Stealing music because you don’t have the money to buy it… IS.
I don't think stealing it is the only other option. Personally I do an All-I-Can-Eat All-Access Music subscription. I don't see $1 or more a song to be an attractive way of feeding my music fix, particularly when there's really not all that much music I wish to "own" ....
which in the strictest sense you really don't anyway if you're buying from iTunes or Amazon or Google Music. Even worse there's been reported instances of purchased iTunes and Amazon content pulled from their stores making what should have been a re-download of your legally purchased media impossible.
My point was though that if the market isn't offering what consumers want to buy, then that is not the fault of the consumers.
Of course not.
Originally Posted by Gatorguy
I don't think stealing it is the only other option.
Nor I. Just about the only option that gets content creators any amount of money, however, is buying songs.
Even worse there's been reported instances of purchased iTunes and Amazon content pulled from their stores making what should have been a re-download of your legally purchased media impossible.
That’s why you don’t trust the cloud. Ever. Local copies always. Period. Until the psychosis is removed and this never happens again.
Exclusive content is definitely the only way Apple will attract users.
It needs to fix the user experience of finding and getting music. My two daughters used to be very regular users (wife somewhat less) of getting their music there. All three abandoned it due to the cluttered interface and generally cluttered experience once they realized there were other places they could do what they wanted with less effort.
Me? I'm just tired of having to download and delete again those three live Rolling Stones songs over and over again every time I go to another device.
You tube is making a much bigger difference than a lot of people think. My wife and daughter used to get me to buy them a lot of music that I'd otherwise never look into (different tastes), but they don't ask very much at all anymore because almost all of it is on Youtube for free. I know plenty of people who use Youtube as their primary audio source for their living room audio systems too. I was taken aback when I saw it, think the audio quality would be really bad. In a normal room, with people and other ambient sounds, it's more than good enough as background music during a party and such.
Also I laughed quite hard at 'get a job'. As if not buying enough music is the consumer's fault instead of a bad market.
It could be that the demographics are against the music industry. A good chunk of the population are baby boomers and have all the music they ever wanted.
It could be that the demographics are against the music industry. A good chunk of the population are baby boomers and have all the music they ever wanted.
Agreed, there are also subscription based services and it's now much easier to produce music off-label. There's a whole number of reasons that the music industry is facing significant pressure.
Exclusive content is a mistake. People will simply turn to piracy.
I don't follow your logic. I get that there are low barriers to piracy, but that is irrelevant. Apple built a successful online music business to compete with piracy which already existed since the days of Napster. It's just as easy to pirate music now as it was in the 1990s. Why would exclusive platform content drive people towards piracy? Here's why I think you are wrong: iTunes' success was predicated on eliminating barriers to buying music legally. It assumes (correctly) that there is a market of people who want to buy (pay for) digital music. There's also a segment of the population that won't pay for music--they're not part of the market because they will not exchange money for music. How is offering exclusive content to those who will pay for their music, going to turn them into people who will not pay? People who think of themselves as honest don't change their values just because you reward their honesty with exclusive content.
Why would exclusive platform content drive people towards piracy? Here's why I think you are wrong: iTunes' success was predicated on eliminating barriers to buying music legally. It assumes (correctly) that there is a market for people who want to buy (pay for) digital music. There's also a segment of the population that won't pay for music--they're not part of the market because they will not exchange money for music.
I'm not sure why you think this logic works. iTunes' success indeed was based on eliminating barriers, but by making content exclusive then that introduces a fresh barrier for anyone who would not use that service. For example, I wouldn't buy the latest Sunn album from an Apple service that wouldn't work on my phone. I doubt I'd end up pirating it but many people would.
Quote:
How is offering exclusive content to those who will pay for their music, going to turn them into people who will not pay? People who think of themselves as honest don't change their values just because you reward their honesty with exclusive content.
I've only met few pirates who consider it particularly dishonest, and I'm not suggesting that iTunes users would suddenly turn into pirates. I'm suggesting that say a heavy Amazon user who does not have a Windows PC is not likely to buy one just to use iTunes.
I'm not sure why you think this logic works. iTunes' success indeed was based on eliminating barriers, but by making content exclusive then that introduces a fresh barrier for anyone who would not use that service. For example, I wouldn't buy the latest Sunn album from an Apple service that wouldn't work on my phone. I doubt I'd end up pirating it but many people would.
I've only met few pirates who consider it particularly dishonest, and I'm not suggesting that iTunes users would suddenly turn into pirates. I'm suggesting that say a heavy Amazon user who does not have a Windows PC is not likely to buy one just to use iTunes.
There has always been exclusive items/content if you buy it at one place. Target does this with some CDs/DVDs ; GameStop does it with games w DLC. Hell, Amazon has exclusive shit too.
There has always been exclusive items/content if you buy it at one place. Target does this with some CDs/DVDs ; GameStop does it with games w DLC. Hell, Amazon has exclusive shit too.
Sure, and look how hated that is almost universally. If you can pirate it, people do.
Sure, and look how hated that is almost universally. If you can pirate it, people do.
But then nothing anyone does matters. I don't see how piracy becomes more of the equation here. People who don't pay for their music are completely oblivious to such things as exclusive content or not.
But then nothing anyone does matters. I don't see how piracy becomes more of the equation here. People who don't pay for their music are completely oblivious to such things as exclusive content or not.
In my experience most pirates are pirates because they can't get what they want for a reasonable price, not because they are fundamentally opposed to paying. Adding more barriers in to that just results in more people refusing to pay for it. I guess we'll have to look at the statistics if this happens, but I know that ebook publishers had similar fears.
In my experience most pirates are pirates because they can't get what they want for a reasonable price, not because they are fundamentally opposed to paying.
Borsht! I buy a shit-ton of used music from Amazon for pennies. People who pirate anymore are just asshats. In addition, many CD have only one or two great songs. If I buy those two songs from iTunes for a buck or so each, I've essentially got the meat of a CD for under three bucks. How much more reasonably priced can it get???
Borsht! I buy a shit-ton of used music from Amazon for pennies. People who pirate anymore are just asshats. In addition, many CD have only one or two great songs. If I buy those two songs from iTunes for a buck or so each, I've essentially got the meat of a CD for under three bucks. How much more reasonably priced can it get???
I'm not disagreeing with you, that wasn't the case only a few years ago though, and we're talking about making these songs unavailable from Amazon for example for a few months. That is what I think would drive piracy.
What if they pirate BBC shows they can't get in a timely manner in the US. Like today's Top Gear episode?
Thanks for reminding me! For what it's worth pirating BBC shows that are shown via BBC America does actually hurt the BBC, as they sell the licenses internationally. Still I really don't consider it a big deal as I doubt it will actually affect deals.
Thanks for reminding me! For what it's worth pirating BBC shows that are shown via BBC America does actually hurt the BBC, as they sell the licenses internationally. Still I really don't consider it a big deal as I doubt it will actually affect deals.
I know Top Gear eventually aires on BBC America although I'm not sure when. Doctor Who aires the same day as it does in the UK and Downton Abbey hits PBS months later, but as far as I know there are zero QI and Bad Education episodes airing in the US.
I know Top Gear eventually aires on BBC America although I'm not sure when. Doctor Who aires the same day as it does in the UK and Downton Abbey hits PBS months later, but as far as I know there are zero QI and Bad Education episodes airing in the US.
Well hey, from my perspective then go for it. I really don't think you'd be hurting anyone and I paid for the programs to be made so I wish I got a say in it
I use deezer, the european spotify equivalent. Why would I buy iTunes content that I don't even own after buying it, when I can pay 9,99%u20AC per month to be able to listen to everything, whenever I want?
Well hey, from my perspective then go for it. I really don't think you'd be hurting anyone and I paid for the programs to be made so I wish I got a say in it
Addendum: I do pay for cable that includes BBC America.
Comments
I don't think stealing it is the only other option. Personally I do an All-I-Can-Eat All-Access Music subscription. I don't see $1 or more a song to be an attractive way of feeding my music fix, particularly when there's really not all that much music I wish to "own" ....
which in the strictest sense you really don't anyway if you're buying from iTunes or Amazon or Google Music. Even worse there's been reported instances of purchased iTunes and Amazon content pulled from their stores making what should have been a re-download of your legally purchased media impossible.
My point was though that if the market isn't offering what consumers want to buy, then that is not the fault of the consumers.
Of course not.
Nor I. Just about the only option that gets content creators any amount of money, however, is buying songs.
That’s why you don’t trust the cloud. Ever. Local copies always. Period. Until the psychosis is removed and this never happens again.
Exclusive content is definitely the only way Apple will attract users.
It needs to fix the user experience of finding and getting music. My two daughters used to be very regular users (wife somewhat less) of getting their music there. All three abandoned it due to the cluttered interface and generally cluttered experience once they realized there were other places they could do what they wanted with less effort.
Me? I'm just tired of having to download and delete again those three live Rolling Stones songs over and over again every time I go to another device.
It could be that the demographics are against the music industry. A good chunk of the population are baby boomers and have all the music they ever wanted.
It could be that the demographics are against the music industry. A good chunk of the population are baby boomers and have all the music they ever wanted.
Agreed, there are also subscription based services and it's now much easier to produce music off-label. There's a whole number of reasons that the music industry is facing significant pressure.
I don't follow your logic. I get that there are low barriers to piracy, but that is irrelevant. Apple built a successful online music business to compete with piracy which already existed since the days of Napster. It's just as easy to pirate music now as it was in the 1990s. Why would exclusive platform content drive people towards piracy? Here's why I think you are wrong: iTunes' success was predicated on eliminating barriers to buying music legally. It assumes (correctly) that there is a market of people who want to buy (pay for) digital music. There's also a segment of the population that won't pay for music--they're not part of the market because they will not exchange money for music. How is offering exclusive content to those who will pay for their music, going to turn them into people who will not pay? People who think of themselves as honest don't change their values just because you reward their honesty with exclusive content.
Why would exclusive platform content drive people towards piracy? Here's why I think you are wrong: iTunes' success was predicated on eliminating barriers to buying music legally. It assumes (correctly) that there is a market for people who want to buy (pay for) digital music. There's also a segment of the population that won't pay for music--they're not part of the market because they will not exchange money for music.
I'm not sure why you think this logic works. iTunes' success indeed was based on eliminating barriers, but by making content exclusive then that introduces a fresh barrier for anyone who would not use that service. For example, I wouldn't buy the latest Sunn album from an Apple service that wouldn't work on my phone. I doubt I'd end up pirating it but many people would.
I've only met few pirates who consider it particularly dishonest, and I'm not suggesting that iTunes users would suddenly turn into pirates. I'm suggesting that say a heavy Amazon user who does not have a Windows PC is not likely to buy one just to use iTunes.
There has always been exclusive items/content if you buy it at one place. Target does this with some CDs/DVDs ; GameStop does it with games w DLC. Hell, Amazon has exclusive shit too.
There has always been exclusive items/content if you buy it at one place. Target does this with some CDs/DVDs ; GameStop does it with games w DLC. Hell, Amazon has exclusive shit too.
Sure, and look how hated that is almost universally. If you can pirate it, people do.
Sure, and look how hated that is almost universally. If you can pirate it, people do.
But then nothing anyone does matters. I don't see how piracy becomes more of the equation here. People who don't pay for their music are completely oblivious to such things as exclusive content or not.
But then nothing anyone does matters. I don't see how piracy becomes more of the equation here. People who don't pay for their music are completely oblivious to such things as exclusive content or not.
In my experience most pirates are pirates because they can't get what they want for a reasonable price, not because they are fundamentally opposed to paying. Adding more barriers in to that just results in more people refusing to pay for it. I guess we'll have to look at the statistics if this happens, but I know that ebook publishers had similar fears.
Borsht! I buy a shit-ton of used music from Amazon for pennies. People who pirate anymore are just asshats. In addition, many CD have only one or two great songs. If I buy those two songs from iTunes for a buck or so each, I've essentially got the meat of a CD for under three bucks. How much more reasonably priced can it get???
What if they pirate BBC shows they can't get in a timely manner in the US. Like today's Top Gear episode?
Borsht! I buy a shit-ton of used music from Amazon for pennies. People who pirate anymore are just asshats. In addition, many CD have only one or two great songs. If I buy those two songs from iTunes for a buck or so each, I've essentially got the meat of a CD for under three bucks. How much more reasonably priced can it get???
I'm not disagreeing with you, that wasn't the case only a few years ago though, and we're talking about making these songs unavailable from Amazon for example for a few months. That is what I think would drive piracy.
What if they pirate BBC shows they can't get in a timely manner in the US. Like today's Top Gear episode?
Thanks for reminding me! For what it's worth pirating BBC shows that are shown via BBC America does actually hurt the BBC, as they sell the licenses internationally. Still I really don't consider it a big deal as I doubt it will actually affect deals.
I know Top Gear eventually aires on BBC America although I'm not sure when. Doctor Who aires the same day as it does in the UK and Downton Abbey hits PBS months later, but as far as I know there are zero QI and Bad Education episodes airing in the US.
I know Top Gear eventually aires on BBC America although I'm not sure when. Doctor Who aires the same day as it does in the UK and Downton Abbey hits PBS months later, but as far as I know there are zero QI and Bad Education episodes airing in the US.
Well hey, from my perspective then go for it. I really don't think you'd be hurting anyone and I paid for the programs to be made so I wish I got a say in it
Addendum: I do pay for cable that includes BBC America.