"Dark Mode" is now "dark menubar and dock"? Very disappointied...
And the calculator... looks so mish-mashed. Dark/Translucent window decoration, no delineation between window decoration and calculator "screen", blinding contrast between decoration/screen and keypad.
I agree. I'm wondering if portions of the OS were re-written because system applications are opening up on my iMac in half a bounce and that has never happened with any of the previous OS's.
Sorry I wasn't more clear, I meant previous beta Yosemite versions, not previous released versions.
I agree. I'm wondering if portions of the OS were re-written because system applications are opening up on my iMac in half a bounce and that has never happened with any of the previous OS's.
To me what's surprising is not the look of the new design -- that's a subjective call -- but that Apple is devoting engineering resources to it at all. When people complain about bugs or long-standing interoperability issues between Apple apps, the apologist's response is that there are only so many engineers to go around. If that's really the case, maybe the prudent approach is to repair the framing and floors before redecorating.
Then again, structural repairs won't attract buyers the way splashing on a coat of fresh paint will.
The resources being devoted to theming are quite likely mutually exclusive from the resources necessary for fixing the "long-standing interoperability issues" and/or bugs you're talking about.
But but but… what about the argument that "there are only so many engineers to go around?" If that's true, then anyone working on the "look" is delaying work on the "bugs," right?
(Don't worry, I'm not serious. I'm just taking a shot at the zealots who trot out that argument every time someone points out a long-standing issue.)
Either Apple is not acknowledging certain issues or they're using clever language to obfuscate their existence, like saying "That's not a fault, that's an unsupported operation" since I can demonstrate at least one obvious and repeatable blurp.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX
Have you submitted this bug? I assume you must have if you're telling us about it here, so what is the status of it?
I'm not a developer so I have no means of ticketing a bug (that I know of) but I did report it via the feedback page.
Either Apple is not acknowledging certain issues or they're using clever language to obfuscate their existence.
So your claim is that Apple is aware of every issue you've had before you've had it? Can you prove that?
What?! That's a ridiculous statement. I didn't say that and you know it. I also said that yes, I reported it to Apple.
Why are you so vehemently opposed -- to the point of absurd posturing -- to the idea that Apple may not be completely forthcoming with every issue that exists within their software? Obviously there are going to be things that they know about and just don't want to deal with right now. Rather than muddy the waters by calling them "known issues" with any particular beta, with the implication that it's something pending resolution, they just leave it alone.
If you're just going to accuse me of being disingenuous despite evidence to the contrary, there's no point in any further discussion.
What?! That's a ridiculous statement. I didn't say that and you know it. I also said that yes, I reported it to Apple.
Why are you so vehemently opposed -- to the point of absurd posturing -- to the idea that Apple may not be completely forthcoming with every issue that exists within their software? Obviously there are going to be things that they know about and just don't want to deal with right now. Rather than muddy the waters by calling them "known issues" with any particular beta, with the implication that it's something pending resolution, they just leave it alone.
If you're just going to accuse me of being disingenuous despite evidence to the contrary, there's no point in any further discussion.
You did. You said EITHER Apple isn't acknowledging it which implies they know about it or they are using sleazy language to give themselves plausible deniability, despite "No known bugs" being pretty fucking clear. You created a scenario that doesn't allow for their developers to not be aware of a particular bug. You did!
What?! That's a ridiculous statement. I didn't say that and you know it. I also said that yes, I reported it to Apple.
Why are you so vehemently opposed -- to the point of absurd posturing -- to the idea that Apple may not be completely forthcoming with every issue that exists within their software? Obviously there are going to be things that they know about and just don't want to deal with right now. Rather than muddy the waters by calling them "known issues" with any particular beta, with the implication that it's something pending resolution, they just leave it alone.
If you're just going to accuse me of being disingenuous despite evidence to the contrary, there's no point in any further discussion.
There are a few individuals here that like to engage in "absurd posturing." I'd tell you to ignore them but it's difficult since they dominate almost every post. They consider saying anything even slightly critical about Apple to be heresy. Even saying you have a preference that is contrary to what Apple has made available (like finally adding a keypad to the wireless keyboard, for example) will be met with hostility. They take being a fan to a new level.
You did. You said EITHER Apple isn't acknowledging it which implies they know about it or they are using sleazy language to give themselves plausible deniability, despite "No known bugs" being pretty fucking clear. You created a scenario that doesn't allow for their developers to not be aware of a particular bug. You did!
Tell you what: I'll call Apple first thing tomorrow morning. I won't hang up until I'm allowed to speak to someone on the OS engineering team. I will describe the very same issue I outlined for you. Then we'll wait for the next beta and see if it shows up as a "known issue."
Will THAT satisfy you?
BTW, I'm willing to wager a month's income on the outcome. Are you?
Either Apple is not acknowledging certain issues or they're using clever language to obfuscate their existence, like saying "That's not a fault, that's an unsupported operation" since I can demonstrate at least one obvious and repeatable blurp.
I'm not a developer so I have no means of ticketing a bug (that I know of) but I did report it via the feedback page.
Apple hasn't written to tell me how it's coming…
Uhh, you can register as a free developer, and get access to the Radar (aka Apple Bug Reporter). I know because I'm in the developer program (for Safari, if I recall correctly) and I don't pay $99 yearly.
When Apple say "No known issues" they mean "No known issues which we consider blockers". There are plenty of bugs in radar on any release, and they get working on the 10.x.1 release to fix them ( and any others which turn up after general release).
Dark mode was presented in the keynote - and in the API - as a universal feature which you could use as part of your applications. They seem to be moving away from that now.
Tell you what: I'll call Apple first thing tomorrow morning. I won't hang up until I'm allowed to speak to someone on the OS engineering team. I will describe the very same issue I outlined for you. Then we'll wait for the next beta and see if it shows up as a "known issue."
Will THAT satisfy you?
BTW, I'm willing to wager a month's income on the outcome. Are you?
Yes, but it has to be someone from the Mac OS X development team.
Are you suggesting that when Apple ship a preview with "no known issues" that their Radar backlog is totally clear? Because that's demonstrably untrue.
Many developers have many issues with Apple's responsiveness to bug reporting.
Are you suggesting that when Apple ship a preview with "no known issues" that their Radar backlog is totally clear? Because that's demonstrably untrue.
Many developers have many issues with Apple's responsiveness to bug reporting.
Yes, I'm saying that whatever team puts the bug list together is not aware of any bugs for that release; anything else would be disingenuous. Whether there are people reporting bugs in their developer portal or if Apple's slow to respond to those is a completely different issue.
Comments
"Dark Mode" is now "dark menubar and dock"? Very disappointied...![:\](/resources/emoji/confused.png ":\")
And the calculator... looks so mish-mashed. Dark/Translucent window decoration, no delineation between window decoration and calculator "screen", blinding contrast between decoration/screen and keypad.
I knew "dark mode" was too good to be true....
Sorry I wasn't more clear, I meant previous beta Yosemite versions, not previous released versions.
I agree. I'm wondering if portions of the OS were re-written because system applications are opening up on my iMac in half a bounce and that has never happened with any of the previous OS's.
Maybe it has something to do with Swift?
To me what's surprising is not the look of the new design -- that's a subjective call -- but that Apple is devoting engineering resources to it at all. When people complain about bugs or long-standing interoperability issues between Apple apps, the apologist's response is that there are only so many engineers to go around. If that's really the case, maybe the prudent approach is to repair the framing and floors before redecorating.
Then again, structural repairs won't attract buyers the way splashing on a coat of fresh paint will.
The resources being devoted to theming are quite likely mutually exclusive from the resources necessary for fixing the "long-standing interoperability issues" and/or bugs you're talking about.
But but but… what about the argument that "there are only so many engineers to go around?" If that's true, then anyone working on the "look" is delaying work on the "bugs," right?
(Don't worry, I'm not serious. I'm just taking a shot at the zealots who trot out that argument every time someone points out a long-standing issue.)
What?! No known issue ? no issues.
Did you try the example I gave you?
Either Apple is not acknowledging certain issues or they're using clever language to obfuscate their existence, like saying "That's not a fault, that's an unsupported operation" since I can demonstrate at least one obvious and repeatable blurp.
Have you submitted this bug? I assume you must have if you're telling us about it here, so what is the status of it?
I'm not a developer so I have no means of ticketing a bug (that I know of) but I did report it via the feedback page.
Apple hasn't written to tell me how it's coming…
So your claim is that Apple is aware of every issue you've had before you've had it? Can you prove that?
Either Apple is not acknowledging certain issues or they're using clever language to obfuscate their existence.
So your claim is that Apple is aware of every issue you've had before you've had it? Can you prove that?
What?! That's a ridiculous statement. I didn't say that and you know it. I also said that yes, I reported it to Apple.
Why are you so vehemently opposed -- to the point of absurd posturing -- to the idea that Apple may not be completely forthcoming with every issue that exists within their software? Obviously there are going to be things that they know about and just don't want to deal with right now. Rather than muddy the waters by calling them "known issues" with any particular beta, with the implication that it's something pending resolution, they just leave it alone.
If you're just going to accuse me of being disingenuous despite evidence to the contrary, there's no point in any further discussion.
Dude, chill out. It's an operating system not your mother.
You did. You said EITHER Apple isn't acknowledging it which implies they know about it or they are using sleazy language to give themselves plausible deniability, despite "No known bugs" being pretty fucking clear. You created a scenario that doesn't allow for their developers to not be aware of a particular bug. You did!
You did. You said EITHER Apple isn't acknowledging it which implies they know about it or they are using sleazy language to give themselves plausible deniability, despite "No known bugs" being pretty fucking clear. You created a scenario that doesn't allow for their developers to not be aware of a particular bug. You did!
Tell you what: I'll call Apple first thing tomorrow morning. I won't hang up until I'm allowed to speak to someone on the OS engineering team. I will describe the very same issue I outlined for you. Then we'll wait for the next beta and see if it shows up as a "known issue."
Will THAT satisfy you?
BTW, I'm willing to wager a month's income on the outcome. Are you?
(like finally adding a keypad to the wireless keyboard, for example)
Must… suppress rant… about wireless keyboard… useless for Pro Tools... ARG!
This new "Dark mode" sounds interesting though, doesn't it?
Did you try the example I gave you?
Either Apple is not acknowledging certain issues or they're using clever language to obfuscate their existence, like saying "That's not a fault, that's an unsupported operation" since I can demonstrate at least one obvious and repeatable blurp.
I'm not a developer so I have no means of ticketing a bug (that I know of) but I did report it via the feedback page.
Apple hasn't written to tell me how it's coming…
Uhh, you can register as a free developer, and get access to the Radar (aka Apple Bug Reporter). I know because I'm in the developer program (for Safari, if I recall correctly) and I don't pay $99 yearly.
Dark mode was presented in the keynote - and in the API - as a universal feature which you could use as part of your applications. They seem to be moving away from that now.
Yes, but it has to be someone from the Mac OS X development team.
No known issue ? no issues.
Are you suggesting that when Apple ship a preview with "no known issues" that their Radar backlog is totally clear? Because that's demonstrably untrue.
Many developers have many issues with Apple's responsiveness to bug reporting.
When did they ever say otherwise?
In previous previews the dark mode affected in-app controls. It was hidden at the time, but set an expectation.
http://www.cultofmac.com/282685/enabling-yosemites-hidden-dark-mode-feature/
Yes, I'm saying that whatever team puts the bug list together is not aware of any bugs for that release; anything else would be disingenuous. Whether there are people reporting bugs in their developer portal or if Apple's slow to respond to those is a completely different issue.
That's rather a different prospect to the insinuation behind:
Quote:
So your claim is that Apple is aware of every issue you've had before you've had it? Can you prove that?
You're flipping between talking about Apple and Apple's core OS development team.