Where am I posting from? How can you tell me what to say in my culture, and how to say it?
I'm posting from Hong Kong. I'm speaking Cantonese, which is what we speak in Hong Kong. I'm saying what people here say FIRST, which means, roughly, "congratulations, get rich". I could say "sun nin fai lok" ("xin nian kwai le") to say "happy new year", but in Hong Kong, that's not usually what is said. Why do I have to go by your rules? Are you somehow superior? Do you have some sort of resentment of Hong Kong?
You're not the only real Chinese in this forum, but you might be the only real asshole.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Hey! What's with the attitude?!
Do you think you're being debased because I'm from Shanghai and you Hong Kong?
I thought that people from Hong Kong are superior as they are somewhat Europeans who are superior.
Do you really feel so different?
Sure, say whatever you want. I just thought that it'd be more 'international' to use mandarin.
For example, if I were to go to work in India, I would'nt start by learning a lesser languange. I'd go for the mostly spoken one (as I was told they have more than 100)
<strong>stevegongrui, how's Shanghai look? Everyone keeps telling me it's the future. Is there any particular reason you're not there?</strong><hr></blockquote>
In a nutshell, Shanghai is beautiful.
The last time I was in Hong Kong was 5 years ago so I guess I'm not in the position to compare it with Shanghai.
I remember being pretty impressed by Hong Kong, but with every year that I go back to Shanghai, I must say that it has changed a lot.
Beijing cannot compare with Shanghai. Beijing somewhat coexists with chaos, which I guess is normal when there are so many inhabitants.
But, although there are 17 million inhabitants in Shanghai, you do not get the feeling of congestion of cars, people etc. Furthermore, there are all sorts of projects right at the centre, where, whole spaces are just made into green parks. I think its really beautiful to have these parks in the middle of the center where the land must cost shitloads.
The transport system is also quite impressive. The metro is actually much better than the shit we have here in Rome (which is considered a developed country). The sky is always blue and pollution is at a minimum mostly due to the sea winds and the large tree plantation.
So, there are lots of trees even in the city where the skyscrapers are soaring. Many of the building are also quite beautiful as they look very artistic. Also, the third tallest building in the world is in the pudong area which is actually an island overlooking Shanghai.
Especially during the night, Shanghai is amazing.
Lots of people now speak English and the city is really international. I can buy almost any major product from any country. This is a lot better than Rome, where you see nothing but local stuff.
Rome seems extremely provincial compared to Shanghai.
Recently, the Maglev has been installed and is already taking people (though officially still in testing phase)
I wouldn't be objective if I don't talk about the bad things, though there aren't too many.
Mostly, It's too hot during the summer.
Stuff here is also really expensive. I remember reading somehwere that it is the 6th most expensive city in terms of living expenses in the world.
This is very unusual in a developing country.
I think the future is very bright for Shanghai. Although Beijing is the center of politics, Shanghai will be the Economic focus of China and will permit China to springboard into the future.
-there are 200 thousand Taiwanese businessmen alone in Shanghai! Amazing!
People of Shanghai have a very international attitude and look into the future. They are extremely hardworking and in my opinion, a little smarter and more cunning than those from other provinces.
But I really do admire the fact that many Americans will outwardly admit their weaknesses even if US is No. 1.
But what I don't like are the type of Americans at my school who are mainly exchange students.
I don't like them because they think themselves superior and that somehow the rules for them do not apply.
I think you don't have to worry too much about Anti-Americanism if you yourself feel equal with the others.
I have come to think that Anti-Americanism arises because the Americans somehow begin by thinking that they are hated, so as a result they put on a kind of 'act'. I see this as them thinking themselves superior.
By the way, a kid at our school even posted a poster at our school's entrance saying:
FOR ALL YOU ANTI-AMERICANS:
JUST THINK WHERE YOU'D BE IF IT WEREN'T FOR USA.
Not that really pissed me off as I live in an international community. I speak 4 languages too.
One of the reasons why Hong Kong is not doing so well these days is because it is easier than ever to go to the mainland.
Before, business with the mainland had to first go through Hong Kong but now, it is direct.
Also, it was very difficult for tourists to go to China and so they just went to Hong Kong as it was easier. Now, it is a lot easier.
There are plenty of foreigners roaming around in Shanghai. There are also some expat quarters.
Foreigners tolerance is very high too and I feel are somewhat treated with more respect.
Design is really hot in Shanghai. I mean pure design. Real design. There are so many people who can work for designers.
I have a friend who has his own design company. He's actually still in University but he makes around 20000 yuan a month just with the extra weekends and time he has.
Outlook is very good. I think it'd be a good idea to go to Shanghai and not only does it have the elegant and professional work atmosphere Hong Kong possesses but also the possibility for you to play hard which you are looking for.
It is such a big city that there is so much opportunity for everyone.
Just by looking I think you'd find the best paying job in international communication.
Demand for language experts is incredibly big.
What do you know in international communication?
My father is a simultaneous interpretor. He works here in Rome for the UN, but I know that if he were to work as a freelance in China, pay would be around 600$ per day.
By the way, its about time you move out of Hong Kong.
Outlook is not so good unless Hong Kong switches to doing things like high tech development which the mainland is still at this time not so good at.
Basically, when it will be possible to freely go to the Mainland and Taiwan, Hong Kong will be even worse off.
Hong Kong just doesn't have the advantage it had a couple of years back. It isn't special anymore and people prefer doing business with the Mainland because of the advantages...
Reasons why Hong Kong is not doing well is not strictly the administration's fault.
Also, to answer the statement that two people said that China will end up like the other asian economies:
China is not the same as the other asian economies that are in ruin now. The best reason is becuase the other asian economies such as Indonesia, Malay, Thailand, Phillipines etc., are all export oriented and depend on the economies of the world. Hong Kong is no exception.
So, how do you expect them to do well when the economy of the whole world is not doing well?
China however, is very different. Statistics show that China consumes most of what it produces. This means that China, unlike the other economies has a big market. There is market in China and this will sustain its growth for a verylong time.
For example, Nikon used to make its cameras in Thailand, but the market for Nikon cameras in Thailand was virtually nil. Now, Nikon has moved its factories to China where demand in China is actually very high. The price of the cameras have been reduced since they are made in china.
I don't understand why the macs have to be first exported and then imported.
<strong>Yeah, but it's so sanitized. Read: boring.
And the work ethic, like Hong Kong, is a little too serious for me. I work hard and play hard, but in HK and Singapore if you leave work before 7 or 8 your boss thinks you're lazy.
And there's not much chance to fall back on teaching English if I have trouble getting a job in Singapore.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Sigh. Work hours are indeed long in Singapore. Luckily, more and more companies are adopting the 5 day week now.
Its hard to teach English in Singapore. U need a good degree and pass a few tests.. I should know, cos I am a trainee teacher.
Singapore and both HK are both export-orientated and the worldwide recession is hurting our economies. I hope this year of the goat will bring prosperity to our nations!!
What is there to mind about PRC in terms of politics?
Most people are not even remotely affected by this. Especially in Shanghai, the scent of politics is very small.
I agree with you on the way Chinese people behave and that would be a problem if you were thinking about Beijing. Shanghai however, I believe is truly different. I have interned in both cities and Shanghai is a lot more open.
As for your girlfriend, has she ever been to Shanghai? I have a feeling that it is just a general attitude of HK people. A general feeling of hostility. I'm sure that this misconception (if it is one) will be eliminated once you set foot on Shanghai.
People are very friendly.
Attitudes are very different in Shanghai compared to other cities in the Mainland.
Tonton, Why don't you go to Shanghai and have a look to see if working environments/atmosphere etc. is the one you want?
You could stay in a 4/5 star hotel for almost nothing compared to HK.
BTW, if you eventually need to rent a house, we've got one to rent. Its a 300m2 villa 3 kilometres from the metro. We can rent it as cheep as 650 USD. (This is shockingly cheap)
Hi..... I visited China this year spending time in Beijing and Shanghai both are wonderful cities. I prefered Beijing although there is not much to choose between them. Shanghai is beautiful so much to see and do. The Maglev is something else the new airport at Pudong great, plenty of cheap eating places excellent shopping. I caught the train to Hong Kong and enjoyed my stay there. I am intending to make another trip later on in the year wish me luck....an old backpacker. [QUOTE=stevegongrui;210881]
Quote:
Originally posted by tonton:
<strong>stevegongrui, how's Shanghai look? Everyone keeps telling me it's the future. Is there any particular reason you're not there?</strong><hr></blockquote>
In a nutshell, Shanghai is beautiful.
The last time I was in Hong Kong was 5 years ago so I guess I'm not in the position to compare it with Shanghai.
I remember being pretty impressed by Hong Kong, but with every year that I go back to Shanghai, I must say that it has changed a lot.
Beijing cannot compare with Shanghai. Beijing somewhat coexists with chaos, which I guess is normal when there are so many inhabitants.
But, although there are 17 million inhabitants in Shanghai, you do not get the feeling of congestion of cars, people etc. Furthermore, there are all sorts of projects right at the centre, where, whole spaces are just made into green parks. I think its really beautiful to have these parks in the middle of the center where the land must cost shitloads.
The transport system is also quite impressive. The metro is actually much better than the shit we have here in Rome (which is considered a developed country). The sky is always blue and pollution is at a minimum mostly due to the sea winds and the large tree plantation.
So, there are lots of trees even in the city where the skyscrapers are soaring. Many of the building are also quite beautiful as they look very artistic. Also, the third tallest building in the world is in the pudong area which is actually an island overlooking Shanghai.
Especially during the night, Shanghai is amazing.
Lots of people now speak English and the city is really international. I can buy almost any major product from any country. This is a lot better than Rome, where you see nothing but local stuff.
Rome seems extremely provincial compared to Shanghai.
Recently, the Maglev has been installed and is already taking people (though officially still in testing phase)
I wouldn't be objective if I don't talk about the bad things, though there aren't too many.
Mostly, It's too hot during the summer.
Stuff here is also really expensive. I remember reading somehwere that it is the 6th most expensive city in terms of living expenses in the world.
This is very unusual in a developing country.
I think the future is very bright for Shanghai. Although Beijing is the center of politics, Shanghai will be the Economic focus of China and will permit China to springboard into the future.
-there are 200 thousand Taiwanese businessmen alone in Shanghai! Amazing!
People of Shanghai have a very international attitude and look into the future. They are extremely hardworking and in my opinion, a little smarter and more cunning than those from other provinces.
Comments
<strong>uhg... christmas, chinese new year, valentine's day, birthday
all within 2-3 months....
im gonna go broke with buying gifts :eek: </strong><hr></blockquote>
At least u get to celebrate Valenetine's Day.
<strong>
Where am I posting from? How can you tell me what to say in my culture, and how to say it?
I'm posting from Hong Kong. I'm speaking Cantonese, which is what we speak in Hong Kong. I'm saying what people here say FIRST, which means, roughly, "congratulations, get rich". I could say "sun nin fai lok" ("xin nian kwai le") to say "happy new year", but in Hong Kong, that's not usually what is said. Why do I have to go by your rules? Are you somehow superior? Do you have some sort of resentment of Hong Kong?
You're not the only real Chinese in this forum, but you might be the only real asshole.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Hey! What's with the attitude?!
Do you think you're being debased because I'm from Shanghai and you Hong Kong?
I thought that people from Hong Kong are superior as they are somewhat Europeans who are superior.
Do you really feel so different?
Sure, say whatever you want. I just thought that it'd be more 'international' to use mandarin.
For example, if I were to go to work in India, I would'nt start by learning a lesser languange. I'd go for the mostly spoken one (as I was told they have more than 100)
Don't take it personally.
<strong>stevegongrui, how's Shanghai look? Everyone keeps telling me it's the future. Is there any particular reason you're not there?</strong><hr></blockquote>
In a nutshell, Shanghai is beautiful.
The last time I was in Hong Kong was 5 years ago so I guess I'm not in the position to compare it with Shanghai.
I remember being pretty impressed by Hong Kong, but with every year that I go back to Shanghai, I must say that it has changed a lot.
Beijing cannot compare with Shanghai. Beijing somewhat coexists with chaos, which I guess is normal when there are so many inhabitants.
But, although there are 17 million inhabitants in Shanghai, you do not get the feeling of congestion of cars, people etc. Furthermore, there are all sorts of projects right at the centre, where, whole spaces are just made into green parks. I think its really beautiful to have these parks in the middle of the center where the land must cost shitloads.
The transport system is also quite impressive. The metro is actually much better than the shit we have here in Rome (which is considered a developed country). The sky is always blue and pollution is at a minimum mostly due to the sea winds and the large tree plantation.
So, there are lots of trees even in the city where the skyscrapers are soaring. Many of the building are also quite beautiful as they look very artistic. Also, the third tallest building in the world is in the pudong area which is actually an island overlooking Shanghai.
Especially during the night, Shanghai is amazing.
Lots of people now speak English and the city is really international. I can buy almost any major product from any country. This is a lot better than Rome, where you see nothing but local stuff.
Rome seems extremely provincial compared to Shanghai.
Recently, the Maglev has been installed and is already taking people (though officially still in testing phase)
I wouldn't be objective if I don't talk about the bad things, though there aren't too many.
Mostly, It's too hot during the summer.
Stuff here is also really expensive. I remember reading somehwere that it is the 6th most expensive city in terms of living expenses in the world.
This is very unusual in a developing country.
I think the future is very bright for Shanghai. Although Beijing is the center of politics, Shanghai will be the Economic focus of China and will permit China to springboard into the future.
-there are 200 thousand Taiwanese businessmen alone in Shanghai! Amazing!
People of Shanghai have a very international attitude and look into the future. They are extremely hardworking and in my opinion, a little smarter and more cunning than those from other provinces.
I really love Shanghai.
You should check out some photos.
My father works for the UN here in Rome. I came here when I was 4 and have lived here ever since.
I really hate it though. I mean, the history is great, but looking at the colisem every day for 13 years is just too much.
I want to go to a modern city.
Thankfully, I'm going to University this year. In the US
I share some of your anxieties.
But I really do admire the fact that many Americans will outwardly admit their weaknesses even if US is No. 1.
But what I don't like are the type of Americans at my school who are mainly exchange students.
I don't like them because they think themselves superior and that somehow the rules for them do not apply.
I think you don't have to worry too much about Anti-Americanism if you yourself feel equal with the others.
I have come to think that Anti-Americanism arises because the Americans somehow begin by thinking that they are hated, so as a result they put on a kind of 'act'. I see this as them thinking themselves superior.
By the way, a kid at our school even posted a poster at our school's entrance saying:
FOR ALL YOU ANTI-AMERICANS:
JUST THINK WHERE YOU'D BE IF IT WEREN'T FOR USA.
Not that really pissed me off as I live in an international community. I speak 4 languages too.
<strong>
I mean what's the career outlook for a foreigner in Shanghai with experience in marketing, design and interntational communication?
I should make myself more clear. But Shanghai sounds like a decent place to live according to your report. Thanks.
I do hope I can feel welcome not just in the expatriate community. I like to feel like a local sometimes.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Why not try Singapore? My govt encourages foreign talent and there is good law and order over here.
Before, business with the mainland had to first go through Hong Kong but now, it is direct.
Also, it was very difficult for tourists to go to China and so they just went to Hong Kong as it was easier. Now, it is a lot easier.
There are plenty of foreigners roaming around in Shanghai. There are also some expat quarters.
Foreigners tolerance is very high too and I feel are somewhat treated with more respect.
Design is really hot in Shanghai. I mean pure design. Real design. There are so many people who can work for designers.
I have a friend who has his own design company. He's actually still in University but he makes around 20000 yuan a month just with the extra weekends and time he has.
Outlook is very good. I think it'd be a good idea to go to Shanghai and not only does it have the elegant and professional work atmosphere Hong Kong possesses but also the possibility for you to play hard which you are looking for.
It is such a big city that there is so much opportunity for everyone.
Just by looking I think you'd find the best paying job in international communication.
Demand for language experts is incredibly big.
What do you know in international communication?
My father is a simultaneous interpretor. He works here in Rome for the UN, but I know that if he were to work as a freelance in China, pay would be around 600$ per day.
And there aren't many people capable.
Ask me for more info if you want.
I can ask my father too.
Outlook is not so good unless Hong Kong switches to doing things like high tech development which the mainland is still at this time not so good at.
Basically, when it will be possible to freely go to the Mainland and Taiwan, Hong Kong will be even worse off.
Hong Kong just doesn't have the advantage it had a couple of years back. It isn't special anymore and people prefer doing business with the Mainland because of the advantages...
Also, to answer the statement that two people said that China will end up like the other asian economies:
China is not the same as the other asian economies that are in ruin now. The best reason is becuase the other asian economies such as Indonesia, Malay, Thailand, Phillipines etc., are all export oriented and depend on the economies of the world. Hong Kong is no exception.
So, how do you expect them to do well when the economy of the whole world is not doing well?
China however, is very different. Statistics show that China consumes most of what it produces. This means that China, unlike the other economies has a big market. There is market in China and this will sustain its growth for a verylong time.
For example, Nikon used to make its cameras in Thailand, but the market for Nikon cameras in Thailand was virtually nil. Now, Nikon has moved its factories to China where demand in China is actually very high. The price of the cameras have been reduced since they are made in china.
I don't understand why the macs have to be first exported and then imported.
Could someone explain?
<strong>Yeah, but it's so sanitized. Read: boring.
And the work ethic, like Hong Kong, is a little too serious for me. I work hard and play hard, but in HK and Singapore if you leave work before 7 or 8 your boss thinks you're lazy.
And there's not much chance to fall back on teaching English if I have trouble getting a job in Singapore.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Sigh. Work hours are indeed long in Singapore. Luckily, more and more companies are adopting the 5 day week now.
Its hard to teach English in Singapore. U need a good degree and pass a few tests.. I should know, cos I am a trainee teacher.
Singapore and both HK are both export-orientated and the worldwide recession is hurting our economies. I hope this year of the goat will bring prosperity to our nations!!
Stay optimistic!!
There just aren't enough Englishmen/Americans teaching English!
You can teach at one of many prestigious International Schools in China. The pay AFAIK is extremely high. Really.
Give more info about what you do and I might be able to help.
Cheers
Most people are not even remotely affected by this. Especially in Shanghai, the scent of politics is very small.
I agree with you on the way Chinese people behave and that would be a problem if you were thinking about Beijing. Shanghai however, I believe is truly different. I have interned in both cities and Shanghai is a lot more open.
As for your girlfriend, has she ever been to Shanghai? I have a feeling that it is just a general attitude of HK people. A general feeling of hostility. I'm sure that this misconception (if it is one) will be eliminated once you set foot on Shanghai.
People are very friendly.
Attitudes are very different in Shanghai compared to other cities in the Mainland.
Tonton, Why don't you go to Shanghai and have a look to see if working environments/atmosphere etc. is the one you want?
You could stay in a 4/5 star hotel for almost nothing compared to HK.
BTW, if you eventually need to rent a house, we've got one to rent. Its a 300m2 villa 3 kilometres from the metro. We can rent it as cheep as 650 USD. (This is shockingly cheap)
Regards.
Originally posted by tonton:
<strong>stevegongrui, how's Shanghai look? Everyone keeps telling me it's the future. Is there any particular reason you're not there?</strong><hr></blockquote>
In a nutshell, Shanghai is beautiful.
The last time I was in Hong Kong was 5 years ago so I guess I'm not in the position to compare it with Shanghai.
I remember being pretty impressed by Hong Kong, but with every year that I go back to Shanghai, I must say that it has changed a lot.
Beijing cannot compare with Shanghai. Beijing somewhat coexists with chaos, which I guess is normal when there are so many inhabitants.
But, although there are 17 million inhabitants in Shanghai, you do not get the feeling of congestion of cars, people etc. Furthermore, there are all sorts of projects right at the centre, where, whole spaces are just made into green parks. I think its really beautiful to have these parks in the middle of the center where the land must cost shitloads.
The transport system is also quite impressive. The metro is actually much better than the shit we have here in Rome (which is considered a developed country). The sky is always blue and pollution is at a minimum mostly due to the sea winds and the large tree plantation.
So, there are lots of trees even in the city where the skyscrapers are soaring. Many of the building are also quite beautiful as they look very artistic. Also, the third tallest building in the world is in the pudong area which is actually an island overlooking Shanghai.
Especially during the night, Shanghai is amazing.
Lots of people now speak English and the city is really international. I can buy almost any major product from any country. This is a lot better than Rome, where you see nothing but local stuff.
Rome seems extremely provincial compared to Shanghai.
Recently, the Maglev has been installed and is already taking people (though officially still in testing phase)
I wouldn't be objective if I don't talk about the bad things, though there aren't too many.
Mostly, It's too hot during the summer.
Stuff here is also really expensive. I remember reading somehwere that it is the 6th most expensive city in terms of living expenses in the world.
This is very unusual in a developing country.
I think the future is very bright for Shanghai. Although Beijing is the center of politics, Shanghai will be the Economic focus of China and will permit China to springboard into the future.
-there are 200 thousand Taiwanese businessmen alone in Shanghai! Amazing!
People of Shanghai have a very international attitude and look into the future. They are extremely hardworking and in my opinion, a little smarter and more cunning than those from other provinces.
I really love Shanghai.
You should check out some photos.