Why do you think you'll buy apps on a Windows tablet when you wouldn't buy them on an iPad -- likely the function will [should] be similar -- even apps like maps or YouTube that are equally accessible through a browser?
I didn't say I wouldn't buy them on an iPad. I said on desktops people generally don't install apps for things like news feeds, facebook etc. But the way Win8 is set up with tiles as your start screen when you log on, app running in full screen, along with the tile for the app store. It makes it more like using a phone or tablet where you woudn't think twice about installing an app rather than visiting a website.
I think after win 8, people will be visiting websites less on a desktop/laptop and download apps instead.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum
What do you think the experience with a Windows tablet will be when web sites and app developers begin to serve pages tailored to exploit the iPad's retina display and graphics... and they will?
The bar has been set higher for tablet display resolution -- will you (and others) be satisfied with second best or almost as good?
Why would it be any different on a Win8 tablet? Win8 has been set up to support high res images to.
Do you really think many websites are going to suddenly start supporting high res images though? 90% of the web currently positions everything using pixels rather than em's or points. Unless you can break all those habbits websites are going to stay looking the same.
I have the Win 8 preview installed. Looks to be Win 7 with Metro slathered on. If there isn't a way to put the UI permanently in "classic" mode, count me out!
The Metro UI is pretty nice, at least it's original compared to the route Android took.
For phones and mobile, yes. Forcing it onto the desktop? Hardly revolutionary - more reactionary
Quote:
I like that you can switch to the classic Windows view too if for some reason you hate Metro.
No you can't. There's a "desktop", but it's not your fathers windows desktop. Just try to find your apps or control panel - or ANYTHING other than IE. The only reason I was able to find the hidden sidebar is that I happened to read others complaints. If I hadn't, at least I would have had IE to search to find out how to make the damned thing useable.
I see no innovation in the Win 8 interface - just "different" for the sake of different. If the don't change it or at least let it be really turned off, support in the enterprise will be a nightmare.
That just might provide the ammo that since we have to retrain everyone anyway, we might as well switch to Mac. Hmm, Windows 8 could be a good thing after all!
Quote:
Some people just hate Microsoft, I think people are underestimating how well these will do.
I think traditionalist are overestimating how well they will do - fundamentally there is very little new here - another half hearted attempt by MS. If they were willing to commit - not call it Windows, but like Appe christen a new category and really go after it, then maybe.
But I doubt they will fool many people...
Quote:
Apple will be approaching 100 million iPads sold by the time these are released but I really predict Windows tablets will be taking the number 2 spot eventually.
that's not saying much since they could be number 2 with 10 million. Hardly a success if you look at the real gauge of success in business: profit (not marketshare!)
I don't know. But from the path that's being taken with Win8, I do get the impression that MS is taking the tablet market very seriously indeed
the fact that it still has "windows" in the product name tells you all you need to know.
Tablet PC round two - Ding Ding Ding!
More of the same leftover strategy is not going to change the tide. MS's biggest problem is their own internal organization structure kills innovation.
Frankly, I'm not sure if this Retina is worth it from a storage standpoint until price on the 32GB+ models come down.
Typing on the new iPad right now, I can attest Retina is indeed well worth it! I skipped the 2 and budgeted for the 64GB and couldn't be more pleased. I feel for those who only get the 16GB model
I believe you are right -- MS is taking the tablet market very seriously...
I believe they are scared shitless (as they should be). Serious about committing? If they were serious it wouldn't be a strategy dominated by the multi-decade failure of tablet PC. Instead, like Apple, it would be a truely fresh approach where the desktop would willingly be made a peer.
That's heresy in the church of Microsoft!
They just can't help themselves - without a strong leader the Windows and Office teams have too much power
Microsoft should have scooped up Mark Hurd from HP instead of letting him go to Oracle - he's the exact kind of replacement for Ballmer they need.
No guts, no glory. Being timid or traditional is not going to counter Apple...
I think something that is missing in all current, and for that matter near future OSes, is the ability to understand what I'm doing at some point, where am I going to, is hot there? is cold? am I moving fast or slow? what time is it? etc so, if I'm leaving my house early morning, but I'm moving at a relative slow speed, saying at pedester speed, my mobile companion could guess that I'm jogging and ask for permission to start pedometer, jogging music, check my emails etc. If I check the device it would show apps first apps that could be useful for what I'm doing at this moment.
Say that I'm reaching the office, it could check my calendar and emails, maybe warn me about presence of friends around me, and if I check the device, again apps shown should be reorganized around where am I, at what time etc It could even resemble my desktop, if I'm in the office, but make no sense in a lot of other places to show me spreadsheet apps if I'm going to a theater or something. Probably I would like to check restaurants, foursquare-ike apps, nearby friends etc
just my two cents...
Emerson
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider
As Microsoft scrambles to finish its next generation Windows 8 tablet and desktop operating system, some analysts say that the Redmond, Wash., company must launch by October to avoid being overrun by mounting competition from Apple and Google's Android.
Citing sources with inside knowledge of Microsoft's 2012 roadmap, Bloomberg reports that the company is looking to complete Windows 8 by summer and plans to launch the OS on a variety of tablets and PCs before the holiday season in October.
In respect to tablet sales, Gartner Inc. analyst Michael Gartenberg notes that a pre-holiday shipment is necessary for Microsoft to fend off the fierce competition presented by Apple's iOS and Android.
?If they miss the September-October time frame, they?re going to be stuck without being able to ship anything in 2012,? Gartenberg said. ?The last thing Microsoft wants to have is a situation where there are no compelling Windows tablets at a time when the new iPad looks like it?s going to be a good seller for the holidays.?
Windows 8 Consumer Preview. | Source: Microsoft
Gartner estimates that over 103 million tablets will be sold in 2012, with the number more than tripling to 326.3 million by 2015. Apple will take a majority of those sales, however growing competition from devices running Google's Android and, to a lesser extent, Microsoft will eat into the iPad's market share.
Since its introduction in 2010, the iPad has enjoyed the lion's share of tablet sales and moved over 15 million units in the last quarter of 2011 alone. At the end of January, the iPad accounted for 58 percent of the market while Android held a 39 percent share. Microsoft came in a distant third with 1.5 percent.
Demand for Apple's tablet has not waned, as the recently-released third-generation iPad sold a record-breaking 3 million units over its launch weekend.
Gartner expects that a flood of Android and Windows devices will dilute the iPad's market share to 46 percent in 2015, however that number is contingent on Microsoft meeting a 2012 Windows 8 launch date.
In addition to over 40 traditional Intel-based machines, Microsoft is looking to rollout devices based on the ARM platform when Windows 8 is eventually released. The number of devices running on ARM chips at launch will be limited to fewer than five, three of which are reported to be tablets.
Although no official date has been set for the Windows 8 rollout, insiders say that Microsoft will be holding a special event for industry partners in April to announce release timing and marketing.
Do you really think many websites are going to suddenly start supporting high res images though? 90% of the web currently positions everything using pixels rather than em's or points. Unless you can break all those habbits websites are going to stay looking the same.
As I understand it, the reason for a public web site is to attract and hold visitors.
Now, it is suggested that there will be 60-100 million new retina iPads sold this year -- one of the fastest growing segments accessing the web.
If I were competing for iPad retina eyeballs, I would design my site to maximize their experience by tailoring pages and controls to the device -- common sense.
Sure I would support other one-size-fits -all resolutions/formats, but I want my site to cater to the large numbers of users, with money to spend -- and who actually spending money -- they bought the iPad.
Further, it is a rather easy target as there is only one screen size, aspect ratio and 2 PPI resolutions.
Don't believe me? Visit http://eweek.com on an iPad -- they have an option on their home page to view and navigate the 1st layer of the site, optimized for touch (kind of an amalgam of iOS and Android). The second layer, the actual stories are one-size-fits-all.
My point is that the tailoring of web sites to a target device has already begun and some one(s) are going to gain viewers by serving pages targeted to the new iPad retina display.
And, I'd be willing to bet that sites like AI are looking at ways to exploit the new iPad retina display -- as I type this!
I think something that is missing in all current, and for that matter near future OSes, is the ability to understand what I'm doing at some point, where am I going to, is hot there? is cold? am I moving fast or slow? what time is it? etc so, if I'm leaving my house early morning, but I'm moving at a relative slow speed, saying at pedester speed, my mobile companion could guess that I'm jogging and ask for permission to start pedometer, jogging music, check my emails etc. If I check the device it would show apps first apps that could be useful for what I'm doing at this moment.
Say that I'm reaching the office, it could check my calendar and emails, maybe warn me about presence of friends around me, and if I check the device, again apps shown should be reorganized around where am I, at what time etc It could even resemble my desktop, if I'm in the office, but make no sense in a lot of other places to show me spreadsheet apps if I'm going to a theater or something. Probably I would like to check restaurants, foursquare-ike apps, nearby friends etc
just my two cents...
Emerson
A rudimentary form of that exists in iOS -- you can set reminders that get triggered based on location:
Windows 8 works extremely well on a desktop. I've only been using the consumer preview for 3 weeks, but have already made it my primary OS and can't imagine going back to Windows 7 or OS X.
Joined in March of 2012, 2 posts hmmm.... Sure, whatever you say.
As I understand it, the reason for a public web site is to attract and hold visitors.
Now, it is suggested that there will be 60-100 million new retina iPads sold this year -- one of the fastest growing segments accessing the web.
If I were competing for iPad retina eyeballs, I would design my site to maximize their experience by tailoring pages and controls to the device -- common sense.
Sure I would support other one-size-fits -all resolutions/formats, but I want my site to cater to the large numbers of users, with money to spend -- and who actually spending money -- they bought the iPad.
Further, it is a rather easy target as there is only one screen size, aspect ratio and 2 PPI resolutions.
Don't believe me? Visit http://eweek.com on an iPad -- they have an option on their home page to view and navigate the 1st layer of the site, optimized for touch (kind of an amalgam of iOS and Android). The second layer, the actual stories are one-size-fits-all.
My point is that the tailoring of web sites to a target device has already begun and some one(s) are going to gain viewers by serving pages targeted to the new iPad retina display.
And, I'd be willing to bet that sites like AI are looking at ways to exploit the new iPad retina display -- as I type this!
Yet your discussing this on a site that doesn't even have a tablet version, let alone rework all the images to take advantage of high res screens.
Also still doesn't answer the point of why do you think the iPad will definitely remain having the best screen. I have a lumia 800 and my wife has an iPhone 4, the iPhone certainly has a better resolution but the colours on the Nokia are far better. The iPhone is probably the best screen for showing things in gray, but if you want some colour in you life it's fairly poor in comparison.
Also still doesn't answer the point of why do you think the iPad will definitely remain having the best screen. I have a lumia 800 and my wife has an iPhone 4, the iPhone certainly has a better resolution but the colours on the Nokia are far better. The iPhone is probably the best screen for showing things in gray, but if you want some colour in you life it's fairly poor in comparison.
Quote:
?The new iPad has a virtually perfect 99 percent of the Standard Color Gamut (a 38 percent improvement over the iPad 2). The colours are beautiful and accurate due to very good factory calibration ? they are also ?more vibrant? but not excessively so or gaudy like some existing OLED displays,? Dr Soneira concluded.
The very accurate colours and picture quality, he adds, mean that the new iPad is likely to be the best quality display you own, unless you happen to own a calibrated professional display. In fact, with just some minor calibration tweaks the new iPad would qualify as a studio reference monitor, Soneira says.
I don't know. But from the path that's being taken with Win8, I do get the impression that MS is taking the tablet market very seriously indeed and will pump in just about as much cash as it takes. Apple certainly has a head start, but MS has more clout and reputation than the various Android manufacturers and will put up a better fight. Of course, those factors didn't help MS very much with Windows Phone! But perhaps MS is fighting a little closer to its own territory with larger devices.
Perhaps. I agree, if anyone of these competitors could give Apple a run for it's money, it would be the clout of Microsoft. It surely isn't a sure thing though judging by their past record. Samsung would be a much more dangerous competitor if [IF] they were to better develop their own software platform and leave Android behind. I don't see any of this happening to any scale that could hurt Apple's growth in market share though. IMO
Comments
Interesting...
Why do you think you'll buy apps on a Windows tablet when you wouldn't buy them on an iPad -- likely the function will [should] be similar -- even apps like maps or YouTube that are equally accessible through a browser?
I didn't say I wouldn't buy them on an iPad. I said on desktops people generally don't install apps for things like news feeds, facebook etc. But the way Win8 is set up with tiles as your start screen when you log on, app running in full screen, along with the tile for the app store. It makes it more like using a phone or tablet where you woudn't think twice about installing an app rather than visiting a website.
I think after win 8, people will be visiting websites less on a desktop/laptop and download apps instead.
What do you think the experience with a Windows tablet will be when web sites and app developers begin to serve pages tailored to exploit the iPad's retina display and graphics... and they will?
The bar has been set higher for tablet display resolution -- will you (and others) be satisfied with second best or almost as good?
Why would it be any different on a Win8 tablet? Win8 has been set up to support high res images to.
Do you really think many websites are going to suddenly start supporting high res images though? 90% of the web currently positions everything using pixels rather than em's or points. Unless you can break all those habbits websites are going to stay looking the same.
The Metro UI is pretty nice, at least it's original compared to the route Android took.
For phones and mobile, yes. Forcing it onto the desktop? Hardly revolutionary - more reactionary
I like that you can switch to the classic Windows view too if for some reason you hate Metro.
No you can't. There's a "desktop", but it's not your fathers windows desktop. Just try to find your apps or control panel - or ANYTHING other than IE. The only reason I was able to find the hidden sidebar is that I happened to read others complaints. If I hadn't, at least I would have had IE to search to find out how to make the damned thing useable.
I see no innovation in the Win 8 interface - just "different" for the sake of different. If the don't change it or at least let it be really turned off, support in the enterprise will be a nightmare.
That just might provide the ammo that since we have to retrain everyone anyway, we might as well switch to Mac. Hmm, Windows 8 could be a good thing after all!
Some people just hate Microsoft, I think people are underestimating how well these will do.
I think traditionalist are overestimating how well they will do - fundamentally there is very little new here - another half hearted attempt by MS. If they were willing to commit - not call it Windows, but like Appe christen a new category and really go after it, then maybe.
But I doubt they will fool many people...
Apple will be approaching 100 million iPads sold by the time these are released but I really predict Windows tablets will be taking the number 2 spot eventually.
that's not saying much since they could be number 2 with 10 million. Hardly a success if you look at the real gauge of success in business: profit (not marketshare!)
I don't know. But from the path that's being taken with Win8, I do get the impression that MS is taking the tablet market very seriously indeed
the fact that it still has "windows" in the product name tells you all you need to know.
Tablet PC round two - Ding Ding Ding!
More of the same leftover strategy is not going to change the tide. MS's biggest problem is their own internal organization structure kills innovation.
Perfect summarization: http://www.bonkersworld.net/organizational-charts/
Frankly, I'm not sure if this Retina is worth it from a storage standpoint until price on the 32GB+ models come down.
Typing on the new iPad right now, I can attest Retina is indeed well worth it! I skipped the 2 and budgeted for the 64GB and couldn't be more pleased. I feel for those who only get the 16GB model
I was hoping for a 128 option
I believe you are right -- MS is taking the tablet market very seriously...
I believe they are scared shitless (as they should be). Serious about committing? If they were serious it wouldn't be a strategy dominated by the multi-decade failure of tablet PC. Instead, like Apple, it would be a truely fresh approach where the desktop would willingly be made a peer.
That's heresy in the church of Microsoft!
They just can't help themselves - without a strong leader the Windows and Office teams have too much power
Microsoft should have scooped up Mark Hurd from HP instead of letting him go to Oracle - he's the exact kind of replacement for Ballmer they need.
No guts, no glory. Being timid or traditional is not going to counter Apple...
Say that I'm reaching the office, it could check my calendar and emails, maybe warn me about presence of friends around me, and if I check the device, again apps shown should be reorganized around where am I, at what time etc It could even resemble my desktop, if I'm in the office, but make no sense in a lot of other places to show me spreadsheet apps if I'm going to a theater or something. Probably I would like to check restaurants, foursquare-ike apps, nearby friends etc
just my two cents...
Emerson
As Microsoft scrambles to finish its next generation Windows 8 tablet and desktop operating system, some analysts say that the Redmond, Wash., company must launch by October to avoid being overrun by mounting competition from Apple and Google's Android.
Citing sources with inside knowledge of Microsoft's 2012 roadmap, Bloomberg reports that the company is looking to complete Windows 8 by summer and plans to launch the OS on a variety of tablets and PCs before the holiday season in October.
In respect to tablet sales, Gartner Inc. analyst Michael Gartenberg notes that a pre-holiday shipment is necessary for Microsoft to fend off the fierce competition presented by Apple's iOS and Android.
?If they miss the September-October time frame, they?re going to be stuck without being able to ship anything in 2012,? Gartenberg said. ?The last thing Microsoft wants to have is a situation where there are no compelling Windows tablets at a time when the new iPad looks like it?s going to be a good seller for the holidays.?
Windows 8 Consumer Preview. | Source: Microsoft
Gartner estimates that over 103 million tablets will be sold in 2012, with the number more than tripling to 326.3 million by 2015. Apple will take a majority of those sales, however growing competition from devices running Google's Android and, to a lesser extent, Microsoft will eat into the iPad's market share.
Since its introduction in 2010, the iPad has enjoyed the lion's share of tablet sales and moved over 15 million units in the last quarter of 2011 alone. At the end of January, the iPad accounted for 58 percent of the market while Android held a 39 percent share. Microsoft came in a distant third with 1.5 percent.
Demand for Apple's tablet has not waned, as the recently-released third-generation iPad sold a record-breaking 3 million units over its launch weekend.
Gartner expects that a flood of Android and Windows devices will dilute the iPad's market share to 46 percent in 2015, however that number is contingent on Microsoft meeting a 2012 Windows 8 launch date.
In addition to over 40 traditional Intel-based machines, Microsoft is looking to rollout devices based on the ARM platform when Windows 8 is eventually released. The number of devices running on ARM chips at launch will be limited to fewer than five, three of which are reported to be tablets.
Although no official date has been set for the Windows 8 rollout, insiders say that Microsoft will be holding a special event for industry partners in April to announce release timing and marketing.
[ View article on AppleInsider ]
the fact that it still has "windows" in the product name tells you all you need to know.
Ha! Yes it says it all...
...
Do you really think many websites are going to suddenly start supporting high res images though? 90% of the web currently positions everything using pixels rather than em's or points. Unless you can break all those habbits websites are going to stay looking the same.
As I understand it, the reason for a public web site is to attract and hold visitors.
Now, it is suggested that there will be 60-100 million new retina iPads sold this year -- one of the fastest growing segments accessing the web.
If I were competing for iPad retina eyeballs, I would design my site to maximize their experience by tailoring pages and controls to the device -- common sense.
Sure I would support other one-size-fits -all resolutions/formats, but I want my site to cater to the large numbers of users, with money to spend -- and who actually spending money -- they bought the iPad.
Further, it is a rather easy target as there is only one screen size, aspect ratio and 2 PPI resolutions.
Don't believe me? Visit http://eweek.com on an iPad -- they have an option on their home page to view and navigate the 1st layer of the site, optimized for touch (kind of an amalgam of iOS and Android). The second layer, the actual stories are one-size-fits-all.
My point is that the tailoring of web sites to a target device has already begun and some one(s) are going to gain viewers by serving pages targeted to the new iPad retina display.
And, I'd be willing to bet that sites like AI are looking at ways to exploit the new iPad retina display -- as I type this!
I think something that is missing in all current, and for that matter near future OSes, is the ability to understand what I'm doing at some point, where am I going to, is hot there? is cold? am I moving fast or slow? what time is it? etc so, if I'm leaving my house early morning, but I'm moving at a relative slow speed, saying at pedester speed, my mobile companion could guess that I'm jogging and ask for permission to start pedometer, jogging music, check my emails etc. If I check the device it would show apps first apps that could be useful for what I'm doing at this moment.
Say that I'm reaching the office, it could check my calendar and emails, maybe warn me about presence of friends around me, and if I check the device, again apps shown should be reorganized around where am I, at what time etc It could even resemble my desktop, if I'm in the office, but make no sense in a lot of other places to show me spreadsheet apps if I'm going to a theater or something. Probably I would like to check restaurants, foursquare-ike apps, nearby friends etc
just my two cents...
Emerson
A rudimentary form of that exists in iOS -- you can set reminders that get triggered based on location:
Here's How You Can Configure Location Reminders In The Reminders App
Windows 8 works extremely well on a desktop. I've only been using the consumer preview for 3 weeks, but have already made it my primary OS and can't imagine going back to Windows 7 or OS X.
Joined in March of 2012, 2 posts hmmm.... Sure, whatever you say.
you're disparaging the 77 Chevy Nova.
Ugly car, man was it ever ugly.
As I understand it, the reason for a public web site is to attract and hold visitors.
Now, it is suggested that there will be 60-100 million new retina iPads sold this year -- one of the fastest growing segments accessing the web.
If I were competing for iPad retina eyeballs, I would design my site to maximize their experience by tailoring pages and controls to the device -- common sense.
Sure I would support other one-size-fits -all resolutions/formats, but I want my site to cater to the large numbers of users, with money to spend -- and who actually spending money -- they bought the iPad.
Further, it is a rather easy target as there is only one screen size, aspect ratio and 2 PPI resolutions.
Don't believe me? Visit http://eweek.com on an iPad -- they have an option on their home page to view and navigate the 1st layer of the site, optimized for touch (kind of an amalgam of iOS and Android). The second layer, the actual stories are one-size-fits-all.
My point is that the tailoring of web sites to a target device has already begun and some one(s) are going to gain viewers by serving pages targeted to the new iPad retina display.
And, I'd be willing to bet that sites like AI are looking at ways to exploit the new iPad retina display -- as I type this!
Yet your discussing this on a site that doesn't even have a tablet version, let alone rework all the images to take advantage of high res screens.
Also still doesn't answer the point of why do you think the iPad will definitely remain having the best screen. I have a lumia 800 and my wife has an iPhone 4, the iPhone certainly has a better resolution but the colours on the Nokia are far better. The iPhone is probably the best screen for showing things in gray, but if you want some colour in you life it's fairly poor in comparison.
Ugly car, man was it ever ugly.
Yeah, but the paint on the Nova lasted... weeks!
Also still doesn't answer the point of why do you think the iPad will definitely remain having the best screen. I have a lumia 800 and my wife has an iPhone 4, the iPhone certainly has a better resolution but the colours on the Nokia are far better. The iPhone is probably the best screen for showing things in gray, but if you want some colour in you life it's fairly poor in comparison.
?The new iPad has a virtually perfect 99 percent of the Standard Color Gamut (a 38 percent improvement over the iPad 2). The colours are beautiful and accurate due to very good factory calibration ? they are also ?more vibrant? but not excessively so or gaudy like some existing OLED displays,? Dr Soneira concluded.
The very accurate colours and picture quality, he adds, mean that the new iPad is likely to be the best quality display you own, unless you happen to own a calibrated professional display. In fact, with just some minor calibration tweaks the new iPad would qualify as a studio reference monitor, Soneira says.
Colour saturation ?key to new iPad wow factor?
I don't know. But from the path that's being taken with Win8, I do get the impression that MS is taking the tablet market very seriously indeed and will pump in just about as much cash as it takes. Apple certainly has a head start, but MS has more clout and reputation than the various Android manufacturers and will put up a better fight. Of course, those factors didn't help MS very much with Windows Phone! But perhaps MS is fighting a little closer to its own territory with larger devices.
Perhaps. I agree, if anyone of these competitors could give Apple a run for it's money, it would be the clout of Microsoft. It surely isn't a sure thing though judging by their past record. Samsung would be a much more dangerous competitor if [IF] they were to better develop their own software platform and leave Android behind. I don't see any of this happening to any scale that could hurt Apple's growth in market share though. IMO