Mac Pro teardown finds easy disassembly, great potential for repairs & upgrades

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  • Reply 41 of 81
    nhtnht Posts: 4,446member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by wizard69 View Post



    This advocacy is due directly to the GPU being far more important to the user experience than many realize. 

     

    Except this is demonstrably false given the really good user experience provided by the MBA, 13" MBP and minis using the older Intel IGPs that frankly sucked.  You couldn't game on these machines but for normal day to day use they worked really well.

  • Reply 42 of 81
    wizard69wizard69 Posts: 12,791member
    mretondo wrote: »
    Quote:
    "Non-proprietary Torx screws"

    Since when are Torx screws proprietary.
    You did quote ""Non-proprietary""!????????????????
    I've had a full set of Torx screw drivers and 3/8" sockets since the mid 70's. Enough already with this proprietary crap.
    Exactly; people whine about screws like they are something sacred or untouchable, they are screws nothing more involved than that. By the way, I can remember people whining about Torx screws in the day. The tune is almost exactly the same. In the end it is non sense because you can simply buy the hardware (tools) you need to do whatever. In the case of screwdrivers it is no big deal any ways as they get replaced often due to wear.
  • Reply 43 of 81

    WOW! what an idiot I am. I'm so use to reading "proprietary" that my mind ignored the "non" part. Thanks the catch:)

  • Reply 44 of 81
    pmzpmz Posts: 3,433member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Inkling View Post



    An iFixtt score of 8. That is impressive. It confirms my hunch that Apple has designers smart enough to design modular, easy to repair or upgrade hardware. All they need is an incentive. If they'd do the same for the MacBook Air, I might finally upgrade--and so would many others.



    It wouldn't be that hard to create a MBA whose back is held on by Torx screws. Remove them and everything likely to need repair or upgrading would be visible. Even the battery could be held in place by Velcro rather than glue. I hate glue.

    Just shows how little you understand about the products themselves. 

    Why is the MacBook Air basically non repairable or upgradable? To achieve the design. The over arching, more important aspect.

     

    Why is the Mac Pro repairable and upgradable? Because the design didn't get in the way of this. Its a side effect (according to some, a positive one), not an intended result.

     

    They have no reason to design products to be upgradeable or repairable. They have one goal: to make the best product. Not to make the best erector set.

  • Reply 45 of 81
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by mretondo View Post



    Quote:

    "Non-proprietary Torx screws"



    Since when are Torx screws proprietary. I've had a full set of Torx screw drivers and 3/8" sockets since the mid 70's. Enough already with this proprietary crap.

    It doesn't say proprietary, it says NON-Proprietary.

    Apple probably used Torx to discourage the average Joe Blow from tinkering with hardware that they may not be familiar with. I remember my first Mac (1984) didn't only come with Torx, but they screws were dug so deep that I had to literally get a long-Torx from a tech friend who worked at Apple.

  • Reply 46 of 81
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Stef View Post



    After a month of tech bloggers whining, whining, whining about how closed the Pro will be, it isn't. Surprise. Cue Leo Laporte.

    My first thought, too, Stef.

     

    To me, it shows Apple is in deed listening.

     

    Most of the negative comments on these message boards are just dross! :) 

  • Reply 47 of 81

    I know, I already replied to my stupid remark. Torx or allen screws aren't used to make it had for the average user. These screws give greater torque per surface area hence you can make a smaller screw head. They also don't strip as easily which matters when your making millions of things.

  • Reply 48 of 81

    In other news, iFixit's self-promoting tear-down robbed one Apple user from getting a Mac Pro before Dec 31.

  • Reply 49 of 81
    Mac Pro's HDMI is 1.4 ver. but now 2.0.
    HDMI Specification Ver.2.0 was released on September 4, 2013.
    HDMI 2.0, which is backwards compatible with earlier versions of the HDMI specifications, significantly increases bandwidth up to 18Gbps and adds key enhancements to support continuing market requirements for enhancing the consumer video and audio experience. New functionality includes:
    [email protected]/60, (2160p), which is 4 times the clarity of 1080p/60 video resolution

    HDMI 2.0
    – 2160p, 10/12 bits, 24/25/30Hz, RGB/4:2:2/4:4:4
    – 2160p, 10/12 bits, 50/60Hz, 4:2:0/4:2:2

    HDMI 1.4
    – 3840x2160 24Hz |25Hz |30Hz 4096x2160 24Hz
  • Reply 50 of 81
    mac_128mac_128 Posts: 3,429member
    pmz wrote: »
    They have no reason to design products to be upgradeable or repairable. They have one goal: to make the best product. Not to make the best erector set.
    Of course they do.

    But setting aside that debate for the moment, can you think of one reason why the Pro might be the only current Apple product that appears to be so easily upgradable?

    How about this: the Pro was on its deathbead, Apple almost dropping the platform completely. Who knows, if Jobs were still with us, that might have been the net result. Instead, years after it was already long in the tooth the Pro gets a highly upgradeable new design, one that will allow Apple to ignore it for several more years by allowing third parties to keep it relatively current until Apple is forced to deal with it again.

    The Pro is perhaps the most niche and expensive product in their offerings based on demand. What better strategy than create a design that will keep them free to focus on their core business of consumer products.
  • Reply 51 of 81
    virtuavirtua Posts: 207member
    And there is me thinking about the repair ability of my pocket if I got the top model ;p
  • Reply 52 of 81
    rogifanrogifan Posts: 10,669member
  • Reply 53 of 81
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by digitalclips View Post





    I can see no reason why two of the Taiwan-made GPUs couldn't be used, both with SSDs can you? Meanwhile, after finally wresting my Mac Pro from the evil clutches of UPS who seemed determined I'd never get it, it is gorgeous!



    BTW: I can now explain to all those that asked ... 'how on earth you can rotate its case with wires in, to light up the rear panel?' It seems to have a motion detector . The slightest movement of the Mac Pro lights it up. You can't put your fingers in the fan. It is silent, it is tiny, it is totally portable, expansion is a breeze, it hardly gets warm and it is wickedly fast. The overwhelming emotion it engenders is love. image

     

    digitclips, be sure and post your user review of the nMP. In fact, why not start a new thread "I received my nMP'. I have to wait until February for mine.

     

    What day did you receive yours?  On another site there were numerous horror stories of how UPS messed up nMP deliveries.

  • Reply 54 of 81
    solipsismxsolipsismx Posts: 19,566member
    The Mac Pro Review (Late 2013)


    [LIST]
    [*] http://www.anandtech.com/show/7603/mac-pro-review-late-2013
    [/LIST]
  • Reply 55 of 81
    malaxmalax Posts: 1,598member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by pmz View Post

     

    Just shows how little you understand about the products themselves. 

    Why is the MacBook Air basically non repairable or upgradable? To achieve the design. The over arching, more important aspect.

     

    Why is the Mac Pro repairable and upgradable? Because the design didn't get in the way of this. Its a side effect (according to some, a positive one), not an intended result.

     

    They have no reason to design products to be upgradeable or repairable. They have one goal: to make the best product. Not to make the best erector set.


     

    Exactly right.  All design is about selecting among compromises to achieve some desired end.  If Apple could make the MBA just as small, light, and strong and offer the same performance while making it more user-serviceable... they probably wouldn't.  Instead they would choose to make it a tiny bit smaller or lighter.  Improving a "repairability score" of 2 to 3 is essentially worthless, while improving the "carriability score" from 9.5 to 9.6 is good stuff.  Apply the same logic to the new Mac Pro and the value proposition is completely different.  People aren't going to pay $3K+ for a desktop computer that can't be upgraded, so Apple puts a high emphasis on that design requirement.

     

    Or one could just ignore reality/physics and just assert that of course Apple could make the current MBA and make it "more repairable" without compromising anywhere.

  • Reply 56 of 81
    MacProMacPro Posts: 18,225member
    digitclips, be sure and post your user review of the nMP. In fact, why not start a new thread "I received my nMP'. I have to wait until February for mine.

    What day did you receive yours?  On another site there were numerous horror stories of how UPS messed up nMP deliveries.

    I retrieved mine Monday morning, several days late. I posted my UPS horror story on MacRumors, I didn't think the gentlefolk of AI would want to hear such stuff ;) Bottom line use FedEx.

    OK some chit chat of the goings on. The fancy reports are all over the web but here is the dirty stuff we all need to do ... Mine is a 6 Core just so you know, for comparison. I am still transferring data from several other Macs on to my Mac Pro's new external 6 GIG TB RAID. I used CCC for the system SSD copy rather than migration assistant as I always get ACL screw ups with that. I also have the dev version of 10.9.2 on a Mac mini I wanted to try and as both only 256 GIG SSDs CCC did this in 15 minutes using TB to TB (as opposed to nearly two hours via FW 800).

    Sucking data from a 2009 MacBook Pro's 1 TB 5400 RPM HD via FW 800 with a TB converter is painful, especially a 350 GIG Aperture Library and several VMWare VMs. Those two things are the worst to copy I have ever come across. I tried various methods, in the end deciding on Target Mode. Target Mode with Thunderbolt is a whole new world to me. I twice ended up with the targeted Mac, in this case a 2013 Mac mini, on the screen because I'd put the cables in too soon. Can't do that over FW even if you wanted to!

    Tips ... remember to buy a Thunderbolt 2 M cable and a FW to TB converter to get all the stuff off your old Macs. Also set up old mice on older machines you are stealing the Magic Mouse from for the new nMP... you can paint yourself into an annoying corner if you forget as I did ... LOL. I also have put control from nMP using ADR on 2 MBPs and 1 Mac mini running 10.9 Server, it is amazingly responsive on the nMP.

    While all this transferring is going on I have tried PS CS6 which is like lightning and HD 1080p in FCP X, which is silly fast. I stress, all while copying massive files at the same time. I also tried FCPro 7 out of curiosity, which works, but no filters or effects show up and it can't use a second TB monitor. I will look into the filters when I get time. I also have been having a tough time with Logic Pro X which has all the loops etc. copied over to avoid re downloading 30 GIGs however, it won't start without downloading everything again so no opportunity to relink the loops. This seems silly. Worse it says 8 days to download! I have FiOS 75 Mb/s. I tried on my Mac mini and it said 2 hours to download so something wacky going on there. The only other thing I've tried is Compressor 4.1 and hit it with a nasty test, converting NTSC to HD 1080p with all the stops on quality pulled out. Something that would have taken days for me before, took half an hour, and still copying VMWare VMs at same time. Once over VMware running Wincrap 7, and 8.1 extremely fast and responsively. Only game I tried so far is a very complex Trainz set up with 8 locos running and every option setting at max quality with snow falling. Smooth as silk on full 27" screen. Zero stutter.

    OK back to trying to figure out WTF is up with Logic Pro X! :)

    Happy (and Healthy) New Year everybody.
  • Reply 57 of 81
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by pmz View Post

     

    They have no reason to design products to be upgradeable or repairable. They have one goal: to make the best product. Not to make the best erector set.


     

    You're assuming some nasty motives at Apple--products that are intentionally unfixable so users have to buy another sooner than otherwise. I prefer to assume that they're open to their customers's needs. My now aging white MacBook is certainly easy to upgrade, and I happen to think it's a better product for that. And I think that keeping Macs alive longer means they'll be used by more people and create more Mac customers in the long run. A kid who gets given his mom's old MBA when he's in school is likely to want a new one when he goes off to college.

     

    I also don't believe that the "best product" means it can't be upgradable. In fact, I believe the opposite. Would a Mercedes or a BMW be better cars if it were impossible to repair them? No, a product as sophisticated as a car or a laptop that can't be easily fixed can't be the best by definition. It can be disabled by the failure of a ten-cent part.

     

    I've worked in electronics and I understand there are tradeoffs. Plugged-in RAM is more reliable in a desktop that sits on a table that it is in a laptop that gets bounced around. Maybe Apple should use soldered in RAM in a MBA. But maybe it should ship with some RAM soldered in and some upgradable with a slot. After all, if there's a problem with easily accessed RAM, it can be reseated.

     

    Upgradability also makes for more customers. One reason I've not upgraded to a MBA is the limited, pricey, and non-upgradable RAM options. As soon as I bought my Mac mini, I upgraded it to 16 Gig of RAM, and I did so for less than I could add a mere 4 Gig more to a MBA. Apple can certainly do better than that. Gross overpricing doesn't make something better.

     

    I'm not an Apple fanboy, but I try to be open-minded. I suspect that, if some of my suggestions are taken seriously by Apple and become part of the next generation of laptops, these people criticizing me now would quickly adopt repairability as yet another reason why Apple products are better.

     

    And keep in mind that I'm a writer. For me, computers are not collectables to be admired. They're tools to be used. A broken tool is useless. A tool I can't upgrade and improve is almost useless.

     

    --Michael W. Perry, Chesterton on War and Peace: Battling the Ideas and Movements that Led to Nazism and World War II

  • Reply 58 of 81
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Inkling View Post



    An iFixtt score of 8. That is impressive. It confirms my hunch that Apple has designers smart enough to design modular, easy to repair or upgrade hardware. All they need is an incentive. If they'd do the same for the MacBook Air, I might finally upgrade--and so would many others.



    It wouldn't be that hard to create a MBA whose back is held on by Torx screws. Remove them and everything likely to need repair or upgrading would be visible. Even the battery could be held in place by Velcro rather than glue. I hate glue.

    Velcro? You must be kidding.

  • Reply 59 of 81
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by StruckPaper View Post

     

    Velcro? You must be kidding.


     

    I'm merely making a suggestion. If Apple is true to form, they might find a new product that beats the socks off both glue and Velcro. What I want most is no glued in batteries.

     

    Keep in mind the advantages of Velcro:

     

    1. It can be easily reused even in the factory or for repairs at Apple stores. Glue is a bit too permanent and messy. It virtually defines tacky.

     

    2. A Velcro pad roughly the size of a MBA's battery would have far more holding power than needed. You'd probably need both hands to remove it.

     

    3. Velcro is inherently shock absorbing and its traits are automatically defined. Glue will only absorb shock if it's used to a consistent thickness, something not always that easy to do on an assembly line.

     

    To quote someone we know:

     


    Quote:


     Here’s to the crazy ones. The misfits. The rebels. The troublemakers. The round pegs in the square holes. The ones who see things differently. They’re not fond of rules. And they have no respect for the status quo. You can quote them, disagree with them, glorify or vilify them. About the only thing you can’t do is ignore them. Because they change things. They push the human race forward. And while some may see them as the crazy ones, we see genius. Because the people who are crazy enough to think they can change the world, are the ones who do. - Apple Inc.



     

    Actually a lot of round pegs in square holes are not only forgotten, they're gladly forgotten. Victoria Woodhull, the first woman to run for President (1872), is a good example. Little of what she wrote about eugenics and promiscuity can be said to have pushed the "human race forward." At best, she was merely one of the first to popularize cruel and destructive ideas such as forced sterilization and the state control of child rearing. Even her own sister disagreed with her. But that's beside the point.

     

    --Michael W. Perry, editor of Free Lover & Lady Eugenist (two collections of Woodhull's speeches and writings)

  • Reply 60 of 81
    stevehsteveh Posts: 480member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by earthend99 View Post



    Mac Pro's HDMI is 1.4 ver. but now 2.0.

    HDMI Specification Ver.2.0 was released on September 4, 2013.

     

    When you think the Mac Pro's design had to be frozen so that production and shipping might happen around the end of the year?

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