Apple's holiday Mac shipments outpaced PC growth by largest margin in 5 years

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Comments

  • Reply 21 of 50

    LOTUS 1-2-3 

    They use VisiCalc correct?

  • Reply 22 of 50
    clemynxclemynx Posts: 1,512member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by jungmark View Post



    Doomed. Rules of Apple punditry:

    1. Apple is doomed.

    2. Bad news for others is actually worse news for Apple

    3. Good news for Apple is actually bad news

    4. Only Apple needs revolutionary products

    5. Apple must maintain margins AND sell no-profit phones.



    6. Good news for others, even those who have nothing to do with Apple, is bad news for Apple.

    7. Any news, whatever the subject, is bad news for Apple.

    8. Only Apple needs to innovate.

    9. Bigger is always better.

    10. More is always better.

  • Reply 23 of 50
    auxioauxio Posts: 2,416member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by phalanx View Post

     

    For corporations and for most home users, isn't it about dollars and cents.   Corporations look at the laptop or computer as a tool to produce work (i.e. spreadsheets, docs, etc.)  They want a reliable platform to do that work.  They don't see the return for the additional cost of a Mac.  It is that simple.   We tried some Apple products at our corporation.  The results were a lot of extra cost on monitors and devices and productivity no different.  In fact, many people used the iPads for virtual desktops for Windows.    If money is no object, Apple products are fun and useful!!!  


     

    The big problem is that the people buying and using Macs still only see the world painted PC.  Where you see the cost savings on Macs is when you stop using PC software and use Apple software.

     

    For example, people will get a Mac and then demand that MS Office is installed when, in many cases, they could switch to using iWork + Mac Mail + Calendar + Contacts (which integrate just fine with MS Exchange nowadays).  Or worse, they'll get a Mac and then just use MS Windows on it (and thus have to pay for all the same software as PCs).  But most don't know this and/or aren't willing to learn something new.  And the IT support staff are simply trained to support MS products (MCSE-heads), so they can't help either.

  • Reply 24 of 50
    clemynxclemynx Posts: 1,512member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by auxio View Post

     

     

    The big problem is that the people buying and using Macs still only see the world painted PC.  Where you see the cost savings on Macs is when you stop using PC software and use Apple software.

     

    For example, people will get a Mac and then demand that MS Office is installed when, in many cases, they could switch to using iWork + Mac Mail + Calendar + Contacts (which integrate just fine with MS Exchange nowadays).  Or worse, they'll get a Mac and then just use MS Windows on it (and thus have to pay for all the same software as PCs).  But most don't know this and/or aren't willing to learn something new.  And the IT support staff are simply trained to support MS products (MSCE-heads), so they can't help either.




    iWork isn't competitive enough with Office for the professional world. Word has a lot more features and integration with the rest of the suite. Excel can manage a lot bigger spreadsheets without slowing down like Numbers does. Powerpoint... well, from what I know, that one is a lot inferior to Keynote.

     

    And Apple has nothing close to Exchange. It's one of the main reasons people use other MS products. Active directory, Exchange, SQL Server, and Windows Server. Apple doesn't offer all that unfortunately.

  • Reply 25 of 50
    auxioauxio Posts: 2,416member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by ClemyNX View Post

     



    iWork isn't competitive enough with Office for the professional world. Word has a lot more features and integration with the rest of the suite. Excel can manage a lot bigger spreadsheets without slowing down like Numbers does. Powerpoint... well, from what I know, that one is a lot inferior to Keynote.


     

    But the vast majority of people using Office aren't using the advanced features.  I'll give you Excel being far superior to Numbers, but not everyone works in finance.  Pages is just fine for what most people do with a word processor.  And Keynote is much better than Powerpoint.

     

    Quote:

    And Apple has nothing close to Exchange. It's one of the main reasons people use other MS products. Active directory, Exchange, SQL Server, and Windows Server. Apple doesn't offer all that unfortunately.


     

    And that's fine, use MS Exchange on the server side.  I agree, Apple doesn't do server-side well.

     

    However, on the client side, Mac Mail + Contacts + Calendar can interact with the Exchange server just fine for the vast majority of people.  For people on iPads/iPhones within an organization, that's essentially what they're using.  The only time I ever need to go back to Outlook personally is for 3rd party meeting resources which use an Outlook plugin (voice bridges, etc).  Avoid those types of things, and you're ok.

  • Reply 26 of 50
    sudonym wrote: »
    I never trust analysts.  They just rely on guesswork.

    Unless they say something one already believes, then it's Truth, with a capital T. ;)
  • Reply 27 of 50
    macxpress wrote: »
    Either way, Apple is doomed. I haven't seen any signs of doomness, but Apple is still doomed somehow. 

    I prefer Doominess as the noun version of Doomed.
  • Reply 28 of 50
    "which has not been immune to consumer adoption of touchscreen tablets such as the iPad"

    Odd locution. Apple caused that adoption and benefits from it.
  • Reply 29 of 50
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by jungmark View Post



    Doomed. Rules of Apple punditry:

    1. Apple is doomed.

    2. Bad news for others is actually worse news for Apple

    3. Good news for Apple is actually bad news

    4. Only Apple needs revolutionary products

    5. Apple must maintain margins AND sell no-profit phones.

     

    jungmark nailed it.

  • Reply 30 of 50
    clemynxclemynx Posts: 1,512member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by auxio View Post

     

     

    But the vast majority of people using Office aren't using the advanced features.  I'll give you Excel being far superior to Numbers, but not everyone works in finance.  Pages is just fine for what most people do with a word processor.  And Keynote is much better than Powerpoint.

     

     

    And that's fine, use MS Exchange on the server side.  I agree, Apple doesn't do server-side well.

     

    However, on the client side, Mac Mail + Contacts + Calendar can interact with the Exchange server just fine for the vast majority of people.  For people on iPads/iPhones within an organization, that's essentially what they're using.  The only time I ever need to go back to Outlook personally is for 3rd party meeting resources which use an Outlook plugin (voice bridges, etc).  Avoid those types of things, and you're ok.


     

    I agree that a vast majority of Word users use it for baby stuff. They could even benefit from using Pages which motivates people to use better and different fonts. It's just that in my company we REALLY need stuff to work seamlessly. And I think it would be very difficult to move away from the integration of Office with Exchange, and change the whole infrastructure.

    Apple has to make an effort, if it's not already, in entering in the small businesses. It's already installing itself in schools. This is a pretty slow process compared to how fast the tech world moves usually. We'll have to wait a few years to see how that influences the market. But some people have accused Apple of being slow to react to business and that it doesn't always give all the tools people need in the work space. In the end, the pro world doesn't really need something that works intuitively and is beautiful, even if it does the work. They need something that gives them everything they want, immediately. And Apple doesn't know how to do that. It goes against the way they work. And that's fine. That's why I perfectly see a world with Apple products being used mostly at home, and MS still being the main provider for enterprise. MS has become obsolete for the mass market, but will remain in the pro world.

    I know what I'm saying is nothing new and lots of people have said the same before.

  • Reply 31 of 50
    I went to a meeting the other day. The computers used at the meeting were two windows laptops, a MacBook Air 13" and an iPad. Both windows laptops were constantly connected to the mains whilst both Apple products went through the whole meeting on their battery. That is why Apple products are being used more and more by business as well as consumers.
  • Reply 32 of 50
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by phalanx View Post

    ...Corporations look at the laptop or computer as a tool... want a reliable platform... don't see the return for the additional cost of a Mac.  It is that simple.....

     

    Last time I needed to buy hardware to run Win7, I compared the specs of available units, and the iMac came out $50 cheaper. Bought it, installed Bootcamp and a legal copy of Win7, and was off to the races. Hardware has been supremely reliable. And we got MacOS and affiliated software free, allowing us to boot into MacOS occasionally for other purposes. The Apple hardware was thus cheaper and far more flexible than any comparably-equipped competitor.  Period.  It was that simple.

  • Reply 33 of 50
    jfc1138jfc1138 Posts: 3,090member
    "In fact, many people used the iPads for virtual desktops for Windows."

    How?
  • Reply 34 of 50
    auxioauxio Posts: 2,416member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by ClemyNX View Post

     

    And I think it would be very difficult to move away from the integration of Office with Exchange, and change the whole infrastructure.


     

    Apple knows they don't offer anything competitive to Microsoft on the server side, and I honestly believe they're just not interested in server-side for various reasons (margins are low, need to have support staff training programs, etc).  So yeah, no need to make any changes on the server side.

     

    However, because of iOS, Apple has put a ton of effort into making their client-side software work well with Exchange.  This has made it's way back to OS X in the past couple of releases.  I've been using OS X in a Microsoft environment for years, and I can honestly say that the integration at this point in time has finally reached the point where it can cover most people's needs.

     

    Quote:

    In the end, the pro world doesn't really need something that works intuitively and is beautiful, even if it does the work. They need something that gives them everything they want, immediately. And Apple doesn't know how to do that. It goes against the way they work. And that's fine. That's why I perfectly see a world with Apple products being used mostly at home, and MS still being the main provider for enterprise. MS has become obsolete for the mass market, but will remain in the pro world.

     

    Those of us in the pro world who have taken the time to learn about all technologies (and the history of them) know that most of Microsoft's server-side technologies are actually based on open standards developed on UNIX systems long before Microsoft became the dominant player in the corporate server market.

     

    Admittedly, they certainly have the nicest packaging and best support infrastructure, but if you can find a few experienced UNIX server admins, you could do the same thing for a lot cheaper with a UNIX-based server infrastructure.  Not beautiful, not easy to use, but just as powerful in the right hands (if not moreso in many situations).  This is likely another major reason why Apple got out of the server-side market: given that OS X is based on BSD UNIX, it's hard to be price-competitive with a Linux or free BSD variant server.

  • Reply 35 of 50
    rob53 wrote: »
    I'm Apple all the way and am happy Macs are growing faster than PCs (actually growing instead of falling) but graphs like these are why I hate graphs. Going from 2.1% to 5.5% worldwide marketshare in 8 years is the most critical information mentioned in this article. Tons of people are still buying Windows PCs, not Macs, and until Macs are closer to 50% of the mix, Apple is still behind. iOS devices are secondary computers for many people and they are killing Microsoft devices but now they have to fight Android garbage. Twist and turn the numbers any way you want then use them to justify an article just doesn't make it. It's the same garbage analysts use when talking about increases made by Apple competitors. Their sales go up 100% while Apple's only goes up 5% but Apple is talking about millions of units sold while the others are talking about thousands. Statistics are always used to justify someone's position but rarely mean everything.

    I am very happy Macs are still selling into every market although I wish they were selling more into the government (one of the largest continuous buyers of PCs).

    Apple rules the platinum end of the PC retail market. That's all you need to know. The barrier is price, because Apple doesn't ship junk. Macs are the best the market has to offer, they are also the most PROFITABLE in the PC biz, and they rule consumer satisfaction for nearly a decade now.

    Apple won the PC wars by doing a vertical business model RIGHT.

    Want a Mac? Great. Be prepared to pay, because quality and attention to detail like THAT doesn't come at Acer or Dell prices. Otherwise, get an iPad and get the best tablet you can get.
  • Reply 36 of 50
    Analysts are like donuts - fat with a hole in the middle.

    They think that Apple will ditch the Mac in favor of iPads. How then, dear analysts, do you think that any iPad or iPhone apps would be developed ?? Would Apple license OS X to run, say, on Dell or HP machines ??

    Get a clue, people.

    Rule #1: start brain before putting mouth in gear.
  • Reply 37 of 50
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by plovell View Post



    <..>



    Rule #1: start brain before putting mouth in gear.

     

     

    What if the brain used to be in the hole ?

  • Reply 38 of 50
    Originally Posted by Hydrogen View Post

    What if the brain used to be in the hole ?


     

    Then it’s either a toad or the kinkiest sex I’ve ever heard of.

  • Reply 39 of 50

    Our sales guys are taking iPads on the road now and our dealers are using iPads to deliver our in-house content. Our in-house software programmer, who was a PC user for years, tossed his PC in favor of a Mac Mini. There is a halo effect going on. On the other hand, there are a lot of old codgers who won't switch, which means that instead of running Windows on a Mac laptop and running superior Mac-only apps such as Keynote, our creative marketing support folks have to create specially hobbled versions of presentations in PowerPoint format just for them.  

  • Reply 40 of 50
    plovell wrote: »
    Analysts are like donuts - fat with a hole in the middle.

    They think that Apple will ditch the Mac in favor of iPads. How then, dear analysts, do you think that any iPad or iPhone apps would be developed ?? Would Apple license OS X to run, say, on Dell or HP machines ??

    Get a clue, people.

    Rule #1: start brain before putting mouth in gear.

    Rule #2: remove foot from said mouth.
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