You take away coupons and the 'thrill of the bargain hunt', be prepared to alienate the big subset of shoppers consisting of bored housewives whose sole source of excitement is the adrenaline rush of 40% Off.
Are you saying that Apple products are cheap, low-end hardware wrapped in fancy marketing? Just asking.
I spent the last two days fixing a computer for my employer that has crapped out for the countless time because she doesn't understanding that buying cheap results in cheap. And she bought the cheapest ink cartridges and then failed to install one of them properly. It leaked and ruined the printer. *shakes his head*
Moral of the story - don't buy cheap if you want reliability. Now, back to the JCP story where "every day is cheap".
Yea well go around asking people with iDevices if they purchased it because of customer service
Huh?
Apple has TERRIBLE customer service.
Ever try to get something simple done?
Better schedule a "Genius" bar appointment 2 weeks in advance and then reschedule you entire day around that appointment.
Needed to get my 'T' power brick replaced. Should be as simple as walking in, giving your info, turning in your old brick, and getting a new one. Nope.
Typical American business man. He figures moving one product is the same as another product, it's all just widgets after all, so what worked for Apple will work for a cheesy department store. This is the same kind of thinking that leads to corporations hiring each other's CEOs regardless of what products or services they are selling, the assumption being that expertise in the companies field of work is irrelevant. All that matters is a tough, callous attitude towards labor costs, a good education in management theories, and experience in management at some other corporation, preferably but not nessesarily a profitable one. Thus we get absurdities like a soft drink CEO running a computer company and making decisions regarding products and technology he knows nothing of. Just cut costs, (especially labor costs, because those lowlife workers are all lazy anyways), get a slick marketing strategy going, and shift the units!
In any event, Mr. Johnson will do fine in the end, no matter what happens to JC Penny. If Penny's goes bankrupt tomorrow, Johnson will walk away with millions.
Ever try to get something simple done?
Better schedule a "Genius" bar appointment 2 weeks in advance and then reschedule you entire day around that appointment.
Needed to get my 'T' power brick replaced. Should be as simple as walking in, giving your info, turning in your old brick, and getting a new one. Nope.
Huh?
Apple has terrible customer service? The company that is repeatedly ranked by consumers as having world-class customer service? The company that even provides the opportunity to schedule free appointments at the Genius Bar?
I've been to many different Apple Stores in many different cities/countries and can say that I've never been unable to get a Genius Bar appointment on the same day. And that includes extremely busy stores like Michigan Ave in Chicago and Fifth Ave in NYC.
Are you talking about the same Apple Stores that don't have checkout lines and cash registers so that every transaction can be efficiently and speedily completed on the spot? And that's after you've been greeted by someone who will either check you in for an appointment or will call over someone to assist you with your specific need.
I confess that I've not found the time to visit one of the Microsoft stores -- are they the ones with the stellar customer service? How about Dell, Sony, HP, or Wal-Mart or Best Buy?
And as for my own experience getting a replacement power brick -- I needed one for my wife's MacBook. I walked into a relatively crowded, fairly busy Apple Store and walked out with the new one in less than 5 minutes -- no appointment required. And that's including the time it took the Associate to go in the back and grab the box off the shelf.
But I'm sure it must be all of my experiences that are the outliers and your one that is the norm for everyone...
Seems like it's pretty early to cast judgement on the JCP makeover. Remember, what Johnson has done in the past was all about "feel." Target went from being a downmarket dump to a kind of a fun place to shop. At least in my neck of the woods, they're typically clean, well laid out, with a pretty good selection of Target branded stuff or Target exclusives. A combination of store design, branding, judicious selection of merchandise, decent pricing and (apparently) efficient management make for more than the sum of the parts. Compared to, say, Walmart, which seems to be designed around the idea that getting stuff for as little as possible should be depressing, Target is an oasis. Or, to cite another example, Old Navy, which feels kind of cheap and nasty in its every particular, from the lighting to the displays to the merchandise.
So getting hung up on negative past experiences, or the efficacy of their pricing model, or the fate of department stores in general sort of misses the point, IMO. Wait and see what Johnson has in mind. If the new JCP is fun and welcoming in feel-- if when you walk in you think "Cool! This is pretty nice! I wonder what they have for sale?" then that's half the battle. And we won't really know how well that's working until we see the finished product.
Indeed. Not even Apple has had everything go gold right off. And some stuff like MobileMe was ultimately so bad they did a total revamp and even changed the name to try to avoid the bad taste left behind.
Actually no you're wrong. MobileMe STARTED off being bad then became a really good product.
Apple changed to iCloud for a much better reason. The device is king so let's get all the devices together. MobileMe made the cloud king and that is going to be fraught with danger.
iCloud is not MobileMe revamped. It is a new product, one that most people haven't grasped yet.
P.S. Is it just me or is AI just about unusable on the iPhone? Helloooooooooooooo come on Ai get an iPhone App already. If there is one already, "My bad!
Particularly ironic since that was the biggest complaint about vBulletin which was the previous forum application. Just so happens that vBulletin released their iPhone compatible version only a few weeks before AI bailed on them.
I like shopping at JCP and Macy's. But as some posters pointed out, women (especially) love sales and coupons and 40% off last price marked. And CLEARANCE signs. It'd be like someone coming into Apple and changing the packaging to something more practical and cheaper. We'd be screaming at the top of our lungs for a return of the opening experience we've come to know and love.
RJ has a crazy scheme of pricing where they are low all the time, but especially low on Fridays and then super super low when the planets align, blah blah blah. I'm fine with the low prices. But perhaps he should have kept at least one sale per month where we needed coupons to shop. He should have talked to his wife about his ambitious plan to save the rain forest.....
On an unrelated note, here's a question to AI: Why can't I hit RETURN when logging in? I have to actually click the login button. Or is it just me?
Wow. That ad campaign totally fell flat with me. It's this AppleInsider story that got my attention. JCP is having a sale (a lowering of their everyday low prices) on men's pants. I think I'll stop in this weekend.
(this has to be my most useless post on anything, anywhere)
Are you saying that Apple products are cheap, low-end hardware wrapped in fancy marketing? Just asking.
I spent the last two days fixing a computer for my employer that has crapped out for the countless time because she doesn't understanding that buying cheap results in cheap. And she bought the cheapest ink cartridges and then failed to install one of them properly. It leaked and ruined the printer. *shakes his head*
Moral of the story - don't buy cheap if you want reliability. Now, back to the JCP story where "every day is cheap".
Tallest was being sarcastic... And I agree with you, printers for example are mostly decrepit because innovation there stopped 10 years ago, and they've relied on this obtuse, broken business model of unicorn-tear in cartridges. Ironically since most printers are all-in-one for the mainstream now, focusing on ~reducing~ paper clutter should be their goal, like Doxie. Throw in Shoeboxed integration and I'm sure you instantly have a better "printer".
Tech dies when innovation stops. That's why we got into tech, right? But too many are now focused on useless gimmicky rubbish that won't last six months.
I mean, it's 2012, why do I have to go through a BOOK just to hit File, Print???
I like shopping at JCP and Macy's. But as some posters pointed out, women (especially) love sales and coupons and 40% off last price marked. And CLEARANCE signs. It'd be like someone coming into Apple and changing the packaging to something more practical and cheaper. We'd be screaming at the top of our lungs for a return of the opening experience we've come to know and love.
RJ has a crazy scheme of pricing where they are low all the time, but especially low on Fridays and then super super low when the planets align, blah blah blah. I'm fine with the low prices. But perhaps he should have kept at least one sale per month where we needed coupons to shop. He should have talked to his wife about his ambitious plan to save the rain forest.....
On an unrelated note, here's a question to AI: Why can't I hit RETURN when logging in? I have to actually click the login button. Or is it just me?
Yeah, you can't say everyday low prices if some days there are even more lots of low prices. It's confusing, and you screw with the customer's buying cycle.
Why can't they have everyday low, with just Friday as super Friday... Then you don't need sales and clearances, because Friday is always slotted to clear stock.
Everyday low for everyone, super Friday for hardcore bargain hunters, lose the coupons and clearances, instead boost loyalty marketing. Tell me this doesn't make you go, wow, that makes sense.
If you have "coupons" it should be related to loyalty marketing and special events, like fashion shows, makeovers, personal shopping... For gawds sake Ron knows all this stuff already!
Cheap is okay. Cheap and Fun! Now that's something. I don't see any fun in JC Penneys ads so far.
Comments
You take away coupons and the 'thrill of the bargain hunt', be prepared to alienate the big subset of shoppers consisting of bored housewives whose sole source of excitement is the adrenaline rush of 40% Off.
It's called sarcasm.
Quote:
Originally Posted by dasanman69
The moral of the story boys and girls is that you can't polish shit, you can only spread it around.
Nah, you CAN polish a turd... (
The REAL moral of the story is what to do when you are given a turd... spread it around, flush it, or polish it?
Well the REAL REAL moral of the story is that iDevices will sell well whether it's from a nice store or a cardboard lemonade stand.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jason98
Product is the king, not a store that sells it.
Wrong. Customer service is king.
This strategy might work over time as Penny changes its customer base from the Target crowd to the K-Mart/Walmart crowd.
Everyday low prices = every day low quality. People still believe you get what you pay for.
Yea well go around asking people with iDevices if they purchased it because of customer service
Quote:
Originally Posted by dasanman69
Yea well go around asking people with iDevices if they purchased it because of customer service
Huh?
Apple has TERRIBLE customer service.
Ever try to get something simple done?
Better schedule a "Genius" bar appointment 2 weeks in advance and then reschedule you entire day around that appointment.
Needed to get my 'T' power brick replaced. Should be as simple as walking in, giving your info, turning in your old brick, and getting a new one. Nope.
Typical American business man. He figures moving one product is the same as another product, it's all just widgets after all, so what worked for Apple will work for a cheesy department store. This is the same kind of thinking that leads to corporations hiring each other's CEOs regardless of what products or services they are selling, the assumption being that expertise in the companies field of work is irrelevant. All that matters is a tough, callous attitude towards labor costs, a good education in management theories, and experience in management at some other corporation, preferably but not nessesarily a profitable one. Thus we get absurdities like a soft drink CEO running a computer company and making decisions regarding products and technology he knows nothing of. Just cut costs, (especially labor costs, because those lowlife workers are all lazy anyways), get a slick marketing strategy going, and shift the units!
In any event, Mr. Johnson will do fine in the end, no matter what happens to JC Penny. If Penny's goes bankrupt tomorrow, Johnson will walk away with millions.
Huh?
Apple has terrible customer service? The company that is repeatedly ranked by consumers as having world-class customer service? The company that even provides the opportunity to schedule free appointments at the Genius Bar?
I've been to many different Apple Stores in many different cities/countries and can say that I've never been unable to get a Genius Bar appointment on the same day. And that includes extremely busy stores like Michigan Ave in Chicago and Fifth Ave in NYC.
Are you talking about the same Apple Stores that don't have checkout lines and cash registers so that every transaction can be efficiently and speedily completed on the spot? And that's after you've been greeted by someone who will either check you in for an appointment or will call over someone to assist you with your specific need.
I confess that I've not found the time to visit one of the Microsoft stores -- are they the ones with the stellar customer service? How about Dell, Sony, HP, or Wal-Mart or Best Buy?
And as for my own experience getting a replacement power brick -- I needed one for my wife's MacBook. I walked into a relatively crowded, fairly busy Apple Store and walked out with the new one in less than 5 minutes -- no appointment required. And that's including the time it took the Associate to go in the back and grab the box off the shelf.
But I'm sure it must be all of my experiences that are the outliers and your one that is the norm for everyone...
Seems like it's pretty early to cast judgement on the JCP makeover. Remember, what Johnson has done in the past was all about "feel." Target went from being a downmarket dump to a kind of a fun place to shop. At least in my neck of the woods, they're typically clean, well laid out, with a pretty good selection of Target branded stuff or Target exclusives. A combination of store design, branding, judicious selection of merchandise, decent pricing and (apparently) efficient management make for more than the sum of the parts. Compared to, say, Walmart, which seems to be designed around the idea that getting stuff for as little as possible should be depressing, Target is an oasis. Or, to cite another example, Old Navy, which feels kind of cheap and nasty in its every particular, from the lighting to the displays to the merchandise.
So getting hung up on negative past experiences, or the efficacy of their pricing model, or the fate of department stores in general sort of misses the point, IMO. Wait and see what Johnson has in mind. If the new JCP is fun and welcoming in feel-- if when you walk in you think "Cool! This is pretty nice! I wonder what they have for sale?" then that's half the battle. And we won't really know how well that's working until we see the finished product.
Quote:
Originally Posted by charlituna
Indeed. Not even Apple has had everything go gold right off. And some stuff like MobileMe was ultimately so bad they did a total revamp and even changed the name to try to avoid the bad taste left behind.
Actually no you're wrong. MobileMe STARTED off being bad then became a really good product.
Apple changed to iCloud for a much better reason. The device is king so let's get all the devices together. MobileMe made the cloud king and that is going to be fraught with danger.
iCloud is not MobileMe revamped. It is a new product, one that most people haven't grasped yet.
Quote:
Originally Posted by christopher126
P.S. Is it just me or is AI just about unusable on the iPhone? Helloooooooooooooo
Particularly ironic since that was the biggest complaint about vBulletin which was the previous forum application. Just so happens that vBulletin released their iPhone compatible version only a few weeks before AI bailed on them.
Quote:
Originally Posted by dualie
This strategy might work over time as Penny changes its customer base from the Target crowd to the K-Mart/Walmart crowd.
Everyday low prices = every day low quality. People still believe you get what you pay for.
Target doesn't do coupons, and their new commercials are aimed squarely at the Target shopper.
You're thinking Kohls.
I don't really care about JC Penney.
SO...
Could you guys sack him so we can replace the PC World guy? Maybe he would be better suited for JC Penney.
I like shopping at JCP and Macy's. But as some posters pointed out, women (especially) love sales and coupons and 40% off last price marked. And CLEARANCE signs. It'd be like someone coming into Apple and changing the packaging to something more practical and cheaper. We'd be screaming at the top of our lungs for a return of the opening experience we've come to know and love.
RJ has a crazy scheme of pricing where they are low all the time, but especially low on Fridays and then super super low when the planets align, blah blah blah. I'm fine with the low prices. But perhaps he should have kept at least one sale per month where we needed coupons to shop. He should have talked to his wife about his ambitious plan to save the rain forest.....
On an unrelated note, here's a question to AI: Why can't I hit RETURN when logging in? I have to actually click the login button. Or is it just me?
Wow. That ad campaign totally fell flat with me. It's this AppleInsider story that got my attention. JCP is having a sale (a lowering of their everyday low prices) on men's pants. I think I'll stop in this weekend.
(this has to be my most useless post on anything, anywhere)
Quote:
Originally Posted by dasanman69
The moral of the story boys and girls is that you can't polish shit, you can only spread it around.
Actually you can polish shit,
http://dsc.discovery.com/videos/mythbusters-polishing-a-turd.html
Just saying
Tallest was being sarcastic... And I agree with you, printers for example are mostly decrepit because innovation there stopped 10 years ago, and they've relied on this obtuse, broken business model of unicorn-tear in cartridges. Ironically since most printers are all-in-one for the mainstream now, focusing on ~reducing~ paper clutter should be their goal, like Doxie. Throw in Shoeboxed integration and I'm sure you instantly have a better "printer".
Tech dies when innovation stops. That's why we got into tech, right? But too many are now focused on useless gimmicky rubbish that won't last six months.
I mean, it's 2012, why do I have to go through a BOOK just to hit File, Print???
Yeah, you can't say everyday low prices if some days there are even more lots of low prices. It's confusing, and you screw with the customer's buying cycle.
Why can't they have everyday low, with just Friday as super Friday... Then you don't need sales and clearances, because Friday is always slotted to clear stock.
Everyday low for everyone, super Friday for hardcore bargain hunters, lose the coupons and clearances, instead boost loyalty marketing. Tell me this doesn't make you go, wow, that makes sense.
If you have "coupons" it should be related to loyalty marketing and special events, like fashion shows, makeovers, personal shopping... For gawds sake Ron knows all this stuff already!
Cheap is okay. Cheap and Fun! Now that's something. I don't see any fun in JC Penneys ads so far.