although PC makers Dell and Lenovo both voiced continued commitment to Microsoft as a valuable partner.
What are they going to do?! Develop their own desktop OS? Not going to happen. MS can start their own PC hardware and no one can do anything. All they can do is pay to get Window on their PCs and accept it.
Well I don't think Microsoft has much choice either -- to be honest. This is the RIGHT MOVE for them. The only way they can compete with the iPad is to create the same vertical market. To procure the materials, to have the hardware eke out all the processing it can per watt -- they have to create a flawless widget like the iPad and that means marrying software and hardware and probably throwing away screws.
Vendors are just going to HAVE to find a new business model - this day was going to happen. They can push Google to make an Android-like tablet OS (oh, they did already?) and compete on price. They can start bundling their laptops and PCs with some flavor of LINUX.
But don't be surprised. Don't act like Microsoft was ever your friend and now you feel hurt. Apple forced them into this. And Microsoft's own market manipulation and bundling forced Apple to do what it did.
If Microsoft doesn't also make this interact with the XBox games and content -- they've dropped the ball. They certainly can't use Windows 8 or Microsoft Office to entice users -- heck, I've moved back to Office 2007 and it felt like a damn upgrade. That "office bundle" ship has sailed -- or that turnip got all the blood squeezed out of it -- whatever you want to call it.
Intuitive, personal, appliance-like devices that don't anchor people down nor waste their time is going to be the bulk of the market -- and Microsoft, Google and Apple all know this. The rest of the manufacturers need to find an alternative that doesn't depend on these three's coat tails any more.
Awwww poor poor PC makers. They've been raking in millions riding the back of MS for decades and now they're going to have to do something to differentiate themselves. So sad. What will they do?
Did any of these PC makers have brand loyal customers? Nope. Does anybody care about the brand of their computer, other than Apple customers? Nope. Microsoft is making their only move for survival. Watch for google to do the same. The PC makers are going away. Soon there will be three.
If there are 5 OEMs planning to sell Windows 8 tablets in the Fall… now there will be 6
If the OEMs are worried about an additional competitor… then they better step up their game.
Every PC manufacturer already fights for relevance in this crowded market… this is no different.
Maybe this will light a fire under their ass to make better products.
That's basically what I was going to say. MS's 'partners' shouldn't be whining. They should be excited at the opportunity to innovate and perhaps beat MS at their own game.
On a related note... The Surface is a goofy name. It implies that there's nothing deep with this thing. It's just a shallow product with a cool hued soft keyboard. Even Windows 8 is surface only. Once you click out of that main window, you're in...old windows. At least as far as I understand it. People have described it as schizophrenic.
I don't think this is going to dent the iPad. I think Google's offering is more interesting. That's what MS is going to compete with. Someone else with the financial heft and DNA that appreciates cheap pricing and can thrive in that environment.
So Ballmer thinks he can get close to Apple's success by copying the jerk side of the Jobs persona. There's also the perfectionism, the sense of style and the ability to get the best out of people.
I don't understand why the media have been so conned into reporting this as the product that will knock down the iPad. That story has been done so often it's become ridiculous. The only thing Microsoft adds to the game is some hardware innovation that no one really wants.
...
"...why the media have been so conned into reporting this as the product that will knock down the iPad."?
I don't think the media has been conned -- the media is driven by what has always driven the media; Microsoft advertising dollars. More ads means a pile of steaming horse manure becomes the next breath through product. Look at any magazine that covers a product -- say Bicycling. Those articles won't cover the super cool new way to move people along the ground that IS NOT one of the advertisers. The don't randomly select interesting stories about bikes -- they find interesting stories that relate to the bikes that just so happen to be sold by their advertisers.
Often the best news is low coverage of bad news - and advertising is like a protection racket. The reason your local news only covers auto repair ripoffs and city workers sleeping on the job is because their bread is buttered by the large chemical manufacturer who just had a spill in the river that they didn't seem to cover.
MS spends advertising dollars. The surface however might be awesome -- but that's totally independent of what drives the good press in most heavily ad-funded magazines. Blogs on the other hand often don't have that kind of corrupting money creeping in.
If there are 5 OEMs planning to sell Windows 8 tablets in the Fall… now there will be 6
If the OEMs are worried about an additional competitor… then they better step up their game.
Every PC manufacturer already fights for relevance in this crowded market… this is no different.
Maybe this will light a fire under their ass to make better products.
The thing is, one OEM gets a $85 discount on the OS. That amounts to about a 10-20% discount on a $500-$1000 device, which is a huge amount of money. That's money Microsoft can use to give it a better case, and a nicer screen, maybe a larger battery.
So, just to match Microsoft's offering, other OEMs have to really squeeze the supply chain or sell for no profit [while MS makes a profit both on their own tablets AND all the OEMs]. And then, as icing on the cake, Microsoft makes extra money selling apps and content for the tablets. And their tablets can have no-charge updates, so match what Apple does, while other OEMs can't afford to update older models...because they made no money on them...
Never mind that it also gives the MS hardware group a huge advantage over other OEMs for getting all the bugs fixed.
Has anybody done this kind of thing successfully in the past [as in both created their own software/hardware and licensed the software to others to make competing products]. It was a train wreck when Apple did it with PowerPC clones, and PalmOS licensing really went nowhere...and that's all I can think of off the top of my head.
The thing is, one OEM gets a $85 discount on the OS. That amounts to about a 10-20% discount on a $500-$1000 device, which is a huge amount of money. That's money Microsoft can use to give it a better case, and a nicer screen, maybe a larger battery.
So, just to match Microsoft's offering, other OEMs have to really squeeze the supply chain or sell for no profit [while MS makes a profit both on their own tablets AND all the OEMs]. And then, as icing on the cake, Microsoft makes extra money selling apps and content for the tablets. And their tablets can have no-charge updates, so match what Apple does, while other OEMs can't afford to update older models...because they made no money on them...
Never mind that it also gives the MS hardware group a huge advantage over other OEMs for getting all the bugs fixed.
Has anybody done this kind of thing successfully in the past [as in both created their own software/hardware and licensed the software to others to make competing products]. It was a train wreck when Apple did it with PowerPC clones, and PalmOS licensing really went nowhere...and that's all I can think of off the top of my head.
I don't think that's MS's goal here. They aren't saying "Hey, this tablet market is really profitable we need to make our own." they are saying "Hey, this tablet market is excluding Windows completely we need to make our own." The difference being that MS goal isn't trying to undercut their vendors but trying to cut a path that will allow their vendors to have a healthy future in buying Windows OEMs for the tablet market.
Remember when MS hired Creative to design the Zune HW and they dropped all their Play4Sure partners? That was a last ditch effort to gain relevancy in the PMP market. It failed miserably. This is much the same motive but in their defense they are taking a new approach which I think has a marginally better chance of succeeding.
That surface has fail written all over it. The well paid reviewers giving that non-demonstrate product high praise are pathetic.
Steve Ballmer can wipe his butt after a number two, show the pro MS trolls his doo doo and they'd write about how goddamn innovative and game changing that blood and feces soaked piece of toilet paper is.
Seems to me only a matter of time now before MS buys out Nokia and uses that acquisition to leverage its hardware manufacturing ability. They've seen the success of Apple and, although it's taken a long time, they've worked out that doing the software while leaving the hardware to other people (Apple did this, before SJ canned that strategy on his return) isn't a good way to maintain control over your products.
Whether MS is canny enough to do this, I don't know, but they *could* do an Apple and end up manufacturing PCs, tablets, phones, laptops that all run their own OS and they *could* do it well (in that it's possible) but I have no doubt at all in my mind that it won't be Ballmer that is in charge of this. His stewardship of the company is, to me, characterised by drift, muddle-headed decision making and complacence. If Ballmer goes and they put a charismatic visionary perfectionist in his place, then potentially they'll survive the 'IBM syndrome' whereby they turn into an irrelevance as the world moves past them. Left as they are, they'll just have two main areas: staid, boring but dependable enterprise software (because their installed base is huge and is, essentially, a cash cow) and Xbox (a rare flash of excitement).
While I am a dedicated Apple user, I want to see other parts of the tech industry match Apple's standards, because it's good for everyone - Apple included, since it will keep them on their toes and ahead of everyone else. And that is good for us because we'll continue to get the best. If MS fails and recedes into boring irrelevance then technological stagnation will eventually afflict Apple as well. Apple needs a vigorous MS. We need a vigorous and forward thinking MS, even if we don't use their products.
So Microsoft is more and more becoming like Apple in business strategy. Next they buy Nokia.
Google is becoming more and more like Apple, buying Motorola Mobile for their own hardware, leaving the crumbs to the "Open" platform partners. Samsung will be the only company to profit from Android.
How should I view the pundits that said Apple needs to open up and be more like Microsoft? Be more like Google?
I do like the new Microsoft. It's like they are saying, the PC makers are stupid. They are not able to make a good Windows tablet and give consumers the experience we want. Up theirs and we do our own. That's Apple-like.
Of course, that they do their own hardware is also because of the Android platform. Most manufacturers are creating Android stuff. How can MS compete against a "free and open" platform? They need to push the Windows brand. Look at the Surface. There are Windows logos on it, not Microsoft logo. They need to push Windows against Android.
Dying... but not dead. Remember that sales growth (in percent) of Macs are triple the industry average overall without such growth the PC industry would be shrinking.
It's hardly dead.
Microsoft thinks they can make the PC experience continue through their Intel-based tablet. People have commented how MS didn't demonstrate how to USE the tablet, and THAT is the key to success. People USE their iPads (unless millions of them are sitting in drawers after being sold). Will people USE the INTEL tablet or will they just say MEH and stick to laptops (Apple laptops, at that).
I'm not going to pass judgement on judgement, but I'm not so sure MS has a hit on their hands or a flop. I know what I want it to be.
I watched the keynote video. It was incredibly sad, and pathetic. There were constant veiled references to the iPad, I laughed when Ballmer talked about the innovation Microsloth has done in the past few years. There was virtually no actual demonstrations of the surface itself. They spent almost all the time talking about the physical characteristics of the unit. "It is only _____ mm wide!" "It has a professionally designed kick stand that goes away." "Look at this venting."
They just don't get it. They still think in terms of a desktop unit. The thing (according to M$), is a small PC with a keyboard. And what a keyboard! Holy copy of the Apple smart cover! I couldn't believe it. If I want a tablet, I don't want to type on a stupid pliable keyboard. Why the hell would I want a trackpad, when the entire glass surface is trackpad!
The video about how they built it. "Wow, this is really hard!" It seemed to convey the image that they had never designed any hardware before.
The entire setting seemed contrived too. How many people were there, 20, 30? It didn't appear to be that many more than that, and it was obvious there were ringers in the audience. The name of the case, vapourware! Too funny!
No release date, no real details. It was just so sad.
I am surprised Microsoft could actually discuss this for over 46 minutes. If I were in the audience, I would probably have to be ushered out from laughing too loudly. Ballmer is so full of #*$&. Their whole company is based on leaving the hardware design left to their OEM partners, yet they are NOW realizing that better products are made better if the OS company designed the entire product themselves. I actually envision OEM partners suing Microsoft for selling a competing when Microsoft doesn't pay for the OS. WOW, a 22 degree bevel and less than 1 inch thick! HAHAHA.
LIquid metal magnesium case? Um, ALL metal becomes liquid when you heat to the melting temperature so that it can be casted into a mold. PVD coating has been around for YEARS and it a coating process not a case mfg process. I was cracking up when the presenter couldn't get the first one to work. HAHA. THIS HAS TO BE A JOKE.
So Ballmer thinks he can get close to Apple's success by copying the jerk side of the Jobs persona. There's also the perfectionism, the sense of style and the ability to get the best out of people.
I don't understand why the media have been so conned into reporting this as the product that will knock down the iPad. That story has been done so often it's become ridiculous. The only thing Microsoft adds to the game is some hardware innovation that no one really wants.
What they still don't get about the Jobs story is the big breakthroughs happen when you don't listen to your customers. I bet this thing was designed based on focus groups who said “if only we could get a tablet that worked just like a desktop machine.” Guess what? The same people in those focus groups won't buy one, any more than people in 1900, asked what an automobile should be like, and who asked for it to have a horse manure scoop, would buy it for that feature.
Tablets with keyboards have been done, and failed. Doing the keyboard better in some way (thinner, possible to ignore because it's a semi-rigid dust cover you can't fold out of the way) doesn't fix that.
I've been wrong before but not as often as the journalists who've reported yet another iPad killer. Time will tell.
In my opinion, while there will certainly be some takers, as we've seen with the WebOS tablet and RIM Playbook, ultimately there is no commitment from the hardware vendor to continue the product. This is what investors see. This is why RIM and Nokia have been tanking in the mobile phone market. Changing the OS inside a device with no backwards compatibility is suicide.
When Apple switched from 68K to PPC, OS 8 to OS X, PPC to Intel, and forked iOS from OSX onto ARM, there was always some backwards compatibility mechanism to run old software on new devices. Software written for iOS still works on the current iOS, and likewise software written for the PPC can still run on the current OS X if you have Rosetta installed.
Microsoft is not as good at this, at best you might get old software to work by bypassing security restrictions, at worst, it doesn't run at all. Other versions of Windows, PPC/Alpha (Windows NT 3.5/4.0 era) don't run x86 binaries. However this problem also exists on the Windows CE platform which intially had MIPS and ARM, but no version Windows CE works with any other version. Anytime you upgrade the device, you had to buy new versions of software or dump it. This problem continues into the Windows Phone platform.
The only hardware product that Microsoft produces that's any good is the Xbox 360,but it took them 6 revisions of the hardware over 6 years (Xbox 360 S) to get it to that stage. They entered a competative field that only had 2 players (Nintendo and Sony) and aimed at the middle.
So I have reason enough to think that unless the Microsoft tablets are in the 300$ range or have 5 year warranties, it will fail spectacularly. I don't trust that Microsoft can engineer a device that won't have the kinds of issues the Xbox 360 has, and since they're entering a market with only one major player (Apple) and a handful of minor players (Samsung/Android) they have some chance of success.
Chrome OS is still an infant (and web-only at present) but, say what you like about their scruples, Google is much, much smarter than MS. If it's in their interests to develop a full PC OS they can and will. Remember Netscape Constellation? It was headed off and killed by MS but Mr Gates was in charge of things then.
That was my thought too. Google must be now thinking a free OS for PCs would be just the ticket. All they have to do is rip of Windows 7 and give it away for free. Dell et al would be all over it as an option at first then their main OS. Heck if Google can rip off iOS that fast they can probably make a pretty decent copy of 7 and in fact probably make it far better. I suggest 7 as the most likely OS to succeed as a copy since it is really a working XP and what most PC users feel most comfortable with.
I watched the keynote video. It was incredibly sad, and pathetic. There were constant veiled references to the iPad, I laughed when Ballmer talked about the innovation Microsloth has done in the past few years. There was virtually no actual demonstrations of the surface itself. They spent almost all the time talking about the physical characteristics of the unit. "It is only _____ mm wide!" "It has a professionally designed kick stand that goes away." "Look at this venting."
They just don't get it. They still think in terms of a desktop unit. The thing (according to M$), is a small PC with a keyboard. And what a keyboard! Holy copy of the Apple smart cover! I couldn't believe it. If I want a tablet, I don't want to type on a stupid pliable keyboard. Why the hell would I want a trackpad, when the entire glass surface is trackpad!
The video about how they built it. "Wow, this is really hard!" It seemed to convey the image that they had never designed any hardware before.
The entire setting seemed contrived too. How many people were there, 20, 30? It didn't appear to be that many more than that, and it was obvious there were ringers in the audience. The name of the case, vapourware! Too funny!
No release date, no real details. It was just so sad.
Ah but don't you know this makes Apple's smart cover look dumb now. /s Interesing though that they didn't let the invited media type on any of these touch covers/keyboards. Or pull up any apps, like say Word or Excel on the device. And if this touch cover is soft like Apple's smart cover how in the world will you type on it if your not using it on a flat, hard surface. If someone presented this keyboard cover to Jony Ive it probably wouldn't take him long to reject it as a gimmick.
Anybody can wow people with a new tablet when you don't give them the price. I've also already seen confusion in the media between the two tablets. The pro model should have used a completely different name.
Contrary to some people here who think their own needs in some way represent everyone's needs, I do see a place for a netbook + tablet hybrid, even an ARM-based version of it, especially one with Microsoft Office installed.
An iPad is a content delivery platform, and not always an optimal one at that, as the lack of physical controls makes it unsuitable for most kinds of hardcore handheld gaming, and even simpler tasks such as chatting online can be quite unpleasant on the iPad. It's good to deliver media, but unsuitable for anything else. Those are areas where netbooks shine, except netbooks usually don't come with UMTS/LTE connectivity, decent cameras, high-definition displays, or GPSes, whereas tablets do.
As a developer with both kinds of needs, I have to carry both an iPad and a MaBook Pro whenever I leave home for extended periods of time (not to mention an iPhone, but I carry that everywhere) when a proper netbook + tablet solution would suit me perfectly. Unfortunately I've tried many OEM solutions in the past and they all sucked in more than one way such as by lacking mobile connectivity, GPS functionality, using TN screens in devices that are expected to rotate, and relying on crappy resistive touch screens. Assuming that Microsoft does it right, the Ivy Bridge version of Surface will suit my needs perfectly!
The need for a general-purpose netbook + tablet solution is not restricted to my kind of profile, however. For example: how many of you use Pages, Numbers, or Keynote on the iPad? How many of you use Office on the iPad? I doubt that many of you do, because it's impractical without a keyboard clam shell case. And what do you get when you stuff an iPad into a keyboard clam shell case? A netbook + tablet hybrid with a huge battery life! Problem is, the iPad is not designed to be a netbook; it is very far from behind a general purpose computer; you can't connect a mouse or any kind of game controller to it even if you want to (because the bluetooth HID profile on it is restricted to keyboards); you can't attach external drives to it, so you are always limited to its own storage (and no, the cloud is no replacement, you won't be downloading gigabytes of data through your mobile connection only to watch a movie). These are all needs that the ARM version of Surface can address!
I'm glad that, for the first time, Microsoft is actually coming out to (at least try to) show OEMs how they expect it to be done. Will they succeed? Only time will tell! I'm not too hopeful, since Microsoft doesn't seem to have what it takes to pull this kind of stunt, but I am not one to underestimate anyone, and I truly wish that they come up with something great for a change, because I need a proper netbook + tablet hybrid and Apple won't be doing it.
Comments
Quote:
Originally Posted by NasserAE
Quote:
although PC makers Dell and Lenovo both voiced continued commitment to Microsoft as a valuable partner.
What are they going to do?! Develop their own desktop OS? Not going to happen. MS can start their own PC hardware and no one can do anything. All they can do is pay to get Window on their PCs and accept it.
Well I don't think Microsoft has much choice either -- to be honest. This is the RIGHT MOVE for them. The only way they can compete with the iPad is to create the same vertical market. To procure the materials, to have the hardware eke out all the processing it can per watt -- they have to create a flawless widget like the iPad and that means marrying software and hardware and probably throwing away screws.
Vendors are just going to HAVE to find a new business model - this day was going to happen. They can push Google to make an Android-like tablet OS (oh, they did already?) and compete on price. They can start bundling their laptops and PCs with some flavor of LINUX.
But don't be surprised. Don't act like Microsoft was ever your friend and now you feel hurt. Apple forced them into this. And Microsoft's own market manipulation and bundling forced Apple to do what it did.
If Microsoft doesn't also make this interact with the XBox games and content -- they've dropped the ball. They certainly can't use Windows 8 or Microsoft Office to entice users -- heck, I've moved back to Office 2007 and it felt like a damn upgrade. That "office bundle" ship has sailed -- or that turnip got all the blood squeezed out of it -- whatever you want to call it.
Intuitive, personal, appliance-like devices that don't anchor people down nor waste their time is going to be the bulk of the market -- and Microsoft, Google and Apple all know this. The rest of the manufacturers need to find an alternative that doesn't depend on these three's coat tails any more.
Did any of these PC makers have brand loyal customers? Nope. Does anybody care about the brand of their computer, other than Apple customers? Nope. Microsoft is making their only move for survival. Watch for google to do the same. The PC makers are going away. Soon there will be three.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Scrip
If there are 5 OEMs planning to sell Windows 8 tablets in the Fall… now there will be 6
If the OEMs are worried about an additional competitor… then they better step up their game.
Every PC manufacturer already fights for relevance in this crowded market… this is no different.
Maybe this will light a fire under their ass to make better products.
That's basically what I was going to say. MS's 'partners' shouldn't be whining. They should be excited at the opportunity to innovate and perhaps beat MS at their own game.
On a related note... The Surface is a goofy name. It implies that there's nothing deep with this thing. It's just a shallow product with a cool hued soft keyboard. Even Windows 8 is surface only. Once you click out of that main window, you're in...old windows. At least as far as I understand it. People have described it as schizophrenic.
I don't think this is going to dent the iPad. I think Google's offering is more interesting. That's what MS is going to compete with. Someone else with the financial heft and DNA that appreciates cheap pricing and can thrive in that environment.
Quote:
Originally Posted by philipm
So Ballmer thinks he can get close to Apple's success by copying the jerk side of the Jobs persona. There's also the perfectionism, the sense of style and the ability to get the best out of people.
I don't understand why the media have been so conned into reporting this as the product that will knock down the iPad. That story has been done so often it's become ridiculous. The only thing Microsoft adds to the game is some hardware innovation that no one really wants.
...
"...why the media have been so conned into reporting this as the product that will knock down the iPad."?
I don't think the media has been conned -- the media is driven by what has always driven the media; Microsoft advertising dollars. More ads means a pile of steaming horse manure becomes the next breath through product. Look at any magazine that covers a product -- say Bicycling. Those articles won't cover the super cool new way to move people along the ground that IS NOT one of the advertisers. The don't randomly select interesting stories about bikes -- they find interesting stories that relate to the bikes that just so happen to be sold by their advertisers.
Often the best news is low coverage of bad news - and advertising is like a protection racket. The reason your local news only covers auto repair ripoffs and city workers sleeping on the job is because their bread is buttered by the large chemical manufacturer who just had a spill in the river that they didn't seem to cover.
MS spends advertising dollars. The surface however might be awesome -- but that's totally independent of what drives the good press in most heavily ad-funded magazines. Blogs on the other hand often don't have that kind of corrupting money creeping in.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Scrip
If there are 5 OEMs planning to sell Windows 8 tablets in the Fall… now there will be 6
If the OEMs are worried about an additional competitor… then they better step up their game.
Every PC manufacturer already fights for relevance in this crowded market… this is no different.
Maybe this will light a fire under their ass to make better products.
The thing is, one OEM gets a $85 discount on the OS. That amounts to about a 10-20% discount on a $500-$1000 device, which is a huge amount of money. That's money Microsoft can use to give it a better case, and a nicer screen, maybe a larger battery.
So, just to match Microsoft's offering, other OEMs have to really squeeze the supply chain or sell for no profit [while MS makes a profit both on their own tablets AND all the OEMs]. And then, as icing on the cake, Microsoft makes extra money selling apps and content for the tablets. And their tablets can have no-charge updates, so match what Apple does, while other OEMs can't afford to update older models...because they made no money on them...
Never mind that it also gives the MS hardware group a huge advantage over other OEMs for getting all the bugs fixed.
Has anybody done this kind of thing successfully in the past [as in both created their own software/hardware and licensed the software to others to make competing products]. It was a train wreck when Apple did it with PowerPC clones, and PalmOS licensing really went nowhere...and that's all I can think of off the top of my head.
I don't think that's MS's goal here. They aren't saying "Hey, this tablet market is really profitable we need to make our own." they are saying "Hey, this tablet market is excluding Windows completely we need to make our own." The difference being that MS goal isn't trying to undercut their vendors but trying to cut a path that will allow their vendors to have a healthy future in buying Windows OEMs for the tablet market.
Remember when MS hired Creative to design the Zune HW and they dropped all their Play4Sure partners? That was a last ditch effort to gain relevancy in the PMP market. It failed miserably. This is much the same motive but in their defense they are taking a new approach which I think has a marginally better chance of succeeding.
That surface has fail written all over it. The well paid reviewers giving that non-demonstrate product high praise are pathetic.
Steve Ballmer can wipe his butt after a number two, show the pro MS trolls his doo doo and they'd write about how goddamn innovative and game changing that blood and feces soaked piece of toilet paper is.
Seems to me only a matter of time now before MS buys out Nokia and uses that acquisition to leverage its hardware manufacturing ability. They've seen the success of Apple and, although it's taken a long time, they've worked out that doing the software while leaving the hardware to other people (Apple did this, before SJ canned that strategy on his return) isn't a good way to maintain control over your products.
Whether MS is canny enough to do this, I don't know, but they *could* do an Apple and end up manufacturing PCs, tablets, phones, laptops that all run their own OS and they *could* do it well (in that it's possible) but I have no doubt at all in my mind that it won't be Ballmer that is in charge of this. His stewardship of the company is, to me, characterised by drift, muddle-headed decision making and complacence. If Ballmer goes and they put a charismatic visionary perfectionist in his place, then potentially they'll survive the 'IBM syndrome' whereby they turn into an irrelevance as the world moves past them. Left as they are, they'll just have two main areas: staid, boring but dependable enterprise software (because their installed base is huge and is, essentially, a cash cow) and Xbox (a rare flash of excitement).
While I am a dedicated Apple user, I want to see other parts of the tech industry match Apple's standards, because it's good for everyone - Apple included, since it will keep them on their toes and ahead of everyone else. And that is good for us because we'll continue to get the best. If MS fails and recedes into boring irrelevance then technological stagnation will eventually afflict Apple as well. Apple needs a vigorous MS. We need a vigorous and forward thinking MS, even if we don't use their products.
So Microsoft is more and more becoming like Apple in business strategy. Next they buy Nokia.
Google is becoming more and more like Apple, buying Motorola Mobile for their own hardware, leaving the crumbs to the "Open" platform partners. Samsung will be the only company to profit from Android.
How should I view the pundits that said Apple needs to open up and be more like Microsoft? Be more like Google?
I do like the new Microsoft. It's like they are saying, the PC makers are stupid. They are not able to make a good Windows tablet and give consumers the experience we want. Up theirs and we do our own. That's Apple-like.
Of course, that they do their own hardware is also because of the Android platform. Most manufacturers are creating Android stuff. How can MS compete against a "free and open" platform? They need to push the Windows brand. Look at the Surface. There are Windows logos on it, not Microsoft logo. They need to push Windows against Android.
Quote:
Originally Posted by umrk_lab
The PC platform, as we know it, is dead.
Dying... but not dead. Remember that sales growth (in percent) of Macs are triple the industry average overall without such growth the PC industry would be shrinking.
It's hardly dead.
Microsoft thinks they can make the PC experience continue through their Intel-based tablet. People have commented how MS didn't demonstrate how to USE the tablet, and THAT is the key to success. People USE their iPads (unless millions of them are sitting in drawers after being sold). Will people USE the INTEL tablet or will they just say MEH and stick to laptops (Apple laptops, at that).
I'm not going to pass judgement on judgement, but I'm not so sure MS has a hit on their hands or a flop. I know what I want it to be.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maecvs
I watched the keynote video. It was incredibly sad, and pathetic. There were constant veiled references to the iPad, I laughed when Ballmer talked about the innovation Microsloth has done in the past few years. There was virtually no actual demonstrations of the surface itself. They spent almost all the time talking about the physical characteristics of the unit. "It is only _____ mm wide!" "It has a professionally designed kick stand that goes away." "Look at this venting."
They just don't get it. They still think in terms of a desktop unit. The thing (according to M$), is a small PC with a keyboard. And what a keyboard! Holy copy of the Apple smart cover! I couldn't believe it. If I want a tablet, I don't want to type on a stupid pliable keyboard. Why the hell would I want a trackpad, when the entire glass surface is trackpad!
The video about how they built it. "Wow, this is really hard!" It seemed to convey the image that they had never designed any hardware before.
The entire setting seemed contrived too. How many people were there, 20, 30? It didn't appear to be that many more than that, and it was obvious there were ringers in the audience. The name of the case, vapourware! Too funny!
No release date, no real details. It was just so sad.
I am surprised Microsoft could actually discuss this for over 46 minutes. If I were in the audience, I would probably have to be ushered out from laughing too loudly. Ballmer is so full of #*$&. Their whole company is based on leaving the hardware design left to their OEM partners, yet they are NOW realizing that better products are made better if the OS company designed the entire product themselves. I actually envision OEM partners suing Microsoft for selling a competing when Microsoft doesn't pay for the OS. WOW, a 22 degree bevel and less than 1 inch thick! HAHAHA.
LIquid metal magnesium case? Um, ALL metal becomes liquid when you heat to the melting temperature so that it can be casted into a mold. PVD coating has been around for YEARS and it a coating process not a case mfg process. I was cracking up when the presenter couldn't get the first one to work. HAHA. THIS HAS TO BE A JOKE.
Quote:
Originally Posted by philipm
So Ballmer thinks he can get close to Apple's success by copying the jerk side of the Jobs persona. There's also the perfectionism, the sense of style and the ability to get the best out of people.
I don't understand why the media have been so conned into reporting this as the product that will knock down the iPad. That story has been done so often it's become ridiculous. The only thing Microsoft adds to the game is some hardware innovation that no one really wants.
What they still don't get about the Jobs story is the big breakthroughs happen when you don't listen to your customers. I bet this thing was designed based on focus groups who said “if only we could get a tablet that worked just like a desktop machine.” Guess what? The same people in those focus groups won't buy one, any more than people in 1900, asked what an automobile should be like, and who asked for it to have a horse manure scoop, would buy it for that feature.
Tablets with keyboards have been done, and failed. Doing the keyboard better in some way (thinner, possible to ignore because it's a semi-rigid dust cover you can't fold out of the way) doesn't fix that.
I've been wrong before but not as often as the journalists who've reported yet another iPad killer. Time will tell.
+1 - Well said!
In my opinion, while there will certainly be some takers, as we've seen with the WebOS tablet and RIM Playbook, ultimately there is no commitment from the hardware vendor to continue the product. This is what investors see. This is why RIM and Nokia have been tanking in the mobile phone market. Changing the OS inside a device with no backwards compatibility is suicide.
When Apple switched from 68K to PPC, OS 8 to OS X, PPC to Intel, and forked iOS from OSX onto ARM, there was always some backwards compatibility mechanism to run old software on new devices. Software written for iOS still works on the current iOS, and likewise software written for the PPC can still run on the current OS X if you have Rosetta installed.
Microsoft is not as good at this, at best you might get old software to work by bypassing security restrictions, at worst, it doesn't run at all. Other versions of Windows, PPC/Alpha (Windows NT 3.5/4.0 era) don't run x86 binaries. However this problem also exists on the Windows CE platform which intially had MIPS and ARM, but no version Windows CE works with any other version. Anytime you upgrade the device, you had to buy new versions of software or dump it. This problem continues into the Windows Phone platform.
The only hardware product that Microsoft produces that's any good is the Xbox 360,but it took them 6 revisions of the hardware over 6 years (Xbox 360 S) to get it to that stage. They entered a competative field that only had 2 players (Nintendo and Sony) and aimed at the middle.
So I have reason enough to think that unless the Microsoft tablets are in the 300$ range or have 5 year warranties, it will fail spectacularly. I don't trust that Microsoft can engineer a device that won't have the kinds of issues the Xbox 360 has, and since they're entering a market with only one major player (Apple) and a handful of minor players (Samsung/Android) they have some chance of success.
I can't wait for the photos of Steve Balmer in a giant yellow outfit touring a factory in China waving at workers making the MS zune tablet.
That was my thought too. Google must be now thinking a free OS for PCs would be just the ticket. All they have to do is rip of Windows 7 and give it away for free. Dell et al would be all over it as an option at first then their main OS. Heck if Google can rip off iOS that fast they can probably make a pretty decent copy of 7 and in fact probably make it far better. I suggest 7 as the most likely OS to succeed as a copy since it is really a working XP and what most PC users feel most comfortable with.
Quote:
Originally Posted by superdx
If the OEMs / PC makers actually did a decent job making good hardware that didn't break every 6 months, then maybe MS wouldn't of had to step in.
*COUGH* Red ring of death *COUGH*
I wouldn't hold up MS as a bastion of high quality hardware. The Intellimouse Explorer was great tho.
Contrary to some people here who think their own needs in some way represent everyone's needs, I do see a place for a netbook + tablet hybrid, even an ARM-based version of it, especially one with Microsoft Office installed.
An iPad is a content delivery platform, and not always an optimal one at that, as the lack of physical controls makes it unsuitable for most kinds of hardcore handheld gaming, and even simpler tasks such as chatting online can be quite unpleasant on the iPad. It's good to deliver media, but unsuitable for anything else. Those are areas where netbooks shine, except netbooks usually don't come with UMTS/LTE connectivity, decent cameras, high-definition displays, or GPSes, whereas tablets do.
As a developer with both kinds of needs, I have to carry both an iPad and a MaBook Pro whenever I leave home for extended periods of time (not to mention an iPhone, but I carry that everywhere) when a proper netbook + tablet solution would suit me perfectly. Unfortunately I've tried many OEM solutions in the past and they all sucked in more than one way such as by lacking mobile connectivity, GPS functionality, using TN screens in devices that are expected to rotate, and relying on crappy resistive touch screens. Assuming that Microsoft does it right, the Ivy Bridge version of Surface will suit my needs perfectly!
The need for a general-purpose netbook + tablet solution is not restricted to my kind of profile, however. For example: how many of you use Pages, Numbers, or Keynote on the iPad? How many of you use Office on the iPad? I doubt that many of you do, because it's impractical without a keyboard clam shell case. And what do you get when you stuff an iPad into a keyboard clam shell case? A netbook + tablet hybrid with a huge battery life! Problem is, the iPad is not designed to be a netbook; it is very far from behind a general purpose computer; you can't connect a mouse or any kind of game controller to it even if you want to (because the bluetooth HID profile on it is restricted to keyboards); you can't attach external drives to it, so you are always limited to its own storage (and no, the cloud is no replacement, you won't be downloading gigabytes of data through your mobile connection only to watch a movie). These are all needs that the ARM version of Surface can address!
I'm glad that, for the first time, Microsoft is actually coming out to (at least try to) show OEMs how they expect it to be done. Will they succeed? Only time will tell! I'm not too hopeful, since Microsoft doesn't seem to have what it takes to pull this kind of stunt, but I am not one to underestimate anyone, and I truly wish that they come up with something great for a change, because I need a proper netbook + tablet hybrid and Apple won't be doing it.