I disagree. I don't think that one of the fastest and highest selling models of portable devices can be defined as a niche product. I would say that a 5.5" phone/tablet device is a niche product category. The difference being that in one category you have the $500-range 5" Note is being compared to all specific products in terms of unit sales, and in the other category you have a 5" device being compared to all portable device classes.
Samsung shipped 2 million tablets. They shipped 47 million phones. The ratio combining Samsung's and Apples numbers put the Note as niche. 80 million to 5 million.
I have said over and over that it is successful. Niche, cult, is not derogatory. But it can't be called mainstream, not yet at least. Blackberrys were successful but were not Everyman mainstream phones. I think the Note is the new Blackberry, a great business enterprise phone that will have some commercial appeal, but not mainstream success. Popular on Wall Street but not Mainstreet.
Does anyone argue that the iPod Shuffle is not really a big seller to many people other than runners, bikers and those that go to he gym? No, because that is what it is and who it appeals to because of its SIZE. Why is it such a friggin stretch to think that not everyone wants a 5 inch phone and that it's appeal is limited, albeit to a large group?
Blackberrys were successful but were not Everyman mainstream phones. I think the Note is the new Blackberry, a great business enterprise phone that will have some commercial appeal, but not mainstream success. Popular on Wall Street but not Mainstreet.
This statement alone tells me that you have no idea of what you are talking about.
The Blackberry was the smartphone of choice amongst young people before the iPhone appeared.
The only reason it fits is because of its aspect ratio. If the iPad maintains its current aspect ratio down to 7 inches it will not fit in your pocket. So in the end you either needed a coat, jacket or a bag. That Has been my point all along.
Can it fit in your (now I must state specifically) pants pocket?
Would you just carry it around in your hand?
Would you need a bag to take it with you?
I have a small over the shoulder bag that fits my iPad, a pico projector and every conceivable cable I'll ever need. Try again on the bag argument. That is just obsurred that a iPad doesn't fit in a over the shoulder bag.
I'm more likely to bring a 7" tablet with me than a ~10" tablet. If I am going to a friend's house, then I'm more likely to bring a 7" just because it's actually smaller and lighter. That's it. And I can probably hide it in my jacket pockets were the 10" would have no chance whatsoever.
I'm more likely to bring a 7" tablet with me than a ~10" tablet. If I am going to a friend's house, then I'm more likely to bring a 7" just because it's actually smaller and lighter. That's it. And I can probably hide it in my jacket pockets were the 10" would have no chance whatsoever.
You don't understand. Your personal choice doesn't enter into the discussion. What you think is more or less portable is irrelevant. Just get it into your head that 10" is the best size and what you want or need is stupid.
At least that seems to be the rebuttal that you'll receive. Just saying...
Samsung shipped 2 million tablets. They shipped 47 million phones. The ratio combining Samsung's and Apples numbers put the Note as niche. 80 million to 5 million.
I have said over and over that it is successful. Niche, cult, is not derogatory. But it can't be called mainstream, not yet at least. Blackberrys were successful but were not Everyman mainstream phones. I think the Note is the new Blackberry, a great business enterprise phone that will have some commercial appeal, but not mainstream success. Popular on Wall Street but not Mainstreet.
Does anyone argue that the iPod Shuffle is not really a big seller to many people other than runners, bikers and those that go to he gym? No, because that is what it is and who it appeals to because of its SIZE. Why is it such a friggin stretch to think that not everyone wants a 5 inch phone and that it's appeal is limited, albeit to a large group?
So you've not only combined all of Samsung's handset numbers into one group to compare to a specific model, but also added all of their tablet sales and all of Apple's portable device sales to compare to a single product from a single company. If you want to take all the handset and tablet sales since the iPhone 4S released and compare that figure to only the iPhone 4S sales then you have the 4S being a niche product by your definition. That's disingenuous in every way.
BTW, as of June 2012 that number is 7 million, not 5 million.
So you've not only combined all of Samsung's handset numbers into one group to compare to a specific model, but also added all of their tablet sales and all of Apple's portable device sales to compare to a single product from a single company. If you want to take all the handset and tablet sales since the iPhone 4S released and compare that figure to only the iPhone 4S sales then you have the 4S being a niche product by your definition. That's disingenuous in every way.
BTW, as of June 2012 that number is 7 million, not 5 million.
Between two companies 80 million more phones smaller than 5 inches sold or shipped this year.
From the same manufacturer, 40 million more phones shipped that we're smaller than 5 inches.
How is that disingenuous?
The point is, a 5 inch phone is NOT a runaway success.
Not only do I not know anyone who has a Note, I don't even know anyone who knows anyone that has a Note.
The Note is popular but it is not universally so. Is there something wrong with that? Am I missing something? Have I been derogative of the Note in some way?
Perhaps this analogy will work for you without insulting anyone.
The Note is like a good independent film. A quality product, but perhaps a bit offbeat and not a mainstream universal success of say a summer blockbuster.
Between two companies 80 million more phones smaller than 5 inches sold or shipped this year.
From the same manufacturer, 40 million more phones shipped that we're smaller than 5 inches.
How is that disingenuous?
The point is, a 5 inch phone is NOT a runaway success.
Not only do I not know anyone who has a Note, I don't even know anyone who knows anyone that has a Note.
The Note is popular but it is not universally so. Is there something wrong with that? Am I missing something? Have I been derogative of the Note in some way?
Perhaps this analogy will work for you without insulting anyone.
The Note is like a good independent film. A quality product, but perhaps a bit offbeat and not a mainstream universal success of say a summer blockbuster.
It's disingenuous because you are making a fallacious comparison for the purpose of disparaging the device. It's no different than people years ago calling the iPhone a niche product by comparing it's specific sales figures for the entire handset market. The Note is a success! Whether the 5.x" phone or phone-tablet hybrid will be successful or remain a niche market that is owned by only the Galaxy Note remains to be seen, but on a product-to-product comparison the Note is successful.
It's disingenuous because you are making a fallacious comparison for the purpose of disparaging the device. It's no different than people years ago calling the iPhone a niche product by comparing it's specific sales figures for the entire handset market. The Note is a success! Whether the 5.x" phone or phone-tablet hybrid will be successful or remain a niche market that is owned by only the Galaxy Note remains to be seen, but on a product-to-product comparison the Note is successful.
I said Samsung shipped 2 million tablets last year!
It is only disparaging to Samsung tablets which are not a part of the discussion. No matter how you want to slice it, Samsung shipped 40 million more phones that were less than 5 inches.
Apple sold 37 million iPhones in the first quarter. That is, between two companies, close to 80 million more phones shipped or sold that we're smaller than 5 inches.
I never effing said that the Note is NOT a success! But it is NOT a household name! There is no average guy, on the street buzz about it! There are no reports about not being in stock. Nobody is lining up for it! It is NOT a phenomenon! It is a nice Independent Film that is successful, but it is not The Avengers.
The point is, 7 million people wanted a 5 inch phone and 80 million people didn't. There is a distinction between success and market share.
If the trend demonstrated that people wanted more 5 inch phones more manufacturers would be announcing them.
People, by contrast, purchased 3 million new iPads in the first 4 days. That is real cash that is unsubsidized by telecom carriers.
So however you want to cut it, the Note is not a blockbuster but it is a success. It is unlikely that even Samsung believes it to be their number one phone. A high priority phone? Sure, but not their everyday industry and brand defining phone.
If you friggin say that I have not called it a success again you are simply tone deaf.
It is the worlds number one selling 5 inch phone. There, feel better now?
You don't understand. Your personal choice doesn't enter into the discussion. What you think is more or less portable is irrelevant. Just get it into your head that 10" is the best size and what you want or need is stupid.
[SIZE=9px]At least that seems to be the rebuttal that you'll receive. Just saying...[/SIZE]
You are now just being silly.
I have asked a simple user based question, "Does it fit in the front pocket of most to all pants?"
Anything that doesn't still requires some level of planning or thinking to bring it with you. Period.
This is a fact. It is not based on hypotheticals like, "ummm, if it is smaller id be more likely to take it with me to my buddies house.
I said Samsung shipped 2 million tablets last year!
It is only disparaging to Samsung tablets which are not a part of the discussion. No matter how you want to slice it, Samsung shipped 40 million more phones that were less than 5 inches.
Apple sold 37 million iPhones in the first quarter. That is, between two companies, close to 80 million more phones shipped or sold that we're smaller than 5 inches.
I never effing said that the Note is NOT a success! But it is NOT a household name! There is no average guy, on the street buzz about it! There are no reports about not being in stock. Nobody is lining up for it! It is NOT a phenomenon! It is a nice Independent Film that is successful, but it is not The Avengers.
The point is, 7 million people wanted a 5 inch phone and 80 million people didn't. There is a distinction between success and market share.
If the trend demonstrated that people wanted more 5 inch phones more manufacturers would be announcing them.
People, by contrast, purchased 3 million new iPads in the first 4 days. That is real cash that is unsubsidized by telecom carriers.
So however you want to cut it, the Note is not a blockbuster but it is a success. It is unlikely that even Samsung believes it to be their number one phone. A high priority phone? Sure, but not their everyday industry and brand defining phone.
If you friggin say that I have not called it a success again you are simply tone deaf.
It is the worlds number one selling 5 inch phone. There, feel better now?
Everything you've stated is to paint the Note as unsuccessful for the market as a whole by comparing specific product sales to an entire market. You can do that to the iPhone to all handsets, too.
Everything you've stated is to paint the Note as unsuccessful for the market as a whole by comparing specific product sales to an entire market. You can do that to the iPhone to all handsets, too.
Why do you keep trying... the guy/girl thinks they've got a lock on intelligence... and, I'm sure, it has become evident that that is not the case.
You are now just being silly.
I have asked a simple user based question, "Does it fit in the front pocket of most to all pants?"
Anything that doesn't still requires some level of planning or thinking to bring it with you. Period.
This is a fact. It is not based on hypotheticals like, "ummm, if it is smaller id be more likely to take it with me to my buddies house.
The fact that I think it's a stupidly large phone and pointlessly small tablet that doesn't appear to me to good for either job makes their success even more impressive. When the first iPad arrived I said that I didn't see how it would fit into my needs but I could definitely see how it could meet the needs of a great many current and new Apple customers. I can't see it with the Note which means, in internet logic, I should automatically disparage it, but it's clearly a success and a blockbuster device for its category. To say anything else would just be lying to myself.
The fact that I think it's a stupidly large phone and pointlessly small tablet that doesn't appear to me to good for either job makes their success even more impressive. When the first iPad arrived I said that I didn't see how it would fit into my needs but I could definitely see how it could meet the needs of a great many current and new Apple customers. I can't see it with the Note which means, in internet logic, I should automatically disparage it, but it's clearly a success and a blockbuster device for its category. To say anything else would just be lying to myself.
Everything you're saying here I have already said. I really don't get what your argument is either?
In regards to "its category" I even said "it is the worlds number one selling 5 inch phone."
Anything in the top 5 in unit sales or usage numbers can't really be defined as a niche product. You could even further bring it up the list by combining the product models of the Galaxy S models they way you can combine YoY iPhone models, but there really is no need for all that.
If you call the Note a niche product then you should call the iPhone 3GS a niche product because it's clearly selling less than newer iPhones. But that would be silly.
In regards to "its category" I even said "it is the worlds number one selling 5 inch phone."
What is niche is the device size for the smartphone market, not the device itself. There is a very real and distinct difference.
Anything in the top 5 in unit sales or usage numbers can't really be defined as a niche product. You could even further bring it up the list by combining the product models of the Galaxy S models they way you can combine YoY iPhone models, but there really is no need for all that.
If you call the Note a niche product then you should call the iPhone 3GS a niche product because it's clearly selling less than newer iPhones. But that would be silly.
In regards to "its category" I even said "it is the worlds number one selling 5 inch phone."
What is niche is the device size for the smartphone market, not the device itself. There is a very real and distinct difference.
I AGREE WITH YOU!!!!!!!!!
Yes the iPhone 3GS is a bargain entry level device of a model that is being phased out.
If you want to extend "niche" to that device I won't argue the point.
I AGREE WITH YOU!!!!!!!!!
Yes the iPhone 3GS is a bargain entry level device of a model that is being phased out.
If you want to extend "niche" to that device I won't argue the point.
2.8% of all Android is not a runaway. It also dropped 6% of its relative percentage in the last 30 days. In fact it isn't even in the top three of Samsung smart phones on the list. By your definition the HTC Evo 4G is a runaway smash with its similar Android market share of 2.4%. Which, by the way, is the average market share of the following four Android phones on the list.
I have asked a simple user based question, "Does it fit in the front pocket of most to all pants?"
Anything that doesn't still requires some level of planning or thinking to bring it with you. Period.
This is a fact. It is not based on hypotheticals like, "ummm, if it is smaller id be more likely to take it with me to my buddies house.
And why does it need to be a pant? Why couldn't it be a jacket with large pockets? And why does it needs to fit a pant pocket to be the definition of "more portable"? I can tell you most of my jackets can fit a 7" tablet. And at worst, it's easier to hold the damn 7" with one hand like a small book. If I have the option of a 9.7" iPad and 7.85" iPad that I can use on the run, then I will most likely choose the 7.85" most of the time. Why? Because it's freakingly and physically SMALLER and LIGHTER. By my definition, that makes it more portable.
Why do you suppose some people choose the 11" MBA over the 13" MBA? Heck, if the 11" is not more portable simply because of its size and weight, then why the hell did Apple make it?
And why does it need to be a pant? Why couldn't it be a jacket with large pockets? And why does it needs to fit a pant pocket to be the definition of "more portable"? I can tell you most of my jackets can fit a 7" tablet. And at worst, it's easier to hold the damn 7" with one hand like a small book. If I have the option of a 9.7" iPad and 7.85" iPad that I can use on the run, then I will most likely choose the 7.85" most of the time. Why? Because it's freakingly and physically SMALLER and LIGHTER. By my definition, that makes it more portable.
Why do you suppose some people choose the 11" MBA over the 13" MBA? Heck, if the 11" is not more portable simply because of its size and weight, then why the hell did Apple make it?
Why a pant pocket? Because you are always wearing pants that's why. Do you always need to wear a jacket? all these guys chiming in bringing up their coats and jackets, well either you have to wear a suit everyday or you only plan on carrying it seasonally.
It has been a 100 degrees all week this week. What coat pocket are you going to carry it in?
But the fact is it requires something "extra" to carry it with you if it isn't in your hands the whole time. Is that so hard to understand?
If the MBA's had the same specs other than just size, sure you would have a point, but there is more than just the size that differentiates the two models. Greater price difference being the biggest difference.
Ok, half the time you wear a jacket and the other half you wear shorts with deep pockets! Why does it need to fit a pocket to be more portable, light and easy to handle? Why do I continue to post here?
Comments
Samsung shipped 2 million tablets. They shipped 47 million phones. The ratio combining Samsung's and Apples numbers put the Note as niche. 80 million to 5 million.
I have said over and over that it is successful. Niche, cult, is not derogatory. But it can't be called mainstream, not yet at least. Blackberrys were successful but were not Everyman mainstream phones. I think the Note is the new Blackberry, a great business enterprise phone that will have some commercial appeal, but not mainstream success. Popular on Wall Street but not Mainstreet.
Does anyone argue that the iPod Shuffle is not really a big seller to many people other than runners, bikers and those that go to he gym? No, because that is what it is and who it appeals to because of its SIZE. Why is it such a friggin stretch to think that not everyone wants a 5 inch phone and that it's appeal is limited, albeit to a large group?
Quote:
Originally Posted by bmason1270
Blackberrys were successful but were not Everyman mainstream phones. I think the Note is the new Blackberry, a great business enterprise phone that will have some commercial appeal, but not mainstream success. Popular on Wall Street but not Mainstreet.
This statement alone tells me that you have no idea of what you are talking about.
The Blackberry was the smartphone of choice amongst young people before the iPhone appeared.
Quote:
Originally Posted by bmason1270
The only reason it fits is because of its aspect ratio. If the iPad maintains its current aspect ratio down to 7 inches it will not fit in your pocket. So in the end you either needed a coat, jacket or a bag. That Has been my point all along.
Can it fit in your (now I must state specifically) pants pocket?
Would you just carry it around in your hand?
Would you need a bag to take it with you?
I have a small over the shoulder bag that fits my iPad, a pico projector and every conceivable cable I'll ever need. Try again on the bag argument. That is just obsurred that a iPad doesn't fit in a over the shoulder bag.
I'm more likely to bring a 7" tablet with me than a ~10" tablet. If I am going to a friend's house, then I'm more likely to bring a 7" just because it's actually smaller and lighter. That's it. And I can probably hide it in my jacket pockets were the 10" would have no chance whatsoever.
Compare this:
http://blogs.computerworld.com/sites/default/themes/cw_blogs/cache/files/u3/2tablets.jpg
http://blog.laptopmag.com/wpress/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/samsung-vs-apple-ipad_2.jpg
Quote:
Originally Posted by KevinN206
I'm more likely to bring a 7" tablet with me than a ~10" tablet. If I am going to a friend's house, then I'm more likely to bring a 7" just because it's actually smaller and lighter. That's it. And I can probably hide it in my jacket pockets were the 10" would have no chance whatsoever.
Compare this:
http://blogs.computerworld.com/sites/default/themes/cw_blogs/cache/files/u3/2tablets.jpg
http://blog.laptopmag.com/wpress/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/samsung-vs-apple-ipad_2.jpg
You don't understand. Your personal choice doesn't enter into the discussion. What you think is more or less portable is irrelevant. Just get it into your head that 10" is the best size and what you want or need is stupid.
At least that seems to be the rebuttal that you'll receive. Just saying...
So you've not only combined all of Samsung's handset numbers into one group to compare to a specific model, but also added all of their tablet sales and all of Apple's portable device sales to compare to a single product from a single company. If you want to take all the handset and tablet sales since the iPhone 4S released and compare that figure to only the iPhone 4S sales then you have the 4S being a niche product by your definition. That's disingenuous in every way.
BTW, as of June 2012 that number is 7 million, not 5 million.
Between two companies 80 million more phones smaller than 5 inches sold or shipped this year.
From the same manufacturer, 40 million more phones shipped that we're smaller than 5 inches.
How is that disingenuous?
The point is, a 5 inch phone is NOT a runaway success.
Not only do I not know anyone who has a Note, I don't even know anyone who knows anyone that has a Note.
The Note is popular but it is not universally so. Is there something wrong with that? Am I missing something? Have I been derogative of the Note in some way?
Perhaps this analogy will work for you without insulting anyone.
The Note is like a good independent film. A quality product, but perhaps a bit offbeat and not a mainstream universal success of say a summer blockbuster.
It's disingenuous because you are making a fallacious comparison for the purpose of disparaging the device. It's no different than people years ago calling the iPhone a niche product by comparing it's specific sales figures for the entire handset market. The Note is a success! Whether the 5.x" phone or phone-tablet hybrid will be successful or remain a niche market that is owned by only the Galaxy Note remains to be seen, but on a product-to-product comparison the Note is successful.
I said Samsung shipped 2 million tablets last year!
It is only disparaging to Samsung tablets which are not a part of the discussion. No matter how you want to slice it, Samsung shipped 40 million more phones that were less than 5 inches.
Apple sold 37 million iPhones in the first quarter. That is, between two companies, close to 80 million more phones shipped or sold that we're smaller than 5 inches.
I never effing said that the Note is NOT a success! But it is NOT a household name! There is no average guy, on the street buzz about it! There are no reports about not being in stock. Nobody is lining up for it! It is NOT a phenomenon! It is a nice Independent Film that is successful, but it is not The Avengers.
The point is, 7 million people wanted a 5 inch phone and 80 million people didn't. There is a distinction between success and market share.
If the trend demonstrated that people wanted more 5 inch phones more manufacturers would be announcing them.
People, by contrast, purchased 3 million new iPads in the first 4 days. That is real cash that is unsubsidized by telecom carriers.
So however you want to cut it, the Note is not a blockbuster but it is a success. It is unlikely that even Samsung believes it to be their number one phone. A high priority phone? Sure, but not their everyday industry and brand defining phone.
If you friggin say that I have not called it a success again you are simply tone deaf.
It is the worlds number one selling 5 inch phone. There, feel better now?
You are now just being silly.
I have asked a simple user based question, "Does it fit in the front pocket of most to all pants?"
Anything that doesn't still requires some level of planning or thinking to bring it with you. Period.
This is a fact. It is not based on hypotheticals like, "ummm, if it is smaller id be more likely to take it with me to my buddies house.
Everything you've stated is to paint the Note as unsuccessful for the market as a whole by comparing specific product sales to an entire market. You can do that to the iPhone to all handsets, too.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX
Everything you've stated is to paint the Note as unsuccessful for the market as a whole by comparing specific product sales to an entire market. You can do that to the iPhone to all handsets, too.
Why do you keep trying... the guy/girl thinks they've got a lock on intelligence... and, I'm sure, it has become evident that that is not the case.
The fact that I think it's a stupidly large phone and pointlessly small tablet that doesn't appear to me to good for either job makes their success even more impressive. When the first iPad arrived I said that I didn't see how it would fit into my needs but I could definitely see how it could meet the needs of a great many current and new Apple customers. I can't see it with the Note which means, in internet logic, I should automatically disparage it, but it's clearly a success and a blockbuster device for its category. To say anything else would just be lying to myself.
I'm sorry it is true that a seven inch tablet won't it in the front pocket of most pants.
That is all I have said, and for ME that is what I would need it to do to be considered more portable than my iPad.
The Galaxy Note does or is likely to. Exactly what is your problem?
Everything you're saying here I have already said. I really don't get what your argument is either?
In regards to "its category" I even said "it is the worlds number one selling 5 inch phone."
It's also looks to be in the top 5 selling Android phones which, again, makes it even more impressive for being such a fundamentally bad, IMO, size.
Anything in the top 5 in unit sales or usage numbers can't really be defined as a niche product. You could even further bring it up the list by combining the product models of the Galaxy S models they way you can combine YoY iPhone models, but there really is no need for all that.
If you call the Note a niche product then you should call the iPhone 3GS a niche product because it's clearly selling less than newer iPhones. But that would be silly.
What is niche is the device size for the smartphone market, not the device itself. There is a very real and distinct difference.
I AGREE WITH YOU!!!!!!!!!
Yes the iPhone 3GS is a bargain entry level device of a model that is being phased out.
If you want to extend "niche" to that device I won't argue the point.
2.8% of all Android is not a runaway. It also dropped 6% of its relative percentage in the last 30 days. In fact it isn't even in the top three of Samsung smart phones on the list. By your definition the HTC Evo 4G is a runaway smash with its similar Android market share of 2.4%. Which, by the way, is the average market share of the following four Android phones on the list.
Quote:
Originally Posted by bmason1270
You are now just being silly.
I have asked a simple user based question, "Does it fit in the front pocket of most to all pants?"
Anything that doesn't still requires some level of planning or thinking to bring it with you. Period.
This is a fact. It is not based on hypotheticals like, "ummm, if it is smaller id be more likely to take it with me to my buddies house.
And why does it need to be a pant? Why couldn't it be a jacket with large pockets? And why does it needs to fit a pant pocket to be the definition of "more portable"? I can tell you most of my jackets can fit a 7" tablet. And at worst, it's easier to hold the damn 7" with one hand like a small book. If I have the option of a 9.7" iPad and 7.85" iPad that I can use on the run, then I will most likely choose the 7.85" most of the time. Why? Because it's freakingly and physically SMALLER and LIGHTER. By my definition, that makes it more portable.
Why do you suppose some people choose the 11" MBA over the 13" MBA? Heck, if the 11" is not more portable simply because of its size and weight, then why the hell did Apple make it?
Why a pant pocket? Because you are always wearing pants that's why. Do you always need to wear a jacket? all these guys chiming in bringing up their coats and jackets, well either you have to wear a suit everyday or you only plan on carrying it seasonally.
It has been a 100 degrees all week this week. What coat pocket are you going to carry it in?
But the fact is it requires something "extra" to carry it with you if it isn't in your hands the whole time. Is that so hard to understand?
If the MBA's had the same specs other than just size, sure you would have a point, but there is more than just the size that differentiates the two models. Greater price difference being the biggest difference.
Ok, half the time you wear a jacket and the other half you wear shorts with deep pockets! Why does it need to fit a pocket to be more portable, light and easy to handle? Why do I continue to post here?