US DEA upset it can't break Apple's iMessage encryption



  • Reply 21 of 66
    websnapwebsnap Posts: 224member


    Originally Posted by charlituna View Post


    More like 10 if you are only looking for 'heard of'. 


    As for this issue, I'm sure with a proper federal warrant, Apple would comply and there is some way for them to access the data. 

    Read the Article, even with a warrant they couldn't.





    DEA officials first discovered that iMessages could be a hinderance to their efforts when a real-time electronic surveillance under the Federal Wiretap Act failed to yield all of a target's text messages

  • Reply 22 of 66
    solipsismxsolipsismx Posts: 19,566member
    Finally, the truth comes out! :wow: :lol:

    "Say hello to my little friend" couldn't be more accurate.

  • Reply 23 of 66

    This is the part from the original article that I found most interesting. Not that Apple IS encrypting, but why isn't everyone else?





    Christopher Soghoian, a senior policy analyst at the American Civil Liberties Union, said yesterday that "Apple's service is not designed to be government-proof."

    "It's much much more difficult to intercept than a telephone call or a text message" that federal agents are used to, Soghoian says. "The government would need to perform an active man-in-the-middle attack... The real issue is why the phone companies in 2013 are still delivering an unencrypted audio and text service to users. It's disgraceful."

  • Reply 24 of 66
    The real message here is: DEA want you bad guys out there to use iPhones because we have the ability to trace your location with your iMessages because we have decrypted both now.
  • Reply 25 of 66
    rot'napplerot'napple Posts: 1,839member

    You'd think that Dept. of Justice not breaking iMessage would be a plus to all the fraud and abuse that is done by governmental agencies buying iPhones.  Now it will be harder to shine the light of truth on the corruption that is well known in Washington!


    On a side note, the EPA just ordered a million iPhones... take that BlackBerry! imageimage




  • Reply 26 of 66
    kdarlingkdarling Posts: 1,640member

    Hmm.  "Cannot be intercepted", but there seems to be some wiggle room in that statement.


    For example, are the messages available from Apple's store-and-forward servers upon request?


    I usually don't look for conspiracies, but this whole thing seems too public, and the explanation lists specific cases instead of making a blanket statement.

  • Reply 27 of 66
    dmarcootdmarcoot Posts: 191member
    rickag wrote: »
    Woohoo, security by obscurity.

    You clearly don't know what that means.

    256 AES encryption is the NSA standard, and Apple is applying it to 2 billion texts a day across over 200 million iOS devices, including the top selling phones in United States. If there was ever an example of the inverse of security they obscurity, this would be it.
  • Reply 28 of 66

    All communications should be encrypted -- it is the only way to preserve liberty.  

  • Reply 29 of 66
    rickagrickag Posts: 1,626member
    Man I have to admit ther are many posters here that wouldn't recognize sarcasm if hit them on their head.
  • Reply 30 of 66
    Love it. Yeah, go ahead and use it, we can't crack it, go ahead, it's totally safe. (wink wink)
  • Reply 31 of 66
    gazoobeegazoobee Posts: 3,754member


    Originally Posted by RedRaider2011 View Post

    Apple isn't a telecom company, they are a technology company so the same rules don't apply to them. I'm sure that is about to change though.




    The line in the sand that shouldn't have been crossed is when the US Government started intercepting all your emails and phone calls directly at the carriers and recording/searching them.  When no one said anything about this and not one of you freedom loving yanks decided to fight it, it was a given that it would spread.  


    That's how fascism works.  You have to fight it when someone takes away your liberty even in a technical sense, because if you don't, then the government just takes away more and more and more ...


    If Apple's servers haven't already been compromised, it's only a matter of time until Uncle Sam sets up one of those little "monitoring rooms" they have at each carrier, in every iCloud facility as well because despite all the talk, Americans don't actually seem to care about personal liberty and freedom anymore. 


    I mean 911 wasn't even that long ago and already the only section of the US constitution that hasn't been abrogated is the one that says you can buy assault weapons in the parking lot at WalMart.  image

  • Reply 32 of 66
    sessamoidsessamoid Posts: 182member

    The way I understand it, even with MIM attacks, iMessages are not decipherable, at least not easily. The FBI/NSA/CIA can put whatever stations they want in-between,but the messages are secure END TO END. The memo noted that they only have some success reading the texts when one of the parties is not on iMessage.

  • Reply 33 of 66


    Originally Posted by Gazoobee View Post

    Sounds good to me. F*ck Big Brother, the DEA, the American Government and all those other peepers that infringe upon our freedom.

    Fascism is still a bad thing AFAIK.

    How dare we have an agency that tries to keep drugs out of the US and the hands of children. Not sure how the DEA would infringe upon your freedom unless for some reason you take drugs that are illegal.


    Also not sure why my userid is on your banned list. I have never been banned from this site. Two uneducated comments.

  • Reply 34 of 66
    banchobancho Posts: 1,517member


    Originally Posted by rickag View Post

    Man I have to admit ther are many posters here that wouldn't recognize sarcasm if hit them on their head.


  • Reply 35 of 66
    apple ][apple ][ Posts: 9,233member

    Good! Prohibition is immoral and a huge waste of money and resources. It is idiocy and it's only a matter of time before it's gone, though that might still be years away. The people at the DEA have one of the most useless jobs ever, most of them should be fired.


    Hopefully people are using iMessage to make a lot of drug deals.

  • Reply 36 of 66
    apple ][apple ][ Posts: 9,233member


    Originally Posted by extremeskater View Post

    Not sure how the DEA would infringe upon your freedom unless for some reason you take drugs that are illegal.


    I enjoy smoking weed sometimes. 


    I tend to stay away from dangerous legal drugs, such as alcohol and prescription drugs, which are real killers, so only illegal stuff for me! image

  • Reply 37 of 66


    Originally Posted by Apple ][ View Post


    I enjoy smoking weed sometimes. 


    I tend to stay away from dangerous legal drugs, such as alcohol and prescription drugs, which are real killers, so only illegal stuff for me! image


  • Reply 38 of 66
    carthusiacarthusia Posts: 583member


    Originally Posted by genovelle View Post

    I don't think it will matter.  Most drug dealers want giant phones to match their 24 inch rims on their giant SUV. Their girlfriends need them to match the giant hoop earrings.

    Right, because that what drug dealers look like. Sheesh!

  • Reply 39 of 66

    More info from PCMag Security Watch:


    According to the ACLU's Principal Technologist Christopher Soghoian, Ph.D., the real issue lies in the Communications Assistance for Law Enforcement Act or CALEA which was passed in 1994.

    Soghoian told SecurityWatch this law, "mandated that industries build in intercept capabilities to their networks." These industries included phone and broadband companies, but not companies like Apple. iMessage is also different from normal text messaging because it both encrypts the message and sends it peer-to-peer between iPhones, without touching a carrier's network...

    Another critical aspect of CALEA deals with encrypted messaging, mainly that it is exempt from all wireless surveillance. Soghoian explained that communications, "encrypted with a key not known to the company […] cannot be intercepted." So in a situation where the decryption keys are handled on the device, and not by whomever is delivering the messages, then law enforcement must ignore the message entirely...

    But just because iMessages aren't immediately available for intercept doesn’t provide complete protection. "With the right kind of system," said Soghoian. "Apple messages could be intercepted." At issue is that Apple provides no indication to the parties in an iMessage chat that a new device has been introduced.

  • Reply 40 of 66
    apple ][apple ][ Posts: 9,233member


    Originally Posted by mtkoren View Post


    Fortunately for me, marijuana is decriminalized where I live, so it's the equivalent of a traffic violation. image

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