I have observed this issue when using the Maps application. Tapping the End button on the top left corner of the screen almost never responds. It is extremely frustrating.
Something tell me that their top manufacturer samsung had something to do with it. It's weird how the iPhone 5s works so well but when the amazing 64bit A7 iPhone with ID sensor came the screens sensitivity is bad. I blame samsung.
Probably you are right. We know now, that Sammy pays students to write bogus articles against some competing products/companies, so why shouldn't they bribe a finnish company to fake some test results? To see the 100% perfect Galaxy3 test result besides the two iPhones, seems more than suspicious.
If you look at the touch map they provided for the phone it not only has an issue at the edges it has issues over most of the phone base on all the red dots. I am thinking something is fundamentally wrong. I think most would agree that Apple would not go from best to worst from one generation of products to the other. I also find it interesting that a whole group of people did not seem to think there was an issue and now that this has been pointed out they are say it explains their typing mistake. Maybe people have always made similar mistakes, but now that can blame it on something else other than themselves, why should people take responsibility for their actions.
If we are to believe this error map they provided then most everyone would be experiencing errors all over the display especially when playing games since you tend to use most of the display with games. At this point I am thinking apple changed something with the display that the calibrated finger no longer represents a touch which the digitizer recognized correctly, however, the digitizer still closely works with a real human finger.
I agree ... this "report" doesn't pass the smell test. The first sentence in their "report" : <em style="border-bottom-width:0px;border-left-width:0px;border-right-width:0px;border-top-width:0px;margin-bottom:0px;margin-left:0px;margin-right:0px;margin-top:0px;padding-bottom:0px;padding-left:0px;padding-right:0px;padding-top:0px;vertical-align:baseline;">Out of curiosity, OptoFidelity test patrol engineers wanted to see what differences in performance our untouchable robot systems could find between iPhone 5 S and iPhone C and would that difference guide consumer to pick right version. </em>
Out of curiosity ??? Give me a break ... and they were just as "curious", I suppose, to "test"it against Galaxy S3 .... how "convenient". I sense this is more of Samsung's dirty tricks campaign. Just another paid shill working for the world's most shameful company. :no:
I never thought my thumb was millimeter precise to begin with as a pointing instrument. Or put differently: when I type, I'm not hitting the on-screen keys with any real precision, I'm relying on autocorrect to do most of the heavy lifting, or alternatively, to take the blame for any weird things I end up typing
I agree with that. But that makes him (or her) arrogant and rude, not wrong.
Noting not experiencing a particular issue does not implicitly dispute the existence of the issue but rather adds to the numerical data of whether the issue is widespread or of a more limited nature. Otherwise the thing should just be locked down after the first post of the incident. My take is a real but of minor occurrence or real and very widespread occurrence of an item is a useful piece of information regarding an issue.
Having a different experience, perhaps based on different hardware or circumstances, doesn't attack anyone else's experience as invalid absent one boatload of defensiveness. Hence the acronym; YMMV
I have noticed this. Some buttons seem to be closer to the edges in IOS and I thought that was the problem. My bottom right corner is the most noticeable. The P works fine.
Is it possible that Apple applies some sort of correction? Since we are using fingers and thumbs, not precise styluses (as used in this test) to use our devices, that register as blobs on the screen rather than points, perhaps some kind of correction was needed to improve accuracy.
And likewise, if it really is a result of inaccuracy, couldn't it be corrected via software?
Unless someone wants to claim that the robot was purposely set up to test the iPhone differently from the Samsung phone. :???:
I think the moral of the story is that you should give robots a Samsung Galaxy S3, because they are capable of precision aim.
When I type on my iPhone 5 screen, I'm flying though it very quickly and there's hardly anything resembling sub-millimeter precision involved. I'm just stabbing at where my muscle memory thinks the buttons are--Apple did say they have predictive algorithms that dynamically expand and contract the target areas of each key based on what you've typed so far. And of course, Apple's excellent autocorrect comes in afterwards to clean up any lingering errors. Anyone who does a lot of rapid typing on iPhones knows what I'm talking about. (I jabbed this message out using my iPhone, for example.)
Noting not experiencing a particular issue does not implicitly dispute the existence of the issue but rather adds to the numerical data of whether the issue is widespread or of a more limited nature. Otherwise the thing should just be locked down after the first post of the incident. My take is a real but of minor occurrence or real and very widespread occurrence of an item is a useful piece of information regarding an issue.
Having a different experience, perhaps based on different hardware or circumstances, doesn't attack anyone else's experience as invalid absent one boatload of defensiveness. Hence the acronym; YMMV
So you're counting up all the defensive "no problem here" posts on the internet? Let me know when you are ready to publish your findings.
In order to make the test more believable, I would suggest the following improvements:
Each error measured is represented by a vector v=(x,y). That vector is mapped to HSL color space:
Hue = vector's angle = arctan (y / x),
Saturation = length of the vector = |v|
Lightness is fixed at 50%
Using that mapping, each tested pixel will get a color, making a map.
If that map contains noise (gradients are not smooth), then obviously and undeniably the iPhone 5S is faulty (display and/or OS processing is gravely incorrect).
If, however, the there is no noise, and gradients are smooth, then there is a consistency in the way touches are processed. And then, we have theSteve Jobs patent in action.
Instead, what we get is a gravely filtered data set. The direction of those error vectors is not preserved, and a threshold is set to map the magnitude of each vector to a binary (RED/GREEN) value. Both "techniques" strip meaningful information and introduce a huge error in the process of measuring those errors.
So, forgive me for being a bit sceptical on that topic, but what I see is pseudo science in action.
EDIT: I stand corrected! The research is not completely bogus. There is actually a meaningful image, the third one (http://cdn1.appleinsider.com/1025-touchaccuracy-3.jpg). It is an alternative representation of the map I described above. And it shows a significant consistency in the way touches are detected and processed. That image, however, goes directly against the conclusions of the research.
This test was done by idiots - or someone on the take from Samsung.
The edges have less sensitivity _by design_ so you don't accidentally press anything when holding the phone. This is software+hardware integration in action.
The fact that the Galaxy doesn't account for this and is showing even sensitivity across the surface just shows Samsung doesn't have a clue - or care - about how their users use their products.
"Sometimes it helps to read the actual report rather than the article or other people’s comments.
If you look at page 4 of the report (http://www.optofidelity.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/OF_iPhone5C_vs_iPhone5C.pdf), there is a rather distinct and obvious pattern to the discrepancy that is absolutely consistent with the notion that it is a parallax correction at the OS level and not a sensor problem. It looks suspiciously like the correction you would expect for a device held primarily in the left hand and operated by the right hand.
Now it may be that the compensation amounts are wrong or too much or too little—and the user reports seem to indicate that too much correction at the edges may be the case here—but the idea of correcting for parallax is not a problem per se. Not correcting for parallax could be a bigger problem.
Assuming the results are valid, it doesn't tell us where the issue arises. My guess, again looking at the report and not just other people’s comments, is that the issue arises at a low level in the OS as it is processing the raw input stream from the screen. That is good news because if the correction amounts are wrong an OS update could easily correct them. If the problem was just a bad sensor, then nothing could fix it. (Well, theoretically, a software correction/calibration could do it, but random error distribution wouldn't make that easy.)"
Synthetic testing like this rarely converts to real life application. I have to admit it does make me laugh when I read member making it sound like Samsung was the sponsor of this test. I doubt those same people had a problem with the testing methodology when the iPhone tested as having one of the most accurate touch screens in 2010.
Lets remember screen dynamics changed from 2010. In any case unless you are Lady Gaga that has her nails shaved to a 1mm point I doubt anyone is going to have any real problems. Everyone in my family has a 5s and the only problem I have is my fat finger hits the space bar.
Samsung makes very good hardware which is why Apple has used them for decades and will continue to use them. The problem with Samsung smartphones isn't the hardware it's the fact the put Android on it.
I'm finding it hard to try and grab the video-slider on my iPhone 5 now that I upgraded to iOS7. It tends to jump to a completely different position than where my finger is. This never happened with iOS 6, I wonder if this is an OS issue or maybe the slider is way too small to grab.
Btw, I'm not a fan of the iPhone's new video-player UI, I find it too opaque and intrusive.
I dislike the slider in the music app too. ugh I guess no one ever scrolls through their music? Why did Apple's designers make it even smaller and basically useless? I mean what's the point of sliding your finger upwards to change the shuttle speed when you can even make contact with the slider? It's the most awkward gesture in iOS7 IMO.
Quote:
Originally Posted by bloggerblog
I'm finding hard try and grab the video-slider on my iPhone 5 now that I upgraded to OS7. It tends to jump to a completely different position than where my finger is. This never happened with iOS 6, I wonder if this is an OS issue rather than a hardware/sensor issue.
Btw, I'm not a fan of the iPhone's new video-player UI, I find it too opaque and intrusive.
Comments
HPC
Makes sense since Nokia is in Finland
Gotcha
I have observed this issue when using the Maps application. Tapping the End button on the top left corner of the screen almost never responds. It is extremely frustrating.
Probably you are right. We know now, that Sammy pays students to write bogus articles against some competing products/companies, so why shouldn't they bribe a finnish company to fake some test results? To see the 100% perfect Galaxy3 test result besides the two iPhones, seems more than suspicious.
I am not sure how to read this report.
If you look at the touch map they provided for the phone it not only has an issue at the edges it has issues over most of the phone base on all the red dots. I am thinking something is fundamentally wrong. I think most would agree that Apple would not go from best to worst from one generation of products to the other. I also find it interesting that a whole group of people did not seem to think there was an issue and now that this has been pointed out they are say it explains their typing mistake. Maybe people have always made similar mistakes, but now that can blame it on something else other than themselves, why should people take responsibility for their actions.
If we are to believe this error map they provided then most everyone would be experiencing errors all over the display especially when playing games since you tend to use most of the display with games. At this point I am thinking apple changed something with the display that the calibrated finger no longer represents a touch which the digitizer recognized correctly, however, the digitizer still closely works with a real human finger.
I never thought my thumb was millimeter precise to begin with as a pointing instrument. Or put differently: when I type, I'm not hitting the on-screen keys with any real precision, I'm relying on autocorrect to do most of the heavy lifting, or alternatively, to take the blame for any weird things I end up typing
I agree with that. But that makes him (or her) arrogant and rude, not wrong.
Noting not experiencing a particular issue does not implicitly dispute the existence of the issue but rather adds to the numerical data of whether the issue is widespread or of a more limited nature. Otherwise the thing should just be locked down after the first post of the incident. My take is a real but of minor occurrence or real and very widespread occurrence of an item is a useful piece of information regarding an issue.
Having a different experience, perhaps based on different hardware or circumstances, doesn't attack anyone else's experience as invalid absent one boatload of defensiveness. Hence the acronym; YMMV
Is it possible that Apple applies some sort of correction? Since we are using fingers and thumbs, not precise styluses (as used in this test) to use our devices, that register as blobs on the screen rather than points, perhaps some kind of correction was needed to improve accuracy.
And likewise, if it really is a result of inaccuracy, couldn't it be corrected via software?
I think the moral of the story is that you should give robots a Samsung Galaxy S3, because they are capable of precision aim.
When I type on my iPhone 5 screen, I'm flying though it very quickly and there's hardly anything resembling sub-millimeter precision involved. I'm just stabbing at where my muscle memory thinks the buttons are--Apple did say they have predictive algorithms that dynamically expand and contract the target areas of each key based on what you've typed so far. And of course, Apple's excellent autocorrect comes in afterwards to clean up any lingering errors. Anyone who does a lot of rapid typing on iPhones knows what I'm talking about. (I jabbed this message out using my iPhone, for example.)
Noting not experiencing a particular issue does not implicitly dispute the existence of the issue but rather adds to the numerical data of whether the issue is widespread or of a more limited nature. Otherwise the thing should just be locked down after the first post of the incident. My take is a real but of minor occurrence or real and very widespread occurrence of an item is a useful piece of information regarding an issue.
Having a different experience, perhaps based on different hardware or circumstances, doesn't attack anyone else's experience as invalid absent one boatload of defensiveness. Hence the acronym; YMMV
So you're counting up all the defensive "no problem here" posts on the internet? Let me know when you are ready to publish your findings.
So Apple (or you) is 100% sure everyone will hold and tap the device at the angle they predict?
No, they cannot. But, they could make a few assumptions and work their way up.
Here is some background to the problem that the Steve Jobs patent tries to solve:
The http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parallax error (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parallax#Parallax_in_sights).
In order to make the test more believable, I would suggest the following improvements:
Each error measured is represented by a vector v=(x,y). That vector is mapped to HSL color space:
Hue = vector's angle = arctan (y / x),
Saturation = length of the vector = |v|
Lightness is fixed at 50%
Using that mapping, each tested pixel will get a color, making a map.
If that map contains noise (gradients are not smooth), then obviously and undeniably the iPhone 5S is faulty (display and/or OS processing is gravely incorrect).
If, however, the there is no noise, and gradients are smooth, then there is a consistency in the way touches are processed. And then, we have the Steve Jobs patent in action.
Instead, what we get is a gravely filtered data set. The direction of those error vectors is not preserved, and a threshold is set to map the magnitude of each vector to a binary (RED/GREEN) value. Both "techniques" strip meaningful information and introduce a huge error in the process of measuring those errors.
So, forgive me for being a bit sceptical on that topic, but what I see is pseudo science in action.
EDIT: I stand corrected! The research is not completely bogus. There is actually a meaningful image, the third one (http://cdn1.appleinsider.com/1025-touchaccuracy-3.jpg). It is an alternative representation of the map I described above. And it shows a significant consistency in the way touches are detected and processed. That image, however, goes directly against the conclusions of the research.
This test was done by idiots - or someone on the take from Samsung.
The edges have less sensitivity _by design_ so you don't accidentally press anything when holding the phone. This is software+hardware integration in action.
The fact that the Galaxy doesn't account for this and is showing even sensitivity across the surface just shows Samsung doesn't have a clue - or care - about how their users use their products.
I've never had any problem pressing Q, O or P.
Poster 'fenevadka' @ Cnet comment board posts this:
"Sometimes it helps to read the actual report rather than the article or other people’s comments.
If you look at page 4 of the report (http://www.optofidelity.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/OF_iPhone5C_vs_iPhone5C.pdf), there is a rather distinct and obvious pattern to the discrepancy that is absolutely consistent with the notion that it is a parallax correction at the OS level and not a sensor problem. It looks suspiciously like the correction you would expect for a device held primarily in the left hand and operated by the right hand.
Now it may be that the compensation amounts are wrong or too much or too little—and the user reports seem to indicate that too much correction at the edges may be the case here—but the idea of correcting for parallax is not a problem per se. Not correcting for parallax could be a bigger problem.
Assuming the results are valid, it doesn't tell us where the issue arises. My guess, again looking at the report and not just other people’s comments, is that the issue arises at a low level in the OS as it is processing the raw input stream from the screen. That is good news because if the correction amounts are wrong an OS update could easily correct them. If the problem was just a bad sensor, then nothing could fix it. (Well, theoretically, a software correction/calibration could do it, but random error distribution wouldn't make that easy.)"
One hundred posts in, and not one quip about sharpened fingers. You guys are losing your touch.
Synthetic testing like this rarely converts to real life application. I have to admit it does make me laugh when I read member making it sound like Samsung was the sponsor of this test. I doubt those same people had a problem with the testing methodology when the iPhone tested as having one of the most accurate touch screens in 2010.
Lets remember screen dynamics changed from 2010. In any case unless you are Lady Gaga that has her nails shaved to a 1mm point I doubt anyone is going to have any real problems. Everyone in my family has a 5s and the only problem I have is my fat finger hits the space bar.
Samsung makes very good hardware which is why Apple has used them for decades and will continue to use them. The problem with Samsung smartphones isn't the hardware it's the fact the put Android on it.
I'm finding it hard to try and grab the video-slider on my iPhone 5 now that I upgraded to iOS7. It tends to jump to a completely different position than where my finger is. This never happened with iOS 6, I wonder if this is an OS issue or maybe the slider is way too small to grab.
Btw, I'm not a fan of the iPhone's new video-player UI, I find it too opaque and intrusive.
This is funnier than the point you’re trying to make.
I dislike the slider in the music app too. ugh I guess no one ever scrolls through their music? Why did Apple's designers make it even smaller and basically useless? I mean what's the point of sliding your finger upwards to change the shuttle speed when you can even make contact with the slider? It's the most awkward gesture in iOS7 IMO.
Quote:
I'm finding hard try and grab the video-slider on my iPhone 5 now that I upgraded to OS7. It tends to jump to a completely different position than where my finger is. This never happened with iOS 6, I wonder if this is an OS issue rather than a hardware/sensor issue.
Btw, I'm not a fan of the iPhone's new video-player UI, I find it too opaque and intrusive.