Adobe goes subscription-only, rebrands Creative Suite as Creative Cloud

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Comments

  • Reply 141 of 180
    bergermeisterbergermeister Posts: 6,784member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post


     


    If they're too lazy or stupid to do the research about the product, that's their problem.


     


    Why do I see "to Blu-ray" conversions all through FCS 2, then?



     


     


     


    Let's say you are creating a collection of 30 short videos you want independent access to from menus on several different menu pages, and it needs to be on BR.  You need something better than what Apple provides.


     


     


    FCS can save to BR with very simple menus.  If you want a finished-looking product with multiple menus of your own design, you are out of luck.  In short, if you have a long movie and want to plop it in to BR, you're OK.


     


    Toast can burn BR, but again with very limited menus.


     


    Encore is pretty much the only way to go.  


     


    A little bit of quick research turns up this:


    https://discussions.apple.com/thread/3632863?start=0&tstart=0


     


    Maybe Toast will jump in here to fill a gap.  

  • Reply 142 of 180
    v5vv5v Posts: 1,357member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by chris v View Post



    Goodbye 100% of their casual home users, hobbyists & self-employed freelancers.\


     


    Elements. Much more feature-rich than I would have expected. A steal at $100.


     


     


    Quote:

    Originally Posted by studiomusic View Post


    Sad too. They were on the cusp of running Avid out of town and winning the race in the video field since Apple screwed the intro to FCPX...



     


    Premiere certainly got a boost from the FCPX debacle, but "running Avid out of town?" I think we're talking about two different tiers of users there.


     


     


    Quote:

    Originally Posted by dysamoria View Post



    i do NOT do subscription ANYTHING.


     


    So, no telephone, internet or cable?


     


     


    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Big Brother 84 View Post


    Until now Adobe needed to make improvements to each CS to encourage users to upgrade. Once we're all under subscription, and with little competition, there will be no real incentive for them to improve the products.



     


    I'm wondering about that too now. I'm already over a year into the subscription model because I didn't want to shell out the long coin for an update to Master, but I didn't expect it to become the only choice. You're right -- doing this really lifts the pedal on Adobe having to develop new hooks. Unless new players emerge, but I'm not holding my breath...


     


     


    Quote:

    Originally Posted by the cool gut View Post


    Don't forget Pages - already in striking distance for 90% of the population.



     


    90% of the population isn't doing stuff that will ever see a press. They're doing a flyer that goes from inkjet to light pole.


     


     


    Quote:

    Originally Posted by the cool gut View Post


    The person who designs graphics for paper bags is not using CS6.



     


    Wanna bet? You don't even have to take my word for it. Pop in to the bag printing shop and ask them.


     


    I think you may be surprised to discover how much ink is still being applied by presses these days, and how ubiquitous Adobe products are in the process.


     


    That's just print. Wanna talk about video?

  • Reply 143 of 180
    aderutteraderutter Posts: 604member
    To be honest, the cloud solution is good for smaller businesses and freelancers who don't want to shell out a few grand in one go. As long as they can rent the software they need for the projects they have on this month and then stop or change what they are renting as the business needs change all is great. e.g. a designer might need AE for one project a year, not worth buying AE stand-alone, but now they can use the software as and when and build the software cost into the project budget. Mind you, I still use CS3 quite a bit ;) I'd still prefer it if Apple bought Adobe and stopped it selling windows versions though lol
  • Reply 144 of 180


    No, small users like freelancers, photographers and home users haven't had to spend $1500 to $2000 a year to upgrade, rarely even to purchase initially. I've upgraded almost every version of Adobe software for years while paying significantly less than the $600/year Adobe now demands. And in a very lean (disability) period, I was able to continue with nearly then-current versions while skipping one or even two. That will no longer ever be possible if this lasts, as once CS6 becomes outdated, due to hardware or system compatibility issues, continued work with Adobe will become impossible. Or for anyone adopting the cloud versions but needing to step away for any period longer than six months, most work with will also become impossible in such a situation, as previous versions virtually never open work created with newer software, so you can't go backwards. This will put some small freelancers out of business, at least with Adobe products.

  • Reply 145 of 180
    evokenevoken Posts: 56member
    I knew they were going to go this way eventually. Ever since Adobe bought Macromedia they have just become more and more greedy. This reeks of fail imo.
  • Reply 146 of 180
    suddenly newtonsuddenly newton Posts: 13,819member
    don't get me started... WORST.  PHONE.  SUPPORT. EVER!!!!

    Seriously, each call I made took at least an hour and was entirely unsatisfactory.  Each time, and I believe there were three, I had an Indian man who was reading from a script and didn't seem to understand my question.  It was extremely frustrating!!!

    This is why Apple runs a call center out of Austin, TX.
  • Reply 147 of 180
    suddenly newtonsuddenly newton Posts: 13,819member
    john.b wrote: »
    Adobe Credit Card.  Truth in advertising.  :lol:

    Hmmm... interesting. People like credit.
  • Reply 148 of 180
    kedakeda Posts: 722member


    After thinking about this a bit, I have two thoughts:


     


    1. This move is generally bad for consumers.  


     


    2. Adobe will be successful, because we will all be forced to adopt CC.


     


    Adobe has not offered me a compelling, feature-based reason to upgrade their software in a while.  I moved to CS5, in 2010, because CS3 stopped working on OSX.  Since then, I have not felt any need to move to CS6.  Adobe likely sees people like me as an opportunity cost, and has shifted their model to force obsolescence upon users.


     


    I can complain all I want, but the reality is that Adobe has a monopoly on the space in which I work.  Without Photoshop, Acrobat, and Illustrator, I'd be unable to work with my clients and contractors.  There are simply no viable alternatives.


     


    In the end, I will be forced to upgrade to CC.

  • Reply 149 of 180

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by mstone View Post


    I doubt Adobe would be announcing this if their initial beta, trial and upgrade process wasn't a huge success already. They have probably cut the piracy rate considerably with this model. Usually the folks who complain the loudest about the high price of Adobe products are the one using pirated copies. They wish they could afford it but they are not professionals so they cannot. That leaves them with three choices: live on Ramen noodles for the rest of their life, steal the software, or use some less capable alternative. With the subscription only model, option 2 has been eliminated.





    Don't be so naive. 



    First, Creative Cloud hasn't existed long enough to get a true picture of how many people truly prefer it over perpetual licenses - the majority of people/companies typically skip 1 to 2 versions between upgrades.



    Second, the move comes in more difficult economic times where a lower up-front expense can be an acceptable, if not necessary, tradeoff for a long-term increase in cost - if you're like the majority who skipped 1 to 2 versions between upgrades, the subscription model costs MORE money today, and will cost even more when Adobe inevitably increases rates once everyone is fully locked in to the subscription model.



    Third, pirates will circumvent the subscription activation check just as easily as they did the one-time, on-install activation.  And no, to your contention, I'm not using a pirated copy, I'm actually a very satisfied owner of the full CS6 Master Collection.

  • Reply 150 of 180
    ptramptram Posts: 58member


    I must keep care of my CS6 package, since it will have to last for decades...

  • Reply 151 of 180
    ptramptram Posts: 58member


    Uhm... are you saying that graphic professionals still using, say, CS2 are totally lost? They are no longer able to do their work?

  • Reply 152 of 180
    frank777frank777 Posts: 5,839member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Keda View Post


    After thinking about this a bit, I have two thoughts:


     


    1. This move is generally bad for consumers.  


     


    2. Adobe will be successful, because we will all be forced to adopt CC.


     


    Adobe has not offered me a compelling, feature-based reason to upgrade their software in a while.  I moved to CS5, in 2010, because CS3 stopped working on OSX.  Since then, I have not felt any need to move to CS6.  Adobe likely sees people like me as an opportunity cost, and has shifted their model to force obsolescence upon users.


     


    I can complain all I want, but the reality is that Adobe has a monopoly on the space in which I work.  Without Photoshop, Acrobat, and Illustrator, I'd be unable to work with my clients and contractors.  There are simply no viable alternatives.


     


    In the end, I will be forced to upgrade to CC.



     


    Probably true that you will, but beyond high-level creatives Adobe will have a problem.


     


    Pixelmator and Lineform meet the general needs of the average creative. iStudio Publisher isn't even close to matching InDesign, but if Quark did something game-changing, like lowering prices to $399. or launching a cheaper basic version on the App Store, it might help them regain marketshare.


     


    Alternatives do exist, but yes, Photoshop pros are at the mercy of Adobe and will bend to their will.

  • Reply 153 of 180
    frank777frank777 Posts: 5,839member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by the cool gut View Post


     


    Print is dead.  It's over.  I'm sorry you haven't realized this, but newspapers all over the globe are in big trouble trying to move to a subscription model.



     


    Daily newspapers have been slapped around by the internet and savaged by Craigslist. That does not mean that all print is dead.

  • Reply 154 of 180
    edward oedward o Posts: 2member
    Just say no.
  • Reply 155 of 180
    edward oedward o Posts: 2member
    Just say no.
  • Reply 156 of 180
    tribalogicaltribalogical Posts: 1,182member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by mstone View Post


    That is the model that super high end software has been using for awhile. Creative Cloud is now on the same licensing model as other high end professional solutions. I think the difference is that many pro-sumer type users were also using some of their titles. Clearly they are changing that relationship by targeting high end professionals only. I can't imagine that they haven't considered the implications of such a move and apparently this is the direction they want to go. If you don't like it, you need to find other alternatives. For us it is a no brainer decision. We use Adobe CS->CC and we could not operate the business without it.


     


    There is no competition in the market but that is not Adobe's fault and all the pros have standardized on CS so what are you going to do? Pass the additional cost on to your customers.



     


    Excuse me? First of all, we're talking about 'mainstream' design-related software. Not "super high end" software…  Which "professional solutions" are you talking about that this subscription model emulates? $40,000 'suites' used in the music and film industries or something? That isn't Adobe's primary marketplace for Creative Suite. 


     


    "There is no competition in the market but that is not Adobe's fault…"  Really? Buying out then shutting down their main competition (Macromedia) isn't Adobe's "fault"?


     


    It isn't their fault that they're now behaving like a company with a monopoly position…? 


     


    When you say "for us", do tell… who or what kind of company do you work for? Because for "the rest of us" (on this forum apparently) this is clearly NOT a working model.

  • Reply 157 of 180
    tribalogicaltribalogical Posts: 1,182member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Marvin View Post





    Wouldn't you also lose the ability to eat, pay your rent, pay for internet etc? I don't see how knowing you will pay $50/month is worse than coming across a situation where Adobe issues an update and you require the update and unexpectedly have a $600 or higher expense in one month. Would it really be that difficult to keep aside $200 to cover you for 4 months?


     


    I said "tight", not "completely broke". I was spelling out a scenario where compromises and financial difficulties could arise. It's common in the creative community. What are you suggesting? Lose the rent or food but for god's sake just keep that subscription alive?


     


    Adobe has released multiple updates without me being FORCED to upgrade on the spot (your mistaken supposition that them releasing an upgrade means I'd suddenly have a $600 bill to pay). In my experience, there has never been a paid update that required an immediate update and expense.


     


    Have you ever worked as a freelance designer? I can almost guarantee times when "keeping $400 aside" would be exceedingly difficult. You save up to buy the software, plan and budget for upgrades, and do them when you can… subscriptions are for companies and corporate budgets. I doubt this is a model that will work in the freelance market (without causing hardship at the least).

  • Reply 158 of 180
    tribalogicaltribalogical Posts: 1,182member

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by mstone View Post


    The mail carriers are duty bound to deliver junk mail so your sign does nothing. So your sign is relevant, they ignore it.


    You don't receive business cards because you are not in business, The rest of us professionals use business cards.


     


    Bus stop graphics are not digital in my area and even when they change to digital they will be produced by Adobe software.


     


    You are just clueless about professional graphics. I am a member of all the trade associations for print, web and trade show graphics and you are not.



     


     


    aren't you special? so who do you work for, mstone?

  • Reply 159 of 180
    macarenamacarena Posts: 365member


    The old pricing models, where people paid hundreds or even thousands of dollars for highly bloated software are on their way out. Earlier you had no choice but to buy software even if you needed just 20-30% of the functionality.


     


    Today, with the AppStore model, there are thousands of options out there, that offer high quality software for free or for a dollar. With this sort of competition, the old companies. like MS and Adobe, look to compete by moving to subscription models. Of course, they cannot migrate to the really cheap models because their revenues would drop dramatically.


     


    The only thing that is still helping these companies is that their data and file formats are proprietary. As we see open source solutions get better at handling these proprietary file formats, the market power of these companies is going to erode dramatically.


     


    I think Microsoft is literally at the edge of the crater with its pricing models, and it has the most to lose with the competition from good enough software for $1, or free open source software. I expect that within a year or two, MS will be seeing revenues shrink dramatically, probably at 15-20% per year, and accelerated fall from there on. Same with Adobe, and other pricey software.

  • Reply 160 of 180
    MarvinMarvin Posts: 15,309moderator
    What are you suggesting? Lose the rent or food but for god's sake just keep that subscription alive?

    Obviously not the essential ones but you get 180 days to get back on your feet. If you can't sort $50/m out in 6 months then you probably can't afford food or rent, which is a bigger problem.
    I can almost guarantee times when "keeping $400 aside" would be exceedingly difficult.

    Why did you quote $400 when I said $200? $400 is 8 months worth of subscriptions. Surely you can budget ahead 4 months. I don't understand why people have a problem with the subscription model. It's used for a lot of things these days. Do people complain about mobile phone or internet subscriptions as in, if I stop paying $50/m I'll get cut off and then how do I contact people to get jobs, I'll be unable to work?

    Everybody needs regular cashflow and I'm not really seeing where paying over $2000 in a one-off fee is a better option than a $50/m subscription. In the long-run maybe but the huge purchase prices were a big problem to people, especially freelancers starting out.
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