you are forgetting that Apple fans = 90% of the worlds population. Those with enough money will buy it because despite being expensive, is a much better product on every single rational metric.
A commanding lead in profit share is getting Apple shareholders nothing in return. The only thing that matters to Wall Street is outright sales even if margins are slim. That's how Wall Street determines which company is winning. Who sold the most product? Why did Apple's share price collapse 40%? You think it was from a loss of overall profits. No. It was because iPhone profit margins dropped and Apple didn't sell as many iPhones as Wall Street expected. Everyone that matters believes it was because people stopped buying iPhones in order to buy Samsung Galaxy S IIIs.
Apple's market share losses will only get worse in 2013 as Samsung covers every price point possible to make Apple look bad. That's all Wall Street will notice and that's what the news media will make perfectly clear. They will announce Apple is still losing market share to Samsung and Android. That will make Apple's share price tank again as investors run for the hills and into the arms of Google. Samsung is going to flood the smartphone industry with their cheaper plastic, feature-rich smartphones. They can stamp them out like fudge cookies and Apple will fall way behind in production using their high-quality, machined metal case design. Apple will be made to look like a big loser again. Wall Street doesn't give a damn about quality products. Only high sales numbers count for share value.
Normally I don't drag apart a post - sorry about that.
So not being #1 in China is a problem? Does not compute
"a $499 price point would simply destroy any chance Apple has of breaking the Chinese market" What? You cannot possibly believe this statement to be true.
"Only the Apple fans and the rich folk" reads to me that these are two different groups of people, is all.
That $999 app is pathetic, and not the first time. I remember a $6999 app, some green diamond app that didn't do much, was sold 7 times. They pulled it, but I never read that the developer had to return the money - if he ever received it in the first place.
"Unfortunately share price isn't dictated by how a small few think, but by expectations of a company." THAT is such a true statement I'd put it in a sig if I were you; I couldn't agree more.
"A brand new phone for $499 vs a 6 month old phone for $649. Let's keep it realistic now..." Really doesn't seem to hurt. There are various reports that many buy in Hong Kong, for over $1000 just to get the iPhone. Not [I]en masse[/I], but supposedly it is big business nonetheless. However, I might have a total different view than most when it comes to price: I simply do not care. If I want the product I'll pay for it, and if it's out of my reach, I'll save for it.
That is exactly what has happened and what is going to happen....I also added in my comment that faith of iPhone is that of the Mac: being a niche product as number of software developers and titles will collapse...
Apple "sticking to quality" is childish and arrogant position that was made clear by the Street as unacceptable. Same will be response of wide customer base. No doubt about it. Cook and the guys are clearly stating they will build only the best. Soon or a later majority of customer base will say: "OK, let them.". As they did in PC world...
A commanding lead in profit share is getting Apple shareholders nothing in return. The only thing that matters to Wall Street is outright sales even if margins are slim. That's how Wall Street determines which company is winning. Who sold the most product? Why did Apple's share price collapse 40%? You think it was from a loss of overall profits. No. It was because iPhone profit margins dropped and Apple didn't sell as many iPhones as Wall Street expected. Everyone that matters believes it was because people stopped buying iPhones in order to buy Samsung Galaxy S IIIs.
Apple's market share losses will only get worse in 2013 as Samsung covers every price point possible to make Apple look bad. That's all Wall Street will notice and that's what the news media will make perfectly clear. They will announce Apple is still losing market share to Samsung and Android. That will make Apple's share price tank again as investors run for the hills and into the arms of Google. Samsung is going to flood the smartphone industry with their cheaper plastic, feature-rich smartphones. They can stamp them out like fudge cookies and Apple will fall way behind in production using their high-quality, machined metal case design. Apple will be made to look like a big loser again. Wall Street doesn't give a damn about quality products. Only high sales numbers count for share value.
That is exactly what has happened and what is going to happen....I also added in my comment that faith of iPhone is that of the Mac: being a niche product as number of software developers and titles will collapse...
Apple "sticking to quality" is childish and arrogant position that was made clear by the Street as unacceptable. Same will be response of wide customer base. No doubt about it. Cook and the guys are clearly stating they will build only the best. Soon or a later majority of customer base will say: "OK, let them.". As they did in PC world...
If the rumors about the new Galaxy S4 are true, and they decide to sell it at $499, then Apple will be in serious trouble in China. No one will pay $649 for an iPhone when they can get the S4 for $499. Only the Apple fans and the rich folk that don't care about spending money will spend the extra $150.
If the Galaxy S4 is announced at $499, take your money out of Apple stock ASAP! Atleast until just before the 5S gets announced.
Where will that leave the S III and the Note 2?
They both sell for well over $499.
The "smartphones" that make up the bulk of Samsung's sales are not their flagship phones.
One only has to look at Nokia's profit and loss statements to see what raw Chinese market share means.
iPhones will hold their own against the S4, the S4 will also be competing against Sony's Xperia Z and HTC's One, companies which have all but given up on the near worthless low to mid range market.
I think that Apple needs to do something. I feel like iPhones lately have just been iterative improvements - fantastic hardware and software to be sure, but nothing too exciting over the previous version, whereas Android and Windows Phone have been making leaps of improvements. With the Galaxy Nexus and Jelly Bean 4.2, I think that Android is finally in the same league as Apple - and Apple has gotten a bit complacent as it took five years for competitors to catch up.
So I'm hoping that this year or next year we see a big shift in Apple's iPhone strategy, to trying to push the envelope more and be a little bit more risky in successive iOS versions. I think we forget that the iPhone itself was a risky device when it was released, and it could very well have been dead on arrival - but had they not tried, Apple wouldn't be half the company it is today. They need more of that.
Given Apple takes a hit in the media and on Wall Street even on rumors relating to ridiculous trivia can you imagine if Apple were mainly manufactured in South Korea what AAPL would be doing on the news today from Dennis Rodman's BBF? So that begs the question ... is Wall Street dumping all things Scamsung related today?
A commanding lead in profit share is getting Apple shareholders nothing in return. .
This, like most of your posts, is pure nonsense.
Five years ago, AAPL was around 130. Today, it's around 430 - or a 200% increase. That's hardly 'nothing'. And that doesn't include the dividends the shareholders have received.
I doubt if any long term AAPL shareholders are unhappy with that result.
If the rumors about the new Galaxy S4 are true, and they decide to sell it at $499, then Apple will be in serious trouble in China. No one will pay $649 for an iPhone when they can get the S4 for $499. Only the Apple fans and the rich folk that don't care about spending money will spend the extra $150.
If the Galaxy S4 is announced at $499, take your money out of Apple stock ASAP! Atleast until just before the 5S gets announced.
That is a ridiculous info. Samsung will never sell S4 for 499, because they have no competition in that segment of whatsoever. If people want premium "normal size" phone, they are bound to look at iPhone first, if they want premium large screen phone they won't even think about iPhone. If you ask me, Samsung can sell S4 easily for 650, but they shouldn't drop the price below 599.
More bad news for Apple is the fact that Samsung is making "halo" effect with flagship phone and people are willing to buy their mid-range phone in mass as well...
Apple made crucial bad decisions in last year and they will pay dearly in this one. If AAPL climbs to 500 this year it will be a miracle. However, Samsung should watch their back in 2014, because the gloves are off and I am pretty much sure that Apple has a full sleeve. On the other hand, Samsung has absolutely nothing, except copying and updated specs. As always.
A commanding lead in profit share is getting Apple shareholders nothing in return. The only thing that matters to Wall Street is outright sales even if margins are slim. That's how Wall Street determines which company is winning. Who sold the most product? Why did Apple's share price collapse 40%? You think it was from a loss of overall profits. No. It was because iPhone profit margins dropped and Apple didn't sell as many iPhones as Wall Street expected. Everyone that matters believes it was because people stopped buying iPhones in order to buy Samsung Galaxy S IIIs.
That's interesting. I'm pretty sure the 5S and 4 outsold the SG3 in the last qtr. by the way, that last qtr had record sales of the iPhone. The only reason there wasn't more sold was supply was constrained. Keep drinking what you're drinking.
Comments
I know - irrelevant and dated argument.
Quote:Originally Posted by pedromartins
you are forgetting that Apple fans = 90% of the worlds population. Those with enough money will buy it because despite being expensive, is a much better product on every single rational metric.
According to Engadget, this is the new Galaxy S4. Wow, ugly. If its true and the phone is glossy plastic again I think people will be disappointed.
Apple's market share losses will only get worse in 2013 as Samsung covers every price point possible to make Apple look bad. That's all Wall Street will notice and that's what the news media will make perfectly clear. They will announce Apple is still losing market share to Samsung and Android. That will make Apple's share price tank again as investors run for the hills and into the arms of Google. Samsung is going to flood the smartphone industry with their cheaper plastic, feature-rich smartphones. They can stamp them out like fudge cookies and Apple will fall way behind in production using their high-quality, machined metal case design. Apple will be made to look like a big loser again. Wall Street doesn't give a damn about quality products. Only high sales numbers count for share value.
Normally I don't drag apart a post - sorry about that.
So not being #1 in China is a problem? Does not compute
"a $499 price point would simply destroy any chance Apple has of breaking the Chinese market" What? You cannot possibly believe this statement to be true.
"Only the Apple fans and the rich folk" reads to me that these are two different groups of people, is all.
That $999 app is pathetic, and not the first time. I remember a $6999 app, some green diamond app that didn't do much, was sold 7 times. They pulled it, but I never read that the developer had to return the money - if he ever received it in the first place.
"Unfortunately share price isn't dictated by how a small few think, but by expectations of a company." THAT is such a true statement I'd put it in a sig if I were you; I couldn't agree more.
"A brand new phone for $499 vs a 6 month old phone for $649. Let's keep it realistic now..." Really doesn't seem to hurt. There are various reports that many buy in Hong Kong, for over $1000 just to get the iPhone. Not [I]en masse[/I], but supposedly it is big business nonetheless. However, I might have a total different view than most when it comes to price: I simply do not care. If I want the product I'll pay for it, and if it's out of my reach, I'll save for it.
That is exactly what has happened and what is going to happen....I also added in my comment that faith of iPhone is that of the Mac: being a niche product as number of software developers and titles will collapse...
Apple "sticking to quality" is childish and arrogant position that was made clear by the Street as unacceptable. Same will be response of wide customer base. No doubt about it. Cook and the guys are clearly stating they will build only the best. Soon or a later majority of customer base will say: "OK, let them.". As they did in PC world...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Constable Odo
A commanding lead in profit share is getting Apple shareholders nothing in return. The only thing that matters to Wall Street is outright sales even if margins are slim. That's how Wall Street determines which company is winning. Who sold the most product? Why did Apple's share price collapse 40%? You think it was from a loss of overall profits. No. It was because iPhone profit margins dropped and Apple didn't sell as many iPhones as Wall Street expected. Everyone that matters believes it was because people stopped buying iPhones in order to buy Samsung Galaxy S IIIs.
Apple's market share losses will only get worse in 2013 as Samsung covers every price point possible to make Apple look bad. That's all Wall Street will notice and that's what the news media will make perfectly clear. They will announce Apple is still losing market share to Samsung and Android. That will make Apple's share price tank again as investors run for the hills and into the arms of Google. Samsung is going to flood the smartphone industry with their cheaper plastic, feature-rich smartphones. They can stamp them out like fudge cookies and Apple will fall way behind in production using their high-quality, machined metal case design. Apple will be made to look like a big loser again. Wall Street doesn't give a damn about quality products. Only high sales numbers count for share value.
That is exactly what has happened and what is going to happen....I also added in my comment that faith of iPhone is that of the Mac: being a niche product as number of software developers and titles will collapse...
Apple "sticking to quality" is childish and arrogant position that was made clear by the Street as unacceptable. Same will be response of wide customer base. No doubt about it. Cook and the guys are clearly stating they will build only the best. Soon or a later majority of customer base will say: "OK, let them.". As they did in PC world...
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrrodriguez
If the rumors about the new Galaxy S4 are true, and they decide to sell it at $499, then Apple will be in serious trouble in China. No one will pay $649 for an iPhone when they can get the S4 for $499. Only the Apple fans and the rich folk that don't care about spending money will spend the extra $150.
If the Galaxy S4 is announced at $499, take your money out of Apple stock ASAP! Atleast until just before the 5S gets announced.
Where will that leave the S III and the Note 2?
They both sell for well over $499.
The "smartphones" that make up the bulk of Samsung's sales are not their flagship phones.
One only has to look at Nokia's profit and loss statements to see what raw Chinese market share means.
iPhones will hold their own against the S4, the S4 will also be competing against Sony's Xperia Z and HTC's One, companies which have all but given up on the near worthless low to mid range market.
I think that Apple needs to do something. I feel like iPhones lately have just been iterative improvements - fantastic hardware and software to be sure, but nothing too exciting over the previous version, whereas Android and Windows Phone have been making leaps of improvements. With the Galaxy Nexus and Jelly Bean 4.2, I think that Android is finally in the same league as Apple - and Apple has gotten a bit complacent as it took five years for competitors to catch up.
So I'm hoping that this year or next year we see a big shift in Apple's iPhone strategy, to trying to push the envelope more and be a little bit more risky in successive iOS versions. I think we forget that the iPhone itself was a risky device when it was released, and it could very well have been dead on arrival - but had they not tried, Apple wouldn't be half the company it is today. They need more of that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by robogobo
What's Chinese for shipped does not equal sold?
Look at one of Apple's quarterly reports - they consider a product sold when it's shipped... http://investor.apple.com/
Is that when shipped to a end user or an Apple Store for stock? Apple charge my card when they ship thus it is sold.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrrodriguez
Must be sarcastic because no-one can be that deluded.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lerxt
iPhones are becoming much less popular in China, I see it every day. Apple needs to innovate fast...more screen sizes and more cool tech.
I thought it was because iPhones are too expensive. Now it's because they don't feature enough "cool tech" (whatever that means)?
This, like most of your posts, is pure nonsense.
Five years ago, AAPL was around 130. Today, it's around 430 - or a 200% increase. That's hardly 'nothing'. And that doesn't include the dividends the shareholders have received.
I doubt if any long term AAPL shareholders are unhappy with that result.
It does look pretty disgusting. Nevermind don't sell your shares...
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrrodriguez
It does look pretty disgusting. Nevermind don't sell your shares...
Cnet is guessing this is a dummy shell. But knowing Samsung I can't imagine the real thing will look much better.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrrodriguez
If the rumors about the new Galaxy S4 are true, and they decide to sell it at $499, then Apple will be in serious trouble in China. No one will pay $649 for an iPhone when they can get the S4 for $499. Only the Apple fans and the rich folk that don't care about spending money will spend the extra $150.
If the Galaxy S4 is announced at $499, take your money out of Apple stock ASAP! Atleast until just before the 5S gets announced.
That is a ridiculous info. Samsung will never sell S4 for 499, because they have no competition in that segment of whatsoever. If people want premium "normal size" phone, they are bound to look at iPhone first, if they want premium large screen phone they won't even think about iPhone. If you ask me, Samsung can sell S4 easily for 650, but they shouldn't drop the price below 599.
More bad news for Apple is the fact that Samsung is making "halo" effect with flagship phone and people are willing to buy their mid-range phone in mass as well...
Apple made crucial bad decisions in last year and they will pay dearly in this one. If AAPL climbs to 500 this year it will be a miracle. However, Samsung should watch their back in 2014, because the gloves are off and I am pretty much sure that Apple has a full sleeve. On the other hand, Samsung has absolutely nothing, except copying and updated specs. As always.
That's interesting. I'm pretty sure the 5S and 4 outsold the SG3 in the last qtr. by the way, that last qtr had record sales of the iPhone. The only reason there wasn't more sold was supply was constrained. Keep drinking what you're drinking.