Could you please elaborate on "BUT it does not come close to iOS or Android"?
Sure....to be more specific...IMHO it does not come close to IOS or Android. I was stating a personal preference. I like Win 7 OS....it feels smooth and the layout and user function mappings make sense. I like it.... but for me it comes in 3rd behind IOS and Android. I think it need to mature a little more but it is definatley headed in the right direction.
They're nice looking phones, but they're not going to be a match for the iPhones (3GS, 4, 4S), (or Android) because at this point Windows Phone is a new platform, hasn't sold well at all and doesn't have an ecosystem grown around them - MS will pour billions and billions at it and eventually like they did with the Xbox and 360 they'll eventually buy their way in to an extent but it'll take alot of time and money.
Amazing the higher end 800 doesn't have a forward facing camera, kind of blows the mind considering the target audience, its the younger, hipper audience that uses it (and the N9 has one).
No announcements for US deliveries, which is really weird - they purposely kept the N9 out of the US so they could immediately sell their new Windows phones supposedly - but that isn't happening.
In the end Nokia is just a WP OEM (misguided strategy in my opinion) where their main competition is actually the other WP vendors HTC, Motorola and Samsung and that is not a good margin future.
I think by "ecosystem" you simply mean mindset. Certainly Microsoft has built a pretty nice ecosystem around the phone. Tens of thousands of apps in their marketplace. Millions of songs in their music library - plus the Zune subscription model if desired. It sounds as if Nokia is introducing some SkyDrive integration.
I think if the phone doesn't sell, it won't be on it's technical merits - or lack thereof. It will be because it's not an iPhone (or Android phone). It's one less thing for consumers to think about.
Amazing the higher end 800 doesn't have a forward facing camera, kind of blows the mind considering the target audience, its the younger, hipper audience that uses it (and the N9 has one).
I think this is probably because Microsoft doesn't yet support one with its OS. Nokia could supply a front-facing camera, but then they would catch flack because it was unusable. Now as to why Microsoft didn't think it was important enough to support yet, well... I guess they have limited resources. They just haven't gotten to it yet.
Sure....to be more specific...IMHO it does not come close to IOS or Android. I was stating a personal preference. I like Win 7 OS....it feels smooth and the layout and user function mappings make sense. I like it.... but for me it comes in 3rd behind IOS and Android. I think it need to mature a little more but it is definatley headed in the right direction.
You've not actually listed any functional differences. So you're basically stating that you don't care for the look and feel of the phone? It certainly is different.
How would you expect the phone to "mature"? What should change?
I think if the phone doesn't sell, it won't be on it's technical merits - or lack thereof. It will be because it's not an iPhone (or Android phone). It's one less thing for consumers to think about.
I think that most consumers will buy whatever they are sold (as long as the product isn't a total piece of shit)... give a sales person enough spiffs and they'll sell the crap out of anything.
The question is... will the product be good enough for the customer to return to it. Brand loyalty.
You've not actually listed any functional differences. So you're basically stating that you don't care for the look and feel of the phone? It certainly is different.
How would you expect the phone to "mature"? What should change?
When I was playing around with the UI the functional mappings did not make sense to me. The grouping of the cards did not allow me to navigate smoothly. But i was not experinced with it all all so it was somewhat new. As far as maturing...as a product is released it goes through public revisions where enhancements are made over time as the public gives the vendors requirements and likes to haves. More bells and whistles and functionality is added over time. Just like in IOS now has OTA updates....it is maturing.
Most of people I know with windows 7 phones actually like windows 7 mobile VERY much... much more then they like Android and even some like it more then iOS. The only problem they have is the lack of quality HW phone for windows mobile... if this Nokia HW is very good as it supposed to be then this phone will be pretty solid! At list better then most of androids... the lack of good SW available for windows mobile can be a problem though....
Does this mean all the Android fan boiz will go over to Windows forums and post nonsense about Windows mobile now, instead of trolling here every day?
I suspect Windows mobile will grab some market share and remaining around for a while because Microsoft has strong ties with corporate IT, and they receive a $5 subsidy on every Android phone sold.
Whatever the outcome, expect a big uptick in "anal-systs" making predictions about smartphone market share and units shipped vs units sold. And they will all be wrong.
Personally, I am waiting on the Amazon Kindle phone.
I think if the phone doesn't sell, it won't be on it's technical merits - or lack thereof. It will be because it's not an iPhone (or Android phone). It's one less thing for consumers to think about.
I agree. The marketplace already has people focused on iPhone and Android and phone version of the Zune will be tough (and appears to be what's happened so far, just lost in the noise).
Sure....to be more specific...IMHO it does not come close to IOS or Android. I was stating a personal preference. I like Win 7 OS....it feels smooth and the layout and user function mappings make sense. I like it.... but for me it comes in 3rd behind IOS and Android. I think it need to mature a little more but it is definatley headed in the right direction.
I personally think WP7 trumps iOS and Android on the visual side (I like that minimalist ish) but from a functionality standpoint the OS feels very boring and cold and static (despite the moving 'parts')
I get bored with WP7 even faster than I get bored with iOS app launcher homescreen.
I agree. The marketplace already has people focused on iPhone and Android and phone version of the Zune will be tough (and appears to be what's happened so far, just lost in the noise).
The marketplace is whatever is sold to the public... marketing is king... advertising, advertising, advertising and plenty of spiffs. Unless, of course, Microsoft doesn't have enough $$$ to advertise Mango properly...
[the mobile phone racket is quite different from the music player racket]
They would only do it if they knew beyond a shadow of a doubt that they would win. Anything else would be too dangerous.
It's certainly a long shot, but there's no denying the heavy influences here.
Vendettas are disgusting and destructive. Mind explaining why you think quoting that is a good idea?
I can quote whom ever i want to quote....remembering history and context are always constructive. No vendetta....I will let the facts speak for themselves
I can quote whom ever i want to quote....remembering history and context are always constructive. No vendetta....I will let the facts speak for themselves
The fact is that we'll never be forcibly limited to LTE (or wireless in general) for Internet and we'll never only have services capped at 2GB (or capped at any size).
OK, so what if the W7phone is as good as a similarly priced Android or iOS phone. To sell it has to be prefered for some reason. To get something like all the apps and music in iTunes is to trival thing and then they still only have parity.
MS will make them merge better with Office 365 and perhaps also subsidise the price and aim for the corporate market. But they can not lock the other out. The time when some websites only worked with explorer and MS "enhanced" java so it only worked in Windows is gone
When I was playing around with the UI the functional mappings did not make sense to me. The grouping of the cards did not allow me to navigate smoothly. But i was not experinced with it all all so it was somewhat new. As far as maturing...as a product is released it goes through public revisions where enhancements are made over time as the public gives the vendors requirements and likes to haves. More bells and whistles and functionality is added over time. Just like in IOS now has OTA updates....it is maturing.
OK, you've defined "maturing". Now what features do you feel are lacking? What in particular needs maturation? You wouldn't buy one today because you think it needs to mature. Well, what needs to mature? Is it simply a usability issue? The interface is different enough from iOS and Android that you weren't sure how to use it? Would time be enough? Or do you think the UI needs to become more iOS like?
Most of people I know with windows 7 phones actually like windows 7 mobile VERY much... much more then they like Android and even some like it more then iOS. The only problem they have is the lack of quality HW phone for windows mobile... if this Nokia HW is very good as it supposed to be then this phone will be pretty solid! At list better then most of androids... the lack of good SW available for windows mobile can be a problem though....
So what makes good hardware? Did your friends' phones fail in some way? Or are we talking about a subjective feel of the hardware? Does it need to feel better in your hand?
Does this mean all the Android fan boiz will go over to Windows forums and post nonsense about Windows mobile now, instead of trolling here every day?
I suspect Windows mobile will grab some market share and remaining around for a while because Microsoft has strong ties with corporate IT, and they receive a $5 subsidy on every Android phone sold.
Whatever the outcome, expect a big uptick in "anal-systs" making predictions about smartphone market share and units shipped vs units sold. And they will all be wrong.
Personally, I am waiting on the Amazon Kindle phone.
Personally, I would ask restraint in the use of the "fan boiz" term. It's good to hear contradictory arguments. It's good to hear something that you don't agree with. If for no other reason than to force you to rethink your own views. Yes, trolls can be tiresome. Ignore the ones you can. Some however, do have legitimate points.
Comments
Could you please elaborate on "BUT it does not come close to iOS or Android"?
Sure....to be more specific...IMHO it does not come close to IOS or Android. I was stating a personal preference. I like Win 7 OS....it feels smooth and the layout and user function mappings make sense. I like it.... but for me it comes in 3rd behind IOS and Android. I think it need to mature a little more but it is definatley headed in the right direction.
They're nice looking phones, but they're not going to be a match for the iPhones (3GS, 4, 4S), (or Android) because at this point Windows Phone is a new platform, hasn't sold well at all and doesn't have an ecosystem grown around them - MS will pour billions and billions at it and eventually like they did with the Xbox and 360 they'll eventually buy their way in to an extent but it'll take alot of time and money.
Amazing the higher end 800 doesn't have a forward facing camera, kind of blows the mind considering the target audience, its the younger, hipper audience that uses it (and the N9 has one).
No announcements for US deliveries, which is really weird - they purposely kept the N9 out of the US so they could immediately sell their new Windows phones supposedly - but that isn't happening.
In the end Nokia is just a WP OEM (misguided strategy in my opinion) where their main competition is actually the other WP vendors HTC, Motorola and Samsung and that is not a good margin future.
I think by "ecosystem" you simply mean mindset. Certainly Microsoft has built a pretty nice ecosystem around the phone. Tens of thousands of apps in their marketplace. Millions of songs in their music library - plus the Zune subscription model if desired. It sounds as if Nokia is introducing some SkyDrive integration.
I think if the phone doesn't sell, it won't be on it's technical merits - or lack thereof. It will be because it's not an iPhone (or Android phone). It's one less thing for consumers to think about.
Amazing the higher end 800 doesn't have a forward facing camera, kind of blows the mind considering the target audience, its the younger, hipper audience that uses it (and the N9 has one).
I think this is probably because Microsoft doesn't yet support one with its OS. Nokia could supply a front-facing camera, but then they would catch flack because it was unusable. Now as to why Microsoft didn't think it was important enough to support yet, well... I guess they have limited resources. They just haven't gotten to it yet.
Sure....to be more specific...IMHO it does not come close to IOS or Android. I was stating a personal preference. I like Win 7 OS....it feels smooth and the layout and user function mappings make sense. I like it.... but for me it comes in 3rd behind IOS and Android. I think it need to mature a little more but it is definatley headed in the right direction.
You've not actually listed any functional differences. So you're basically stating that you don't care for the look and feel of the phone? It certainly is different.
How would you expect the phone to "mature"? What should change?
I think if the phone doesn't sell, it won't be on it's technical merits - or lack thereof. It will be because it's not an iPhone (or Android phone). It's one less thing for consumers to think about.
I think that most consumers will buy whatever they are sold (as long as the product isn't a total piece of shit)... give a sales person enough spiffs and they'll sell the crap out of anything.
The question is... will the product be good enough for the customer to return to it. Brand loyalty.
You've not actually listed any functional differences. So you're basically stating that you don't care for the look and feel of the phone? It certainly is different.
How would you expect the phone to "mature"? What should change?
When I was playing around with the UI the functional mappings did not make sense to me. The grouping of the cards did not allow me to navigate smoothly. But i was not experinced with it all all so it was somewhat new. As far as maturing...as a product is released it goes through public revisions where enhancements are made over time as the public gives the vendors requirements and likes to haves. More bells and whistles and functionality is added over time. Just like in IOS now has OTA updates....it is maturing.
I suspect Windows mobile will grab some market share and remaining around for a while because Microsoft has strong ties with corporate IT, and they receive a $5 subsidy on every Android phone sold.
Whatever the outcome, expect a big uptick in "anal-systs" making predictions about smartphone market share and units shipped vs units sold. And they will all be wrong.
Personally, I am waiting on the Amazon Kindle phone.
I think if the phone doesn't sell, it won't be on it's technical merits - or lack thereof. It will be because it's not an iPhone (or Android phone). It's one less thing for consumers to think about.
I agree. The marketplace already has people focused on iPhone and Android and phone version of the Zune will be tough (and appears to be what's happened so far, just lost in the noise).
It's not going to take Apple six months to sue the pants off of Nokia for this design.
You sure Apple wants to sue Nokia AND Microsoft?
Sure....to be more specific...IMHO it does not come close to IOS or Android. I was stating a personal preference. I like Win 7 OS....it feels smooth and the layout and user function mappings make sense. I like it.... but for me it comes in 3rd behind IOS and Android. I think it need to mature a little more but it is definatley headed in the right direction.
I personally think WP7 trumps iOS and Android on the visual side (I like that minimalist ish) but from a functionality standpoint the OS feels very boring and cold and static (despite the moving 'parts')
I get bored with WP7 even faster than I get bored with iOS app launcher homescreen.
You sure Apple wants to sue Nokia AND Microsoft?
They would only do it if they knew beyond a shadow of a doubt that they would win. Anything else would be too dangerous.
It's certainly a long shot, but there's no denying the heavy influences here.
I'll just not have Internet. Simple.
Vendettas are disgusting and destructive. Mind explaining why you think quoting that is a good idea?
I agree. The marketplace already has people focused on iPhone and Android and phone version of the Zune will be tough (and appears to be what's happened so far, just lost in the noise).
The marketplace is whatever is sold to the public... marketing is king... advertising, advertising, advertising and plenty of spiffs. Unless, of course, Microsoft doesn't have enough $$$ to advertise Mango properly...
[the mobile phone racket is quite different from the music player racket]
They would only do it if they knew beyond a shadow of a doubt that they would win. Anything else would be too dangerous.
It's certainly a long shot, but there's no denying the heavy influences here.
Vendettas are disgusting and destructive. Mind explaining why you think quoting that is a good idea?
I can quote whom ever i want to quote....remembering history and context are always constructive. No vendetta....I will let the facts speak for themselves
I can quote whom ever i want to quote....remembering history and context are always constructive. No vendetta....I will let the facts speak for themselves
The fact is that we'll never be forcibly limited to LTE (or wireless in general) for Internet and we'll never only have services capped at 2GB (or capped at any size).
So that quote's pointless.
MS will make them merge better with Office 365 and perhaps also subsidise the price and aim for the corporate market. But they can not lock the other out. The time when some websites only worked with explorer and MS "enhanced" java so it only worked in Windows is gone
When I was playing around with the UI the functional mappings did not make sense to me. The grouping of the cards did not allow me to navigate smoothly. But i was not experinced with it all all so it was somewhat new. As far as maturing...as a product is released it goes through public revisions where enhancements are made over time as the public gives the vendors requirements and likes to haves. More bells and whistles and functionality is added over time. Just like in IOS now has OTA updates....it is maturing.
OK, you've defined "maturing". Now what features do you feel are lacking? What in particular needs maturation? You wouldn't buy one today because you think it needs to mature. Well, what needs to mature? Is it simply a usability issue? The interface is different enough from iOS and Android that you weren't sure how to use it? Would time be enough? Or do you think the UI needs to become more iOS like?
Why?
:filler:
Why give free publicity to a product that would most likely not make any impact in the market?
Most of people I know with windows 7 phones actually like windows 7 mobile VERY much... much more then they like Android and even some like it more then iOS. The only problem they have is the lack of quality HW phone for windows mobile... if this Nokia HW is very good as it supposed to be then this phone will be pretty solid! At list better then most of androids... the lack of good SW available for windows mobile can be a problem though....
So what makes good hardware? Did your friends' phones fail in some way? Or are we talking about a subjective feel of the hardware? Does it need to feel better in your hand?
Does this mean all the Android fan boiz will go over to Windows forums and post nonsense about Windows mobile now, instead of trolling here every day?
I suspect Windows mobile will grab some market share and remaining around for a while because Microsoft has strong ties with corporate IT, and they receive a $5 subsidy on every Android phone sold.
Whatever the outcome, expect a big uptick in "anal-systs" making predictions about smartphone market share and units shipped vs units sold. And they will all be wrong.
Personally, I am waiting on the Amazon Kindle phone.
Personally, I would ask restraint in the use of the "fan boiz" term. It's good to hear contradictory arguments. It's good to hear something that you don't agree with. If for no other reason than to force you to rethink your own views. Yes, trolls can be tiresome. Ignore the ones you can. Some however, do have legitimate points.