16 GIG will seem so little in a couple of years though ...
I was soooo excited with my Mac IIfx and 8 MB
At least the Mac Pro seems to still be DIY in both RAM and SSD against all rumors!
I know, I regret getting 8 a few months ago, market feels around 6 now, in a few years 32 might be average (tablets hitting 2 easily now is not surprising).
So...no matte screen option basically means Apple has finally decided that professional photographers don't kick in enough cash to be taken seriously when they design new products. Don't get me wrong...I love the look of those fancy-assed Retina screens, but they are totally useless when you shoot tethered. They are impossible to calibrate for contrast...the contrast is dandy if you wanna watch a movie or play video games...and that added contrast makes judging your final results pointless. I bought a current top-shelf matte-screen Macbook Pro a couple of months ago and when it's calibrated it rivals my super-spendy NEC retouching monitors for output quality. I can guarantee that if I were to try to shoot and retouch a job on a Retina screen the final file would be borderline unusable. Period! And while I don't hafta shoot and deliver jobs immediately after the gig that often, there are TONS of guys whose workflow is exactly like that, and I'd bet the ranch they're gonna be hard pressed to consider a new Macbook Pro as their tethering computer of choice.
I love my 15" macbook pro and really wanted to refresh to a new 15" Haswell model, but I am beginning to think that I don't make enough to afford Apple products. When I priced the Macbook Pro out the lowest tier model ($1,999) it only gives me 8gig of RAM, no discrete video card, & only a 256 SSD HD.
With 16Gig of ram ( because I cannot add it myself and need it for parallels) and 512 SSD HD takes me to $2600. And while the SSD is nice it is just not necessary for me. Maybe I am just not the target market anymore, I always thought Apple was about doing things differently with more elegance. Now it just feels like they are looking for more ways to charge higher margins and be a true luxury brand(Retina IPad Mini for $399 & IPad 2 for $399 what the..).
I really love their products....I really do.....I am just not sure I can afford them anymore....
I'm in the publishing industry, and need to open 3 pages or more under 3 different apps simultaneously, on the go.
I can't do that with 15".
Do what everyone else in the "industry" do. Either use a desktop PC, or plug your laptop into an external monitor when you need that much visual real estate. Accept that laptops are designed with mobility in mind, and 17" behemoths are not the norm anymore. While many people use a laptop as their primary (and only) computer, the point of laptops is that they are mobile and are designed as such. Those 17" Macbook Pros weighed a ton!
Heck my 13" MBA sucks for 8-hour/day work, which is why I plug it into a 27" monitor for the serious stuff.
With 16Gig of ram ( because I cannot add it myself and need it for parallels) and 512 SSD HD takes me to $2600. And while the SSD is nice it is just not necessary for me.
So get the base SSD and buy an external hard drive. USB 3 is finally fast enough to boot from, and Thunderbolt is obviously fast enough.
16 GIG will seem so little in a couple of years though ...
I was soooo excited with my Mac IIfx and 8 MB
At least the Mac Pro seems to still be DIY in both RAM and SSD against all rumors!
My first machine had 8K, 2nd 20K, 3rd 64K, 4th 128K and I figured that was the top of the world. I got PC with 1MB and people thought I was crazy. I was a god (not The God.... A god) in 1988 with 4MB and ATI graphics.
Today, I just need the ability to run all my OS X apps and a few VMs while mobile w/o feeling like I'm dragging ass. I found it near impossible on 8 GB and without flash storage. Looking forward to the soon to be announce 4K Cinema Displays!! I'll soon be able to retire my 17" quad core MBP.
Accept that laptops are designed with mobility in mind, and 17" behemoths are not the norm anymore. While many people use a laptop as their primary (and only) computer, the point of laptops is that they are mobile and are designed as such. Those 17" Macbook Pros weighed a ton!
Yeah, but a 17" laptop designed with today's thin bezels and components would probably be smaller and lighter than the 15 inchers of yore. And have more battery life, too.
I can understand not wanting to downsize on screen space when you've got a workflow that you like. With a desktop, you can reposition your laptop relative to your keyboard to maintain a nice pair of working distances; with a laptop, that's not possible (when you're using it without the external monitor and keyboard, natch -- which just makes it into an oddly shaped desktop anyway).
Do what everyone else in the "industry" do. Either use a desktop PC, or plug your laptop into an external monitor when you need that much visual real estate. Accept that laptops are designed with mobility in mind, and 17" behemoths are not the norm anymore. While many people use a laptop as their primary (and only) computer, the point of laptops is that they are mobile and are designed as such. Those 17" Macbook Pros weighed a ton!
As a designer I often take my 17" Macbook Pro to see a client and sit down at a table with them to go over designs and maybe make changes with the client looking over my shoulder. I don't really have a need for a Retina display, it's over kill. Just need something that has lots of screen space and is easy to view from 4 to 8 feet away.
Then there is the issue is the glued in battery. Am I supposed to be without my laptop for a day or so while Apple replaces it?
Then there is the SSD drive. I'm sure it is fast and all but 1tb is a 500 upgrade and I'm not sure if I can even put a bigger drive in it once bigger SSD drives become available. Right now my 1tb drive is getting pretty full with files that I need to have with me. I have 4 tb of fiirewire drives that I archive stuff on but my work files just keep on growing in size.
I plug 17" into a 30" monitor when I'm in my office and it is nice to be able to just close the lid and go see a client. Don't want to have to start dragging external drives and monitors in the field with me.
Sacrifice Hard Drives and RAM all for the sake of a few mm of thickness?
I for one do not like the trend where the internal storage cannot be upgraded. And for what? The only "benefit" I get as a user is that volume inside the chassis is lessened, resulting in the device(s) being thinner than they were.
Who cares how thin it is? Really. Past a certain point, are you willing to sacrifice any degree of performance or expandability just to get a notebook that's 0.7" instead of 0.8"? (And especially with the iMac, WGASA about how thin it is?).
I love my 15" macbook pro and really wanted to refresh to a new 15" Haswell model, but I am beginning to think that I don't make enough to afford Apple products. When I priced the Macbook Pro out the lowest tier model ($1,999) it only gives me 8gig of RAM, no discrete video card, & only a 256 SSD HD.
With 16Gig of ram ( because I cannot add it myself and need it for parallels) and 512 SSD HD takes me to $2600. And while the SSD is nice it is just not necessary for me. Maybe I am just not the target market anymore, I always thought Apple was about doing things differently with more elegance. Now it just feels like they are looking for more ways to charge higher margins and be a true luxury brand(Retina IPad Mini for $399 & IPad 2 for $399 what the..).
I really love their products....I really do.....I am just not sure I can afford them anymore....
What the hell are you ranting about? You can't afford them anymore? Apple products are getting cheaper every year, and you're getting more for your money. An iPad now starts @ $299. A Retina MBP @ $1299. But no, you're not the target market, since you apparently are demading obsolete tech like hard drives, optical drives, and expandability, which is no longer the norm or practical for modern notebooks.
So it’s a good guess that only the legacy 13" will have user-upgradeable RAM? Presumably the new models are pretty much the same internally as the old ones including soldered-in RAM. How soon before someone gets one and tears it down?
What the hell are you ranting about? You can't afford them anymore? Apple products are getting cheaper every year, and you're getting more for your money. An iPad now starts @ $299. A Retina MBP @ $1299.
Yeah, but what do you get for that $1299? 4 GB RAM, and 128 GB storage, which is positively anemic. This wouldn't be an issue if you could upgrade those specs later, but of course you can't.
To get a MBP that will last more than two years, you pretty much have to spend $2000 at a minimum, (plus another $300 for AppleCare since there's no way you can hope to fix the thing yourself). This was not true a couple of years ago, when you actually could realistically buy the $1299 model, and just get the other parts from Newegg when you needed them (or when the price came down a bit).
Hell, you have to spend more than that just to get a machine that's usable today. A friend of mine has a MBP with only 4 GB of RAM. She doesn't even have that much open — basically, Chrome, Mail, Word, Preview, and a couple of other things — but the thing pages so constantly as to be virtually unusable. Fortunately, she's got a 2011 model, so I'm planning to win brownie points by putting some more RAM in that sucker and solving her problem. If it were a Retina, the solution would pretty much be "throw it away."
Don't get me wrong, the Retina MBPs are really nice machines in every other aspect, and I'll probably end up getting one eventually (whenever I can scrape together enough cash to buy a maxed out one, so that it'll be usable for at least a while). I doubt it will last 5 years like my 2008 unibody has, though. These machines just aren't built to last like the older ones were.
So it’s a good guess that only the legacy 13" will have user-upgradeable RAM? Presumably the new models are pretty much the same internally as the old ones including soldered-in RAM. How soon before someone gets one and tears it down?
You can go to Apple.com and see that they’re identical inside to the past models. Your question was answered months ago.
Do what everyone else in the "industry" do. Either use a desktop PC, or plug your laptop into an external monitor when you need that much visual real estate. Accept that laptops are designed with mobility in mind, and 17" behemoths are not the norm anymore. While many people use a laptop as their primary (and only) computer, the point of laptops is that they are mobile and are designed as such. Those 17" Macbook Pros weighed a ton!
Heck my 13" MBA sucks for 8-hour/day work, which is why I plug it into a 27" monitor for the serious stuff.
I use A 27" iMac + 24" display in office, but need a 17" on the go. Period. Actually, I monitor all the 17" "like new" on sale on eBay since a few months. Will hoard them.
Comments
I know, I regret getting 8 a few months ago, market feels around 6 now, in a few years 32 might be average (tablets hitting 2 easily now is not surprising).
On-the-go publisher
is that in the excitable content industry?
He could buy a MacBook Air and a generic 17" monitor. Together they are probably thinner and lighter than the old 17" MacBook.
I'm a writer. A novelist. And I publish other's books too.
So...no matte screen option basically means Apple has finally decided that professional photographers don't kick in enough cash to be taken seriously when they design new products. Don't get me wrong...I love the look of those fancy-assed Retina screens, but they are totally useless when you shoot tethered. They are impossible to calibrate for contrast...the contrast is dandy if you wanna watch a movie or play video games...and that added contrast makes judging your final results pointless. I bought a current top-shelf matte-screen Macbook Pro a couple of months ago and when it's calibrated it rivals my super-spendy NEC retouching monitors for output quality. I can guarantee that if I were to try to shoot and retouch a job on a Retina screen the final file would be borderline unusable. Period! And while I don't hafta shoot and deliver jobs immediately after the gig that often, there are TONS of guys whose workflow is exactly like that, and I'd bet the ranch they're gonna be hard pressed to consider a new Macbook Pro as their tethering computer of choice.
With 16Gig of ram ( because I cannot add it myself and need it for parallels) and 512 SSD HD takes me to $2600. And while the SSD is nice it is just not necessary for me. Maybe I am just not the target market anymore, I always thought Apple was about doing things differently with more elegance. Now it just feels like they are looking for more ways to charge higher margins and be a true luxury brand(Retina IPad Mini for $399 & IPad 2 for $399 what the..).
I really love their products....I really do.....I am just not sure I can afford them anymore....
I'm in the publishing industry, and need to open 3 pages or more under 3 different apps simultaneously, on the go.
I can't do that with 15".
Do what everyone else in the "industry" do. Either use a desktop PC, or plug your laptop into an external monitor when you need that much visual real estate. Accept that laptops are designed with mobility in mind, and 17" behemoths are not the norm anymore. While many people use a laptop as their primary (and only) computer, the point of laptops is that they are mobile and are designed as such. Those 17" Macbook Pros weighed a ton!
Heck my 13" MBA sucks for 8-hour/day work, which is why I plug it into a 27" monitor for the serious stuff.
So get the base SSD and buy an external hard drive. USB 3 is finally fast enough to boot from, and Thunderbolt is obviously fast enough.
Same thing here.
Really want a newer Macbook Pro but don't want to downsize to a 15".
My first machine had 8K, 2nd 20K, 3rd 64K, 4th 128K and I figured that was the top of the world. I got PC with 1MB and people thought I was crazy. I was a god (not The God.... A god) in 1988 with 4MB and ATI graphics.
Today, I just need the ability to run all my OS X apps and a few VMs while mobile w/o feeling like I'm dragging ass. I found it near impossible on 8 GB and without flash storage. Looking forward to the soon to be announce 4K Cinema Displays!! I'll soon be able to retire my 17" quad core MBP.
Accept that laptops are designed with mobility in mind, and 17" behemoths are not the norm anymore. While many people use a laptop as their primary (and only) computer, the point of laptops is that they are mobile and are designed as such. Those 17" Macbook Pros weighed a ton!
Yeah, but a 17" laptop designed with today's thin bezels and components would probably be smaller and lighter than the 15 inchers of yore. And have more battery life, too.
I can understand not wanting to downsize on screen space when you've got a workflow that you like. With a desktop, you can reposition your laptop relative to your keyboard to maintain a nice pair of working distances; with a laptop, that's not possible (when you're using it without the external monitor and keyboard, natch -- which just makes it into an oddly shaped desktop anyway).
Do what everyone else in the "industry" do. Either use a desktop PC, or plug your laptop into an external monitor when you need that much visual real estate. Accept that laptops are designed with mobility in mind, and 17" behemoths are not the norm anymore. While many people use a laptop as their primary (and only) computer, the point of laptops is that they are mobile and are designed as such. Those 17" Macbook Pros weighed a ton!
As a designer I often take my 17" Macbook Pro to see a client and sit down at a table with them to go over designs and maybe make changes with the client looking over my shoulder. I don't really have a need for a Retina display, it's over kill. Just need something that has lots of screen space and is easy to view from 4 to 8 feet away.
Then there is the issue is the glued in battery. Am I supposed to be without my laptop for a day or so while Apple replaces it?
Then there is the SSD drive. I'm sure it is fast and all but 1tb is a 500 upgrade and I'm not sure if I can even put a bigger drive in it once bigger SSD drives become available. Right now my 1tb drive is getting pretty full with files that I need to have with me. I have 4 tb of fiirewire drives that I archive stuff on but my work files just keep on growing in size.
I plug 17" into a 30" monitor when I'm in my office and it is nice to be able to just close the lid and go see a client. Don't want to have to start dragging external drives and monitors in the field with me.
Sacrifice Hard Drives and RAM all for the sake of a few mm of thickness?
I for one do not like the trend where the internal storage cannot be upgraded. And for what? The only "benefit" I get as a user is that volume inside the chassis is lessened, resulting in the device(s) being thinner than they were.
Who cares how thin it is? Really. Past a certain point, are you willing to sacrifice any degree of performance or expandability just to get a notebook that's 0.7" instead of 0.8"? (And especially with the iMac, WGASA about how thin it is?).
I love my 15" macbook pro and really wanted to refresh to a new 15" Haswell model, but I am beginning to think that I don't make enough to afford Apple products. When I priced the Macbook Pro out the lowest tier model ($1,999) it only gives me 8gig of RAM, no discrete video card, & only a 256 SSD HD.
With 16Gig of ram ( because I cannot add it myself and need it for parallels) and 512 SSD HD takes me to $2600. And while the SSD is nice it is just not necessary for me. Maybe I am just not the target market anymore, I always thought Apple was about doing things differently with more elegance. Now it just feels like they are looking for more ways to charge higher margins and be a true luxury brand(Retina IPad Mini for $399 & IPad 2 for $399 what the..).
I really love their products....I really do.....I am just not sure I can afford them anymore....
What the hell are you ranting about? You can't afford them anymore? Apple products are getting cheaper every year, and you're getting more for your money. An iPad now starts @ $299. A Retina MBP @ $1299. But no, you're not the target market, since you apparently are demading obsolete tech like hard drives, optical drives, and expandability, which is no longer the norm or practical for modern notebooks.
So it’s a good guess that only the legacy 13" will have user-upgradeable RAM? Presumably the new models are pretty much the same internally as the old ones including soldered-in RAM. How soon before someone gets one and tears it down?
To get a MBP that will last more than two years, you pretty much have to spend $2000 at a minimum, (plus another $300 for AppleCare since there's no way you can hope to fix the thing yourself). This was not true a couple of years ago, when you actually could realistically buy the $1299 model, and just get the other parts from Newegg when you needed them (or when the price came down a bit).
Hell, you have to spend more than that just to get a machine that's usable today. A friend of mine has a MBP with only 4 GB of RAM. She doesn't even have that much open — basically, Chrome, Mail, Word, Preview, and a couple of other things — but the thing pages so constantly as to be virtually unusable. Fortunately, she's got a 2011 model, so I'm planning to win brownie points by putting some more RAM in that sucker and solving her problem. If it were a Retina, the solution would pretty much be "throw it away."
Don't get me wrong, the Retina MBPs are really nice machines in every other aspect, and I'll probably end up getting one eventually (whenever I can scrape together enough cash to buy a maxed out one, so that it'll be usable for at least a while). I doubt it will last 5 years like my 2008 unibody has, though. These machines just aren't built to last like the older ones were.
You can go to Apple.com and see that they’re identical inside to the past models. Your question was answered months ago.
Please fix this Apple.
If I could figure out how to get Mac OSX to run on something like this I would buy it today.
http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=8208716&CatId=2511
http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=8208716&CatId=2511
Enjoy your boat.
Do what everyone else in the "industry" do. Either use a desktop PC, or plug your laptop into an external monitor when you need that much visual real estate. Accept that laptops are designed with mobility in mind, and 17" behemoths are not the norm anymore. While many people use a laptop as their primary (and only) computer, the point of laptops is that they are mobile and are designed as such. Those 17" Macbook Pros weighed a ton!
Heck my 13" MBA sucks for 8-hour/day work, which is why I plug it into a 27" monitor for the serious stuff.
I use A 27" iMac + 24" display in office, but need a 17" on the go. Period. Actually, I monitor all the 17" "like new" on sale on eBay since a few months. Will hoard them.