Jesus W. Christ

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  • Reply 21 of 30
    [quote]Originally posted by Hassan i Sabbah:

    <strong>



    I'm sure you do. Ancient characters from antiquity. Like contemporary characters from the present. Only old.



    I see the problem.</strong><hr></blockquote>





    Why bother with modernity at all? Just go with quotes from Aristotle and Plato in your next debate, and be done with it.
  • Reply 22 of 30
    [quote]Originally posted by Immanuel Goldstein:

    If you ask me, I find rather futile the idea of recruting ancient characters from antiquity, as ammunition for arguing a contemporary matter.<hr></blockquote>

    [quote]Originally posted by Hassan i Sabbah:

    <strong>I'm sure you do. Ancient characters from antiquity. Like contemporary characters from the present. Only old.



    I see the problem.</strong><hr></blockquote>



    The writings and statements by contemporary characters from the present (like say, Sheikh Muhammad Sayeed Tantawi, supreme imam of the Islamic Institute of Al-Azhar) is not at all like that of long gone characters, particularly those of whom we only know what their good friends are supposed to have written about them, later on (whether you believe in it or not, which is another matter), or from indifferent or hostile third-parties.



    As for me, my opinion on the futility of using ancient characters as ammunition is related to my generally low opinion of appeals to authority in an argument.

    So, if I find appeal to some relatively contemporary authority unintersting and unconvincing, the appeal to ones from eons ago, as told by friends and written on papyri (or on parchment scrolls, or on clay tablets, etc?) in a language other than the original [ * ], not to mention, a selective appeal to an authority, quoting its lines favourable to one's opinion but missing those less so, looks quite futile indeed.

    If you ask me.



    * Galilean carpenters and their friends didn't speak koinê Greek. They spoke and wrote Hebrew and Aramaic. Only the upper stratae of Judaean society were fluent or litterate in Greek.



    [ 03-14-2003: Message edited by: Immanuel Goldstein ]</p>
  • Reply 23 of 30
    Ah, no, you misunderstand me, Immanuel.



    My point is that saying "ancient characters from antiquity" is a tautology. Like my "contemporary characters from the present day". Or "dead people who aren't alive anymore and have now passed on", say.



    Rather than giving you another excuse to display your splendid erudition, I was actually taking the piss.







    How funny.



    Anyway, I wasn't quoting scripture to say - look, GWB's bad, it says so in the Bible, but to make the point that to claim moral authority from the divine is as dangerous and wrong in the United States as it is in Afghanistan, Saudi Arabia or Iran, and wondering why the board's Christians seem to have no problem with a man claiming guidance from the Holy Spirit when he seems philosophically and morally opposed to the spirit of the teachings of Jesus Christ as described here in the Beatitudes.
  • Reply 24 of 30
    Because they, like Shrubbery, were raised to believe in a particular brand of Unilateralistani protestantism which happens to be the bastard child of fascism and intolerance and bears no resemblence to the Beatitudes or any other principle inconsistent with their faith. Your intolerance for their intolerance is disturbing.
  • Reply 25 of 30
    Forgot to add, May God have mercy on your soul. Even though your name doesn't quite work out to be a palindrome.
  • Reply 26 of 30
    [quote]Originally posted by Hassan i Sabbah:

    <strong>



    I was actually taking the piss.







    How funny.

    </strong><hr></blockquote>





    Then someone really needs to cut your fscking dick off, you little pissher.
  • Reply 27 of 30
    (It?s for your own good, of-course).





  • Reply 28 of 30
    [quote]Originally posted by Hassan i Sabbah:

    <strong>Ah, no, you misunderstand me, Immanuel.



    My point is that saying "ancient characters from antiquity" is a tautology.



    Rather than giving you another excuse to display your splendid erudition, I was actually taking the piss.</strong><hr></blockquote>

    I also like to say ?the world's bestest thing in the world? from time to time.

    If it's worth anything, I'm not pissed off.

    Not that it should discourage you from pursuing such noble endeavour.



    [quote]<strong>Anyway, I wasn't quoting scripture to say - look, GWB's bad, it says so in the Bible, but to make the point that to claim moral authority from the divine is as dangerous and wrong in the United States as it is in Afghanistan, Saudi Arabia or Iran, and wondering why the board's Christians seem to have no problem with a man claiming guidance from the Holy Spirit when he seems philosophically and morally opposed to the spirit of the teachings of Jesus Christ as described here in the Beatitudes.</strong><hr></blockquote>

    When appealing to authority, all tend to see what they prefer (hence ?selective? etc.), so some will see there a hippie bearded lady peacenik, while others will see the bearer of the sword of swift and angry justice.
  • Reply 29 of 30
    powerdocpowerdoc Posts: 8,123member
    there is two ways to deal with holy scriptures or philosophicals texts : pick in it what you want to get your point, or start a never ending research and learning of it.

    This learning represant a tremendeous amount of work, but is the only way that worth it.



    As i am lazy, and did not do this work, i try to not pick thing in holy scripture or philosophical texts. I think it's better to deal with his own idears, than to pick up things like in a bazaar.



    BTW i nominate Immanuel, for the most erudite poster of AI
  • Reply 30 of 30
    enaena Posts: 667member
    hmmmmm...but if everything is permitted---and nothing forbidden, what's the point? Mr. "Hassan"
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