40% of such a large workforce is not a pretty number. Good luck to those people.
But, at the end of the day, RIM got far to comfortable with a single gimmick and a marketing campaign; Glorified Text Messaging and "We're super secure", respectively.
Anyone could've seen this coming a mile off, it's more predictable than 30 GOTO 10.
Funny. So Dell's profit has declined in recent quarters and it's only the projections that show their profit recovering. Note that they've had several earnings misses in recent years.
One could look at the overall history. Dell was gaining market share, growing, and increasing profits up to about 2004. Their market share peaked in 2006 at 19%. They're now down to 12% and still falling.
While there's no guarantee that Dell is going anywhere, their recent history is not particularly promising.
Vast majority of PC vendors have lost profits due to the current economic climate. That and Apple is using them all as scrubbing brushes under their mighty boot.
Dell are stagnating, no denying that, but 12% of the market share is still several millions in their back pack. Apple only has, what, 8%?
I've been predicting RIM's death for over a year now, when BB10 comes out, their market share will be nearly insignificant, they'll have nothing to leverage carriers with, and they'll have to load up their phones with carrier branded crapware. Between the iP5 and the juggernaut of Android, there's nowhere to run for RIM.
A sad end to a former giant, the two co CEO's destroyed RIM by having absolutely no clue about the current smartphone market and technology.
Problem is, RIM thinks they're in the handset business. They're not.They're in the communications business.
The value behind the BlackBerry phone system is BlackBerry Messenger. It, and the backend services, are what make the platform valuable. Without it, even a new BlackBerry 10 is just a so-so phone with a decent keyboard and a one-trick-pony camera app.
To survive, RIM needs to hire a team of crack iOS, Android, and Windows developers and use them to create a set of RIM messaging apps based on their existing Enterprise platform. Then sell their customers on having a truly secure cross-platform system for their sensitive corporate communications.
They need to be on iOS. They need to be on Android. They need to be on Window's Phone.
And they needed to do it a year ago.
They're not going to survive making a me-too phone with a me-too OS with no developer support or ecosystem behind it.
I've been predicting RIM's death for over a year now, when BB10 comes out, their market share will be nearly insignificant, they'll have nothing to leverage carriers with, and they'll have to load up their phones with carrier branded crapware. Between the iP5 and the juggernaut of Android, there's nowhere to run for RIM.
A sad end to a former giant, the two co CEO's destroyed RIM by having absolutely no clue about the current smartphone market and technology.
Could Microsoft gives it a mercy killing with new Exchange?
How? Just bring the new Exchange for Win 8 Enterprise that does everything BBM can, push mails and what have you. And has both iOS version, Google App version, and bundled with all pro-model Windows Mobile 8 handset. That would mean any Nokia's Lumia series of 800 model upward can have this update free later as well. That should be the end of RIM and BBM.
The best and brightest employees are typically amongst the first to leave. After all, they have the intelligence to see that the ship is sinking and they have the greatest ability to "pursue other opportunities."
This is the later stages of the game for RIM management. You have to worry about employee attrition as much as losing sales. HP -- with plenty of cash -- went through this with their bungled Palm/webOS acquisition. They bled talent faster than anything else. Even if HP wanted to revive the webOS platform today, most of the core engineers are long gone.
Soon RIM will cross that threshold. Without innovative new products in the pipeline, they will cross that point very quickly.
I have picked up the prediction from one fortune teller but... can I ask you this?
The said prediction concerned Kodak. It said that near Christmas 2012 it will all come to a head. The suitors Kodak expected will never arrive. Something big and bad will happen that destroy all values of its IP. Their business of photoprocessing becomes irrelevant completely by something coming along this year. Liquidation process would be announce after New Year 2013. That what he published anyway.
So I believe that prediction, should it come through, would mean one thing lead to the other; being that suitors and creditors look through Kodak's assets and properties and found that something isn't there. And without it, it will be the best to kill Kodak brand entirely. So they all walked away and Kodak's management are forced to do that.
So if it is true, what would be that 'missing something' that finally kill Kodak brand and company? Your post described RiM could be applied here. I was thinking what could it be.
- Last of core engineers and development team gone?
- Their claim on some money making IP was false?
- Apple won the case and whatever Kodak though it owns is now free?
- There really is nothing at all in R&D pipeline and the truth leaks out?
What could be the final blow that will liquidate Eastman Kodak by November 2012 you think?
People are laid off every day. People find work every day. So what.
So what? It's highly stressful for anyone to be laid off. If you don't care about the company, fine. But to brush off the plight of the families affected is to be heartless and ignorant.
Funny. So Dell's profit has declined in recent quarters and it's only the projections that show their profit recovering. Note that they've had several earnings misses in recent years.
One could look at the overall history. Dell was gaining market share, growing, and increasing profits up to about 2004. Their market share peaked in 2006 at 19%. They're now down to 12% and still falling.
While there's no guarantee that Dell is going anywhere, their recent history is not particularly promising.
Funny. Explain to me how this is going down the drain or even remotely close to it. While I don't agree with many of your comments, I can't believe you would make such a stupid comment like the poster I was replying to.
I don't get why everyone on here is so delighted to see a company doing badly. Grow up.
I would hate to see a good company doing badly. In the case of RIM, I don't feel too much sympathy. By my calendar, it's been 5 years since Apple demonstrated the iPhone. In those five years, RIM sat on their asses for the first 3. Then, when Apple showed the iPad it somehow initiated a reaction from RIM ... but not a very humble one. RIM seems to be creating something interested with BB10. So did Palm with WebOS.
I sympathize with some of the people at RIM, but it's hard from this vantage point to separate those who have been part of the problem from those who could have been part of the solution. And most of those would have likely left long ago.
You sure? From what I read they had a healthy business with 26.9% market for the first ten months of 1995 then it went bad.
Never bad more than 15%. But after Apple turned down Microsoft's offer to license System 8 from Apple, Scully raised prices on Macs, and while increasing profits, marketshare dropped to 12%. That's where it was when Michael Spindler became CEO. He made a really dumb decision which damaged the company Christmas 1995.
Oh please, once in a life time?? The Blackberry was once the default option for any company that wanted their staff to have mobile email access.
I don't want this to be looked at the wrong way, but RIM did a good, but not great job. While they were the first to get a good messaging and e-mail device out there, they weren't the first with a smartphone. Nokia was. RIM's smartphones were never that great as phones, and they weren't used that way most of the time.
The truth is that the smartphone industry was a lazy one, with slow growth, and small numbers of phones sold. It was only after the iPhone arrived that the smartphone industry began to grow rapidly. RIM followed along. But they still didn't get it. Same thing for Microsoft and Nokia. And now, they are paying the piper. While Palm got it, they were too small to account for much by then, and failed for a number of reasons.
Apple has branched out into a number of areas, starting with the iPod and iTunes. RIM never branched with anything, except the Playbook, and that's been a failure because of botched execution. Now, they've run out of time. Sales of their present phones are drying up, and there won't be a replacement until the last quarter of the year, assuming it's done by then, which is looking doubtful.
And when it does come out, it had better be perfect! People will be thinking of the Playbook launch. And they had better have a decent amount of native apps, and good ones. If not, it's thumbs down. I don't see it happening though.
That's one article, but Dell has a lot of problems, and they don't seem to be going away. For a while, it looked as though Dell had turned a corner, but now it seems as though they haven't after all. They have a long way to go to fix their problems.
But that already has happened with Apple and Android taking over their market share. RIM had a nice run, and they were the first true smartphone but the iPhone and it is Android copycats blew them out of the water. If they are still around in 2-3 years it will be a miracle.
That's not what we were talking about. We were talking about the business location, and what happens in that area if that business goes belly up, and closes down. Where do those local jobs go? Where do service businesses such as restaurants, dry cleaners and such who made a large portion of their sales to employees who are no longer there, go?
We see the "rust belt" in the US. All other countries have that as well. Some never recover.
Wow, not only does the title indicate RIM will lay off 40% with no real fact for proof, but some of you already seem to have them layed off now.
There's belief that RIm will lay off more than this 2,000. But the 40% mentioned is for the 12 months. They've already laid off 2,000 within that time.
But what's worse, is that there are now estimates that RIM will pare down to 10,000 by early 2013 in preparation of being sold.
Actually companies failing like this are a very good thing. You can't concern yourself with the employees, finding work is their business. Just imagine how much better off the world would be if GM and Chrysler had gone under. We might actually have business in Detroit innovating with respect to transportation. Instead we have the same old corporations invested with bad unions and zero innovation.
Your perspective here is totally screwed, this is exactly what business needs right now. It effectively frees up a great deal of talent that has be squandered by RIM and allows that talent to seed innovation elsewhere. Frankly you need to research your position a bit.
I couldn't agree more. A company like RIM failing might be bade for employees short-term, but it's good for the market (and hence employees) long term. Capitalism is supposed to be survival of the fittest. Weak companies don't innovate, don't produce and don't contribute. Your example with GM and Chrysler is perfect. In actuality, neither would have ceased to exist...they simply would have restructured. Instead, GM CEO Barack Obama took over, screwed the secured bond holders, and gave the company to the very unions that destroyed it. The result are things like the heavily subsidized Chevy Volt, which no one wants. But hey, we saved a lot of union workers who, despite having no real other education or training, get to make $80,000 a year. Fantastic.
Comments
Ouch
40% of such a large workforce is not a pretty number. Good luck to those people.
But, at the end of the day, RIM got far to comfortable with a single gimmick and a marketing campaign; Glorified Text Messaging and "We're super secure", respectively.
Anyone could've seen this coming a mile off, it's more predictable than 30 GOTO 10.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta
Funny. So Dell's profit has declined in recent quarters and it's only the projections that show their profit recovering. Note that they've had several earnings misses in recent years.
One could look at the overall history. Dell was gaining market share, growing, and increasing profits up to about 2004. Their market share peaked in 2006 at 19%. They're now down to 12% and still falling.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dell
While there's no guarantee that Dell is going anywhere, their recent history is not particularly promising.
Vast majority of PC vendors have lost profits due to the current economic climate. That and Apple is using them all as scrubbing brushes under their mighty boot.
Dell are stagnating, no denying that, but 12% of the market share is still several millions in their back pack. Apple only has, what, 8%?
I've been predicting RIM's death for over a year now, when BB10 comes out, their market share will be nearly insignificant, they'll have nothing to leverage carriers with, and they'll have to load up their phones with carrier branded crapware. Between the iP5 and the juggernaut of Android, there's nowhere to run for RIM.
A sad end to a former giant, the two co CEO's destroyed RIM by having absolutely no clue about the current smartphone market and technology.
Problem is, RIM thinks they're in the handset business. They're not.They're in the communications business.
The value behind the BlackBerry phone system is BlackBerry Messenger. It, and the backend services, are what make the platform valuable. Without it, even a new BlackBerry 10 is just a so-so phone with a decent keyboard and a one-trick-pony camera app.
To survive, RIM needs to hire a team of crack iOS, Android, and Windows developers and use them to create a set of RIM messaging apps based on their existing Enterprise platform. Then sell their customers on having a truly secure cross-platform system for their sensitive corporate communications.
They need to be on iOS. They need to be on Android. They need to be on Window's Phone.
And they needed to do it a year ago.
They're not going to survive making a me-too phone with a me-too OS with no developer support or ecosystem behind it.
See http://www.iSights.org/2012/05/rim-death-spiral-continues-massive-layoffs-looming.html
Wow, not only does the title indicate RIM will lay off 40% with no real fact for proof, but some of you already seem to have them layed off now.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Esoom
I've been predicting RIM's death for over a year now, when BB10 comes out, their market share will be nearly insignificant, they'll have nothing to leverage carriers with, and they'll have to load up their phones with carrier branded crapware. Between the iP5 and the juggernaut of Android, there's nowhere to run for RIM.
A sad end to a former giant, the two co CEO's destroyed RIM by having absolutely no clue about the current smartphone market and technology.
Could Microsoft gives it a mercy killing with new Exchange?
How? Just bring the new Exchange for Win 8 Enterprise that does everything BBM can, push mails and what have you. And has both iOS version, Google App version, and bundled with all pro-model Windows Mobile 8 handset. That would mean any Nokia's Lumia series of 800 model upward can have this update free later as well. That should be the end of RIM and BBM.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hentaiboy
Perhaps RIM could branch out into TVs. No wait...
There is no gold at the end of TV's rainbow. Everybody knows that by now, and Samsung might be left as the last man standing.
Quote:
Originally Posted by cvaldes1831
The best and brightest employees are typically amongst the first to leave. After all, they have the intelligence to see that the ship is sinking and they have the greatest ability to "pursue other opportunities."
This is the later stages of the game for RIM management. You have to worry about employee attrition as much as losing sales. HP -- with plenty of cash -- went through this with their bungled Palm/webOS acquisition. They bled talent faster than anything else. Even if HP wanted to revive the webOS platform today, most of the core engineers are long gone.
Soon RIM will cross that threshold. Without innovative new products in the pipeline, they will cross that point very quickly.
I have picked up the prediction from one fortune teller but... can I ask you this?
The said prediction concerned Kodak. It said that near Christmas 2012 it will all come to a head. The suitors Kodak expected will never arrive. Something big and bad will happen that destroy all values of its IP. Their business of photoprocessing becomes irrelevant completely by something coming along this year. Liquidation process would be announce after New Year 2013. That what he published anyway.
So I believe that prediction, should it come through, would mean one thing lead to the other; being that suitors and creditors look through Kodak's assets and properties and found that something isn't there. And without it, it will be the best to kill Kodak brand entirely. So they all walked away and Kodak's management are forced to do that.
So if it is true, what would be that 'missing something' that finally kill Kodak brand and company? Your post described RiM could be applied here. I was thinking what could it be.
- Last of core engineers and development team gone?
- Their claim on some money making IP was false?
- Apple won the case and whatever Kodak though it owns is now free?
- There really is nothing at all in R&D pipeline and the truth leaks out?
What could be the final blow that will liquidate Eastman Kodak by November 2012 you think?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quadra 610
People are laid off every day. People find work every day. So what.So what? It's highly stressful for anyone to be laid off. If you don't care about the company, fine. But to brush off the plight of the families affected is to be heartless and ignorant.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta
Funny. So Dell's profit has declined in recent quarters and it's only the projections that show their profit recovering. Note that they've had several earnings misses in recent years.
One could look at the overall history. Dell was gaining market share, growing, and increasing profits up to about 2004. Their market share peaked in 2006 at 19%. They're now down to 12% and still falling.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dell
While there's no guarantee that Dell is going anywhere, their recent history is not particularly promising.
Funny. Explain to me how this is going down the drain or even remotely close to it. While I don't agree with many of your comments, I can't believe you would make such a stupid comment like the poster I was replying to.
Quote:
Originally Posted by RichL
I don't get why everyone on here is so delighted to see a company doing badly. Grow up.
I would hate to see a good company doing badly. In the case of RIM, I don't feel too much sympathy. By my calendar, it's been 5 years since Apple demonstrated the iPhone. In those five years, RIM sat on their asses for the first 3. Then, when Apple showed the iPad it somehow initiated a reaction from RIM ... but not a very humble one. RIM seems to be creating something interested with BB10. So did Palm with WebOS.
I sympathize with some of the people at RIM, but it's hard from this vantage point to separate those who have been part of the problem from those who could have been part of the solution. And most of those would have likely left long ago.
Never bad more than 15%. But after Apple turned down Microsoft's offer to license System 8 from Apple, Scully raised prices on Macs, and while increasing profits, marketshare dropped to 12%. That's where it was when Michael Spindler became CEO. He made a really dumb decision which damaged the company Christmas 1995.
I don't want this to be looked at the wrong way, but RIM did a good, but not great job. While they were the first to get a good messaging and e-mail device out there, they weren't the first with a smartphone. Nokia was. RIM's smartphones were never that great as phones, and they weren't used that way most of the time.
The truth is that the smartphone industry was a lazy one, with slow growth, and small numbers of phones sold. It was only after the iPhone arrived that the smartphone industry began to grow rapidly. RIM followed along. But they still didn't get it. Same thing for Microsoft and Nokia. And now, they are paying the piper. While Palm got it, they were too small to account for much by then, and failed for a number of reasons.
Apple has branched out into a number of areas, starting with the iPod and iTunes. RIM never branched with anything, except the Playbook, and that's been a failure because of botched execution. Now, they've run out of time. Sales of their present phones are drying up, and there won't be a replacement until the last quarter of the year, assuming it's done by then, which is looking doubtful.
And when it does come out, it had better be perfect! People will be thinking of the Playbook launch. And they had better have a decent amount of native apps, and good ones. If not, it's thumbs down. I don't see it happening though.
That's one article, but Dell has a lot of problems, and they don't seem to be going away. For a while, it looked as though Dell had turned a corner, but now it seems as though they haven't after all. They have a long way to go to fix their problems.
That's not what we were talking about. We were talking about the business location, and what happens in that area if that business goes belly up, and closes down. Where do those local jobs go? Where do service businesses such as restaurants, dry cleaners and such who made a large portion of their sales to employees who are no longer there, go?
We see the "rust belt" in the US. All other countries have that as well. Some never recover.
Capitalism does create wealth. It's about the only way wealth is created.
But what's worse, is that there are now estimates that RIM will pare down to 10,000 by early 2013 in preparation of being sold.
Note the number of 6,000.
http://money.cnn.com/2012/05/29/technology/rim-hires-bankers/index.htm
Quote:
Originally Posted by wizard69
Actually companies failing like this are a very good thing. You can't concern yourself with the employees, finding work is their business. Just imagine how much better off the world would be if GM and Chrysler had gone under. We might actually have business in Detroit innovating with respect to transportation. Instead we have the same old corporations invested with bad unions and zero innovation.
Your perspective here is totally screwed, this is exactly what business needs right now. It effectively frees up a great deal of talent that has be squandered by RIM and allows that talent to seed innovation elsewhere. Frankly you need to research your position a bit.
I couldn't agree more. A company like RIM failing might be bade for employees short-term, but it's good for the market (and hence employees) long term. Capitalism is supposed to be survival of the fittest. Weak companies don't innovate, don't produce and don't contribute. Your example with GM and Chrysler is perfect. In actuality, neither would have ceased to exist...they simply would have restructured. Instead, GM CEO Barack Obama took over, screwed the secured bond holders, and gave the company to the very unions that destroyed it. The result are things like the heavily subsidized Chevy Volt, which no one wants. But hey, we saved a lot of union workers who, despite having no real other education or training, get to make $80,000 a year. Fantastic.