The maps are server based. Fixes doesn't need a new release, and I've seen lots of fixes around here where I'm located.
It cuts both ways. The design of the server backend and the client frontend are evolving. How it is architected will be shaped on how the needs and anticipated needs of customers shapes the direction of what they are strong on and weak on. The frameworks being developed will evolve as they address the demands of customers and goals of Apple with 3rd party devs in the areas they want made available for 3rd party functionality.
Maps thinks my 100 year old office building here in Austin is a parking garage located a block and a half away. I have sent corrections to Apple on several occasions from different phones. Also, Maps could not find a street with a POI in Wichita Falls TX this weekend, but neither could the shitty navigation system in our Toyota. The street does not exist according to Maps, but Google has it. Neither are huge issues, but it would be nice to see a bigger effort on the part of Apple to get this stuff sorted. Maybe this personnel change is exactly that.
When are they going to add turn by turn navigation for the inside of my house - ya know - in case I need to get around in the middle of the night during a power outage?
When are they going to add turn by turn navigation for the inside of my house - ya know - in case I need to get around in the middle of the night during a power outage?
Wasn't Google actually adding interior directions for some stuff? I never got that.
It's not the same thing. Cayman Islands HAD maps and Apple REMOVED it! China didn't had good maps and now they have. That's ok, but you can not screw people and say: "Hey, I screwed you, but... it's better for other people, so you should be happy!".
I don't have movies in iTunes and I don't complain because I never had them in the first place. I knew when I bought the iPhone that I will not have movies and it was my decision to buy the iPhone knowing that I will have limited functionality. But I would be mad like hell if I had movies and then Apple decided to remove them!
Just keep the water on your left!
(Just kidding... I of course agree that the temporary loss of maps for Cayman Island dwellers--like yourself I assume?--is a problem. It’s just a problem that can be put in perspective. Cayman Island residents can get STILL get around using their iPhone with other free mapping systems—including the same old Google web maps they had before—during this temporary transition. Is this equally just a temporary transition for Google users in China, which is, we must admit, a rather larger chunk of people? How many weeks will Cayman residents face missing streets vs. how many weeks will Chinese Google users face them?)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Palex19
The maps used by Apple are still very crappy outside US. Particularly in Asia.
Big downside from what Google is providing.
The US version of Apple Maps is much much better than what we are having outside. This is the most critical point.
I wouldn’t say Apple is worse than Google “particularly in Asia” unless you exclude China:
1. Big leaps forward arrive coupled with limited problems. (A success any other company would kill for.)
2. Cries of doom from “analysts,” astroturfers, and ad-baiting lazy "journalists." (And of course they ignore massive problems with Apple’s competitors.)
3. Rational Apple appreciators post: “Yes, there are problems, but they are overblown and there are great things as well. The alternatives are far from perfect."
4. Emotional anti-Apple trolls post: “As usual, the fanboiz say there are no problems!” (And of course they ignore massive problems with Apple’s competitors.)
Let the rampant speculation begin. Oh, looks like you guys started without me
I for one think it is a good thing. It's far more common in companies to keep people with tenure in positions of power and whitewash their failures (I'm looking at you, Ballmer) than to drop them. According to Adam Lashinsky's book (and the Fortune article it was based on) "Inside Apple", there's always a DRI (directly responsible individual) for any project at Apple, so there shouldn't be any question about who failed to execute.
Maybe yes, maybe no. Maybe the head of the project asked for more budget to acquire more databases and was told, "no". Maybe they wanted to hire more people with appropriate expertise and was told "no, we have all the right people". Maybe they knew of the flaws but were told by others in management, "are you kidding? This looks so cool and is so much better than Google Maps that the flaws don't matter. We'll fix them over time." Or maybe it was the reverse - maybe the guy blew the project. But unless you're an insider, you never really know. I've been involved in all such scenarios. Sometimes, senior execs make bad decisions and then conveniently forget that they made them.
And don't forget the "Six Stages of Any Project":
1. Enthusiasm
2. Disillusionment
3. Panic and Hysteria
4. Search for the Guilty
5. Punishment of the Innocent
6. Praise and Honors for the Non-Participants
Meanwhile, my experience with Maps so far (about two weeks) has been relatively good. Google Maps on my iPhone 3G was so slow (or it would simply lock up) as to be unusable most of the time. Apple Maps on my iPhone 5 is spectacularly fast. One thing that does appear to be missing (unless I'm missing it) is that once I choose a route, I want to manually go through all the steps in the route and be able to listen to the turn-by-turn before I set out. And I'm much more concerned with either bad routes (which Google gave me all the time) or bad location information than I am with a deformed image of a bridge. I also think that Apple HAS to add public transportation information. They can add trains first and add major bus routes later. Adding trains shouldn't be that difficult - most transit systems have their maps online. I'd also like to see Apple to add pedestrian and especially bicycle routes, which Google has in Beta.
I find that some of the images are spectacular (look at Coney Island) and others are inferior to what Google Maps had (areas in New York State). While the Apple images (combined with the retina display) are generally clearer, I think I was able to zoom closer with Google Maps.
The other thing I've noticed is that they tend to have national retailers, but not local ones. Apple should set up a website or add functionality to the app itself where businesses can submit their locations and keywords. Seems to me that with such functionality, Apple could add a million or more businesses virtually overnight. They'd have to deal with validating the information, but it's all doable. Or they can license phone directories.
Also, it seems that Tom Tom is one of the major map suppliers to Apple. TomTom is also used extensively in GPS systems for cars, right? And yet, I've never heard many complaints about the systems used in cars. Why is that?
Also, it seems that Tom Tom is one of the major map suppliers to Apple. TomTom is also used extensively in GPS systems for cars, right? And yet, I've never heard many complaints about the systems used in cars. Why is that?
Confirmation bias: some people start with the assumption that everything Apple does is bad for the user (some serious denial there). Other get swept up by the media (and random posting) telling people how terrible something is. When you’re told to look for a problem, you’ll find it, notice it, and care about it... even if you liked your TomTom before. Classic example: look for white vans in your life. Suddenly there will be TONS of them around. There always were: but now you notice.
Ditto for Waze, which I’ve heard Android users praise over Google... until Apple started using it (alongside TomTom). If Waze and TomTom were both good enough before, you’d think their combined dataset would be good enough too...
I speak from actual personal experience: iOS 6 Maps really IS serving me very well, and better than the old bersion... but I DO notice more little errors with iOS 6 maps than I ever did with the old app! And then I go back on Google, and now I’m noticing them there too... if I hadn’t done so, I’d have assumed iOS 6 Maps was a step down. It’s usually not—and yes, that’s US-specific.
(Exactly the same thing happened with antenna problems: people got a BETTER signal with the iPhone 4 than the acclaimed reception of the 3GS... this was tested. But they never noticed how their hand affected the signal on all phones--until the media made them look for it. Thus, you saw lots of trolls bemoaning for OTHER people’s sake how bad the problem was, while actual iPhone 4 owners shrugged and made calls! The iPhone 4 is still sold, and as a two-year user of it, I wouldn’t hesitate to recommend it—caseless—to anyone. It dropped bars... it didn’t drop calls any more than my 3G, and got a better signal in borderline areas.)
And don't forget the "Six Stages of Any Project":
1. Enthusiasm
2. Disillusionment
3. Panic and Hysteria
4. Search for the Guilty
5. Punishment of the Innocent
6. Praise and Honors for the Non-Participants
Too funny!
Meanwhile, my experience with Maps so far (about two weeks) has been relatively good. Google Maps on my iPhone 3G was so slow (or it would simply lock up) as to be unusable most of the time. Apple Maps on my iPhone 5 is spectacularly fast.
Well, that is a much faster processor you're using; don't know if these should be compared.
Apple should set up a website or add functionality to the app itself where businesses can submit their locations and keywords.
I think that would create clutter, something Apple doesn't like.
Comments
The problem is Yelp. In Australia Yelp hasn't quite caught on yet, in a variety of cities.
The business searches are... hmm... quite bad, really.
Apple's insistence on suddenly switching everything to Yelp is also a major, major issue around the world.
It cuts both ways. The design of the server backend and the client frontend are evolving. How it is architected will be shaped on how the needs and anticipated needs of customers shapes the direction of what they are strong on and weak on. The frameworks being developed will evolve as they address the demands of customers and goals of Apple with 3rd party devs in the areas they want made available for 3rd party functionality.
Maps thinks my 100 year old office building here in Austin is a parking garage located a block and a half away. I have sent corrections to Apple on several occasions from different phones. Also, Maps could not find a street with a POI in Wichita Falls TX this weekend, but neither could the shitty navigation system in our Toyota. The street does not exist according to Maps, but Google has it. Neither are huge issues, but it would be nice to see a bigger effort on the part of Apple to get this stuff sorted. Maybe this personnel change is exactly that.
When are they going to add turn by turn navigation for the inside of my house - ya know - in case I need to get around in the middle of the night during a power outage?
Originally Posted by lilgto64
When are they going to add turn by turn navigation for the inside of my house - ya know - in case I need to get around in the middle of the night during a power outage?
Wasn't Google actually adding interior directions for some stuff?
Quote:
Originally Posted by NelsonX
It's not the same thing. Cayman Islands HAD maps and Apple REMOVED it! China didn't had good maps and now they have. That's ok, but you can not screw people and say: "Hey, I screwed you, but... it's better for other people, so you should be happy!".
I don't have movies in iTunes and I don't complain because I never had them in the first place. I knew when I bought the iPhone that I will not have movies and it was my decision to buy the iPhone knowing that I will have limited functionality. But I would be mad like hell if I had movies and then Apple decided to remove them!
Just keep the water on your left!
(Just kidding... I of course agree that the temporary loss of maps for Cayman Island dwellers--like yourself I assume?--is a problem. It’s just a problem that can be put in perspective. Cayman Island residents can get STILL get around using their iPhone with other free mapping systems—including the same old Google web maps they had before—during this temporary transition. Is this equally just a temporary transition for Google users in China, which is, we must admit, a rather larger chunk of people? How many weeks will Cayman residents face missing streets vs. how many weeks will Chinese Google users face them?)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Palex19
The maps used by Apple are still very crappy outside US. Particularly in Asia.
Big downside from what Google is providing.
The US version of Apple Maps is much much better than what we are having outside. This is the most critical point.
I wouldn’t say Apple is worse than Google “particularly in Asia” unless you exclude China:
http://www.bangkokpost.com/tech/gadget/314283/apple-maps-better-than-google-in-china
P.S. In reply to nobody in particular...
A quick anatomy of Apple scandals-of-the-week:
1. Big leaps forward arrive coupled with limited problems. (A success any other company would kill for.)
2. Cries of doom from “analysts,” astroturfers, and ad-baiting lazy "journalists." (And of course they ignore massive problems with Apple’s competitors.)
3. Rational Apple appreciators post: “Yes, there are problems, but they are overblown and there are great things as well. The alternatives are far from perfect."
4. Emotional anti-Apple trolls post: “As usual, the fanboiz say there are no problems!” (And of course they ignore massive problems with Apple’s competitors.)
5. Repeat steps 3 and 4. Artie McStrawman lives!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Suddenly Newton
Let the rampant speculation begin. Oh, looks like you guys started without me
I for one think it is a good thing. It's far more common in companies to keep people with tenure in positions of power and whitewash their failures (I'm looking at you, Ballmer) than to drop them. According to Adam Lashinsky's book (and the Fortune article it was based on) "Inside Apple", there's always a DRI (directly responsible individual) for any project at Apple, so there shouldn't be any question about who failed to execute.
Maybe yes, maybe no. Maybe the head of the project asked for more budget to acquire more databases and was told, "no". Maybe they wanted to hire more people with appropriate expertise and was told "no, we have all the right people". Maybe they knew of the flaws but were told by others in management, "are you kidding? This looks so cool and is so much better than Google Maps that the flaws don't matter. We'll fix them over time." Or maybe it was the reverse - maybe the guy blew the project. But unless you're an insider, you never really know. I've been involved in all such scenarios. Sometimes, senior execs make bad decisions and then conveniently forget that they made them.
And don't forget the "Six Stages of Any Project":
1. Enthusiasm
2. Disillusionment
3. Panic and Hysteria
4. Search for the Guilty
5. Punishment of the Innocent
6. Praise and Honors for the Non-Participants
Meanwhile, my experience with Maps so far (about two weeks) has been relatively good. Google Maps on my iPhone 3G was so slow (or it would simply lock up) as to be unusable most of the time. Apple Maps on my iPhone 5 is spectacularly fast. One thing that does appear to be missing (unless I'm missing it) is that once I choose a route, I want to manually go through all the steps in the route and be able to listen to the turn-by-turn before I set out. And I'm much more concerned with either bad routes (which Google gave me all the time) or bad location information than I am with a deformed image of a bridge. I also think that Apple HAS to add public transportation information. They can add trains first and add major bus routes later. Adding trains shouldn't be that difficult - most transit systems have their maps online. I'd also like to see Apple to add pedestrian and especially bicycle routes, which Google has in Beta.
I find that some of the images are spectacular (look at Coney Island) and others are inferior to what Google Maps had (areas in New York State). While the Apple images (combined with the retina display) are generally clearer, I think I was able to zoom closer with Google Maps.
The other thing I've noticed is that they tend to have national retailers, but not local ones. Apple should set up a website or add functionality to the app itself where businesses can submit their locations and keywords. Seems to me that with such functionality, Apple could add a million or more businesses virtually overnight. They'd have to deal with validating the information, but it's all doable. Or they can license phone directories.
Also, it seems that Tom Tom is one of the major map suppliers to Apple. TomTom is also used extensively in GPS systems for cars, right? And yet, I've never heard many complaints about the systems used in cars. Why is that?
Quote:
Originally Posted by zoetmb
Also, it seems that Tom Tom is one of the major map suppliers to Apple. TomTom is also used extensively in GPS systems for cars, right? And yet, I've never heard many complaints about the systems used in cars. Why is that?
Confirmation bias: some people start with the assumption that everything Apple does is bad for the user (some serious denial there). Other get swept up by the media (and random posting) telling people how terrible something is. When you’re told to look for a problem, you’ll find it, notice it, and care about it... even if you liked your TomTom before. Classic example: look for white vans in your life. Suddenly there will be TONS of them around. There always were: but now you notice.
Ditto for Waze, which I’ve heard Android users praise over Google... until Apple started using it (alongside TomTom). If Waze and TomTom were both good enough before, you’d think their combined dataset would be good enough too...
I speak from actual personal experience: iOS 6 Maps really IS serving me very well, and better than the old bersion... but I DO notice more little errors with iOS 6 maps than I ever did with the old app! And then I go back on Google, and now I’m noticing them there too... if I hadn’t done so, I’d have assumed iOS 6 Maps was a step down. It’s usually not—and yes, that’s US-specific.
(Exactly the same thing happened with antenna problems: people got a BETTER signal with the iPhone 4 than the acclaimed reception of the 3GS... this was tested. But they never noticed how their hand affected the signal on all phones--until the media made them look for it. Thus, you saw lots of trolls bemoaning for OTHER people’s sake how bad the problem was, while actual iPhone 4 owners shrugged and made calls! The iPhone 4 is still sold, and as a two-year user of it, I wouldn’t hesitate to recommend it—caseless—to anyone. It dropped bars... it didn’t drop calls any more than my 3G, and got a better signal in borderline areas.)
Too funny!
Well, that is a much faster processor you're using; don't know if these should be compared.
I think that would create clutter, something Apple doesn't like.
Fantastic example: buy a yellow* car? "Oh my God, the streets are filled with yellow cars!"
*can be replaced with any colour, it'd still apply.