade than what is truly available for the macbook pros pre Ivy Bridge. This would just be a mid generation spec bump to the latest processors available at the appropriate price points. It won't take precedence and if you looked up the processors referenced in the article (which were slightly off) you could see that a spec bump wasn't likely before now. Apple and Intel aren't quite as close now as they were at the start, so I doubt we're going to see Apple get processors ahead of everyone else.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Bstod View Post


    So I've been waiting to pick up a mbp bc this article says they were going to bring a slight upgrade by the end of sep. What happened to that? What sources are they using for this stuff and why not at least an update saying they were wrong?

    B



    I call a load of crap on "people with proven insight". These rumor sites publish anything including a number of photoshopped images and renders that prove nothing. Didn't this site also publish the one regarding mac pro updates by August ? What was silly about that one was that there were no processors appropriate to it at all. They just made the prediction because it was about a year without any kind of changes, so it made sense.



    The macbook pro could definitely see a bump, but once again they failed at fact checking. The 2.7 Ghz quad core is the 2960XM. It is estimated to cost around $1100 and runs a 55W, 10 higher than any others they've ever used.



    While we could see a refresh simply because the processors are there and we're on top of the holidays (and it relates to one of their most popular lines), the article is completely incorrect and I doubt they had any credible sources. The three that are actually appropriate as drop in replacements are the 2670QM at 2.2Ghz, the 2760QM at 2.4Ghz, and the 2860QM at 2.5Ghz.



    Given that one of those (2670QM) was released just three days ago, it's still early and we could potentially see a release by the holidays. I even linked my sources below . As stated one didn't come out until a couple days ago. If they're going to bump it they may have had a pre-release model for testing, but even then I wouldn't expect anything for at least two to three weeks as they just released the iphone. My best guess would be that they'd want to release it at least a week or two before Black Friday to maximize potential holiday sales. Before a bump you may start to hear rumors of current model stocks running low. We haven't heard anything like this yet.





    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sandy_Bridge



    http://ark.intel.com/products/53469/...he-2_20-GHz%29



    http://ark.intel.com/products/53474/...he-2_40-GHz%29



    http://ark.intel.com/products/53476/...he-2_50-GHz%29
  • Reply 115 of 135
    wizard69wizard69 Posts: 13,377member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by hmm View Post


    Really? That's actually pretty silly. The iphone update is a much bigger one. Not everyone considered it to be huge, but it received a more significant hardware upgrade than what is truly available for the macbook pros pre Ivy Bridge.



    For anybody with half a clue they would see the iPhone 4S as a massive update.

    Quote:

    This would just be a mid generation spec bump to the latest processors available at the appropriate price points. It won't take precedence and if you looked up the processors referenced in the article (which were slightly off) you could see that a spec bump wasn't likely before now. Apple and Intel aren't quite as close now as they were at the start, so I doubt we're going to see Apple get processors ahead of everyone else.



    I don't know why this continues to be a problem. Apple can't update before the hardware to update the machines is available. It is like putting on new Snow tires before they are available in the store.

    Quote:





    I call a load of crap on "people with proven insight". These rumor sites publish anything including a number of photoshopped images and renders that prove nothing.



    While there is a lot of proven poor journalism in these sites you can't really dismiss the idea that people do spill the beans from time to time. There are several problems with this though, what a person knows is often not the whole story.



    I once watch a large company develop a product, build a multi million dollar production line all to scrap it before one item was released to the public. Up until that excutive decision was made there was this belief at the lower levels we where going to market.

    Quote:

    Didn't this site also publish the one regarding mac pro updates by August ? What was silly about that one was that there were no processors appropriate to it at all. They just made the prediction because it was about a year without any kind of changes, so it made sense.



    Yeah just checking publically available info would clear up much and lead to more credible reporting. However the Mac Pro is on of the few Mac volume wise that Apple could get a prerelease or special purpose version of a chip from Intel.

    Quote:

    The macbook pro could definitely see a bump, but once again they failed at fact checking. The 2.7 Ghz quad core is the 2960XM. It is estimated to cost around $1100 and runs a 55W, 10 higher than any others they've ever used.



    While we could see a refresh simply because the processors are there and we're on top of the holidays (and it relates to one of their most popular lines), the article is completely incorrect and I doubt they had any credible sources. The three that are actually appropriate as drop in replacements are the 2670QM at 2.2Ghz, the 2760QM at 2.4Ghz, and the 2860QM at 2.5Ghz.



    Apple insider would do well to exercise a little editorial control over the bloggers. It would help greatly with some of these foul ups. It would be one thing to play a rumor about a low power version of the 2960XM for example. It's another thing to say the public version will go into a MBP.

    Quote:

    Given that one of those (2670QM) was released just three days ago, it's still early and we could potentially see a release by the holidays. I even linked my sources below . As stated one didn't come out until a couple days ago. If they're going to bump it they may have had a pre-release model for testing, but even then I wouldn't expect anything for at least two to three weeks as they just released the iphone. My best guess would be that they'd want to release it at least a week or two before Black Friday to maximize potential holiday sales. Before a bump you may start to hear rumors of current model stocks running low. We haven't heard anything like this yet.



    Basically they have a whole month to play with. With the continued expansion of infra structure though I don't think a release close to the IPhone is impossible. This is after all just a bump.



    The other way to look at this is that if we don't get a bump soon maybe Ivy Bridge isn't that far off. People have to realize though that this is a bit of a guessing game. If you really need a Mac simply go out and buy one.
  • Reply 116 of 135
    winterwinter Posts: 1,238member
    I just got around to reading the first post and to expect Ivy Bridge at the holiday season is a bit rushed.
  • Reply 117 of 135
    hmmhmm Posts: 3,405member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by wizard69 View Post




    Basically they have a whole month to play with. With the continued expansion of infra structure though I don't think a release close to the IPhone is impossible. This is after all just a bump.





    The other way to look at this is that if we don't get a bump soon maybe Ivy Bridge isn't that far off. People have to realize though that this is a bit of a guessing game. If you really need a Mac simply go out and buy one.



    I could definitely use a new one, but speculation on future models and the limitations I've referenced in the current line aren't the only things stopping me at the moment. Regardless when I update hardware, I generally figure I could be using it for a while. Sometimes I update machines frequently but not always. There are different things that influence this stuff for me. On the iphone I get that it's quite a bump, but you saw enough of the comments to know what I meant. I don't think it needs an annual aesthetic refresh anyway, especially with mobile contracts being two year agreements.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Winter View Post


    I just got around to reading the first post and to expect Ivy Bridge at the holiday season is a bit rushed.



    Hehe there's a difference between reading and glancing at a couple words. The discussion wasn't about an Ivy Bridge release at all. Mid generation processors were released over the past month or so meaning we could see a bump especially if Ivy Bridge isn't going to be ready soon enough for a first quarter refresh.
  • Reply 118 of 135
    wizard69wizard69 Posts: 13,377member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by hmm View Post


    I could definitely use a new one, but speculation on future models and the limitations I've referenced in the current line aren't the only things stopping me at the moment. Regardless when I update hardware, I generally figure I could be using it for a while. Sometimes I update machines frequently but not always. There are different things that influence this stuff for me. On the iphone I get that it's quite a bump, but you saw enough of the comments to know what I meant. I don't think it needs an annual aesthetic refresh anyway, especially with mobile contracts being two year agreements.



    While I agree phones don't need to be completely remodeled every year I do wish that Apple had another larger model on offer. Larger at least in the sense of screen size. Frankly a wider screen (in horizontal mode) would be very useful.

    Quote:

    Hehe there's a difference between reading and glancing at a couple words. The discussion wasn't about an Ivy Bridge release at all. Mid generation processors were released over the past month or so meaning we could see a bump especially if Ivy Bridge isn't going to be ready soon enough for a first quarter refresh.



  • Reply 119 of 135
    hmmhmm Posts: 3,405member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by wizard69 View Post


    While I agree phones don't need to be completely remodeled every year I do wish that Apple had another larger model on offer. Larger at least in the sense of screen size. Frankly a wider screen (in horizontal mode) would be very useful.



    I get you on this. No matter how big Apple gets, they seem to be very much about keeping the product line quite lean in nature. I get that it works for them. Since they don't manufacture many designs, it keeps the manufacturing cost low. In theory this make for some real design winners as they can focus on bringing a few great things to market. In all the time I've used them they've been really hit and miss over quite a few years. Here's an example. Remember some of the earlier macbooks? Not the pros but just the normal macbooks had some absolutely abysmal displays. Now this is their budget model, but it was still a $1000+ computer at the time. I'm not sure how they figured this was acceptable. I have no idea why they went to glossy overall for their line. I don't know why they were completely unable to build a reliable machine through the entire G5 generation or why they tried to put it all off on IBM (the internal design was terrible, big box with uneven airflow). So yeah they make me mad sometimes.



    On the other stuff from the previous post, I just wanted to mention the recent and upcoming mid generation releases from intel. They announced bumps pretty much across the board, but most of them aren't that big of a deal. They're pretty much the same thing with the clock speed bumped up a notch. My figures were correct though rather than the ones in the article. It was just a matter of what was a dropin kind of replacement. I don't think we'll see any weird variants or special designs here as it would just be a mid generation thing to keep the macbook(s) (pros) feeling fresh until the next generation. Other oems have already begun to use some of these. I think we'll see them from Apple if they calculate Ivy Bridge machines as unfeasible in the first quarter.
  • Reply 120 of 135
    wizard69wizard69 Posts: 13,377member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by hmm View Post


    I get you on this. No matter how big Apple gets, they seem to be very much about keeping the product line quite lean in nature. I get that it works for them.



    Well they think it works for them. In their desktop line the attitude is killing them. As for the iPhone that desire for a larger display is directly related to being an old fart. That certainly isn't a technical need unless you consider seeing text a technical need. I do so much like pinch to zoom though.

    Quote:

    Since they don't manufacture many designs, it keeps the manufacturing cost low. In theory this make for some real design winners as they can focus on bringing a few great things to market. In all the time I've used them they've been really hit and miss over quite a few years.



    My first Mac was a Mac Plus which I dearly loved even with it's short comings. However Apple drove me away for years due to high prices and crappy OS. I got back into the fold with a early 2098 MBP, but followed the company withou fail before that. So I've seen everything, especially the boondoggles.

    Quote:

    Here's an example. Remember some of the earlier macbooks? Not the pros but just the normal macbooks had some absolutely abysmal displays. Now this is their budget model, but it was still a $1000+ computer at the time. I'm not sure how they figured this was acceptable. I have no idea why they went to glossy overall for their line.



    Interestingly I went matte on my MBP and have regretted it ever since. Frankly I can't fathom why people would desire such a screen. The difference in usability is astounding and not in favor of atte screens.

    Quote:

    I don't know why they were completely unable to build a reliable machine through the entire G5 generation or why they tried to put it all off on IBM (the internal design was terrible, big box with uneven airflow). So yeah they make me mad sometimes.



    Actually I had considered Macs at around the time of the G4/G5 transition but it was an obvious joke of a machine. The only thing it had going for it was Alt-Vec and that like GPU computing is only of limited use. G5's integer performance was so bad it was enough to bring tears to ones eyes. Integer performance relates directly to a systems responsiveness and general performance.



    The G5 is a perfect example of why one should not do business with IBM. As to air flow the G5 burnt up a lot of watts to get the performance levels it did. I don't think Apple had a chance in hell of making a quiet and reliable machine.

    Quote:

    On the other stuff from the previous post, I just wanted to mention the recent and upcoming mid generation releases from intel. They announced bumps pretty much across the board, but most of them aren't that big of a deal. They're pretty much the same thing with the clock speed bumped up a notch. My figures were correct though rather than the ones in the article. It was just a matter of what was a dropin kind of replacement.



    Drop in is what we want, it means Apple can bump the machines anytime they want.

    Quote:

    I don't think we'll see any weird variants or special designs here as it would just be a mid generation thing to keep the macbook(s) (pros) feeling fresh until the next generation. Other oems have already begun to use some of these. I think we'll see them from Apple if they calculate Ivy Bridge machines as unfeasible in the first quarter.



    I suspect we will see them. There is little in the rumor mills about a near term Ivy Bridge release. I wish there was an Ivy Bridge release around the corner as it might get me to fork over more money to Apple. Knowing what Ivy Bridge is I have to hold off.
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