Jobs, who never gave a shit to what he said or approved beforehand, would move mountains, force engineers to make impossible, but he would make sure that iPhone 5 had a screen size that made it the easiest in use smartphone on the market.
Drop it or prove it. No one cares about your individual personal opinion; larger phones don't sell better.
It is very funny that for thousands of years advancement in telecommunications meant decreased size and weight. Samsung has convinced a circus of fools to believe otherwise.
Then why did Apple go bigger for the iPhone 5 and not smaller?
Apple is not hurt. But this number is falling, of course. The problem is it is falling almost exclusively on account on one competitor. Competitor that has clearly worse products, no real DNA, but still taking over market share and profits share. Don't be naive and think Apple's management doesn't realize that and that they don't know they haven't responded properly. Yet. Product pipeline in the fall will confirm my words.
Yes but the market has also grown considerably. While Apple had a bigger slice of a smaller pie that pie has gotten bigger so now percentage wise the slice is smaller but it's bigger than the previous slice. They're still outselling everyone by a large margin.
They sure do....just look at the iPhone 5 versus the iPhone 4s...which one sold better in 2013?
Hint: the Iphone 5 which was bigger than the iPhone 4s........
C'mon even I know that's a BS argument, every new iPhone sold better than the previous model. It would've outsold the 4S regardless of screen size.
It is very funny that for thousands of years advancement in telecommunications meant decreased size and weight. Samsung has convinced a circus of fools to believe otherwise.
from 1999 my phones are getting bigger each year. never owned anything from samsung. what is your point? think, before you shoot....
Yes but the market has also grown considerably. While Apple had a bigger slice of a smaller pie that pie has gotten bigger so now percentage wise the slice is smaller but it's bigger than the previous slice. They're still outselling everyone by a large margin.
Depends how you look at it. If you compare numbers as indicators it is not so bright. Apple still sells only in premium segment and others sell more than Apple. In quantity, of course. And trend is negative for Apple.
If Apple would have 4.6" iPhone today, Samsung would have to sell its plastic-fantastic S4 for at least 150$ cheaper loosing almost all profits. Even if such iPhone would not measure up to quality Apple is used to.
Depends how you look at it. If you compare numbers as indicators it is not so bright. Apple still sells only in premium segment and others sell more than Apple. In quantity, of course. And trend is negative for Apple.
If Apple would have 4.6" iPhone today, Samsung would have to sell its plastic-fantastic S4 for at least 150$ cheaper loosing almost all profits. Even if such iPhone would not measure up to quality Apple is used to.
The premium segment is where the money's at, and in which nobody's outselling Apple.
For Q1 2013, Apple is down to 57%, with Samsung rising to 41%.
Are we talking smartphone or mobile device market here?
It says 'smartphone' in the table heading.
But the one quarter of data kdarling provides proves nothing (he is well-known in these parts for throwing in drive-by data of this sort, and pretending that he's providing 'empirical evidence'). It could very well have been the effect of a new model being introduced or some other unique factor.
It's probably far better to take a look at annual trends. If we did that, I doubt that Samsung is going to be anywhere close to 41% -- indeed, if the recent reports are to be believed, sales of S4 are coming in WAY less than forecast.
I'd love to see the hard, factual evidence that Apple is in a world of hurt because the iPhone doesn't have a bigger screen.
How about $250 billions in losses in shareholder value... and counting. The losses started right after small-screen iPhone 5 hit the market and keep growing. Cook himself acknowledged that this is very frustrating to him. It should be. The losses under Cook overshadow the losses under Gil Amelio. In fact, it is hard to come up with any other company that had such extensive losses in recent memory.
Sure, I agree with several of you points but none of them actually go against what I said. As I mentioned, from 2007 to 2010 Apple was ahead of the competition: they did defeat <span style="background-color:rgb(241,241,241);">Symbian, Blackberry, PalmOS, webOS and Windows Mobile</span>
back then and I never said otherwise.
I compared iOS to Windows XP simply because both were hugely successful operating systems mostly unchanged since their release. iOS added under the hood features like copy and paste, multitasking, the notification shade, Siri, etc on the various point releases. Incremental and evolutionary features at best but no real revolutionary change on the operating system itself like we're seeing on iOS7. This picture says it all: http://img.gawkerassets.com/img/18qqon8g6fucwjpg/xlarge.jpg
I have an iPhone as my daily driver and also have an iPad but honestly have been very disappointed in the last couple of years with the lack of innovation. I don't want to compare APIs or fragmentation or specific apps on android or iOS. You're missing the point. I'm not sure about the great technical strides Google has achieved with Android. All I know is all new features on iOS7 were already in place on the latest release of Android from almost 1 year ago. Google was copying iOS features back in the first version of Android and now they are dictating the changes. That's all I'm saying. <span style="line-height:1.231;">And still in this day and age, despite all the new features on iOS7, I cannot have mailbox as my default e-mail client or open links in another browser not called Safari...</span>
If you are defining OS/platform "innovation" as solely making major, cosmetic changes to the user interface, and particularly the appearance of the Home screen, then it explains your post.
You say APIs and functionality don't matter, all you care about is one or two specific features (that Android debuted because they favor Google's specific business model).
Of course you have no respect for iOS development! You don't recognize any real aspect of innovation.
The premium segment is where the money's at, and in which nobody's outselling Apple.
Should 4 and 4s be counted as premium models? Are you sure this is true globally? I have no doubt about leadership in USA. I am also sure Apple will prove soon there is money in mid segment as well. Even now I do not believe Samsung makes loss in mid segment.
But the one quarter of data kdarling provides proves nothing (he is well-known in these parts for throwing in drive-by data of this sort, and pretending that he's providing 'empirical evidence'). It could very well have been the effect of a new model being introduced or some other unique factor.
It's probably far better to take a look at annual trends. If we did that, I doubt that Samsung is going to be anywhere close to 41% -- indeed, if the recent reports are to be believed, sales of S4 are coming in WAY less than forecast.
I have read the heading, my question was provocative. I could believe in such or similar number if Samsung's semiconductors division were be included...and even then...
How about $250 billions in losses in shareholder value... and counting. The losses started right after small-screen iPhone 5 hit the market and keep growing. Cook himself acknowledged that this is very frustrating to him. It should be. The losses under Cook overshadow the losses under Gil Amelio. In fact, it is hard to come up with any other company that had such extensive losses in recent memory.
your postings are full of bias. I'm counting the losses on AAPL as well but it would be very naive to believe what you are saying. Whatever Apple does or doesn't do, it is always punished most brutally. This has nothing to do with Tim Cook, this has happened before as well. However, you are saying that market has punished Apple so brutally on what? screen size? Why don't they punish Samsung on crappy sales of S4? Why did they swing GOOG from 750 to 450 and nov back to 900? Did they have Tim Cook as well?
Screen size was and still is a failure from Apple's size, but is very much minor to market valuation, so your story just doesn't stick, sorry...
Unlike Cook zealots, you asked a fair question. I'll answer by disecting one of Cook's recent responses. When Walt Mossberg from WSJ asked Cook about iPhone's screen size - a critical issue that largely led to the downfall of AAPL - <span style="font-size:13px;line-height:1.231;">Cook said the following: </span>
"A large screen today comes with a lot of tradeoffs. Customers are clearly looking at the size, but they also look at things like 'do the photos show the proper color? The white balance, the reflectivity, battery life. The longevity of the display.'"
I hope I do not need to explain to you why this "white balance, the reflectivity" comment is - as one Apple Insider forum member justly called it - "pure unadulterated bullshit."
What Cook was actually doing is covering up his decision to go with small 4" size. He knew that 4" was the most convenient choice logistically - that's what his spreadsheets showed. In fact, many Cook zealots rushed to defend Cook by explaining how 4" was the best choice considering the production contracts Apple had at the time with screen manufacturers, and that Jobs himself approved 4" back in 2010. This is typical Tim Cook - trying to be safe by accounting for many things, including profits, but overlooking the most important one - WILL SMALL SCREEN BE EASIER TO INTERACT WITH in 2012?
By early 2012, it was clear to any perceptive person who ventured outside of the US that a larger screen is the future. Larger size makes it EASIER to accomplish most tasks - aside from talking, which people started to do less and less in 2012. Asians, for example started to switch to phablets by the end of 2011.
Jobs, who never gave a shit to what he said or approved beforehand, would move mountains, force engineers to make impossible, but he would make sure that iPhone 5 had a screen size that made it the easiest in use smartphone on the market.
Jobs had both vision and balls to do it. Cook has neither.
In addition to vision and balls you also need to maintain a coherent strategy and possess the technology to enter a given market.
Two years ago, you could be banging your fist on the table that Apple was "failing" to release a 4G phone.
However, from both Google's stats and from IDC data in China, it's clear that big phones are only a market sales niche currently, just as 4G was back when Android phones held it as an exclusive feature.
Google has worked hard to make Android work on a range of hardware. Apple only needs iOS to work on one small set of hardware, so it can work more on other features.
That said, iOS 7 extends the pipeline of technology enabling larger future devices. If there is a significant market ahead for large screen phones, Apple will target it.
Recall that apple was not the first MP3 maker to release a HD-based model, nor flash memory, nor the first to play video. They just were in first place in delivering to the mainstream the products that earned the most money and pleased the most people the best.
But the one quarter of data kdarling provides proves nothing (he is well-known in these parts for throwing in drive-by data of this sort, and pretending that he's providing 'empirical evidence'). It could very well have been the effect of a new model being introduced or some other unique factor.
It's the latest quarter I could find info on.
It never ceases to amaze me how some people sit back and slam other people who actually do some research.
You're more than welcome to stop being lazy, and jump in with more... or any... data.
My big problem with the redesign of iOS 7 isn't how much or little they've copied from the Windows Phone or from Android. I could care less.
What bothers me is that they seem to have given zero thought into whether or not I can read the stuff on my phone. Helvetica Neue Ultra Light may be a gorgeous font, but it makes my eyes work too hard (particularly when they throw it up white on a light background). Then they've got blurry transparencies everywhere to go with the thin font.
It looks as though I'm going to have a pick a special background screen and arrange my apps just so if I ever want to use the Control Center. The whole thing needs contrast and some effort at making it readable.
I can accept the crappy icons and color scheme if they fix the other stuff.
For an Android user, it is unthinkable to have the phone in those same conditions and have more than 2h battery life, even on "high end" devices. Things like that are only a privilege to iPhone users, so when they complain that their phones only hold a charge during 8h, I laugh.
It's like people saying that the S4 and the note have much bigger batteries, so they have a much better battery life... Meanwhile the iPhone and iPad wins every test when both screens are on, and on extensive tasks there is no contest.
Apple is doing a great job with their mobile processors and batteries. The a6 was a marvel, the things that they manage to do with small batteries are great. Can't wait for the end of the year...
Great little story. To bad that you have no clue of what you are talking about.
Comments
Drop it or prove it. No one cares about your individual personal opinion; larger phones don't sell better.
Then why did Apple go bigger for the iPhone 5 and not smaller?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
Drop it or prove it. No one cares about your individual personal opinion; larger phones don't sell better.
They sure do....just look at the iPhone 5 versus the iPhone 4s...which one sold better in 2013?
Hint: the Iphone 5 which was bigger than the iPhone 4s........
Yes but the market has also grown considerably. While Apple had a bigger slice of a smaller pie that pie has gotten bigger so now percentage wise the slice is smaller but it's bigger than the previous slice. They're still outselling everyone by a large margin.
C'mon even I know that's a BS argument, every new iPhone sold better than the previous model. It would've outsold the 4S regardless of screen size.
Quote:
Originally Posted by dasanman69
C'mon even I know that's a BS argument, every new iPhone sold better than the previous model. It would've outsold the 4S regardless of screen size.
lol...that is true....I am stretching it....but my point was to show that the screen sizes are getting bigger even for Apple....
Quote:
Originally Posted by KDarling
For Q1 2013, Apple is down to 57%, with Samsung rising to 41%.
Are we talking smartphone or mobile device market here?
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacBook Pro
It is very funny that for thousands of years advancement in telecommunications meant decreased size and weight. Samsung has convinced a circus of fools to believe otherwise.
from 1999 my phones are getting bigger each year. never owned anything from samsung. what is your point? think, before you shoot....
Quote:
Originally Posted by dasanman69
Yes but the market has also grown considerably. While Apple had a bigger slice of a smaller pie that pie has gotten bigger so now percentage wise the slice is smaller but it's bigger than the previous slice. They're still outselling everyone by a large margin.
Depends how you look at it. If you compare numbers as indicators it is not so bright. Apple still sells only in premium segment and others sell more than Apple. In quantity, of course. And trend is negative for Apple.
If Apple would have 4.6" iPhone today, Samsung would have to sell its plastic-fantastic S4 for at least 150$ cheaper loosing almost all profits. Even if such iPhone would not measure up to quality Apple is used to.
The premium segment is where the money's at, and in which nobody's outselling Apple.
Quote:
Originally Posted by poksi
Quote:
Originally Posted by KDarling
For Q1 2013, Apple is down to 57%, with Samsung rising to 41%.
Are we talking smartphone or mobile device market here?
It says 'smartphone' in the table heading.
But the one quarter of data kdarling provides proves nothing (he is well-known in these parts for throwing in drive-by data of this sort, and pretending that he's providing 'empirical evidence'). It could very well have been the effect of a new model being introduced or some other unique factor.
It's probably far better to take a look at annual trends. If we did that, I doubt that Samsung is going to be anywhere close to 41% -- indeed, if the recent reports are to be believed, sales of S4 are coming in WAY less than forecast.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan
I'd love to see the hard, factual evidence that Apple is in a world of hurt because the iPhone doesn't have a bigger screen.
How about $250 billions in losses in shareholder value... and counting. The losses started right after small-screen iPhone 5 hit the market and keep growing. Cook himself acknowledged that this is very frustrating to him. It should be. The losses under Cook overshadow the losses under Gil Amelio. In fact, it is hard to come up with any other company that had such extensive losses in recent memory.
Cook zealots can blame Wall Street shenanigans, trolls, and anybody else all they want. But back in 2012 it was already clear as day that Apple share price will fall drastically because of Cook's gutless leadership. AAPL is still above $400 but I tell you - we will see $3XX price soon.
If you are defining OS/platform "innovation" as solely making major, cosmetic changes to the user interface, and particularly the appearance of the Home screen, then it explains your post.
You say APIs and functionality don't matter, all you care about is one or two specific features (that Android debuted because they favor Google's specific business model).
Of course you have no respect for iOS development! You don't recognize any real aspect of innovation.
Quote:
Originally Posted by dasanman69
The premium segment is where the money's at, and in which nobody's outselling Apple.
Should 4 and 4s be counted as premium models? Are you sure this is true globally? I have no doubt about leadership in USA. I am also sure Apple will prove soon there is money in mid segment as well. Even now I do not believe Samsung makes loss in mid segment.
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram
It says 'smartphone' in the table heading.
But the one quarter of data kdarling provides proves nothing (he is well-known in these parts for throwing in drive-by data of this sort, and pretending that he's providing 'empirical evidence'). It could very well have been the effect of a new model being introduced or some other unique factor.
It's probably far better to take a look at annual trends. If we did that, I doubt that Samsung is going to be anywhere close to 41% -- indeed, if the recent reports are to be believed, sales of S4 are coming in WAY less than forecast.
I have read the heading, my question was provocative.
Quote:
Originally Posted by enature
How about $250 billions in losses in shareholder value... and counting. The losses started right after small-screen iPhone 5 hit the market and keep growing. Cook himself acknowledged that this is very frustrating to him. It should be. The losses under Cook overshadow the losses under Gil Amelio. In fact, it is hard to come up with any other company that had such extensive losses in recent memory.
Cook zealots can blame Wall Street shenanigans, trolls, and anybody else all they want. But back in 2012 it was already clear as day that Apple share price will fall drastically because of Cook's gutless leadership. AAPL is still above $400 but I tell you - we will see $3XX price soon.
your postings are full of bias. I'm counting the losses on AAPL as well but it would be very naive to believe what you are saying. Whatever Apple does or doesn't do, it is always punished most brutally. This has nothing to do with Tim Cook, this has happened before as well. However, you are saying that market has punished Apple so brutally on what? screen size? Why don't they punish Samsung on crappy sales of S4? Why did they swing GOOG from 750 to 450 and nov back to 900? Did they have Tim Cook as well?
Screen size was and still is a failure from Apple's size, but is very much minor to market valuation, so your story just doesn't stick, sorry...
In addition to vision and balls you also need to maintain a coherent strategy and possess the technology to enter a given market.
Two years ago, you could be banging your fist on the table that Apple was "failing" to release a 4G phone.
However, from both Google's stats and from IDC data in China, it's clear that big phones are only a market sales niche currently, just as 4G was back when Android phones held it as an exclusive feature.
Google has worked hard to make Android work on a range of hardware. Apple only needs iOS to work on one small set of hardware, so it can work more on other features.
That said, iOS 7 extends the pipeline of technology enabling larger future devices. If there is a significant market ahead for large screen phones, Apple will target it.
Recall that apple was not the first MP3 maker to release a HD-based model, nor flash memory, nor the first to play video. They just were in first place in delivering to the mainstream the products that earned the most money and pleased the most people the best.
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram
But the one quarter of data kdarling provides proves nothing (he is well-known in these parts for throwing in drive-by data of this sort, and pretending that he's providing 'empirical evidence'). It could very well have been the effect of a new model being introduced or some other unique factor.
It's the latest quarter I could find info on.
It never ceases to amaze me how some people sit back and slam other people who actually do some research.
You're more than welcome to stop being lazy, and jump in with more... or any... data.
What bothers me is that they seem to have given zero thought into whether or not I can read the stuff on my phone. Helvetica Neue Ultra Light may be a gorgeous font, but it makes my eyes work too hard (particularly when they throw it up white on a light background). Then they've got blurry transparencies everywhere to go with the thin font.
It looks as though I'm going to have a pick a special background screen and arrange my apps just so if I ever want to use the Control Center. The whole thing needs contrast and some effort at making it readable.
I can accept the crappy icons and color scheme if they fix the other stuff.
Quote:
Originally Posted by pedromartins
For an Android user, it is unthinkable to have the phone in those same conditions and have more than 2h battery life, even on "high end" devices. Things like that are only a privilege to iPhone users, so when they complain that their phones only hold a charge during 8h, I laugh.
It's like people saying that the S4 and the note have much bigger batteries, so they have a much better battery life... Meanwhile the iPhone and iPad wins every test when both screens are on, and on extensive tasks there is no contest.
Apple is doing a great job with their mobile processors and batteries. The a6 was a marvel, the things that they manage to do with small batteries are great. Can't wait for the end of the year...
Great little story. To bad that you have no clue of what you are talking about.