Workers' rights petitions delivered to Apple's Grand Central store

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  • Reply 41 of 137
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by astrubhar View Post


    Nobody is claiming these other companies aren't also at fault. This is just a start. Apple does a better job than all these other companies but it doesn't mean they can't do better. Especially with all this cash laying around. This misconception that the price of Apple products will go up is wrong. It will just make Apple slightly less profitable.



    ... and what about the other companies?
  • Reply 42 of 137
    gtrgtr Posts: 3,231member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by astrubhar View Post


    Nobody is claiming these other companies aren't also at fault. This is just a start. Apple does a better job than all these other companies but it doesn't mean they can't do better. Especially with all this cash laying around. This misconception that the price of Apple products will go up is wrong. It will just make Apple slightly less profitable.



    That's awfully noble of you, telling companies that you don't own how to spend their money that you don't have.



    This type of personal sacrifice makes you a true humanitarian in my book!
  • Reply 43 of 137
    apple ][apple ][ Posts: 9,233member
    The employees were given wage increases not that long ago.



    Anybody who complains should send them their own money. Do something about it yourself, don't whine and expect other people to do what you think is right, no matter how perverse and disgusting your own thoughts may be. It is not Apple's responsibility and Apple does not employ those people.



    Go fly to China and protest in front of one of Foxconns factories. Foxconn makes hundreds of millions each quarter in profit. Tell them to pay more. And while you're at it, you might want to overthrow the Chinese government and change the entire Chinese culture while you're there, because that is where the core issues lie.
  • Reply 44 of 137
    gtrgtr Posts: 3,231member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Apple ][ View Post


    The employees were given wage increases not that long ago.



    Anybody who complains should send them their own money. Do something about it yourself, don't whine and expect other people to do what you think is right, no matter how perverse and disgusting your own thoughts may be. It is not Apple's responsibility and Apple does not employ those people.



    Go fly to China and protest in front of one of Foxconns factories. Foxconn makes hundreds of millions each quarter in profit. Tell them to pay more. And while you're at it, you might want to overthrow the Chinese government and change the entire Chinese culture while you're there, because that is where the core issues lie.



    I've heard that Apple has taken the first step in addressing many of the concerns expressed here.



    They've just changed their catchphrase from "We build great products" to "We build great factory conditions".
  • Reply 45 of 137
    apple ][apple ][ Posts: 9,233member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by astrubhar View Post


    Nobody is claiming these other companies aren't also at fault. This is just a start. Apple does a better job than all these other companies but it doesn't mean they can't do better. Especially with all this cash laying around. This misconception that the price of Apple products will go up is wrong. It will just make Apple slightly less profitable.



    You sound like a real humanitarian and a pretty generous person.



    There's this homeless family down the street from me with two children who look like they haven't eaten in 17 days. I think that you should send them some money and help them out. It won't affect you much, it will just make you slightly less profitable.



    And as opposed to Apple, which is a for profit company beholden to stock owners, I assume that there are no such outside forces or pressures which might affect or influence any decisions that a humanitarian such as yourself would make.
  • Reply 46 of 137
    Foxconn also makes the xBox and many other devices - but the order size from Apple must lead the pack. Has anyone listened to this podcast at:

    http://www.thisamericanlife.org/radi...-apple-factory

    Mike Daisey has interviewed ex staff at the Foxconn factory in Shenzhen.
  • Reply 47 of 137
    irnchrizirnchriz Posts: 1,616member
    Accepted by the employee, taken round the back and shredded. Job done.
  • Reply 48 of 137
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Apple ][ View Post


    And as opposed to Apple, which is a for profit company beholden to stock owners, I assume that there are no such outside forces or pressures which might affect or influence any decisions that a humanitarian such as yourself would make.



    I hope you do realize that stock prices are mostly affected by value and growth. Decreasing profit margins by a few dollars wont do anything to the stock and would mean a lot to these people.



    Everyone is this thread is pretending the problem doesn't exist. There have been independent investigations and everyone is coming to the same conclusion. They are overworked and treated like slaves. People here are arguing that because other companies do it that Apple should be able to get away with it too. Yeah, Apple is trying harder than other companies but they aren't trying that hard. Conditions are improving but we need larger and swifter action.



    These hard working people are the reason you can afford your iPod, iPhone, and Macs. They are the only reason Apple can continue building great products and you can afford to buy them. We can sit here and try to justify their crappy incomes and lives with all kinds of excuses or we can treat them with dignity as fellow humans. This protest isn't trying to say Apple is evil, it's saying that a lot of people support this idea and would like to see something done about it.
  • Reply 49 of 137
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by mytdave View Post


    It's crystal clear by now that the European style socialist ideals are a complete failure, and we need to get back to the way things were in the '50s and grow this country again. Let the Chinese worry about China. Their future and working conditions are up to them, not us.



    We would have to go back to the 1940's, and have the majority of the world's manufacturing infrastructure outside of North America blown up during a world war, before we can have the economic growth seen in the 1950's ever again.
  • Reply 50 of 137
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by astrubhar View Post


    Everyone is this thread is pretending the problem doesn't exist.



    Everyone?!



    I'd tell you the same thing I told that other guy yesterday but the mods would probably get upset.



    We know the fucking problem exists. We don't need naive little buggers like yourself telling us how we should act and think and I'm sure Apple and the other companies also don't need you telling them how to think either.



    I want to hear exactly what you would do to rectify these problems. The last person to whom I asked that same question got strangely quiet.
  • Reply 51 of 137
    irnchrizirnchriz Posts: 1,616member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by astrubhar View Post


    Who does Foxconn work for?



    Foxconn work for themselves. As do all other profit making enterprises in the world. Apple are merely one of their customers along with Dell, HP etc etc.



    Now, all a customer can do to improve things is to say they won't do business with them until they improve things. However, to do this you have to have another supplier you can go to for your products or services. As there are no other viable suppliers there is only so Much the customer can do other than stop producing goods and going out of business.
  • Reply 52 of 137
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by island hermit View Post


    I want to hear exactly what you would do to rectify these problems. The last person to whom I asked that same question got strangely quiet.



    1. Apple calls Foxconn and demands they pay their workers more, give them more breaks, and work them less hours or they will stop doing business with them. They also start auditing them much more aggressively.



    2. If Foxconn doesn't respond, Apple builds it's own assembly factory in China.



    See, that wasn't very hard. It just requires firm action. So what's your solution?
  • Reply 53 of 137
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by astrubhar View Post


    1. Apple calls Foxconn and demands they pay their workers more, give them more breaks, and work them less hours or they will stop doing business with them. They also start auditing them much more aggressively.



    2. If Foxconn doesn't respond, Apple builds it's own assembly factory in China.



    See, that wasn't very hard. It just requires firm action. So what's your solution?



    What the hell do you think Apple is doing. This is a slow slow process that takes a long time to rectify. If you had any fucking idea of how the world works you'd understand that these things aren't done overnight. [a little bit of knowledge about British and American labor movements would probably, but not guaranteed, teach you something.]



    Build their own factory? Are you absolutely out of your mind. Do you really think the Chinese would even allow Apple to upset the balance of commerce in that country?



    You are even more naive than I thought.



    Soon enough the Chinese will be making high end machinery all across their country and the US and other current developed nations will have the shit jobs. You should consider yourself lucky this doesn't happen sooner than later.



    [these kids and their magic wand fixes to problems without having enough knowledge to weigh the consequences]
  • Reply 54 of 137
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by island hermit View Post


    What the hell do you think Apple is doing. This is a slow slow process that takes a long time to rectify. If you had any fucking idea of how the world works you'd understand that these things aren't done overnight.



    I'm not talking about overnight. It doesn't take 5 years to solve this problem.



    So what is your solution again? Keep doing what were doing now? That seems to be working out great.
  • Reply 55 of 137
    99.9% of the goods they sell are made in CHINA. same with WAL-MART, the number 2 brick 'n mortar retailer in the US.
  • Reply 56 of 137
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by astrubhar View Post


    I'm not talking about overnight. It doesn't take 5 years to solve this problem.



    So what is your solution again? Keep doing what were doing now? That seems to be working out great.



    You are not even listening, are you.



    It may take 50 years or more to solve this problem.



    Yes... keep doing what they are doing now. Slowly and systematically changing the labor situation.
  • Reply 57 of 137
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by tubbytee View Post


    99.9% of the goods they sell are made in CHINA. same with WAL-MART, the number 2 brick 'n mortar retailer in the US.



    All these little shits that are protesting would have been scared shitless to face Sam Walton when he was alive.
  • Reply 58 of 137
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by island hermit View Post


    You are not even listening, are you.



    It may take 50 years or more to solve this problem.



    I'm just not listening to your opinion.



    We're not trying to reform an entire country's labor system. Just one company. You're making this out to be a lot more complicated than it is. If we push hard enough this will get solved very quickly at Foxconn. I guess you're happy with letting the problem resolve itself, even if it takes 50 years. That kind of solution doesn't satisfy me or a quarter of a million other people. We can fix this. There is no need to be so pessimistic.
  • Reply 59 of 137
    citycity Posts: 522member
    When China has a near monopoly on all of the worlds manufacturing, including automobiles, they will probably pass laws requiring high wages and benefits. The Chinese people will be very happy and rich.
  • Reply 60 of 137
    gtrgtr Posts: 3,231member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by astrubhar View Post


    1. Apple calls Foxconn and demands they pay their workers more, give them more breaks, and work them less hours or they will stop doing business with them. They also start auditing them much more aggressively.



    2. If Foxconn doesn't respond, Apple builds it's own assembly factory in China.



    See, that wasn't very hard. It just requires firm action. So what's your solution?



    You just dodged the question there, sunshine.



    What exactly will YOU be doing to rectify the problem?



    Please keep in mind that the Chinese government and Chinese industry are the same thing when you provide your answer to how you'll be addressing the issue personally.



    (Feel free to add your age and any experience you may have in addressing these types of problems previously - it'll lend a lot of credibility to your solution)
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