This is likely only a basic risk-mitigation strategy. Samsung is 100% dependent on Android, so it makes sense to invest in a fall-back. But I expect this will be as relevant as all the talk about BeOS back in the day. Or as someone else just said, this could be the OS for the basic free phones.
Poor Microsoft trying to be number 3 in the mobile OS might have some competition.
It's certainly a great idea. It's too bad that HP, Dell, et al. didn't invest and develop back up plans when they got in bed with Windows. Now they are struggling to play catchup from disadvantageous positions.
I understand Samsung investing in Titzen — Apple invested in two teams for a mobile OS, one built on PixoOS and one on OSX, the difference being that Samsung is actively using both of theirs — but I think forking Android and taking all their Samsung customers with them is more likely in the long run. This would not mean that Android apps wouldn't work on Samsung's forked Android — even Blackberry expects to run Android apps on BB OS — but they could do more and do it faster, including even offering a curated and safe app store much like Apple that I think would help them market to users that aren't sure which Android phone to buy.
From what I understand, Tizen can run Android apps. If it manages to run all or nearly all of native Android apps as fast and without majors bugs or crashes, it might have a chance to do well. I am also curious how the Amazon app market and their flavor of Android impacts Google's profits as well if any. Their tablets are out selling other native Android tablets.
I don't know a lot about Tizen other than it has some history with Meego from Intel. Hard to judge an OS based on just youtube videos showing demos. But Samsung is smart to have a plan B in place in case Google starts showing special preferential treatment to Motorola which they probably should do since it is not like they owe Samsung, HTC, or any other company anything since they give it away for free. I think Google should throw Motorola a bone or two since it is a Google subsidiary after all.
"Melding" software and hardware is just the tip of the iceberg. You'll need a cross-device ecosystem plus a robust, pervasive, international infrastructure. You know, like the iOS + OS X ecosystem and the iTunes + iCloud infrastructure. An ecosystem and infrastructure more or less like the ones Apple started working on before the first iPod was released in 2001.
iTunes came first. Your infrastructure will also need to come first, otherwise your devices will be attempting to fly in a vacuum.
Oops. Good luck with that, Samsung.
Totally agree. In fact, I suspect that , although it could seem provocative, Samsung has no long term product & services strategy. Only Apple really cares about long term customer relationship, all competitors just take customer money, and run away. The order of magnitude in between Samsung products portfolio (even limited to Consumer electronics) on one hand, and Apple products, on the other hand, also shows how much Apple is a focused company. Because it is possible with such a small number, Apple product strategies (and interrelationship) can be carefully thought out. In the other case, each product line lives its own uncoordinated life.
Don't quit your day jobs to become stand-up comics, guys.
You ever think about stand-up comedy works?
A comedian will a write a series or jokes or anecdotes then practice them on his own or perhaps in front of friends and family. This is alpha testing and isn't too reliable for several reasons I won't get into but it can help weed out ones that may be too confusing for a general audience to get.
The next step is beta testing the material. This is done with a time window. You not only test your material but your execution which includes timing and delivery. You then review your performance either from the 1st person PoV, audio or video. You see what jokes works and why.
You then repeat this beta test many times swapping the material, changing the order, altering when and how the material is delivered. This is a slow and arduous process to 1) perfect your personality as a comedian, and 2) get the right material and deliver it in the right way for a more major event, like a special on Comedy Central or selling out a theater.
It's not easy and every comedian has failed experiences so I don't get why anyone trying to be entertaining needs to be haggled, especially here where you pay no cover and have no minimum drink order to attend.
Comedy is inherently difficult. If the a joke is too obvious it's not funny except perhaps to children or other immature individuals, which is why adults tend not to like jokes kids think are hysterical. If it's too specialized, like a joke that would require a knowledge of astrophysics, then it's not funny because it's not understood, which is why kids tend to get jokes adults think are hysterical.
It's not just about appealing to a specific audience but about the culture it's delivered to. Musicians can travel all around the world and perform to sold out shows but comedians have a much harder time as language and culture can be difficult barrier to overcome.
Along with the cultural issue is the age of the joke. A joke about Kony that Jon Stewart, Stephen Colbert or Bill Maher made a year ago may have been laugh-out-loud funny then but not today. Are you really that much different of a person or does media-based humour simply have a short lifespan?
Finally, there are jokes that are not related to the news but have still expired. Ever see an old man make a joke that you are certain he heard on The Ed Sullivan Show or something like that? You recognize it as a joke as it has the constituent components and you can see how 50 years ago it may have been clever and funny, but today it's simply not. That's the sad reality of comedy. I've tried to sit through the best comedians from the 70's, 80's or 90's. It can be rough. George Carlin talks about human nature a lot so his jokes have held up very well but you'll still a comparison thrown in that would never get used today.
PPS: Comedy Central's The Burn with Jeff Ross is an excellent display of comedic prowess. Ross looks like someone who wouldn't be allowed within 500 feet of a school or playground but he's a nice guy.
What does OHA mean? The other thing that people don't talk about is that most Android phones being sold are STILL old gingerbread phones, which is why about 50% of the Android market is still stuck with 2.x.
I hope to God Samsung does this. It would **** over Android so, so badly.
This could get really interesting. Most iHaters are Fandroids who love Samsung only because it runs Android. They have shifted loyalties as other hardware device makers rose and fell; see Motorola, HTC, etc. Samsung became their most recent shining knight when it rose up to challenge Apple but it's really all about Android. If Samsung forks Android or goes with Tizen what will these people do? Who will they pin their hopes on for Apple's destruction?
Samsung may very well be able to oust Google Android from Samsung products. The problem for Samsung is that Google Android has an well known and accepted ecosystem whereas Samsung does not.
Software and Services:
Gmail
Google+
Google Hangouts
Google Maps
Google Now
Google Play
Google Wallet
Hardware:
Google TV
Nexus Q
Here are some images of Tizen.
Notably, Samsung Software and Services are highly disappointing as well:
Music Hub
S Beam
S Cloud
S Voice
Google may make it where they support Nexus on their own hardware and not support the OEM versions as well moving forward. Google is just immature as far as knowing how to market an OS with a good roadmap for releasing the OS updates and having these updates readily available on all Android devices. It's just becoming more and more of a mess. Tizen sounds like another attempt at having their own platform that won't get much support.
If Sammy has to use Tizen at some point and quit Android due to Goog/Moto...well, I'd be nervous if I were an investor. This will put Sammy virtually in a future tie with MSFT, BB and other bottom feeders. Because if I'm looking at this from just an average consumer's POV, if I'm pretty used to Android, I'm not likely to go to a Tizen phone, I'll just find another Android handset maker.
To put it bluntly, I can buy another cheap plastic phone from any handset maker, most people aren't buying Samsung for the build quality, they're buying because of Android/Advertising/Who knows.
Yes, boring and common. Humans have been arranging things in a grid for thousands of years.
Some choices just make sense, though.
Remember when Microsoft tried something different... a honeycomb grid in Windows Mobile 6.5? *shudder* It was hard to look at it, even though it gave more finger-tap space. I think it taught everyone to avoid unusual layouts
... sure, Samsung can do well with Tizen on its cheap low end "smartphones" that are really just replacing "feature phones," especially throughout the Developing Second/Third World where Samsung is very strong (replacing Nokia).
but where is the Tizen ecosystem? there ain't any. and without an ecosystem there is no way Tizen can compete with iOS and Android, or even Windows. ...
Actually, the Android "ecosystem" doesn't matter very much for most Android users, and there are no strong ties. Carriers would happily push Tizen phones on consumers who don't know what they are buying, just like they push Android now: it would just be, "and here's the latest phone from Samsung, the Galaxy S V," and there wouldn't even be a mention of the OS, except to say, "It's got the latest and greatest OS on it, and it comes with all the apps you will ever need."
What I find interesting is how earlier this week Tim Cook stressed that Apple was not a hardware company (he said it twice). I assumed that was basically saying we're not Samsung without using Samsung's name. I'm sure Samsung is thinking they're big enough now that they don't need to be dependent on Google. I'd love to see what happens if they say goodbye to Google since they have the biggest piece of Android market share.
Yes, boring and common. Humans have been arranging things in a grid for thousands of years.
Some choices just make sense, though.
Remember when Microsoft tried something different... a honeycomb grid in Windows Mobile 6.5? *shudder* It was hard to look at it, even though it gave more finger-tap space. I think it taught everyone to avoid unusual layouts
So what would make someone want to use Tizen over Android? What's the advantage?
That decision is said to have come in response to Google's decision last year to purchase Motorola Mobility, a move that brought Samsung into the uncomfortable position of depending on something from a company that now looks like a competitor.
A company called Open Mobile allows Android apps to run natively on other operating systems. Not in emulation, not in a sandbox, but with full hardware support. This will be interesting to watch in the coming year with not only Tizen, but Blackberry, the mobile Firefox OS and others.
To me the most interesting competing mobile OS out there is the one by Ubuntu. It has very little traction at the moment but the ability to run all the hundreds of thousands of Android apps along with a decent handset might make it appealing. I could see a company like HTC or Sony Ericsson making an Ubuntu phone along with Android compatibility from Open Mobile. That might be their only hope to gain back any market share from Samsung and get noticed again.
Go to about 7:00 in the video to see the Ubuntu phone OS. This guy also reminds me a bit of Steve Jobs in terms of enthusiasm and speaking ability.
What I find interesting is how earlier this week Tim Cook stressed that Apple was not a hardware company (he said it twice). I assumed that was basically saying we're not Samsung without using Samsung's name. I'm sure Samsung is thinking they're big enough now that they don't need to be dependent on Google. I'd love to see what happens if they say goodbye to Google since they have the biggest piece of Android market share.
As long as Google is the default search engine I'm not sure it would matter all that much financially. Difficult to say.
Yeah, it's the ONE THING Android lovers never say on these forums: "...because Google needs competition."
Google HAS competition. It's Microsoft. That's the reason Google made Android (and Chrome) a priority in the first place. So far Google's holding their own I think.
Comments
Tizen... Good Lord!...
I'm not sure any news about Titzen will counteract the news that Jim Balsillie has sold every single share of his Blackberry nee RiM stock.
I prefer tits out.
It's certainly a great idea. It's too bad that HP, Dell, et al. didn't invest and develop back up plans when they got in bed with Windows. Now they are struggling to play catchup from disadvantageous positions.
I understand Samsung investing in Titzen — Apple invested in two teams for a mobile OS, one built on PixoOS and one on OSX, the difference being that Samsung is actively using both of theirs — but I think forking Android and taking all their Samsung customers with them is more likely in the long run. This would not mean that Android apps wouldn't work on Samsung's forked Android — even Blackberry expects to run Android apps on BB OS — but they could do more and do it faster, including even offering a curated and safe app store much like Apple that I think would help them market to users that aren't sure which Android phone to buy.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Relic
The Meego's app store was called AppsUp so does that mean Titzen's store will be called TitzUp.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rot'nApple
Tarzan... Lord of the Jungle!
Tizen... Good Lord!...
Don't quit your day jobs to become stand-up comics, guys.
From what I understand, Tizen can run Android apps. If it manages to run all or nearly all of native Android apps as fast and without majors bugs or crashes, it might have a chance to do well. I am also curious how the Amazon app market and their flavor of Android impacts Google's profits as well if any. Their tablets are out selling other native Android tablets.
I don't know a lot about Tizen other than it has some history with Meego from Intel. Hard to judge an OS based on just youtube videos showing demos. But Samsung is smart to have a plan B in place in case Google starts showing special preferential treatment to Motorola which they probably should do since it is not like they owe Samsung, HTC, or any other company anything since they give it away for free. I think Google should throw Motorola a bone or two since it is a Google subsidiary after all.
Party like it's 2008.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SockRolid
"Melding" software and hardware is just the tip of the iceberg. You'll need a cross-device ecosystem plus a robust, pervasive, international infrastructure. You know, like the iOS + OS X ecosystem and the iTunes + iCloud infrastructure. An ecosystem and infrastructure more or less like the ones Apple started working on before the first iPod was released in 2001.
iTunes came first. Your infrastructure will also need to come first, otherwise your devices will be attempting to fly in a vacuum.
Oops. Good luck with that, Samsung.
Totally agree. In fact, I suspect that , although it could seem provocative, Samsung has no long term product & services strategy. Only Apple really cares about long term customer relationship, all competitors just take customer money, and run away. The order of magnitude in between Samsung products portfolio (even limited to Consumer electronics) on one hand, and Apple products, on the other hand, also shows how much Apple is a focused company. Because it is possible with such a small number, Apple product strategies (and interrelationship) can be carefully thought out. In the other case, each product line lives its own uncoordinated life.
You ever think about stand-up comedy works?
A comedian will a write a series or jokes or anecdotes then practice them on his own or perhaps in front of friends and family. This is alpha testing and isn't too reliable for several reasons I won't get into but it can help weed out ones that may be too confusing for a general audience to get.
The next step is beta testing the material. This is done with a time window. You not only test your material but your execution which includes timing and delivery. You then review your performance either from the 1st person PoV, audio or video. You see what jokes works and why.
You then repeat this beta test many times swapping the material, changing the order, altering when and how the material is delivered. This is a slow and arduous process to 1) perfect your personality as a comedian, and 2) get the right material and deliver it in the right way for a more major event, like a special on Comedy Central or selling out a theater.
It's not easy and every comedian has failed experiences so I don't get why anyone trying to be entertaining needs to be haggled, especially here where you pay no cover and have no minimum drink order to attend.
Comedy is inherently difficult. If the a joke is too obvious it's not funny except perhaps to children or other immature individuals, which is why adults tend not to like jokes kids think are hysterical. If it's too specialized, like a joke that would require a knowledge of astrophysics, then it's not funny because it's not understood, which is why kids tend to get jokes adults think are hysterical.
It's not just about appealing to a specific audience but about the culture it's delivered to. Musicians can travel all around the world and perform to sold out shows but comedians have a much harder time as language and culture can be difficult barrier to overcome.
Along with the cultural issue is the age of the joke. A joke about Kony that Jon Stewart, Stephen Colbert or Bill Maher made a year ago may have been laugh-out-loud funny then but not today. Are you really that much different of a person or does media-based humour simply have a short lifespan?
Finally, there are jokes that are not related to the news but have still expired. Ever see an old man make a joke that you are certain he heard on The Ed Sullivan Show or something like that? You recognize it as a joke as it has the constituent components and you can see how 50 years ago it may have been clever and funny, but today it's simply not. That's the sad reality of comedy. I've tried to sit through the best comedians from the 70's, 80's or 90's. It can be rough. George Carlin talks about human nature a lot so his jokes have held up very well but you'll still a comparison thrown in that would never get used today.
PPS: Comedy Central's The Burn with Jeff Ross is an excellent display of comedic prowess. Ross looks like someone who wouldn't be allowed within 500 feet of a school or playground but he's a nice guy.
What does OHA mean? The other thing that people don't talk about is that most Android phones being sold are STILL old gingerbread phones, which is why about 50% of the Android market is still stuck with 2.x.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slurpy
I hope to God Samsung does this. It would **** over Android so, so badly.
This could get really interesting. Most iHaters are Fandroids who love Samsung only because it runs Android. They have shifted loyalties as other hardware device makers rose and fell; see Motorola, HTC, etc. Samsung became their most recent shining knight when it rose up to challenge Apple but it's really all about Android. If Samsung forks Android or goes with Tizen what will these people do? Who will they pin their hopes on for Apple's destruction?
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacBook Pro
Samsung may very well be able to oust Google Android from Samsung products. The problem for Samsung is that Google Android has an well known and accepted ecosystem whereas Samsung does not.
Software and Services:
Gmail
Google+
Google Hangouts
Google Maps
Google Now
Google Play
Google Wallet
Hardware:
Google TV
Nexus Q
Here are some images of Tizen.
Notably, Samsung Software and Services are highly disappointing as well:
Music Hub
S Beam
S Cloud
S Voice
Google may make it where they support Nexus on their own hardware and not support the OEM versions as well moving forward. Google is just immature as far as knowing how to market an OS with a good roadmap for releasing the OS updates and having these updates readily available on all Android devices. It's just becoming more and more of a mess. Tizen sounds like another attempt at having their own platform that won't get much support.
If Sammy has to use Tizen at some point and quit Android due to Goog/Moto...well, I'd be nervous if I were an investor. This will put Sammy virtually in a future tie with MSFT, BB and other bottom feeders. Because if I'm looking at this from just an average consumer's POV, if I'm pretty used to Android, I'm not likely to go to a Tizen phone, I'll just find another Android handset maker.
To put it bluntly, I can buy another cheap plastic phone from any handset maker, most people aren't buying Samsung for the build quality, they're buying because of Android/Advertising/Who knows.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan
Apps in a grid pattern how original.
Yes, boring and common. Humans have been arranging things in a grid for thousands of years.
Some choices just make sense, though.
Remember when Microsoft tried something different... a honeycomb grid in Windows Mobile 6.5? *shudder* It was hard to look at it, even though it gave more finger-tap space. I think it taught everyone to avoid unusual layouts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alfiejr
... sure, Samsung can do well with Tizen on its cheap low end "smartphones" that are really just replacing "feature phones," especially throughout the Developing Second/Third World where Samsung is very strong (replacing Nokia).
but where is the Tizen ecosystem? there ain't any. and without an ecosystem there is no way Tizen can compete with iOS and Android, or even Windows. ...
Actually, the Android "ecosystem" doesn't matter very much for most Android users, and there are no strong ties. Carriers would happily push Tizen phones on consumers who don't know what they are buying, just like they push Android now: it would just be, "and here's the latest phone from Samsung, the Galaxy S V," and there wouldn't even be a mention of the OS, except to say, "It's got the latest and greatest OS on it, and it comes with all the apps you will ever need."
What I find interesting is how earlier this week Tim Cook stressed that Apple was not a hardware company (he said it twice). I assumed that was basically saying we're not Samsung without using Samsung's name. I'm sure Samsung is thinking they're big enough now that they don't need to be dependent on Google. I'd love to see what happens if they say goodbye to Google since they have the biggest piece of Android market share.
Quote:
Originally Posted by KDarling
Yes, boring and common. Humans have been arranging things in a grid for thousands of years.
Some choices just make sense, though.
Remember when Microsoft tried something different... a honeycomb grid in Windows Mobile 6.5? *shudder* It was hard to look at it, even though it gave more finger-tap space. I think it taught everyone to avoid unusual layouts
So what would make someone want to use Tizen over Android? What's the advantage?
Quote:
That decision is said to have come in response to Google's decision last year to purchase Motorola Mobility, a move that brought Samsung into the uncomfortable position of depending on something from a company that now looks like a competitor.
What goes around...
A company called Open Mobile allows Android apps to run natively on other operating systems. Not in emulation, not in a sandbox, but with full hardware support. This will be interesting to watch in the coming year with not only Tizen, but Blackberry, the mobile Firefox OS and others.
To me the most interesting competing mobile OS out there is the one by Ubuntu. It has very little traction at the moment but the ability to run all the hundreds of thousands of Android apps along with a decent handset might make it appealing. I could see a company like HTC or Sony Ericsson making an Ubuntu phone along with Android compatibility from Open Mobile. That might be their only hope to gain back any market share from Samsung and get noticed again.
Go to about 7:00 in the video to see the Ubuntu phone OS. This guy also reminds me a bit of Steve Jobs in terms of enthusiasm and speaking ability.
Yeah, it's the ONE THING Android lovers never say on these forums: "...because Google needs competition."
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan
What I find interesting is how earlier this week Tim Cook stressed that Apple was not a hardware company (he said it twice). I assumed that was basically saying we're not Samsung without using Samsung's name. I'm sure Samsung is thinking they're big enough now that they don't need to be dependent on Google. I'd love to see what happens if they say goodbye to Google since they have the biggest piece of Android market share.
As long as Google is the default search engine I'm not sure it would matter all that much financially. Difficult to say.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Suddenly Newton
Yeah, it's the ONE THING Android lovers never say on these forums: "...because Google needs competition."
Google HAS competition. It's Microsoft. That's the reason Google made Android (and Chrome) a priority in the first place. So far Google's holding their own I think.