Oh look, they're even doing the Apple-style flat keys, which a lot of PC'ers panned when they first came out for not having enough travel. Shameless b*stards.
True. Also noticed many Ultrabooks with "buttonless" trackpads, another design cue that first appeared on the MacBook line.
As long as the clown called Ballmer is at M$'s helm, windows is slowly going to die away anyway and soon nowbody will care wether any windows crap will be running on a Mac.
Agreed. However, the ability to Run Windows on a Mac via bootcamp is helping to spur sales to people who need the Windows safety blanket. Then the process of weening them off Windows can begin
Agreed. However, the ability to Run Windows on a Mac via bootcamp is helping to spur sales to people who need the Windows safety blanket. Then the process of weening them off Windows can begin
Probably yes, but most of those people will very quickly realize how obsolete all those "Windows only" software is, and free up the disc space that has been reserved for the windows partition. Of course there are all this shooter games wich are not yet ported to the Mac OS. But is this relevant? Who in the right mind could possible say so?
I know not a single Mac owner who would run windows on their machine.
I`m not saying there are none but it`s most definitely not a motivator to buy Mac.
The only real influence Windows has on Mac sales are people trying to get away from the virus ridden blue screen spitting crap of an OS.
I can understand the idea that people buy a Mac because it can run Windows - easy to understand that people want a safety net if they don't like the Mac (OSX), as it's a big risk to make that change from something similar.
However, none of my Mac friends dual boot, and if they do it's not often. In fact, I've never seen anyone I know run Windows on a Mac, and whenever I've seen people using Macs in airport lounges (there are huge numbers of MacBooks in airport lounges) - again I've never seen anyone running Windows...
Not to say people don't, but I've yet to run into anyone doing it.
What made the Mac popular in 2006/7 is a little product called Vista. People (including myself and several of my friends) decided that if we were making a wholesale change to Vista and something new, then OSX was no longer a risk. And Vista was (and is) a piece of crap.
The rest of the Mac take up is the whole halo affect of the iPhone and iPad. And long may it continue.
Without even making an an official appearance at CES as an exhibitor, Apple has become an invisible hand directing the show and what the company's competitors choose to promote as their future strategies.
The writer of this article, Daniel Eran Dilger, has no clue -- NONE!!! -- what Adam Smith's invisible hand of the market metaphor refers to or means. Had he known, he wouldn't have used it to shoot what's remaining of his credibility straight to Hell. How embarrassing. What he said is complete, utter NONSENSE.
He/she may not have SPECIFICALLY have said Apple invented chicklet keyboard but he is certain referencing it by his tone of his statement. Stop trying to wiggle out of this one.
If he has not, in your own words, "SPECIFICALLY... said (that) Apple invented the chicklet keyboard."
then that's the end of your argument.
Interestingly it seems that you have assumed motives about my first post in this forum - how am I trying to "wiggle" out of anything?
I'm calling you out on putting words into someone's mouth that they didn't use (ie. invented), in order to back up a belief you expressed about Apple fans. Thus the only wiggling is being done by you in your reply to me.
He stated invented and gave two very specific names for the style he was referring to. He is wrong. You are wrong. You're also ignorant to think that Wikipedia can't be a good resource. Wikipedia is a great starting place but if you can't put in the minimal effort to corroborate its information then that's your problem.
Despite its official policies, there is plenty of "original research" that appears in Wikipedia. Conflating the rubbery chicklet keyboards of the early 80s with the mechanical, low profile "Island style" keyboards used by Sony and Apple is a good example of this. There is ZERO in common.
The only connection is that some Apple foeboys used the term "chicklet" to disparage the keyboard that pretty much all PCs now use, right up until other PC makers started using them.
There is nothing in Wikipedia nor in your own comments that indicates there is any correlation between the rubbery "touch to short out a circuit" type cheapo keypads of the Ti99 era $99 "PCs" and the low profile keyboards of 30 years later. There simply isn't.
I didn't say Wikipedia is always wrong, I just pointed out that in this instance, there is an article about chicklet keyboards that adds an ignorant paragraph out of left field about an unrelated technology because some Wiki editor decided that since he'd heard the same word applied to both, that there was some connection between them. Nothing outside of that paragraph has anything to do with modern island style keyboards.
Quote:
There are plenty of data points on that page to show first usage of the keyboard style and none of them are from Sony. it doesn't prove invention and doesn't rule out that Sony didn't have a patent for such a keyboard in 1970, but it does show that Sony didn't invent it for the machines he implied. There is a very specific citation that appears to be from a 1984 magazine that describes the keys as Chiclet.
That's because we all called those crappy rubbery keyboards "chicklet" to distinguish them from keyboards one could actually type on because they offered real mechanical action. Again, anyone calling the MacBook/Ultrabook keyboards "chicklet" is just doing so out of a malicious/ignorant attempt to disparage them, not because there is any real connection.
The writer of this article, Daniel Eran Dilger, has no clue -- NONE!!! -- what Adam Smith's invisible hand of the market metaphor refers to or means. Had he known, he wouldn't have used it to shoot what's remaining of his credibility straight to Hell. How embarrassing. What he said is complete, utter NONSENSE.
Except for all the astute analysis that blew over your head.
Putting words in all caps isn't actually the sign of a strong argument.
Absolutely. It makes a big difference to a lot of people:
- Corporate types who are scared to death of Mac OS X. Purchaser can say "if something doesn't work with the Mac, we can always wipe the drive and it runs Windows just fine" to overcome some fears.
- People who want a Mac, but occasionally play games that are not available on the Mac.
- People who want a Mac, but have some obscure Windows program that they have to be able to run. Parallels and Fusion are much more effective solutions than Virtual PC ever was.
I know a lot of Mac users who would not have bought a Mac without the ability to run Windows.
Several apps that I have to run to do my job on a daily basis are available for in Windows only versions - in fact the primary one may only be getting upgraded to be compatible with 64 bit sometime later this year - maybe.
This is not a matter of the Windows version being better or more up to date - there just plain is not ant other version of the software available at all for any OS on any hardware - it is Windows only.
My parents are in real estate - and they have many apps related to real estate and appraisal that - when there is a Mac version - it tends to be several versions behind the windows version with far fewer features or supported forms etc.
I have seen an increase in folks who I personally know switching to Mac from Windows - often as a result of their kids - often college age - exposing them to a Mac for the first time.
Over the years I have used a variety of systems from TI/99 to OS/2 to Windows 3, NT, 98, 2000, ME, Vista, 7 - Unix and VMS - and Mac OS starting way back when it before it was known as System 6.
In my experience the only folks who are Apple haters - have never truly used one - and I don't mean 2 minutes at the Best Buy Apple display - I mean actually use one. Many years ago - after a number of conversations with a co worker he finally admitted that he had never actually even seen a Mac in person - all of his arguments were based on what he heard from friends or read online.
Maybe you should just read History of laptops before even claiming apple created the notebook look...
there you can also see the first apple notebooks had a trackball on the side (later on front).
Only in 1994 Apple licensed the trackpad technology and included it in their laptops.
Apple has a nose for new technology (and often licenses it (arm), or buys it (intrinsity, fingerworks)), combined with remembering their successes and forgetting their failures lead to a false sense of 'apple created/invented everything'....
Any discussion about this quickly leads to : oh no, they re-invented it, or they popularized it. Both are completely different things.
According to your cited "history" the Apple designed Macintosh Portable "evolved" into the PowerBook. That's not true at all. Sony designed the original PowerBook with (for) Apple, and clearly Sony was better at designing portable hardware than Apple was in the late 80s -- it never really had before!
But regardless, it was Apple's PowerBook (with help from Sony) that sold well and established the modern form of the laptop. Until then, every PC laptop had the keyboard go right up to the front edge, and IBM continued that by adding a clit joystick in the home row of the keyboard. Nobody still does that. Everyone builds laptops patterned after the original PowerBook, because it worked.
Apple was also the first significant laptop maker to include a trackpad -- no, it didn't invent the concept of trackpads, but your desperate attempts to take credit away from Apple for popularizing many of the features of the modern notebook PC simply fails to fit the facts.
But that could also be discounted by people like myself, brought into the Apple world through an iPhone, made the switch from years of PCs to a Mac to get AWAY from Windows. The simplicity and intuitiveness that the iPhone demonstrated to me in a mobile device made me reconsider how computers should work. After 20+ years of fighting dozens of Windows machines, I wanted the same experience in personal computing that I suddenly had in mobile computing.
When I purchased my iMac a couple of years ago, I knew it could run Windows, but I didn't want it to run Windows. I'm sure I wasn't the only one feeling this way when I made the Apple shift.
I wonder if anyone has ever did a survey of users who have made the PC to Apple changeover and have never installed Windows on their Mac?
couldn´t agree more with your post
Just thinking of using a Windows prog worse a machine gives me shivers and makes my stomach contract. My neighbor dropped by today and asked me whether I could help him install Nokia Maps on his shitfckucomplexoverengineered piece of manure. Reminded me of how fckued up that MS world is. Parallels? Yeah had it because of a few games, life´s better without the games and the MSWin VM.
The writer of this article, Daniel Eran Dilger, has no clue -- NONE!!! -- what Adam Smith's invisible hand of the market metaphor refers to or means. Had he known, he wouldn't have used it to shoot what's remaining of his credibility straight to Hell. How embarrassing. What he said is complete, utter NONSENSE.
Overly dramatic much?
How does the misapplication of a metaphor shoot what's remaining of one's credibility straight to hell?
On that basis we'd never listen to anyone who writes on the net - including ourselves.
However if his article could be shown to be demonstrably false or disingenuous then that's another matter, and one might even countenance your conclusion.
It takes a genius to explain email on iPad? Oh, the humanity!
Sure, if the folks are 60+ and never before worked on a computer, heck I know people that are not even 50 have a degree and shun computers or have before coming to our place When they see my 3 year old djaying with an iDevice, racing or watching a movie or using educational and design apps and my daughter (20 months) toying around with another iDevice they do get jumpstarted. Toughest case took 9 months to buy into the Apple world, shortest 24 hours.
Last year the focus was on tablets, now it's ultraportable notebooks. If these don't work out for the other vendors and Apple comes out with a new product category I bet I can guess what CES 2013 will be focused on.
I think it looks cheaper than the Dell AIOs but what I find interesting is the lack of a mouse but instead the Magic Trackpad looking pointing device. I would really like to know how well that works.
Comments
Oh look, they're even doing the Apple-style flat keys, which a lot of PC'ers panned when they first came out for not having enough travel. Shameless b*stards.
True. Also noticed many Ultrabooks with "buttonless" trackpads, another design cue that first appeared on the MacBook line.
As long as the clown called Ballmer is at M$'s helm, windows is slowly going to die away anyway and soon nowbody will care wether any windows crap will be running on a Mac.
Agreed. However, the ability to Run Windows on a Mac via bootcamp is helping to spur sales to people who need the Windows safety blanket. Then the process of weening them off Windows can begin
Agreed. However, the ability to Run Windows on a Mac via bootcamp is helping to spur sales to people who need the Windows safety blanket. Then the process of weening them off Windows can begin
Probably yes, but most of those people will very quickly realize how obsolete all those "Windows only" software is, and free up the disc space that has been reserved for the windows partition. Of course there are all this shooter games wich are not yet ported to the Mac OS. But is this relevant? Who in the right mind could possible say so?
True. Also noticed many Ultrabooks with "buttonless" trackpads, another design cue that first appeared on the MacBook line.
I question myself, why would they need all this space for the trackpad. Last Time I checked
windows didn't even support multitouch gestures. So ....
I know not a single Mac owner who would run windows on their machine.
I`m not saying there are none but it`s most definitely not a motivator to buy Mac.
The only real influence Windows has on Mac sales are people trying to get away from the virus ridden blue screen spitting crap of an OS.
I can understand the idea that people buy a Mac because it can run Windows - easy to understand that people want a safety net if they don't like the Mac (OSX), as it's a big risk to make that change from something similar.
However, none of my Mac friends dual boot, and if they do it's not often. In fact, I've never seen anyone I know run Windows on a Mac, and whenever I've seen people using Macs in airport lounges (there are huge numbers of MacBooks in airport lounges) - again I've never seen anyone running Windows...
Not to say people don't, but I've yet to run into anyone doing it.
What made the Mac popular in 2006/7 is a little product called Vista. People (including myself and several of my friends) decided that if we were making a wholesale change to Vista and something new, then OSX was no longer a risk. And Vista was (and is) a piece of crap.
The rest of the Mac take up is the whole halo affect of the iPhone and iPad. And long may it continue.
This is key.
<...>
Here's what was going on:
- 9 people sitting at the Genius Bar getting a lesson about email on their iPads
- a couple getting MS Office installed on their MacBook Pro
<...>
No other platform offers that level of service and support.
<...>
It takes a genius to explain email on iPad? Oh, the humanity!
It takes a genius to explain email on iPad? Oh, the humanity!
It's cool... at least they are trying.
Lots of people save documents on their desktop because they don't know any better!
Technology is hard...
Without even making an an official appearance at CES as an exhibitor, Apple has become an invisible hand directing the show and what the company's competitors choose to promote as their future strategies.
The writer of this article, Daniel Eran Dilger, has no clue -- NONE!!! -- what Adam Smith's invisible hand of the market metaphor refers to or means. Had he known, he wouldn't have used it to shoot what's remaining of his credibility straight to Hell. How embarrassing. What he said is complete, utter NONSENSE.
He/she may not have SPECIFICALLY have said Apple invented chicklet keyboard but he is certain referencing it by his tone of his statement. Stop trying to wiggle out of this one.
If he has not, in your own words, "SPECIFICALLY... said (that) Apple invented the chicklet keyboard."
then that's the end of your argument.
Interestingly it seems that you have assumed motives about my first post in this forum - how am I trying to "wiggle" out of anything?
I'm calling you out on putting words into someone's mouth that they didn't use (ie. invented), in order to back up a belief you expressed about Apple fans. Thus the only wiggling is being done by you in your reply to me.
He stated invented and gave two very specific names for the style he was referring to. He is wrong. You are wrong. You're also ignorant to think that Wikipedia can't be a good resource. Wikipedia is a great starting place but if you can't put in the minimal effort to corroborate its information then that's your problem.
Despite its official policies, there is plenty of "original research" that appears in Wikipedia. Conflating the rubbery chicklet keyboards of the early 80s with the mechanical, low profile "Island style" keyboards used by Sony and Apple is a good example of this. There is ZERO in common.
The only connection is that some Apple foeboys used the term "chicklet" to disparage the keyboard that pretty much all PCs now use, right up until other PC makers started using them.
There is nothing in Wikipedia nor in your own comments that indicates there is any correlation between the rubbery "touch to short out a circuit" type cheapo keypads of the Ti99 era $99 "PCs" and the low profile keyboards of 30 years later. There simply isn't.
I didn't say Wikipedia is always wrong, I just pointed out that in this instance, there is an article about chicklet keyboards that adds an ignorant paragraph out of left field about an unrelated technology because some Wiki editor decided that since he'd heard the same word applied to both, that there was some connection between them. Nothing outside of that paragraph has anything to do with modern island style keyboards.
There are plenty of data points on that page to show first usage of the keyboard style and none of them are from Sony. it doesn't prove invention and doesn't rule out that Sony didn't have a patent for such a keyboard in 1970, but it does show that Sony didn't invent it for the machines he implied. There is a very specific citation that appears to be from a 1984 magazine that describes the keys as Chiclet.
That's because we all called those crappy rubbery keyboards "chicklet" to distinguish them from keyboards one could actually type on because they offered real mechanical action. Again, anyone calling the MacBook/Ultrabook keyboards "chicklet" is just doing so out of a malicious/ignorant attempt to disparage them, not because there is any real connection.
The writer of this article, Daniel Eran Dilger, has no clue -- NONE!!! -- what Adam Smith's invisible hand of the market metaphor refers to or means. Had he known, he wouldn't have used it to shoot what's remaining of his credibility straight to Hell. How embarrassing. What he said is complete, utter NONSENSE.
Except for all the astute analysis that blew over your head.
Putting words in all caps isn't actually the sign of a strong argument.
Absolutely. It makes a big difference to a lot of people:
- Corporate types who are scared to death of Mac OS X. Purchaser can say "if something doesn't work with the Mac, we can always wipe the drive and it runs Windows just fine" to overcome some fears.
- People who want a Mac, but occasionally play games that are not available on the Mac.
- People who want a Mac, but have some obscure Windows program that they have to be able to run. Parallels and Fusion are much more effective solutions than Virtual PC ever was.
I know a lot of Mac users who would not have bought a Mac without the ability to run Windows.
Several apps that I have to run to do my job on a daily basis are available for in Windows only versions - in fact the primary one may only be getting upgraded to be compatible with 64 bit sometime later this year - maybe.
This is not a matter of the Windows version being better or more up to date - there just plain is not ant other version of the software available at all for any OS on any hardware - it is Windows only.
My parents are in real estate - and they have many apps related to real estate and appraisal that - when there is a Mac version - it tends to be several versions behind the windows version with far fewer features or supported forms etc.
I have seen an increase in folks who I personally know switching to Mac from Windows - often as a result of their kids - often college age - exposing them to a Mac for the first time.
Over the years I have used a variety of systems from TI/99 to OS/2 to Windows 3, NT, 98, 2000, ME, Vista, 7 - Unix and VMS - and Mac OS starting way back when it before it was known as System 6.
In my experience the only folks who are Apple haters - have never truly used one - and I don't mean 2 minutes at the Best Buy Apple display - I mean actually use one. Many years ago - after a number of conversations with a co worker he finally admitted that he had never actually even seen a Mac in person - all of his arguments were based on what he heard from friends or read online.
Maybe you should just read History of laptops before even claiming apple created the notebook look...
there you can also see the first apple notebooks had a trackball on the side (later on front).
Only in 1994 Apple licensed the trackpad technology and included it in their laptops.
Apple has a nose for new technology (and often licenses it (arm), or buys it (intrinsity, fingerworks)), combined with remembering their successes and forgetting their failures lead to a false sense of 'apple created/invented everything'....
Any discussion about this quickly leads to : oh no, they re-invented it, or they popularized it. Both are completely different things.
According to your cited "history" the Apple designed Macintosh Portable "evolved" into the PowerBook. That's not true at all. Sony designed the original PowerBook with (for) Apple, and clearly Sony was better at designing portable hardware than Apple was in the late 80s -- it never really had before!
But regardless, it was Apple's PowerBook (with help from Sony) that sold well and established the modern form of the laptop. Until then, every PC laptop had the keyboard go right up to the front edge, and IBM continued that by adding a clit joystick in the home row of the keyboard. Nobody still does that. Everyone builds laptops patterned after the original PowerBook, because it worked.
Apple was also the first significant laptop maker to include a trackpad -- no, it didn't invent the concept of trackpads, but your desperate attempts to take credit away from Apple for popularizing many of the features of the modern notebook PC simply fails to fit the facts.
But that could also be discounted by people like myself, brought into the Apple world through an iPhone, made the switch from years of PCs to a Mac to get AWAY from Windows. The simplicity and intuitiveness that the iPhone demonstrated to me in a mobile device made me reconsider how computers should work. After 20+ years of fighting dozens of Windows machines, I wanted the same experience in personal computing that I suddenly had in mobile computing.
When I purchased my iMac a couple of years ago, I knew it could run Windows, but I didn't want it to run Windows. I'm sure I wasn't the only one feeling this way when I made the Apple shift.
I wonder if anyone has ever did a survey of users who have made the PC to Apple changeover and have never installed Windows on their Mac?
couldn´t agree more with your post
Just thinking of using a Windows prog worse a machine gives me shivers and makes my stomach contract. My neighbor dropped by today and asked me whether I could help him install Nokia Maps on his shitfckucomplexoverengineered piece of manure. Reminded me of how fckued up that MS world is. Parallels? Yeah had it because of a few games, life´s better without the games and the MSWin VM.
The writer of this article, Daniel Eran Dilger, has no clue -- NONE!!! -- what Adam Smith's invisible hand of the market metaphor refers to or means. Had he known, he wouldn't have used it to shoot what's remaining of his credibility straight to Hell. How embarrassing. What he said is complete, utter NONSENSE.
Overly dramatic much?
How does the misapplication of a metaphor shoot what's remaining of one's credibility straight to hell?
On that basis we'd never listen to anyone who writes on the net - including ourselves.
However if his article could be shown to be demonstrably false or disingenuous then that's another matter, and one might even countenance your conclusion.
Except for all the astute analysis that blew over your head.
Putting words in all caps isn't actually the sign of a strong argument.
Learn to recognize the difference between a comment and an argument.
There are few times when all caps are useful or warranted. Expressing personal disgust is one of them. (HINT: You don't have to like it.)
Any analysis/argument stemming from the incorrect use of a metaphor is rendered nonsense.
It takes a genius to explain email on iPad? Oh, the humanity!
Sure, if the folks are 60+ and never before worked on a computer, heck I know people that are not even 50 have a degree and shun computers or have before coming to our place
Last year the focus was on tablets, now it's ultraportable notebooks. If these don't work out for the other vendors and Apple comes out with a new product category I bet I can guess what CES 2013 will be focused on.
Dell TV.
HP TV.
Gateway TV.
Lenovo TV.
Acer TV.
Where do they get these awesome ideas?
Dell TV.
HP TV.
Gateway TV.
Lenovo TV.
Acer TV.
Where do they get these awesome ideas?
Vizio is one going the other way.
- http://www.blogcdn.com/www.engadget....-with-accy.jpg
I think it looks cheaper than the Dell AIOs but what I find interesting is the lack of a mouse but instead the Magic Trackpad looking pointing device. I would really like to know how well that works.