Gruber and Dalrymple might not always get things right but when they question whether this was a good hire then it gives me pause. Hopefully it's not another Papermaster situation.
Dalrymple has one trick - he has someone at Apple telling him when to say Yes or Nope. Beyond that, he makes a living mocking anything non-Apple, without any real technical know-how.
Gruber is a deeper thinker and has software chops. So, his opinions are worth more, and he is clearly more successful as a blogger.
Regardless, both are jumping on Lynch for one reason - Flash. But he was working for Adobe at the time, what else was he going to do?
Hey, maybe YOU could tell us what exactly the problems were with the screen lamination on the iMacs, and the GF/2 film laminations on the iPad mini. Was it a matter of adding suppliers and lines? Inherehent difficulties in these processes? Yeilds? Supplies?
Surely you must know the details, since you're saying that the COO is completely responsible.
Someone at Apple is ultimately responsible even if the problem is in China. Why is that so difficult for you to understand?
Why is singling out any group for preferential treatment any less offensive than excluding a group?
Apple's senior positions are truly the pinnacle of the entire industry. Unfortunately, there are few (if any) women who have proven themselves at that level. The retail position would have been the most likely one, but they apparently didn't find any women they liked for that job.
I'd prefer for Apple to hire the best person for a job - regardless of age, sex, color, sexual preference, or any other extraneous factor.
When all other things are equal, a company like Apple should give serious consideration to hiring women and minorities. They seem to be the only major tech company with neither in their senior ranks right now. I don't for a second believe this is deliberate, but it is sticking out like a sore thumb.
Jobs hired (and fired?) Pagemaster. Give the guy a chance. Since he will not be the leader of any group, he has to conform to Apple culture. He didn't have final say on anything.
I mean Apple has made bone head hirings(Pagemaster) before...but for the most part Apple continues to do the smart thing. So they must have something in mind for this hiring...time will tell.
When one looks at the Executive Profiles for Apple, what jumps out is the absence of any women in senior roles. Remedying that omission should have been Tim Cook's priority for a new senior hire.
People shouldn't be hired based on gender. And this guy isn't senior enough to make the executive page.
You can't knock Shiller for his Flash history, because back then (in the hands of Macromedia) Flash was revolutionary.
Flash used to have a cool interface and free hand ability to draw. Adobe messed it up. Further, people have to start somewhere. If your employer supports something, you will support something.
When one looks at the Executive Profiles for Apple, what jumps out is the absence of any women in senior roles. Remedying that omission should have been Tim Cook's priority for a new senior hire.
NO.
Originally Posted by ankleskater
I don't for a second believe this is deliberate, but it is sticking out like a sore thumb.
When all other things are equal, a company like Apple should give serious consideration to hiring women and minorities. They seem to be the only major tech company with neither in their senior ranks right now. I don't for a second believe this is deliberate, but it is sticking out like a sore thumb.
Doing that wouldn't get Apple any brownie points. All people would say is its a token hire just for PR purposes.
Hey, maybe YOU could tell us what exactly the problems were with the screen lamination on the iMacs, and the GF/2 film laminations on the iPad mini. Was it a matter of adding suppliers and lines? Inherehent difficulties in these processes? Yeilds? Supplies?
Surely you must know the details, since you're saying that the COO is completely responsible.
Hey, I don't work there, but sure as heck can reasonably surmise -- based on all the news, the shortages and delays esp. in iMacs, and the severely negative stock price reaction -- that they've been having major supply chain issues. In most companies, it's the Ops guy/gal that's responsible.
If you want to be cute-sy about it, that's your wont.
My thoughts exactly. With his background (absent Flash involvement) I'd hope he is going to kick Apple's software division in the next decade. iWorks and iLife need to be taken to the next level, perhaps as consumer and pro versions.. I love Apple's own software, its intuitive ease of use and interoperability but there is much to be done. To name but one, iWEb into iWeb Pro (or WebPro) with kick ass HTML5 and something like Hype built in ... Then reabsorb Claris, sorry FileMaker, and make its product line into an affordable database element in iWorks with iCloud support built into all these products where appropriate.
I think that last point should be made louder. Apple should take back FileMaker into the fold and add database technology into iWorks / Works Pro X (select your own name).
Who's ultimately responsible for Apple's professional apps right now? Where did that responsibility go when Sina Tamaddon left?
Someone at Apple is ultimately responsible even if the problem is in China. Why is that so difficult for you to understand?
I will understand when someone, even a hothead like anant, shows me some causation.
Until then what I don't understand is why some people, who know absolutely nothing about any matter at all, whether it's some personnel thing or screen lamination in Taiwan, feel compelled to claim that Apple's going downhill fast in some area or other, or that Cook is incompetent, etc.
Jobs hired (and fired?) Pagemaster. Give the guy a chance. Since he will not be the leader of any group, he has to conform to Apple culture. He didn't havefinal say on anything.
Papermaster was hired and came to work at Apple when Cook was running things and Jobs was onmedical leave.
I don't for a second believe this is deliberate, but it is sticking out like a sore thumb.
Not in the slightest.
Obviously it's subjective (and these appointments should be, by no means, at the sacrifice of quality), but I too think it sticks out like a sore thumb. Look at this, for example: http://www.google.com/about/company/facts/management/
It looks a lot more like America, and these guys are no slouches.
Doing that wouldn't get Apple any brownie points. All people would say is its a token hire just for PR purposes.
It's not about getting brownie points or PR. It's about social responsibilities. When two candidates are equally qualified, hiring a woman or a minority does much to promote science and technology amongst youngsters. Minority hiring is hardly a rarity in technology circles. But Apple is one of the few prominent tech companies without one in their senior ranks, ever since the departure of Avie Tevanian. I don't recall a woman ever being in their inner circle. It is hard to fathom they couldn't find one good enough to promote or hire in all their history, when IBM, HP, Yahoo and Xerox all have women CEOs. I repeat, I don't think this is intentional exclusion. But it shows this is an area where they can be more socially aware.
And once you do that it necessarily changes the way you have to hire. You can no longer simply look at the products someone has produced (such as the Dixon's Stores or the Flash Player), you have to look at abstract resume bullet points and see whether they match the abstract role you are hiring for now. You have set yourself up for more of a lottery in the hiring process.
I like this structure better though because instead of someone protecting their product line (to the possible detriment of other product lines, see: Sinofsky and Windows) everything you do is for the betterment of the company overall.
With all due respect, how do you think women feel when they look at Apple as a place of employment? How many will not notice the glass ceiling? To say this is not in the slightest obvious is just misguided.
My thoughts exactly. With his background (absent Flash involvement) I'd hope he is going to kick Apple's software division in the next decade. iWorks and iLife need to be taken to the next level, perhaps as consumer and pro versions.. I love Apple's own software, its intuitive ease of use and interoperability but there is much to be done. To name but one, iWEb into iWeb Pro (or WebPro) with kick ass HTML5 and something like Hype built in ... Then reabsorb Claris, sorry FileMaker, and make its product line into an affordable database element in iWorks with iCloud support built into all these products where appropriate.
I think that last point should be made louder. Apple should take back FileMaker into the fold and add database technology into iWorks / Works Pro X (select your own name).
Comments
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan
Gruber and Dalrymple might not always get things right but when they question whether this was a good hire then it gives me pause. Hopefully it's not another Papermaster situation.
Dalrymple has one trick - he has someone at Apple telling him when to say Yes or Nope. Beyond that, he makes a living mocking anything non-Apple, without any real technical know-how.
Gruber is a deeper thinker and has software chops. So, his opinions are worth more, and he is clearly more successful as a blogger.
Regardless, both are jumping on Lynch for one reason - Flash. But he was working for Adobe at the time, what else was he going to do?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flaneur
Hey, maybe YOU could tell us what exactly the problems were with the screen lamination on the iMacs, and the GF/2 film laminations on the iPad mini. Was it a matter of adding suppliers and lines? Inherehent difficulties in these processes? Yeilds? Supplies?
Surely you must know the details, since you're saying that the COO is completely responsible.
Someone at Apple is ultimately responsible even if the problem is in China. Why is that so difficult for you to understand?
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta
Why is singling out any group for preferential treatment any less offensive than excluding a group?
Apple's senior positions are truly the pinnacle of the entire industry. Unfortunately, there are few (if any) women who have proven themselves at that level. The retail position would have been the most likely one, but they apparently didn't find any women they liked for that job.
I'd prefer for Apple to hire the best person for a job - regardless of age, sex, color, sexual preference, or any other extraneous factor.
When all other things are equal, a company like Apple should give serious consideration to hiring women and minorities. They seem to be the only major tech company with neither in their senior ranks right now. I don't for a second believe this is deliberate, but it is sticking out like a sore thumb.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chandra69
Bob Mensfeld is Hardware guy. Kevin is software architect. I dont know how do they fit.
I feel this guys is hired for creative suite.
Or a new product that requires both.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jungmark
Jobs hired (and fired?) Pagemaster. Give the guy a chance. Since he will not be the leader of any group, he has to conform to Apple culture. He didn't have final say on anything.
Papermaster
Quote:
Originally Posted by InfoDave
I'm with these guys.
yep....what he said....
I mean Apple has made bone head hirings(Pagemaster) before...but for the most part Apple continues to do the smart thing. So they must have something in mind for this hiring...time will tell.
Quote:
Originally Posted by professorsteve
When one looks at the Executive Profiles for Apple, what jumps out is the absence of any women in senior roles. Remedying that omission should have been Tim Cook's priority for a new senior hire.
People shouldn't be hired based on gender. And this guy isn't senior enough to make the executive page.
Quote:
Originally Posted by monstrosity
You can't knock Shiller for his Flash history, because back then (in the hands of Macromedia) Flash was revolutionary.
Flash used to have a cool interface and free hand ability to draw. Adobe messed it up. Further, people have to start somewhere. If your employer supports something, you will support something.
Originally Posted by professorsteve
When one looks at the Executive Profiles for Apple, what jumps out is the absence of any women in senior roles. Remedying that omission should have been Tim Cook's priority for a new senior hire.
NO.
Originally Posted by ankleskater
I don't for a second believe this is deliberate, but it is sticking out like a sore thumb.
Not in the slightest.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan
People shouldn't be hired based on gender. And this guy isn't senior enough to make the executive page.
I agree. Gender should rarely be a consideration when hiring. Hire the best people for the position you need to hire period.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ankleskater
When all other things are equal, a company like Apple should give serious consideration to hiring women and minorities. They seem to be the only major tech company with neither in their senior ranks right now. I don't for a second believe this is deliberate, but it is sticking out like a sore thumb.
Doing that wouldn't get Apple any brownie points. All people would say is its a token hire just for PR purposes.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flaneur
Hey, maybe YOU could tell us what exactly the problems were with the screen lamination on the iMacs, and the GF/2 film laminations on the iPad mini. Was it a matter of adding suppliers and lines? Inherehent difficulties in these processes? Yeilds? Supplies?
Surely you must know the details, since you're saying that the COO is completely responsible.
Hey, I don't work there, but sure as heck can reasonably surmise -- based on all the news, the shortages and delays esp. in iMacs, and the severely negative stock price reaction -- that they've been having major supply chain issues. In most companies, it's the Ops guy/gal that's responsible.
If you want to be cute-sy about it, that's your wont.
Quote:
Originally Posted by digitalclips
My thoughts exactly. With his background (absent Flash involvement) I'd hope he is going to kick Apple's software division in the next decade. iWorks and iLife need to be taken to the next level, perhaps as consumer and pro versions.. I love Apple's own software, its intuitive ease of use and interoperability but there is much to be done. To name but one, iWEb into iWeb Pro (or WebPro) with kick ass HTML5 and something like Hype built in ... Then reabsorb Claris, sorry FileMaker, and make its product line into an affordable database element in iWorks with iCloud support built into all these products where appropriate.
I think that last point should be made louder. Apple should take back FileMaker into the fold and add database technology into iWorks / Works Pro X (select your own name).
Who's ultimately responsible for Apple's professional apps right now? Where did that responsibility go when Sina Tamaddon left?
I will understand when someone, even a hothead like anant, shows me some causation.
Until then what I don't understand is why some people, who know absolutely nothing about any matter at all, whether it's some personnel thing or screen lamination in Taiwan, feel compelled to claim that Apple's going downhill fast in some area or other, or that Cook is incompetent, etc.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jungmark
Jobs hired (and fired?) Pagemaster. Give the guy a chance. Since he will not be the leader of any group, he has to conform to Apple culture. He didn't have final say on anything.
Papermaster was hired and came to work at Apple when Cook was running things and Jobs was on medical leave.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
Originally Posted by ankleskater
I don't for a second believe this is deliberate, but it is sticking out like a sore thumb.
Not in the slightest.
Obviously it's subjective (and these appointments should be, by no means, at the sacrifice of quality), but I too think it sticks out like a sore thumb. Look at this, for example: http://www.google.com/about/company/facts/management/
It looks a lot more like America, and these guys are no slouches.
The talent is obviously there.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan
Doing that wouldn't get Apple any brownie points. All people would say is its a token hire just for PR purposes.
It's not about getting brownie points or PR. It's about social responsibilities. When two candidates are equally qualified, hiring a woman or a minority does much to promote science and technology amongst youngsters. Minority hiring is hardly a rarity in technology circles. But Apple is one of the few prominent tech companies without one in their senior ranks, ever since the departure of Avie Tevanian. I don't recall a woman ever being in their inner circle. It is hard to fathom they couldn't find one good enough to promote or hire in all their history, when IBM, HP, Yahoo and Xerox all have women CEOs. I repeat, I don't think this is intentional exclusion. But it shows this is an area where they can be more socially aware.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ascii
And once you do that it necessarily changes the way you have to hire. You can no longer simply look at the products someone has produced (such as the Dixon's Stores or the Flash Player), you have to look at abstract resume bullet points and see whether they match the abstract role you are hiring for now. You have set yourself up for more of a lottery in the hiring process.
I like this structure better though because instead of someone protecting their product line (to the possible detriment of other product lines, see: Sinofsky and Windows) everything you do is for the betterment of the company overall.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
NO.
Not in the slightest.
With all due respect, how do you think women feel when they look at Apple as a place of employment? How many will not notice the glass ceiling? To say this is not in the slightest obvious is just misguided.
Quote:
Originally Posted by digitalclips
My thoughts exactly. With his background (absent Flash involvement) I'd hope he is going to kick Apple's software division in the next decade. iWorks and iLife need to be taken to the next level, perhaps as consumer and pro versions.. I love Apple's own software, its intuitive ease of use and interoperability but there is much to be done. To name but one, iWEb into iWeb Pro (or WebPro) with kick ass HTML5 and something like Hype built in ... Then reabsorb Claris, sorry FileMaker, and make its product line into an affordable database element in iWorks with iCloud support built into all these products where appropriate.
I think that last point should be made louder. Apple should take back FileMaker into the fold and add database technology into iWorks / Works Pro X (select your own name).
So far this post makes the most sense......