At least now you can honestly say you've proved me wrong once in this thread.
You don't know how to objectively compare images?
You suggested that Street View is superior by posting a single example; therefore you are liable for defending your "claim."
So, you admit defeat? Thank you. At least you are being honest. Your comments are absurd otherwise. I am beginning to wonder if you are a second account for "Relic."
You don't know how to objectively compare images?
You suggested that Street View is superior by posting a single example; therefore you are liable for defending your "claim."
So, you admit defeat? Thank you. At least you are being honest. Your comments are absurd otherwise. I am beginning to wonder if you are a second account for "Relic."
My gosh you are being ridiculous, and I'm probably just falling for troll bait. But do people really have to spell it out for you?
In practical terms, streetview allows you to view a location from a ground level perspective and a resolution that allows you to orient yourself as if you were actually standing on the location. You can read signs and survey the environment so you'll know what to expect when you arrive there. Flyover looks nifty for aerial views but is of next to no help if you are trying to pick out details like signage.
Furthermore, the current coverage of flyover is far too lacking to be a comprehensive tool of any sort. Perhaps that will change, but I am betting it will take a number of years at least, and that means it is an undeniable step backwards right now.
Every time you list that insane technical term about projection it makes me wonder if you might be perseverating on abstract technical details and losing sight of tangible real world benefits. if that is the case I'm happy that apples implementation fascinates you, but please try understand many others have different needs from a mapping application.
And finally, as long as google will provide and apple will permit a google maps app through the app store, We can enjoy the best of both worlds.
Yet you haven't countered my arguments or provided unequivocal, objective evidence supporting your opinion that Street View is superior. For example, why is Street View superior to 2D aerial and satellite imagery of the entire globe (Space Oblique Mercator projection) and 3D aerial and satellite imagery superimposed on a digital elevation model providing a 360-degree panoramic overhead oblique view including a low level "bird's eye view" (Space Oblique Mercator-variant projection) especially as supplemented further by multiple (typically) static photographs of points of interest?
You could always go to Android. Have fun with that. They do have Street View though.
I guess I may have missed in all the pages. I wouldn't believe nobody has stated the obvious yet:
1.-You're not forced to upgrade
2.-You're not forced to use Apple's Maps application
3.-You'll likely get a PROPER google maps application, which we hadn't got thus far because Google hates you.
4.-Clearly Apple is doing this to convince people to upgrade and influencing new customers to get the newer device. How is this surprising, shocking or even weird?
This ridiculous sense of entitlement where people feel insulted they're not given stuff for free is almost insulting. There are excellent free options (Waze, for one) and fantastic non-free ones (Navigon is my favourite). Now there's an additional free option from Apple for some devices. How is this bad? Where having purchased a phone a year ago (or having got the lower-end phone recently) entitles anyone to free software down the road?
I'd be insulted, if I was developing stuff for you, people.
I guess I may have missed in all the pages. I wouldn't believe nobody has stated the obvious yet:
1.-You're not forced to upgrade
2.-You're not forced to use Apple's Maps application
3.-You'll likely get a PROPER google maps application, which we hadn't got thus far because Google hates you.
4.-Clearly Apple is doing this to convince people to upgrade and influencing new customers to get the newer device. How is this surprising, shocking or even weird?
This ridiculous sense of entitlement where people feel insulted they're not given stuff for free is almost insulting. There are excellent free options (Waze, for one) and fantastic non-free ones (Navigon is my favourite). Now there's an additional free option from Apple for some devices. How is this bad? Where having purchased a phone a year ago (or having got the lower-end phone recently) entitles anyone to free software down the road?
I'd be insulted, if I was developing stuff for you, people.
After a while apps, especially games, require the latest version of iOS to run. Therefore if you don't 'upgrade', then your device gradually becomes less useful as the app store becomes increasingly closed off.
You're speculating that there will be a Google Maps app to replace Apple's horrible new maps app. Maybe there will be, maybe there won't.
Assuming you own an iPhone 4S or buy an iPhone 5, you'll get maps which are hugely inferior to Google's, but you'll get turn by turn with traffic crowd sourced from a tiny sub set of iOS users. You'll also get no street view, but hey, at least you a 3D flyover mode for when you buy that shiny new jetpack.
Assuming you own an iPhone 4 or 3GS, you'll get Apple's crappy maps and have street view removed. Great upgrade!
Unless Apple can turn this around within the space of a few months there is going to be an epic backlash against the new maps. They're taken something which worked extremely well and made it into something which is vastly inferior.
I don't get the iPhone 4 problem. When iOS 6 is released, the iPhone 5 will be available, i would assume that the majority of updates to the 5 will be from the 4, not the 4S - certainly I won't be updating. So most users of OS 6 will, after a year, be on the 4s or 5, so nothing to see here. After all with most 2 year contracts you can upgrade for $99 or something like that, for free in the UK.
The iPhone 4 will be 2 years old at that point. It's still a new device, there should be no reason to upgrade.
The iPhone 4 will be 2 years old at that point. It's still a new device, there should be no reason to upgrade.
27 months old. go back that time again and you are at the first gen. Its old. The normal cycle is two years. You are getting iOS 6, but not all of it. Rejoice. No Android phone released at that time will have sniff of getting last year's latest Android version, never mind whatever they demo next month.
After a while apps, especially games, require the latest version of iOS to run. Therefore if you don't 'upgrade', then your device gradually becomes less useful as the app store becomes increasingly closed off.
Which is a normal process and, I hope, we all agree is a bummer but to be expected.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kotatsu
You're speculating that there will be a Google Maps app to replace Apple's horrible new maps app. Maybe there will be, maybe there won't.
I'm stating it, as it's obvious there will be. I don't think Apple's is horrible. I think it's new, like Google Maps was when it began (I may be the only one that remembers, if we go by the comments).
There will be, and not only from Google. Obviously.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kotatsu
Assuming you own an iPhone 4S or buy an iPhone 5, you'll get maps which are hugely inferior to Google's, but you'll get turn by turn with traffic crowd sourced from a tiny sub set of iOS users. You'll also get no street view, but hey, at least you a 3D flyover mode for when you buy that shiny new jetpack.
Weird statement. The day iOS 6 comes out you will have exactly the same options as you had before, for the platform, plus one more: Apple's own maps.
I currently use Waze for crowdsourced traffic information and turn-by-turn. It's far, FAR, superior to Google's offering in Android. I used to use Street View for specific stuff when needed and now I'll stop using it in the Maps app and start using it in the Google app (where everything else related to Google currently is and where maps would be if Apple hadn't provided its own, if not google earth, google places or google latitude, all of which can accomodate it).
This ridiculous dichotomy doesn't exist. It's argument for the sake of argument. A free built-in tool that relied on freely available data has changed to provide its own data, without limiting the presence of every other tool out there or for a different front-end for the same publicly-available data. Not only this, but the whole argument centers around a tool that SUCKED ROYALLY as it was, so what's happened is the best possible thing that could happen: Someone else now can build a better iOS app for Google maps.
To me, it's all benefit.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kotatsu
Assuming you own an iPhone 4 or 3GS, you'll get Apple's crappy maps and have street view removed. Great upgrade!
Yeah. I also get ability to view a bunch of sports data in Siri I'm also not interested in. You get stuff while not losing stuff (you can get street view elsewhere, RIGHT NOW, in iOS, without going through the limited Maps app).
Quote:
Originally Posted by kotatsu
Unless Apple can turn this around within the space of a few months there is going to be an epic backlash against the new maps. They're taken something which worked extremely well and made it into something which is vastly inferior.
I don't forecast anything bigger than a minor backlash, mainly from people trying to make this more of an item than it is. For all intents and purposes the new maps app is NOT the old maps app. The previous one was vastly limited and was mediocre for the most part, except where the google data came in. The new app is a proper app that's extremely better, but the data provider has changed.
At worst, people won't use it. This is so ridiculous that I'm sure even you can see it. At best people use it a lot (which they will, hey, free GPS navigator!) and it improves enormously (just as Google Maps did once people started using it, again, something you may not be remembering).
Not even counting the inveitable jailbreak that will change the data source or will allow you to open street view.
Considering Apple are KNOWN for their great customer service, this is your OPINION and NOT a fact like you've worded it.
I must disagree. They are known for denying issue until they are forced to admit they exist. iPhone 4 antenna, MagSafe cable fraying, calendar date-shift issues, Siri performance. Consider also the scope of Apple's settlements - they have only ever agreed to compensate affected consumers in countries where they have been successfully sued. So, courts in the country where Apple is based determine there is an issue, Apple refuse to support affected consumers in other countries. How do you like those facts?
Thanks for the reply... I have another question though,
does anybody know how the navigation functionality will work? will the maps from the supported countries be stored locally on the phone just like it is now on the current dedicated navigation apps like TOM TOM, magellan, etc?
The new maps are TERRIBLE. out of date map coverage, worse UI, poor POIs, no building names, no transit information, no building outlines, no public footpaths - everything is worse. Look at this comparison photo - what would you rather use?
Come on, be fair. This is Apple Map 1.0. Give apple a few years and it'll catch on to Google. But personally I don't know why Apple wants to go there. I hope Apple Map is not "wired" into the iOS. If the Big Apple wants to track me to show me ads, I'll think twice about upgrading.
Come on, be fair. This is Apple Map 1.0. Give apple a few years and it'll catch on to Google. But personally I don't know why Apple wants to go there. I hope Apple Map is not "wired" into the iOS. If the Big Apple wants to track me to show me ads, I'll think twice about upgrading.
I've no doubt that targeted ad delivery will be one by-product of Apple Maps. A lot of that may depend on what deals Apple has made to share personal/non-personal data with content providers in exchange for their services. In any case advertising revenue won't be the primary focus.
Thanks for the reply... I have another question though,
does anybody know how the navigation functionality will work? will the maps from the supported countries be stored locally on the phone just like it is now on the current dedicated navigation apps like TOM TOM, magellan, etc?
My guess is that they'll be online-only, like Google Maps navigation was until last week or like most free navigators still are. Waze is the same.
I must disagree. They are known for denying issue until they are forced to admit they exist. iPhone 4 antenna, MagSafe cable fraying, calendar date-shift issues, Siri performance. Consider also the scope of Apple's settlements - they have only ever agreed to compensate affected consumers in countries where they have been successfully sued. So, courts in the country where Apple is based determine there is an issue, Apple refuse to support affected consumers in other countries. How do you like those facts?
Yes, this is it exactly. The list of known issues that plagues Apple devices is not huge, but is significant. The number of issues they acknowledge and fix free of charge for their customers is minute. One example is the large incidence of iPhone 4 users that experience the phone microphone totally malfunctioning. A simple Google search turns up thousands of hits for pages dealing with this. Yet, Apple refuses to acknowledge this is an issue and if it happens to you out of warranty, you have to cough up for a replacement. This is but one example.
This just seems like more Apple crap designed to force users to upgrade, They remove Google Maps and replace it with their own partially functional replacement. What a load of crap. Evidence by Siri working on jailbroken iPhone 4.
You just want to jailbreak.
Look a little more, there is a FREE Siri like App in the Apple Store, which works on the iPhone 4.
As for replacing Google Maps, great I can't wait for a better Map product. I've hit several very significant Google Maps location and route errors recently. Google Map malware for Apple ?
Comments
You don't know how to objectively compare images?
You suggested that Street View is superior by posting a single example; therefore you are liable for defending your "claim."
So, you admit defeat? Thank you. At least you are being honest. Your comments are absurd otherwise. I am beginning to wonder if you are a second account for "Relic."
Looks fine to me...
I have 1 good eye and 3 martinis...
My gosh you are being ridiculous, and I'm probably just falling for troll bait. But do people really have to spell it out for you?
In practical terms, streetview allows you to view a location from a ground level perspective and a resolution that allows you to orient yourself as if you were actually standing on the location. You can read signs and survey the environment so you'll know what to expect when you arrive there. Flyover looks nifty for aerial views but is of next to no help if you are trying to pick out details like signage.
Furthermore, the current coverage of flyover is far too lacking to be a comprehensive tool of any sort. Perhaps that will change, but I am betting it will take a number of years at least, and that means it is an undeniable step backwards right now.
Every time you list that insane technical term about projection it makes me wonder if you might be perseverating on abstract technical details and losing sight of tangible real world benefits. if that is the case I'm happy that apples implementation fascinates you, but please try understand many others have different needs from a mapping application.
And finally, as long as google will provide and apple will permit a google maps app through the app store, We can enjoy the best of both worlds.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacBook Pro
Yet you haven't countered my arguments or provided unequivocal, objective evidence supporting your opinion that Street View is superior. For example, why is Street View superior to 2D aerial and satellite imagery of the entire globe (Space Oblique Mercator projection) and 3D aerial and satellite imagery superimposed on a digital elevation model providing a 360-degree panoramic overhead oblique view including a low level "bird's eye view" (Space Oblique Mercator-variant projection) especially as supplemented further by multiple (typically) static photographs of points of interest?
You could always go to Android. Have fun with that. They do have Street View though.
You must be joking
I guess I may have missed in all the pages. I wouldn't believe nobody has stated the obvious yet:
1.-You're not forced to upgrade
2.-You're not forced to use Apple's Maps application
3.-You'll likely get a PROPER google maps application, which we hadn't got thus far because Google hates you.
4.-Clearly Apple is doing this to convince people to upgrade and influencing new customers to get the newer device. How is this surprising, shocking or even weird?
This ridiculous sense of entitlement where people feel insulted they're not given stuff for free is almost insulting. There are excellent free options (Waze, for one) and fantastic non-free ones (Navigon is my favourite). Now there's an additional free option from Apple for some devices. How is this bad? Where having purchased a phone a year ago (or having got the lower-end phone recently) entitles anyone to free software down the road?
I'd be insulted, if I was developing stuff for you, people.
What will happen with the Maps app on the old (ok, i know it's soooo old) iPhone 3G?
Cause Maps on iPhone 3G is powered by Google...
It will be 'cut off'? Removed?
And I'm happily using voice-enabled Google turn-by-turn direction on my Galaxy Y with just 832 MHz of processor and 250MB RAM. Galaxy Y > iPhone 4.
Quote:
Originally Posted by eduo
I guess I may have missed in all the pages. I wouldn't believe nobody has stated the obvious yet:
1.-You're not forced to upgrade
2.-You're not forced to use Apple's Maps application
3.-You'll likely get a PROPER google maps application, which we hadn't got thus far because Google hates you.
4.-Clearly Apple is doing this to convince people to upgrade and influencing new customers to get the newer device. How is this surprising, shocking or even weird?
This ridiculous sense of entitlement where people feel insulted they're not given stuff for free is almost insulting. There are excellent free options (Waze, for one) and fantastic non-free ones (Navigon is my favourite). Now there's an additional free option from Apple for some devices. How is this bad? Where having purchased a phone a year ago (or having got the lower-end phone recently) entitles anyone to free software down the road?
I'd be insulted, if I was developing stuff for you, people.
After a while apps, especially games, require the latest version of iOS to run. Therefore if you don't 'upgrade', then your device gradually becomes less useful as the app store becomes increasingly closed off.
You're speculating that there will be a Google Maps app to replace Apple's horrible new maps app. Maybe there will be, maybe there won't.
Assuming you own an iPhone 4S or buy an iPhone 5, you'll get maps which are hugely inferior to Google's, but you'll get turn by turn with traffic crowd sourced from a tiny sub set of iOS users. You'll also get no street view, but hey, at least you a 3D flyover mode for when you buy that shiny new jetpack.
Assuming you own an iPhone 4 or 3GS, you'll get Apple's crappy maps and have street view removed. Great upgrade!
Unless Apple can turn this around within the space of a few months there is going to be an epic backlash against the new maps. They're taken something which worked extremely well and made it into something which is vastly inferior.
Quote:
Originally Posted by asdasd
I don't get the iPhone 4 problem. When iOS 6 is released, the iPhone 5 will be available, i would assume that the majority of updates to the 5 will be from the 4, not the 4S - certainly I won't be updating. So most users of OS 6 will, after a year, be on the 4s or 5, so nothing to see here. After all with most 2 year contracts you can upgrade for $99 or something like that, for free in the UK.
The iPhone 4 will be 2 years old at that point. It's still a new device, there should be no reason to upgrade.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kotatsu
The iPhone 4 will be 2 years old at that point. It's still a new device, there should be no reason to upgrade.
27 months old. go back that time again and you are at the first gen. Its old. The normal cycle is two years. You are getting iOS 6, but not all of it. Rejoice. No Android phone released at that time will have sniff of getting last year's latest Android version, never mind whatever they demo next month.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kotatsu
After a while apps, especially games, require the latest version of iOS to run. Therefore if you don't 'upgrade', then your device gradually becomes less useful as the app store becomes increasingly closed off.
Which is a normal process and, I hope, we all agree is a bummer but to be expected.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kotatsu
You're speculating that there will be a Google Maps app to replace Apple's horrible new maps app. Maybe there will be, maybe there won't.
I'm stating it, as it's obvious there will be. I don't think Apple's is horrible. I think it's new, like Google Maps was when it began (I may be the only one that remembers, if we go by the comments).
There will be, and not only from Google. Obviously.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kotatsu
Assuming you own an iPhone 4S or buy an iPhone 5, you'll get maps which are hugely inferior to Google's, but you'll get turn by turn with traffic crowd sourced from a tiny sub set of iOS users. You'll also get no street view, but hey, at least you a 3D flyover mode for when you buy that shiny new jetpack.
Weird statement. The day iOS 6 comes out you will have exactly the same options as you had before, for the platform, plus one more: Apple's own maps.
I currently use Waze for crowdsourced traffic information and turn-by-turn. It's far, FAR, superior to Google's offering in Android. I used to use Street View for specific stuff when needed and now I'll stop using it in the Maps app and start using it in the Google app (where everything else related to Google currently is and where maps would be if Apple hadn't provided its own, if not google earth, google places or google latitude, all of which can accomodate it).
This ridiculous dichotomy doesn't exist. It's argument for the sake of argument. A free built-in tool that relied on freely available data has changed to provide its own data, without limiting the presence of every other tool out there or for a different front-end for the same publicly-available data. Not only this, but the whole argument centers around a tool that SUCKED ROYALLY as it was, so what's happened is the best possible thing that could happen: Someone else now can build a better iOS app for Google maps.
To me, it's all benefit.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kotatsu
Assuming you own an iPhone 4 or 3GS, you'll get Apple's crappy maps and have street view removed. Great upgrade!
Yeah. I also get ability to view a bunch of sports data in Siri I'm also not interested in. You get stuff while not losing stuff (you can get street view elsewhere, RIGHT NOW, in iOS, without going through the limited Maps app).
Quote:
Originally Posted by kotatsu
Unless Apple can turn this around within the space of a few months there is going to be an epic backlash against the new maps. They're taken something which worked extremely well and made it into something which is vastly inferior.
I don't forecast anything bigger than a minor backlash, mainly from people trying to make this more of an item than it is. For all intents and purposes the new maps app is NOT the old maps app. The previous one was vastly limited and was mediocre for the most part, except where the google data came in. The new app is a proper app that's extremely better, but the data provider has changed.
At worst, people won't use it. This is so ridiculous that I'm sure even you can see it. At best people use it a lot (which they will, hey, free GPS navigator!) and it improves enormously (just as Google Maps did once people started using it, again, something you may not be remembering).
Not even counting the inveitable jailbreak that will change the data source or will allow you to open street view.
Quote:
Originally Posted by virginblue4
Considering Apple are KNOWN for their great customer service, this is your OPINION and NOT a fact like you've worded it.
I must disagree. They are known for denying issue until they are forced to admit they exist. iPhone 4 antenna, MagSafe cable fraying, calendar date-shift issues, Siri performance. Consider also the scope of Apple's settlements - they have only ever agreed to compensate affected consumers in countries where they have been successfully sued. So, courts in the country where Apple is based determine there is an issue, Apple refuse to support affected consumers in other countries. How do you like those facts?
Thanks for the reply... I have another question though,
does anybody know how the navigation functionality will work? will the maps from the supported countries be stored locally on the phone just like it is now on the current dedicated navigation apps like TOM TOM, magellan, etc?
Quote:
Originally Posted by kfury77
The new maps are TERRIBLE. out of date map coverage, worse UI, poor POIs, no building names, no transit information, no building outlines, no public footpaths - everything is worse. Look at this comparison photo - what would you rather use?
https://twitter.com/corxo/status/212314131590692864/photo/1/large
Come on, be fair. This is Apple Map 1.0. Give apple a few years and it'll catch on to Google. But personally I don't know why Apple wants to go there. I hope Apple Map is not "wired" into the iOS. If the Big Apple wants to track me to show me ads, I'll think twice about upgrading.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ipen
Come on, be fair. This is Apple Map 1.0. Give apple a few years and it'll catch on to Google. But personally I don't know why Apple wants to go there. I hope Apple Map is not "wired" into the iOS. If the Big Apple wants to track me to show me ads, I'll think twice about upgrading.
I've no doubt that targeted ad delivery will be one by-product of Apple Maps. A lot of that may depend on what deals Apple has made to share personal/non-personal data with content providers in exchange for their services. In any case advertising revenue won't be the primary focus.
I don't know about you, but I think that Apple wants us to jump off the overpass?
Quote:
Originally Posted by staypuft01
Thanks for the reply... I have another question though,
does anybody know how the navigation functionality will work? will the maps from the supported countries be stored locally on the phone just like it is now on the current dedicated navigation apps like TOM TOM, magellan, etc?
My guess is that they'll be online-only, like Google Maps navigation was until last week or like most free navigators still are. Waze is the same.
Quote:
Originally Posted by natshaw
I must disagree. They are known for denying issue until they are forced to admit they exist. iPhone 4 antenna, MagSafe cable fraying, calendar date-shift issues, Siri performance. Consider also the scope of Apple's settlements - they have only ever agreed to compensate affected consumers in countries where they have been successfully sued. So, courts in the country where Apple is based determine there is an issue, Apple refuse to support affected consumers in other countries. How do you like those facts?
Yes, this is it exactly. The list of known issues that plagues Apple devices is not huge, but is significant. The number of issues they acknowledge and fix free of charge for their customers is minute. One example is the large incidence of iPhone 4 users that experience the phone microphone totally malfunctioning. A simple Google search turns up thousands of hits for pages dealing with this. Yet, Apple refuses to acknowledge this is an issue and if it happens to you out of warranty, you have to cough up for a replacement. This is but one example.
thanks for replying!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain J
This just seems like more Apple crap designed to force users to upgrade, They remove Google Maps and replace it with their own partially functional replacement. What a load of crap. Evidence by Siri working on jailbroken iPhone 4.
You just want to jailbreak.
Look a little more, there is a FREE Siri like App in the Apple Store, which works on the iPhone 4.
As for replacing Google Maps, great I can't wait for a better Map product. I've hit several very significant Google Maps location and route errors recently. Google Map malware for Apple ?