The fact that 'Hey Siri' only works when plugged in, I imagine that means that the A7 doesn't have a low power DSP that is capable of supporting an 'always listening' function (like f.e. the Snapdragon 800). So it wouldn't be a stretch for the A8 to have a DSP that does support it, so that could mean the iPhone 6 might have an 'always listening' function (but will be iPhone 6 exclusive with the others keeping the plugged in alternative as it would consume too much battery power). Just thinking out loud here but does seem plausible, not?
Easy fix: Put your current iPhone in a Mophie or other battery-case that tricks the iPhone into thinking it's charging. Bam - mobile always listening.
Of course, the limitation for plug-in could be to prevent (either intentional or inadvertent) Glasshole syndrome - i.e., it's unlawful to tape someone without their express consent in many jurisdictions.
I wish I could change Siri's name. I'd prefer to say "Hey Kit" or "Hey R2". That would be cool.
Now that "Hey, Siri" is coming they might just allow that because there may be someone's name that sounds too alike which keeps setting it of. If they do implement it I wouldn't think it would come this year. This is the sort of thing I would expect Apple to not proactively anticipate.
it only works when plugged in, ie in the car, at home, at work. and how often do you REALLY hear someone say "Hey ....". Anyway, it was just a thought. "Hey Siri" is so lame.
Some people here feel that giving users a choice of making voice activation available on battery or only when plugged in will confuse them. I'd like to counter that what really confuses ME is that some things work all the time and others apparently only work when the phone is plugged in. I don't know which operations fall into the latter category so I don't know when I have to plug in the phone to make them happen. I find THAT difficult and confusing.
Of course, I'm only one or two IQ points smarter than your average house plant so maybe I'm not a good example.
Some people here feel that giving users a choice of making voice activation available on battery or only when plugged in will confuse them. I'd like to counter that what really confuses ME is that some things work all the time and others apparently only work when the phone is plugged in. I don't know which operations fall into the latter category so I don't know when I have to plug in the phone to make them happen. I find THAT difficult and confusing.
Of course, I'm only one or two IQ points smarter than your average house plant so maybe I'm not a good example.
it's the path of least resistance. From Apple's PoV creating something great doesn't stop with it being clever or powerful, but also being understood with little to no effort by pretty much everyone they want as customers. That means they very well may have features they are choosing not to add because they want a feature to become solidified before adding a bunch of knobs and whistles that may affect the experience in a negative way.
You say you want an option, but what if we all got every option we wanted? Imagine how the system would look, especially when Settings is already extremely massive. I can think of a dozen options just for Siri that would be nice for me (and perhaps a few people on this forum) to have but the majority of users simply won't care. "A thousand no's for every yes."
Easy fix: Put your current iPhone in a Mophie or other battery-case that tricks the iPhone into thinking it's charging. Bam - mobile always listening.
Of course, the limitation for plug-in could be to prevent (either intentional or inadvertent) Glasshole syndrome - i.e., it's unlawful to tape someone without their express consent in many jurisdictions.
Well that's a clever work around. With regard to consent I doubt that is a problem as it doesn't actually record anything, nor is any data kept/stored anywhere (not even locally). It just waits for a hotword which happens all locally (on the chip). Internet connection is only made after the hot word is detected. So I don't think that consent should pose as a problem.
And every option that a user wants should be implemented because that user would know how to reasonably handle it? There would be far to many options in the system for the average user to deal with. That would hurt he user experience more than a feature that doesn't exist now in iOS 7 still not existing in iOS 8.
I didn't agree with him; I tried to point out that you were mischaracterizing his post.
Jumping straight to "every option that a user wants" is pure hyperbole and has nothing to do with what either of us said.
I didn't agree with him; I tried to point out that you were mischaracterizing his post.
Jumping straight to "every option that a user wants" is pure hyperbole and has nothing to do with what either of us said.
When the comments start off with wanting to let the user decide what options to select without any notion of the scope of allowable desirable options or suggesting that's it's not a big a deal from a coding standpoint to add an option then it's the only viable response. Are you saying "Add what I want but ignore everyone else's wishes? That sound very selfish and myopic.
A constructive method might be to explain why you feel that a particular option might be very popular among most users (i.e.: therefore being more important than others) and would make the UX better. But to just wonder why they can't add your option because you want it isn't consecutive.
PS: I have an innumerable number of things I wish Apple would do. Thankfully they are implementing an amazing number of them with iOS 8 and Mavericks and yet it doesn't even put a dent in my wish list.
The options are Forever, 1 year, and 30 days. Plus the heading is Store Messages, not Store Message Attachments. I think you might be referring to how an attachment you've sent on your end will disappear from your side of the conversation soon after you sent it.
Yes, I'm referring to how the attachment will disappear on the sender's side. Is the Forever, 1 year, 30 days something new in System Settings? I must have missed that part.
Yes, I'm referring to how the attachment will disappear on the sender's side. Is the Forever, 1 year, 30 days something new in System Settings? I must have missed that part.
It's under Settings » Messages. I don't think it was mentioned on stage.
Why not let USERS decide how to manage the battery? I choose to let my laptop run at full-bore even when on battery because, the way I use it -- short periods of real work -- responsiveness matters more than battery life. If that situation should change I can simply adjust the settings to throttle back performance and brightness to conserve battery power. It's up to me.
Why not offer the same choice on the iPhone? Add a switch so that in addition to ON/OFF users can select "ALWAYS ON" or "BETTER BATTERY LIFE."
I don't think Apple has any desire to give users the tools to abuse the battery and cause early failure. The system is very carefully designed to manage the battery itself under a wide range of conditions and use. Giving you the ability to interfere with that would simply increase warranty claims to Apple for bad batteries.
I don't think Apple has any desire to give users the tools to abuse the battery and cause early failure. The system is very carefully designed to manage the battery itself under a wide range of conditions and use. Giving you the ability to interfere with that would simply increase warranty claims to Apple for bad batteries.
I don't know if that applies. Draining the battery by having the phone "listen" isn't any different that draining it by watching movies. Consumption is consumption. Besides, they use Li-Ion batteries that are extremely tolerant of abuse.
As for the Apple approach, their laptops allow the user to make choices about battery life vs. performance. Why would a phone be any different?
A constructive method might be to explain why you feel that a particular option might be very popular among most users (i.e.: therefore being more important than others) and would make the UX better.
Sorry, I thought the benefit was self-evident. Being able to use a feature all the time is inherently better than only being able to use it under certain conditions. In this case that benefit has a cost -- battery life -- so it's not black-and-white and a choice has to be made. The question is whether it's best for Apple to decide FOR me or let me decide myself.
I think the best way to balance those conflicting objectives is to let me decide which is best in my particular circumstances just like I do with my Mac. I think iPhone users may be expected to be roughly as savvy as Mac users, so I don't think giving them a choice of convenience vs. battery life is over-reaching.
Further, as I stated before, I think including features that only work under certain circumstances -- like being connected to external power, or only over wifi but not cellular -- is actually MORE confusing than letting me decide for myself how best to manage my power consumption.
Draining the battery by having the phone "listen" isn't any different that draining it by watching movies.
The battery draining quickly while you're actively engaging with it is very different from the battery draining quickly hen it's in your pocket, purse, or desk drawer while you're not using.
Consumption is consumption.
What?! Making a 5 minute call is NOT the same as watching a 5 minute 1080p video
Besides, they use Li-Ion batteries that are extremely tolerant of abuse.
We're not talking about abuse; we're talking about usage.
As for the Apple approach, their laptops allow the user to make choices about battery life vs. performance. Why would a phone be any different?
Being able to use a feature all the time is inherently better than only being able to use it under certain conditions.
Oh, I agree 100%, but you're ignoring that there is no ALL THE TIME with device that doesn't have an infinite power source built-in so there is no "inherently better" since the iPhone doesn't have an infinite battery life.
The battery draining quickly while you're actively engaging with it is very different from the battery draining quickly hen it's in your pocket, purse, or desk drawer while you're not using.
Context, my friend. I was responding to a comment about Apple's obligations with respect to ruined batteries. From that perspective the activity (or lack of it) is irrelevant.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX
What?! Making a 5 minute call is NOT the same as watching a 5 minute 1080p video
Again context. See above. Same discussion. The expressed concern was that letting users choose to burn up the battery more quickly would result in ruined battery issues for Apple. I'm saying that using up the battery by letting Siri "listen" isn't any different than using it up by watching videos. One is no more or less likely to ruin a battery than the other.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX
We're not talking about abuse; we're talking about usage.
No, the comments you're quoting here were made in response to a post about battery failure, not usage.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX
Quote:
As for the Apple approach, their laptops allow the user to make choices about battery life vs. performance. Why would a phone be any different?
Seriously?!?!
I think so, unless I'm missing something. Why is giving me control over battery management reasonable on my laptop but not my phone?
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX
you're ignoring that there is no ALL THE TIME with device that doesn't have an infinite power source built-in so there is no "inherently better" since the iPhone doesn't have an infinite battery life.
Damn you're picky about wording! You're right that I presented my argument poorly, but I still contend that the essence of my point is valid. That is: I think it would make more sense for Apple to let ME decide which is more important -- battery life or convenience -- instead of deciding for me. Why? Because we don't all use our devices the same way. Which is more important will vary from person to person and day to day. I never come close to killing my battery, and the time my phone spends plugged in is when I'm not using it. For me and others like me, having Siri listen is a benefit. Longer battery life is not, because we already have more than we need. If it turns out that listening is resulting in the battery going dead before I get home I can always just turn it off during the times I'll be away from power that long and turn it back on when I won't.
Apple has demonstrated with other products that power management is an area users are quite capable of understanding. I think it would be reasonable to include it in iOS. YMMV.
Lest I give the wrong impression, this not something about which I care deeply or am upset. I just disagree with your position that it's a serious issue for Apple to loosen up that particular rein. I think it would work out fine, and be BETTER for users, not worse.
I think it would work out fine, and be BETTER for users, not worse.
It sounds like it would be better for you and I'm sure you can get a handful of people to support your position just as you could have gotten many to say that Apple should offer the 1st gen LTE chip in the iPhone 3GS with a 2 hour data usage time, but that has no barring on Apple's PoV. What you're asking for sounds like it would currently be fine for you but end up hurting a large portion of their customer base who don't understand the nuances of what different electronic components and SW need to run on a system constantly. This is an ever present issue and every day I hear people attributing cause and effect improperly because they don't understand what's at play. Did you know you can describe lossless v lossy to someone and they might then encode their CD collection of audiobooks as lossless. Do you know how large a file a 20 hour audiobook takes up?
If you want an example of the Wild Wild West of smartphone platforms check out Android. You can do pretty much anything you want and you'll use more power per minute than on an iPhone. That's simply not want Apple offers which is why I can recommend them to family and friends. I do enough troubleshooting for friends and family as it is.
I wish I could change Siri's name. I'd prefer to say "Hey Kit" or "Hey R2". That would be cool.
Now that "Hey, Siri" is coming they might just allow that because there may be someone's name that sounds too alike which keeps setting it of. If they do implement it I wouldn't think it would come this year. This is the sort of thing I would expect Apple to not proactively anticipate.
I'd like it if you didn't have to say 'Hey.' I know you Americans regard that as normal, but it's a bit rude for us Brits. 'Excuse me, Siri' or just 'Siri' would suffice.
I'd like it if you didn't have to say 'Hey.' I know you Americans regard that as normal, but it's a bit rude for us Brits. 'Excuse me, Siri' or just 'Siri' would suffice.
Apple does have a long history of at least trying to optimize for different languages and cultures so perhaps that will be an option.
I'd certainly like to see "Wotcha, Siri" be adopted. Maybe Siri can have a Chav setting and reply like Vicky Pollard.
It would be handy to have a way of dumping out the messages in a text file or email (as WhatsApp allows) if the auto-delete is enabled. It would make searching back through them easier too.
It would be handy to have a way of dumping out the messages in a text file or email (as WhatsApp allows) if the auto-delete is enabled. It would make searching back through them easier too.
On a Mac I'd think it would be easy work for a halfway decent programmer.
Comments
The fact that 'Hey Siri' only works when plugged in, I imagine that means that the A7 doesn't have a low power DSP that is capable of supporting an 'always listening' function (like f.e. the Snapdragon 800). So it wouldn't be a stretch for the A8 to have a DSP that does support it, so that could mean the iPhone 6 might have an 'always listening' function (but will be iPhone 6 exclusive with the others keeping the plugged in alternative as it would consume too much battery power). Just thinking out loud here but does seem plausible, not?
Easy fix: Put your current iPhone in a Mophie or other battery-case that tricks the iPhone into thinking it's charging. Bam - mobile always listening.
Of course, the limitation for plug-in could be to prevent (either intentional or inadvertent) Glasshole syndrome - i.e., it's unlawful to tape someone without their express consent in many jurisdictions.
Now that "Hey, Siri" is coming they might just allow that because there may be someone's name that sounds too alike which keeps setting it of. If they do implement it I wouldn't think it would come this year. This is the sort of thing I would expect Apple to not proactively anticipate.
it's the path of least resistance. From Apple's PoV creating something great doesn't stop with it being clever or powerful, but also being understood with little to no effort by pretty much everyone they want as customers. That means they very well may have features they are choosing not to add because they want a feature to become solidified before adding a bunch of knobs and whistles that may affect the experience in a negative way.
You say you want an option, but what if we all got every option we wanted? Imagine how the system would look, especially when Settings is already extremely massive. I can think of a dozen options just for Siri that would be nice for me (and perhaps a few people on this forum) to have but the majority of users simply won't care. "A thousand no's for every yes."
And every option that a user wants should be implemented because that user would know how to reasonably handle it? There would be far to many options in the system for the average user to deal with. That would hurt he user experience more than a feature that doesn't exist now in iOS 7 still not existing in iOS 8.
I didn't agree with him; I tried to point out that you were mischaracterizing his post.
Jumping straight to "every option that a user wants" is pure hyperbole and has nothing to do with what either of us said.
When the comments start off with wanting to let the user decide what options to select without any notion of the scope of allowable desirable options or suggesting that's it's not a big a deal from a coding standpoint to add an option then it's the only viable response. Are you saying "Add what I want but ignore everyone else's wishes? That sound very selfish and myopic.
A constructive method might be to explain why you feel that a particular option might be very popular among most users (i.e.: therefore being more important than others) and would make the UX better. But to just wonder why they can't add your option because you want it isn't consecutive.
PS: I have an innumerable number of things I wish Apple would do. Thankfully they are implementing an amazing number of them with iOS 8 and Mavericks and yet it doesn't even put a dent in my wish list.
It's under Settings » Messages. I don't think it was mentioned on stage.
Why not let USERS decide how to manage the battery? I choose to let my laptop run at full-bore even when on battery because, the way I use it -- short periods of real work -- responsiveness matters more than battery life. If that situation should change I can simply adjust the settings to throttle back performance and brightness to conserve battery power. It's up to me.
Why not offer the same choice on the iPhone? Add a switch so that in addition to ON/OFF users can select "ALWAYS ON" or "BETTER BATTERY LIFE."
I don't think Apple has any desire to give users the tools to abuse the battery and cause early failure. The system is very carefully designed to manage the battery itself under a wide range of conditions and use. Giving you the ability to interfere with that would simply increase warranty claims to Apple for bad batteries.
I don't think Apple has any desire to give users the tools to abuse the battery and cause early failure. The system is very carefully designed to manage the battery itself under a wide range of conditions and use. Giving you the ability to interfere with that would simply increase warranty claims to Apple for bad batteries.
I don't know if that applies. Draining the battery by having the phone "listen" isn't any different that draining it by watching movies. Consumption is consumption. Besides, they use Li-Ion batteries that are extremely tolerant of abuse.
As for the Apple approach, their laptops allow the user to make choices about battery life vs. performance. Why would a phone be any different?
Sorry, I thought the benefit was self-evident. Being able to use a feature all the time is inherently better than only being able to use it under certain conditions. In this case that benefit has a cost -- battery life -- so it's not black-and-white and a choice has to be made. The question is whether it's best for Apple to decide FOR me or let me decide myself.
I think the best way to balance those conflicting objectives is to let me decide which is best in my particular circumstances just like I do with my Mac. I think iPhone users may be expected to be roughly as savvy as Mac users, so I don't think giving them a choice of convenience vs. battery life is over-reaching.
Further, as I stated before, I think including features that only work under certain circumstances -- like being connected to external power, or only over wifi but not cellular -- is actually MORE confusing than letting me decide for myself how best to manage my power consumption.
The battery draining quickly while you're actively engaging with it is very different from the battery draining quickly hen it's in your pocket, purse, or desk drawer while you're not using.
What?! Making a 5 minute call is NOT the same as watching a 5 minute 1080p video
We're not talking about abuse; we're talking about usage.
Seriously?!?!
Oh, I agree 100%, but you're ignoring that there is no ALL THE TIME with device that doesn't have an infinite power source built-in so there is no "inherently better" since the iPhone doesn't have an infinite battery life.
Context, my friend. I was responding to a comment about Apple's obligations with respect to ruined batteries. From that perspective the activity (or lack of it) is irrelevant.
Again context. See above. Same discussion. The expressed concern was that letting users choose to burn up the battery more quickly would result in ruined battery issues for Apple. I'm saying that using up the battery by letting Siri "listen" isn't any different than using it up by watching videos. One is no more or less likely to ruin a battery than the other.
No, the comments you're quoting here were made in response to a post about battery failure, not usage.
Seriously?!?!
I think so, unless I'm missing something. Why is giving me control over battery management reasonable on my laptop but not my phone?
Damn you're picky about wording!
You're right that I presented my argument poorly, but I still contend that the essence of my point is valid. That is: I think it would make more sense for Apple to let ME decide which is more important -- battery life or convenience -- instead of deciding for me. Why? Because we don't all use our devices the same way. Which is more important will vary from person to person and day to day. I never come close to killing my battery, and the time my phone spends plugged in is when I'm not using it. For me and others like me, having Siri listen is a benefit. Longer battery life is not, because we already have more than we need. If it turns out that listening is resulting in the battery going dead before I get home I can always just turn it off during the times I'll be away from power that long and turn it back on when I won't.
Apple has demonstrated with other products that power management is an area users are quite capable of understanding. I think it would be reasonable to include it in iOS. YMMV.
Lest I give the wrong impression, this not something about which I care deeply or am upset. I just disagree with your position that it's a serious issue for Apple to loosen up that particular rein. I think it would work out fine, and be BETTER for users, not worse.
It sounds like it would be better for you and I'm sure you can get a handful of people to support your position just as you could have gotten many to say that Apple should offer the 1st gen LTE chip in the iPhone 3GS with a 2 hour data usage time, but that has no barring on Apple's PoV. What you're asking for sounds like it would currently be fine for you but end up hurting a large portion of their customer base who don't understand the nuances of what different electronic components and SW need to run on a system constantly. This is an ever present issue and every day I hear people attributing cause and effect improperly because they don't understand what's at play. Did you know you can describe lossless v lossy to someone and they might then encode their CD collection of audiobooks as lossless. Do you know how large a file a 20 hour audiobook takes up?
If you want an example of the Wild Wild West of smartphone platforms check out Android. You can do pretty much anything you want and you'll use more power per minute than on an iPhone. That's simply not want Apple offers which is why I can recommend them to family and friends. I do enough troubleshooting for friends and family as it is.
I'd like it if you didn't have to say 'Hey.' I know you Americans regard that as normal, but it's a bit rude for us Brits. 'Excuse me, Siri' or just 'Siri' would suffice.
Apple does have a long history of at least trying to optimize for different languages and cultures so perhaps that will be an option.
I'd certainly like to see "Wotcha, Siri" be adopted.
[VIDEO]
It would be handy to have a way of dumping out the messages in a text file or email (as WhatsApp allows) if the auto-delete is enabled. It would make searching back through them easier too.
On a Mac I'd think it would be easy work for a halfway decent programmer.