If the government caves into the demands of the business community, it isnt going to help with the overall economy as a whole.
This will only encourage companies to send jobs or manufacturing plants OUTSIDE of the US in anticipation of future tax breaks from Congress to take advantage of.
Companies are already utilizing tax planning to extreme measures and finding loopholes in the system to take advantage of.
To cave into the demands of these organizations is only going to make matters worse than it is already.
...and Hillary Clinton's boneheaded idea that natural disasters are great for the economy because they boost employment.
Way to completely misrepresent what she actually said. Congrats.
It wasn't nearly as good as Michele Bachmann implying several times that certain specific natural disasters were due to God's unhappiness with Democrats, and then saying "Now I'm not saying it is, but how much of a coincidence is it?"
You'd have to look much harder for such boneheadedness from Clinton's original remark.
I think Apple and companies like then have a brass neck trying to avoid taxation. They have more money than they know what to do with yet helping the US and its citizens is not on the agenda. As long as the wall street suits get their cash to add to their pile, the rest of you can sing for it. A disgrace.
I gather that you will find a way to pay more taxes? Why should Apple owe more just because they found a way to make a lot of money?
It?s unfortunate that we have so many people in this country like you that somehow think others owe their success to someone else and should be forced to fork over their hard earned money.
Who are you to judge that they have more money than they know what to do with? That?s not your business or anybody else?s but Apple?s.
Apple sets up foreign offices to handle sales in other countries. They do this to avoid tariffs, just like Toyota builds many of its cars in the US to avoid import duties and shipping costs. But I am sure they pay tax in Japan on sales in the US as they are ultimately a Japanese Corporation. Apple has the same obligation. Paying taxes is not evil. It is pat of doing business. Big corporations who complain about their taxes just sound foolish.
No, Bruce, that's not how it works for Toyota or basically all other countries' multinational companies. For nearly all the rest of the world profits are taxed in the country they are earned and that's all. The US on the other hand wants to take money from already taxed profits earned in other countries. Even European governments with huge social systems that require crazy amounts of tax dollars to prop up don't try to steal money their nation's companies on the profits those companies earn from international business.
Way to completely misrepresent what she actually said. Congrats.
It wasn't nearly as good as Michele Bachmann implying several times that certain specific natural disasters were due to God's unhappiness with Democrats, and then saying "Now I'm not saying it is, but how much of a coincidence is it?"
You'd have to look much harder for such boneheadedness from Clinton's original remark.
So... clearly you've lost any ability to talk about the topic at hand... The idea that leftists don't believe in the "broken window" theory and the "magical multiplier" is just flat out wrong. It is EXACTLY what people like Clinton believe.
Seriously... her economic and political beliefs are in lock step with Paul Krugman. He recently advocated that Obama fake an invasion from Mars. He said that we would create a huge amount of economic growth by preparing to fight the invasion. This is what they believe... Yes... Hillary does believe in the broken window theory and the magical multiplier.
Apple should import the iPads, iPhones etc to the US partially completed (mostly completed) as raw materials/parts. Then set up a factory in the US to polish the glass, etch the name and FCC id info, put the cord and the charger in the packaging and call it made in USA. Their foreign subsidiaries have to buy the products from the US and the money stays here.
Haven't you figured out what "fair share" means? To a certain segment of our population... the literal definition of "fair share" means nothing more than "from those according to their means." Apple has it... so they think they deserve it.
Also interesting that it's such a nebulous phrase. No one will ever say what the "fair share" really is or explain why that amount is fair. I don't fit any criteria for a definition above middle class, but I think the anti-wealthy & anti-business rhetoric in the US these days is such shallow nonsense.
The actual tax rate is irrelevant. It the hope of a lower tax rate that is keeping money overseas. If it was half what it is now corporations would still hold out if there was a promise that a hike might be lower still.
What is needed is for the US government to incontrovertibly rule out future tax hikes to remove the incentive for companies to hold money offshore (just in case). Taxation and the government should take steps to avoid becoming a system that can be gamed, both now and in the future.
---
These kind of discussions always start off with the notion that a company would pay too much in corporate taxes but what is that value?
Even if it was half of what it was they would still want half of that anyway.
You cannot allow Corporations to black mail the government into paying less tax.
If I'm an individual working overseas where's my tax break? There are many countries for which I won't receive one. Government sshould offer to tax a US companies _more_ when it keeps it's money offshore.
Apple has already paid the taxes on the foreign earnings. There are lots of economic and supply chain reasons for manufacturing items offshore. And Apple is not the only company doing this, only one of, if not, the biggest.
And if Apple did bring it back, the government would use it to fill in the hole that resulted from all the crooked, built in the USA, mortgage deals that this, and the previous government, supported by buying off and rewarding all the crooked CEOs and their supporters. Why should properly run companies like Apple, that honestly innovate and create, pay for the misdeeds of dishonest, lazy US companies.
No one has stated what the rates are, but the holders of foreign money must think they are significant.
Why is the US government entitled to ANY of this money?
Its all profits from overseas.
It is entitled to the difference between the foreign countries taxes and the US tax because apple is a US Company. In my opinion that is fair. But the difference the US Government is talking about is ridiculous and amounts to no more than double taxation. The amount does not matter. Just because apple has billions it should be taxed at the same rate per dollar that every other corporation is taxed at. People think and use the argument that apple has huge piles of cash and they can afford whatever the government thinks is right is BS. Apple is not asking for the government to remove the taxes completely, there just asking for a fair rate tax rate on that money. Not the ridiculous rate the government wants. Because of those ridiculous rates there is no incentive for apple to brink that money back to the US and loose Billions in doing so.
So for those of you who want all their money because they have more than they need.
How would you feel if..
You lived on a border town between two states. Let's say, St. Louis, MO. But you work in East St. Louis, IL. Since you earn your income in IL you pay income tax in IL. When you file your state returns for MO do you want to be taxed a second time? I'm guessing not. If Missouri decided they had every right to get your money because you are a resident what would you do?
Would you tell MO that if they don't you would be more likely to stay in MO and spend your money in MO and they would benefit from your property tax and sales tax. Or would you move across the river?
Think I'm full of it? Why do professional athletes have to pay income taxes based on where your game is at? Why do you think they like to play in Florida or be on a home team in Florida. And if it were so corrupt and business would just leave, then why aren't the Marlins as good as the Yankees? The only athletes flocking to FL to take advantage of this is LeBron.
Let Apple keep the money that has been taxed at least 2x already and let the "uber-rich" spend some damn money on products and services here.
Apple should just hire Americans to fly overseas and come back with their luggage stuffed full of cash and bring the money "back" that way. Customs checks are so infrequent and superficial, it would create tons of jobs to send those folks back and forth on money runs. As others have said: "Hey, I'm no expert".
I propose a simple deal: Congress should allow Apple to repatriate as much money as they want with zero taxes as long as every dollar is used to open new factories in the USA and hire American workers. They can use the money to purchase equipment such as robotic assembly lines, solar power plants, additional server farms and so on but it must all be located here in the USA even if the gear is purchased overseas.
If I'm an individual working overseas where's my tax break? There are many countries for which I won't receive one. Government sshould offer to tax a US companies _more_ when it keeps it's money offshore.
If as a US citizen you spent all of 2011 living and working in a foreign country (doesn't matter which foreign country it is) the first $95,100 of your salary is exempt from US income tax. You will pay local income taxes in the country where you reside and work as you should.
If the government caves into the demands of the business community, it isnt going to help with the overall economy as a whole.
This will only encourage companies to send jobs or manufacturing plants OUTSIDE of the US in anticipation of future tax breaks from Congress to take advantage of.
Companies are already utilizing tax planning to extreme measures and finding loopholes in the system to take advantage of.
To cave into the demands of these organizations is only going to make matters worse than it is already.
The less money gets filtered through the government, the better off we will ALL be.
I propose a simple deal: Congress should allow Apple to repatriate as much money as they want with zero taxes as long as every dollar is used to open new factories in the USA and hire American workers. They can use the money to purchase equipment such as robotic assembly lines, solar power plants, additional server farms and so on but it must all be located here in the USA even if the gear is purchased overseas.
Thank god you're not in charge of economic policy. I guess blatant protectionism isn't shameful as it used to be. Sad. Trade lifts all parties. A policy of forcing anyone or company to buy something instead of something else causes FAR worse problems than any amount of lost tax revenue could ever. Welcome to communist USSR.
Comments
This will only encourage companies to send jobs or manufacturing plants OUTSIDE of the US in anticipation of future tax breaks from Congress to take advantage of.
Companies are already utilizing tax planning to extreme measures and finding loopholes in the system to take advantage of.
To cave into the demands of these organizations is only going to make matters worse than it is already.
Check this link for more information:
http://www.cbpp.org/cms/index.cfm?fa=view&id=3593
...and Hillary Clinton's boneheaded idea that natural disasters are great for the economy because they boost employment.
Way to completely misrepresent what she actually said. Congrats.
It wasn't nearly as good as Michele Bachmann implying several times that certain specific natural disasters were due to God's unhappiness with Democrats, and then saying "Now I'm not saying it is, but how much of a coincidence is it?"
You'd have to look much harder for such boneheadedness from Clinton's original remark.
I think Apple and companies like then have a brass neck trying to avoid taxation. They have more money than they know what to do with yet helping the US and its citizens is not on the agenda. As long as the wall street suits get their cash to add to their pile, the rest of you can sing for it. A disgrace.
I gather that you will find a way to pay more taxes? Why should Apple owe more just because they found a way to make a lot of money?
It?s unfortunate that we have so many people in this country like you that somehow think others owe their success to someone else and should be forced to fork over their hard earned money.
Who are you to judge that they have more money than they know what to do with? That?s not your business or anybody else?s but Apple?s.
Apple sets up foreign offices to handle sales in other countries. They do this to avoid tariffs, just like Toyota builds many of its cars in the US to avoid import duties and shipping costs. But I am sure they pay tax in Japan on sales in the US as they are ultimately a Japanese Corporation. Apple has the same obligation. Paying taxes is not evil. It is pat of doing business. Big corporations who complain about their taxes just sound foolish.
No, Bruce, that's not how it works for Toyota or basically all other countries' multinational companies. For nearly all the rest of the world profits are taxed in the country they are earned and that's all. The US on the other hand wants to take money from already taxed profits earned in other countries. Even European governments with huge social systems that require crazy amounts of tax dollars to prop up don't try to steal money their nation's companies on the profits those companies earn from international business.
Way to completely misrepresent what she actually said. Congrats.
It wasn't nearly as good as Michele Bachmann implying several times that certain specific natural disasters were due to God's unhappiness with Democrats, and then saying "Now I'm not saying it is, but how much of a coincidence is it?"
You'd have to look much harder for such boneheadedness from Clinton's original remark.
So... clearly you've lost any ability to talk about the topic at hand... The idea that leftists don't believe in the "broken window" theory and the "magical multiplier" is just flat out wrong. It is EXACTLY what people like Clinton believe.
Seriously... her economic and political beliefs are in lock step with Paul Krugman. He recently advocated that Obama fake an invasion from Mars. He said that we would create a huge amount of economic growth by preparing to fight the invasion. This is what they believe... Yes... Hillary does believe in the broken window theory and the magical multiplier.
Haven't you figured out what "fair share" means? To a certain segment of our population... the literal definition of "fair share" means nothing more than "from those according to their means." Apple has it... so they think they deserve it.
Also interesting that it's such a nebulous phrase. No one will ever say what the "fair share" really is or explain why that amount is fair. I don't fit any criteria for a definition above middle class, but I think the anti-wealthy & anti-business rhetoric in the US these days is such shallow nonsense.
The actual tax rate is irrelevant. It the hope of a lower tax rate that is keeping money overseas. If it was half what it is now corporations would still hold out if there was a promise that a hike might be lower still.
What is needed is for the US government to incontrovertibly rule out future tax hikes to remove the incentive for companies to hold money offshore (just in case). Taxation and the government should take steps to avoid becoming a system that can be gamed, both now and in the future.
---
These kind of discussions always start off with the notion that a company would pay too much in corporate taxes but what is that value?
Even if it was half of what it was they would still want half of that anyway.
You cannot allow Corporations to black mail the government into paying less tax.
If I'm an individual working overseas where's my tax break? There are many countries for which I won't receive one. Government sshould offer to tax a US companies _more_ when it keeps it's money offshore.
And if Apple did bring it back, the government would use it to fill in the hole that resulted from all the crooked, built in the USA, mortgage deals that this, and the previous government, supported by buying off and rewarding all the crooked CEOs and their supporters. Why should properly run companies like Apple, that honestly innovate and create, pay for the misdeeds of dishonest, lazy US companies.
No one has stated what the rates are, but the holders of foreign money must think they are significant.
Why is the US government entitled to ANY of this money?
Its all profits from overseas.
It is entitled to the difference between the foreign countries taxes and the US tax because apple is a US Company. In my opinion that is fair. But the difference the US Government is talking about is ridiculous and amounts to no more than double taxation. The amount does not matter. Just because apple has billions it should be taxed at the same rate per dollar that every other corporation is taxed at. People think and use the argument that apple has huge piles of cash and they can afford whatever the government thinks is right is BS. Apple is not asking for the government to remove the taxes completely, there just asking for a fair rate tax rate on that money. Not the ridiculous rate the government wants. Because of those ridiculous rates there is no incentive for apple to brink that money back to the US and loose Billions in doing so.
How would you feel if..
You lived on a border town between two states. Let's say, St. Louis, MO. But you work in East St. Louis, IL. Since you earn your income in IL you pay income tax in IL. When you file your state returns for MO do you want to be taxed a second time? I'm guessing not. If Missouri decided they had every right to get your money because you are a resident what would you do?
Would you tell MO that if they don't you would be more likely to stay in MO and spend your money in MO and they would benefit from your property tax and sales tax. Or would you move across the river?
Think I'm full of it? Why do professional athletes have to pay income taxes based on where your game is at? Why do you think they like to play in Florida or be on a home team in Florida. And if it were so corrupt and business would just leave, then why aren't the Marlins as good as the Yankees? The only athletes flocking to FL to take advantage of this is LeBron.
Let Apple keep the money that has been taxed at least 2x already and let the "uber-rich" spend some damn money on products and services here.
No one has stated what the rates are, but the holders of foreign money must think they are significant.
It would be at the corporations current tax rate. Apple's would be 35%. That is significant.
---
If I'm an individual working overseas where's my tax break? There are many countries for which I won't receive one. Government sshould offer to tax a US companies _more_ when it keeps it's money offshore.
If as a US citizen you spent all of 2011 living and working in a foreign country (doesn't matter which foreign country it is) the first $95,100 of your salary is exempt from US income tax. You will pay local income taxes in the country where you reside and work as you should.
Is that a good enough tax break for you?
At least try to be informed, do a Google search for US foreign earned income tax exemption. - http://www.irs.gov/businesses/small/...=97130,00.html
If the government caves into the demands of the business community, it isnt going to help with the overall economy as a whole.
This will only encourage companies to send jobs or manufacturing plants OUTSIDE of the US in anticipation of future tax breaks from Congress to take advantage of.
Companies are already utilizing tax planning to extreme measures and finding loopholes in the system to take advantage of.
To cave into the demands of these organizations is only going to make matters worse than it is already.
The less money gets filtered through the government, the better off we will ALL be.
The federal government never runs out of money.
Nuff' said.
The less money gets filtered through the government, the better off we will ALL be.
Darn tooting... Everyone stop paying taxes now! We'll show them.
I wouldn't trust a report made by idiots. Look, it is real simple...
35% x $0 = 0
5% x $60,000,000,000 = $3,000,000,000
I know this is complex math, but which result is larger? Who cares what the companies do with the money once it is here, that is just gravy.
-kpluck
And sadly that $3,000,000,000 wouldn't dent the $1.5 trillion dollar deficit.
I propose a simple deal: Congress should allow Apple to repatriate as much money as they want with zero taxes as long as every dollar is used to open new factories in the USA and hire American workers. They can use the money to purchase equipment such as robotic assembly lines, solar power plants, additional server farms and so on but it must all be located here in the USA even if the gear is purchased overseas.
Thank god you're not in charge of economic policy. I guess blatant protectionism isn't shameful as it used to be. Sad. Trade lifts all parties. A policy of forcing anyone or company to buy something instead of something else causes FAR worse problems than any amount of lost tax revenue could ever. Welcome to communist USSR.