Sure, you need him until he gets what he wants and sells all his AAPL and walks away with a fat bank account. Or until his proposal gets voted down and he sells all his AAPL and walks away in search of another corporation with fat coffers that he can raid. Either way, he is not in it for the long hall, he is not in it out of concern for other stockholders, he is in it only to further enrich himself. Sometimes he wins, sometimes he loses, but all times he walks away.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil
Sell your stock now and go back to being a day trader.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lord Amhran
And people who actually care about the company and it's long-term future should ignore people like you and Ichan and vote no on his proposal.
Everyone invests in stocks to make money/get rich, right? I do not think anyone holds stocks because they are married to it! Many people bought it at 10s in early years and are still holding it. They will keep on holding it forever. Many got in at 300 and sold above 600. Many are still holding this bag under loss, so as long as you are making big gains irrespective of time period 1 year or 10 years it does not matter. Do not get married to TECHNOLOGY stocks
Tip- This is a technology stock and it's years are numbered in terms of growth and rising stock price. Do not think in terms of holding this stock forever, otherwise this market will make you remember this story ------> " Who Moved My Cheese" " src="http://forums-files.appleinsider.com/images/smilies//lol.gif" />
I am not sure that capitalism requires companies to be publicly traded. In fact I would think that the entire stock market system is something of a leach on the system and just like labor unions they once served a valuable purpose but have long since outgrown their initial function to take on a life of their own which retains only a glimmer of the original purpose.
In case that is not clear - in the case of unions, they came about at a time when working conditions and worker compensation was horrendous and things like considering it acceptable for some number of workers to die for each floor of a building or span of bridge built where common place. Unions provided a mechanism or means for the workers to have leverage against management, but how far has that leverage been moved since and past a point of balance they become the oppressors. In the case of publicly traded stock, there was a time when you did not need an IPO to start or build or expand a company. Publicly traded stock gives a company a way to fund things that might not be possible through more traditional means, whether from profits or borrowed money or private investors. But at what point does the tail wag the dog?
You're absolute right. In addition, the unions were also necessary because "In the last election of the 19th century, the Presidential Election Of 1896, the corporate plutocrats of the time period—John D. Rockefeller, Andrew Carnegie, J P Morgan—gave financial support to the Republican Presidential nominee, William McKinley, to defeat Democratic nominee William Jennings Bryan, and threatened their workers with lost jobs and closed down industries if Bryan won."
If your understood anything about finance you would understand that people like Carl Icahn and me want to what's best for Apple. You do know that Apple pays a 2.2% dividend to every shareholder, right? Do you also know that Apple can borrow money for the same rate or less? Apple has a small window of opportunity here with market conditions being what they are to do something brilliant for the company and the shareholders. They could literally take 1/3 of the shares off the market and never have to pay a dividend on those shares again. The can use the money they are saving on paying the divined to those retired shares to pay the interest on the debt ENTIRELY. That is called a net neutral carry -- no carry cost for retiring a third of your outstanding shares. Apple should have done this when Icahn suggested it and the shares would have been much cheaper, but it still works at this level. Soon interest rates will be higher and so will Apples share price and this great capital structure move will no longer be available to Apple. If they don't continue to do it (they already did it once in a smaller fashion) they are complete idiots. Apple is crushing it right now. They just had a massive quarter and will have a massive 2014. By the time all the idiot institutional investors figure this out it will be too late because the stock price will be too high. Apple could pay off 150 billion in debt in 3.5 years with free cash flow without even dipping into their war chest of 150 billion (that is probably already 160-165 billion). Does Apple need more than 165 billion for acquisitions and R & D? Come on, get serious. The only way they would is if they are planning something massive like taking over content delivery into the home. But, if they don't do something massive and keep making penny anti acquisitions over the next couple of years AND they don't do this capital structure deal then the investment community will write them off as being financially obtuse -- which many already believe they are.
I wouldn't call an activist investor a leech. The Apple board was asleep at the switch until Einhorn and Icahn set a fire under their greedy, lazy asses.
I wouldn't call an activist investor a leech. The Apple board was asleep at the switch until Einhorn and Icahn set a fire under their greedy, lazy asses.
Crazy Carl is doing this to line his own pockets. He doesn't care about Apple, he cares about $$$. How is the Board greedy? By keeping the money for Apple? Once Apple reaches his target price, he's gone.
If your understood anything about finance you would understand that people like Carl Icahn and me want to what's best for Apple.
The problem is that you don't understand that people like most of us here love Apple for its products, not its "finance". I hope very much that Ichan's proposition will be defeated.
Don't take your focus off Apple! We shareholders need you! Clearly the board and Tim Cook don't care how the call option sellers manipulate the stock to ridiculously low valuations. We need a strong WALL STREET bull to bully these market manipulators out of the stock. These west cost techie nerds have no idea how to play the game which is why they toss Apple stock around like a drunkin' hooker. I will be voting YES on your proxy and so should everyone else that wants to make money being long Apple stock.
I'll be voting against the interests of Carl and his lot.
Carl Icahn is a fool for wasting his time with Apple. He could pick any tech stock name out of a hat and find a better performing stock. Tim Cook is practically useless as a CEO. A company with all that reserve cash and yet Tim Cook can't figure out how to boost shareholder value by normal means except for some financial sleight-of-hand with buybacks. Where are all these products that Apple is supposed to be selling.
I read all these stories of how Apple is leading in this and that category but every time I look at the share price it's dropping lower and lower just like it did last year. It's been a whole year and yet Tim Cook hasn't learned a darn thing except how to make Apple's share price go lower. It's bad enough he's a wuss, but he's making the whole company look incompetent while the rest of the tech stocks are soaring. Even loss leader H-P is gaining in share value while canning employees left and right. Apple's share performance is downright feeble. I hope Apple has been buying up shares like a maniac while the stock plummets.
Oh, and Happy New Year everyone, except for Apple shareholders whose new year is turning out just like last year.
100 percent with Icahn. This Wall Street naive apple board let this stock drop to 385 last year and did nothing. Unless you want to tak that ride again and appl has dropped 30 points last week, I am going with Icahn all the way
100 percent with Icahn. This Wall Street naive apple board let this stock drop to 385 last year and did nothing. Unless you want to tak that ride again and appl has dropped 30 points last week, I am going with Icahn all the way
And most shorts I know are so happy that Apple told shareholder to vote against Icahn. And were scared to death when Cook was meeting with Icahn. Think about that for a second...
And most shorts I know are so happy that Apple told shareholder to vote against Icahn. And were scared to death when Cook was meeting with Icahn. Think about that for a second...
I am Apple Bull and I want that useless board to be shaken with few getting toasted out but regarding the "most shorts" which you are talking is pure a BS. Look at the short interest in this name.
Problem here in Apple is not the shorts (This name needs tons of short sellers lol) but the Pigs AKA Bulltards/Gamblers (Do Not mix them with Bulls) who are buying calls every week as if there is no tomorrow (AKA no brainer trade).
Market Makers rules and they do not want every Tom Dlck and Harry to make the money and they lose being a call writers.
One more big issue is Float of Shares which needs to come down significantly by buybacks!
Only way Apple can screw these manipulating Media/analyst/naysayers is to give a big blowout earnings like Facebook (FB) did in July 2013 (Intermediate term).
Comments
Sure, you need him until he gets what he wants and sells all his AAPL and walks away with a fat bank account. Or until his proposal gets voted down and he sells all his AAPL and walks away in search of another corporation with fat coffers that he can raid. Either way, he is not in it for the long hall, he is not in it out of concern for other stockholders, he is in it only to further enrich himself. Sometimes he wins, sometimes he loses, but all times he walks away.
Sell your stock now and go back to being a day trader.
And people who actually care about the company and it's long-term future should ignore people like you and Ichan and vote no on his proposal.
Everyone invests in stocks to make money/get rich, right? I do not think anyone holds stocks because they are married to it! Many people bought it at 10s in early years and are still holding it. They will keep on holding it forever. Many got in at 300 and sold above 600. Many are still holding this bag under loss, so as long as you are making big gains irrespective of time period 1 year or 10 years it does not matter. Do not get married to TECHNOLOGY stocks
Tip- This is a technology stock and it's years are numbered in terms of growth and rising stock price. Do not think in terms of holding this stock forever, otherwise this market will make you remember this story ------> " Who Moved My Cheese"
" src="http://forums-files.appleinsider.com/images/smilies//lol.gif" />
You're absolute right. In addition, the unions were also necessary because "In the last election of the 19th century, the Presidential Election Of 1896, the corporate plutocrats of the time period—John D. Rockefeller, Andrew Carnegie, J P Morgan—gave financial support to the Republican Presidential nominee, William McKinley, to defeat Democratic nominee William Jennings Bryan, and threatened their workers with lost jobs and closed down industries if Bryan won."
Reference http://www.theprogressiveprofessor.com/?p=20054
When is the vote on the Icahn proposal?
If your understood anything about finance you would understand that people like Carl Icahn and me want to what's best for Apple. You do know that Apple pays a 2.2% dividend to every shareholder, right? Do you also know that Apple can borrow money for the same rate or less? Apple has a small window of opportunity here with market conditions being what they are to do something brilliant for the company and the shareholders. They could literally take 1/3 of the shares off the market and never have to pay a dividend on those shares again. The can use the money they are saving on paying the divined to those retired shares to pay the interest on the debt ENTIRELY. That is called a net neutral carry -- no carry cost for retiring a third of your outstanding shares. Apple should have done this when Icahn suggested it and the shares would have been much cheaper, but it still works at this level. Soon interest rates will be higher and so will Apples share price and this great capital structure move will no longer be available to Apple. If they don't continue to do it (they already did it once in a smaller fashion) they are complete idiots. Apple is crushing it right now. They just had a massive quarter and will have a massive 2014. By the time all the idiot institutional investors figure this out it will be too late because the stock price will be too high. Apple could pay off 150 billion in debt in 3.5 years with free cash flow without even dipping into their war chest of 150 billion (that is probably already 160-165 billion). Does Apple need more than 165 billion for acquisitions and R & D? Come on, get serious. The only way they would is if they are planning something massive like taking over content delivery into the home. But, if they don't do something massive and keep making penny anti acquisitions over the next couple of years AND they don't do this capital structure deal then the investment community will write them off as being financially obtuse -- which many already believe they are.
I wouldn't call an activist investor a leech. The Apple board was asleep at the switch until Einhorn and Icahn set a fire under their greedy, lazy asses.
Crazy Carl is doing this to line his own pockets. He doesn't care about Apple, he cares about $$$. How is the Board greedy? By keeping the money for Apple? Once Apple reaches his target price, he's gone.
Apple already has a buy back program.
The problem is that you don't understand that people like most of us here love Apple for its products, not its "finance". I hope very much that Ichan's proposition will be defeated.
I'll be voting against the interests of Carl and his lot.
I read all these stories of how Apple is leading in this and that category but every time I look at the share price it's dropping lower and lower just like it did last year. It's been a whole year and yet Tim Cook hasn't learned a darn thing except how to make Apple's share price go lower. It's bad enough he's a wuss, but he's making the whole company look incompetent while the rest of the tech stocks are soaring. Even loss leader H-P is gaining in share value while canning employees left and right. Apple's share performance is downright feeble. I hope Apple has been buying up shares like a maniac while the stock plummets.
Oh, and Happy New Year everyone, except for Apple shareholders whose new year is turning out just like last year.
Icahn.
100 percent with Icahn. This Wall Street naive apple board let this stock drop to 385 last year and did nothing. Unless you want to tak that ride again and appl has dropped 30 points last week, I am going with Icahn all the way
Icahn will be roundly outvoted by longs.
Icahn will be roundly outvoted by longs.
Remember this----> If stock performance is poor from now till the Vote----> It's Game over for the Apple board!
So sell and leave us alone. You don’t comprehend the stock; don’t invest in it.
Apple was dead in the water until when last year until Icahn got involved. If you thought that was a coincidence, I got a orange bridge for sale.
And most shorts I know are so happy that Apple told shareholder to vote against Icahn. And were scared to death when Cook was meeting with Icahn. Think about that for a second...
The Brooklyn Bridge is orange now?
And most shorts I know are so happy that Apple told shareholder to vote against Icahn. And were scared to death when Cook was meeting with Icahn. Think about that for a second...
I am Apple Bull and I want that useless board to be shaken with few getting toasted out but regarding the "most shorts" which you are talking is pure a BS. Look at the short interest in this name.
Problem here in Apple is not the shorts (This name needs tons of short sellers lol) but the Pigs AKA Bulltards/Gamblers (Do Not mix them with Bulls) who are buying calls every week as if there is no tomorrow (AKA no brainer trade).
Market Makers rules and they do not want every Tom Dlck and Harry to make the money and they lose being a call writers.
One more big issue is Float of Shares which needs to come down significantly by buybacks!
Only way Apple can screw these manipulating Media/analyst/naysayers is to give a big blowout earnings like Facebook (FB) did in July 2013 (Intermediate term).