…an 8000 RPM engine, a great transmission, but no traction, all you do is spin your wheels. Clock speed means nothing if your bottle neck is data paths…
Exactly! That’s what I’m saying: Apple’s chips forgo mind-numbing clock speeds (and even CORES) but manage to outperform everything else on the market because of the engineering Apple puts into them otherwise, negating the statement that there is nothing notable about their construction.
(another reason why Swift/ObjC/LLVM is a big deal... Apple is worrying about 'how things compile'... Do you think Samsung is doing compiler development?)
Samsung: What’s a compiler? Development? Oh, you mean reading our clients’ product blueprints and basing our own products off of them? That’s the development we know.
…the goal of Android is to be an alternative to apple experience
This is really the crux of the argument in the two industries. When you define yourself by what you’re not being, you tend not to care what you are.
In before “Doesn’t that mean that by ‘not being evil’, Google doesn’t care that they’re good?”
This article is a classic example of how an alarmist headline and lead-in can distort the real story. The headline makes it seem as though Samsung's chip business is in trouble. The real story is that their semiconductor division posted a 6% gain in profits year over year in the latest quarterly statement. While it's true that Wall Street may not have been thrilled by a 6% increase in profits, it's hardly an indication that the division has a "bleak outlook" as the first paragraph stated. Samsung's chip division makes a lot more than just Apple's A-series CPUs.
If you thought that Samsung was a serial copier - you ain't seen nothing yet. China Inc. can copy on a scale that makes Samsung look like rank amateurs. There is no industry and no product on the planet, no matter how complex or how protected with patents and copyrights that China will not copy. We will someday look back and reminisce about the playful way that Samsung coveted everything Apple said, did, and produced. The Chinese copy masters will not be so gentle.
Not that I do not disagree with that statement, however, what I seen China do is they actually copy stuff they are already manufacturing for other companies. They use the exact designs of what they are making for the non-China company, in most cases remove the original manufactures names and make the same product for themselves and sell in under a different name. If the trade name is important when selling the product they will keep the name, Beat headphone is a good example, you can buy the $300 original or the $30 knock off which looks identical.
Personally I have not see them knock off or copy a product which they are not already making in their country for another company. They appears to lack the real design and engineering know how to make it by looking at it or reverse engineering it.
Back in the day Japan knocked off lots of US products, but they were good at engineering so they usually made a better product since they could reverse engineer and see where the problems were.
Unfortunately, Samsung make very good chips and very good screens. No matter how much Apple want to move away to other manufacturers, we have seen the lower quality of these screens and the poor yield of the chips so inevitably, Apple have to return to Samsung.
If you want something done right, you have to do it yourself. Apple have 2 options, stick with Samsung or start their own chip business.
However, I don't understand why Samsung has posted low results. They make all of the chips for the 2 biggest mobile manufacturers in the world.
I'm confused. I thought I've been reading reports that pall did turning away from TSMC in favor of Samsung for the A8. This doesn't fit.
Now there you go again
You say you want your freedom
Well who am I to keep you down
It's only right that you should play it the way that you feel it
But listen carefully to the sound of your loneliness
Like a heartbeat, drives you mad
In the stillness of remembering
What you had, and what you lost
what you had, and what you lost
For the most part AI publishes nothing more than rumors, we can only guess what will actually happen here.
I'm not so sure the editors of AI are intellectually capable of knowing the difference. They frequently blend established fact, hearsay, and analyst opinion into a thick purée of beliefs and prop it up by citing "a new report" from one of their usual suspects. Then they say things like "Apple is widely believed to..." without attributing any source or subject.
This article is a classic example of how an alarmist headline and lead-in can distort the real story. The headline makes it seem as though Samsung's chip business is in trouble. The real story is that their semiconductor division posted a 6% gain in profits year over year in the latest quarterly statement. While it's true that Wall Street may not have been thrilled by a 6% increase in profits, it's hardly an indication that the division has a "bleak outlook" as the first paragraph stated. Samsung's chip division makes a lot more than just Apple's A-series CPUs.
According to the July 31 transcript, the 14nm process is not expected to ramp to full production until then end of 2015 for external customers. To my mind, Samsung has lost its way. Samsung talks of balancing production of their components based on market conditions and having the flexibility to change what the lines are producing. Samsung does not know where the 14nm production lines will be -- in Korea or Austin? Samsung is reacting to market conditions and competition in the low-mid tier mobile segment, being forced to compete with Chinese companies at the same time trying to compete with Apple in the upper tier. Samsung is not driving the market, but reacting to it.
What impressed me on reading the transcript is Samsung's top decision makers are quite confused. They really are split between being a foundry and creating finished products for consumers. This split may be necessary given NDAs between the divisions. Wasn't the product side of Samsung surprised by the nature of A7 chip even though Samsung's foundry side was manufacturing it?
Seems at some level (probably the top), Samsung is being poorly managed. Samsung is an extraordinarily excellent engineering firm -- that's why Apple uses them. Samsung needs to cut the engineering side loose.
Arh, I actually meant the A9. Yes 14nm from Samsung and 16nm+ from TSMC are all facing problems. I can see why the rumours now suggesting A9 will be going to TSMC too, where it was previously suggesting Samsung. May be Samsung over promised on 14nm. And the sudden move of "trying" 16nm+ by TSMC looks like a reaction to it.
I think Apple are waiting for the final minutes to decide which one to choose for A9 SoC.
Or Apple's sticking with Samsung for the A8 while TSMC preps the chip for the watch everyone knows is coming. In which case both companies can truthfully say they have been tapped for big projects for Apple without any contradiction or weirdness.
<div class="quote-container" data-huddler-embed="/t/181692/samsungs-chipmaking-business-posts-weak-outlook-as-rumors-of-apple-shift-persist#post_2574026" data-huddler-embed-placeholder="false"><span>Quote:</span><div class="quote-block">Originally Posted by <strong>sog35</strong> <a href="/t/181692/samsungs-chipmaking-business-posts-weak-outlook-as-rumors-of-apple-shift-persist#post_2574026"><img src="/img/forum/go_quote.gif" class="inlineimg" alt="View Post"/></a><br/><br/><p>Samsung's collapse will be quick and complete.</p>
</div></div><p> </p>That's really premature, even if-when they lose a customer worth billions in annual sales. That's a lot, but it's only in their components division. Samsung will live a long mediocre life, probably much like Microsoft. Less discerning customers will continue buy their products because they think they are marginally less expensive, because they are fooled by a marketing gimmick, or because they just can't be bothered to do any real market research.
Or the life they were living before the whole smartphone thingy took off.
<div class="quote-container" data-huddler-embed="/t/181692/samsungs-chipmaking-business-posts-weak-outlook-as-rumors-of-apple-shift-persist#post_2574058" data-huddler-embed-placeholder="false"><span>Quote:</span><div class="quote-block">Originally Posted by <strong>SpamSandwich</strong> <a href="/t/181692/samsungs-chipmaking-business-posts-weak-outlook-as-rumors-of-apple-shift-persist#post_2574058"><img src="/img/forum/go_quote.gif" class="inlineimg" alt="View Post"/></a><br/><br/>I nominate this thread for First Prize in the category of "Most Spelling and Grammar Errors in the History of the English Language." Outstanding work!</div></div><p> </p>I except.
Comments
Unlikely. Microsoft has a competitive moat around Office and Windows, its two core products.
…an 8000 RPM engine, a great transmission, but no traction, all you do is spin your wheels. Clock speed means nothing if your bottle neck is data paths…
Exactly! That’s what I’m saying: Apple’s chips forgo mind-numbing clock speeds (and even CORES) but manage to outperform everything else on the market because of the engineering Apple puts into them otherwise, negating the statement that there is nothing notable about their construction.
Samsung: What’s a compiler? Development? Oh, you mean reading our clients’ product blueprints and basing our own products off of them? That’s the development we know.
This is really the crux of the argument in the two industries. When you define yourself by what you’re not being, you tend not to care what you are.
In before “Doesn’t that mean that by ‘not being evil’, Google doesn’t care that they’re good?”
If you thought that Samsung was a serial copier - you ain't seen nothing yet. China Inc. can copy on a scale that makes Samsung look like rank amateurs. There is no industry and no product on the planet, no matter how complex or how protected with patents and copyrights that China will not copy. We will someday look back and reminisce about the playful way that Samsung coveted everything Apple said, did, and produced. The Chinese copy masters will not be so gentle.
Not that I do not disagree with that statement, however, what I seen China do is they actually copy stuff they are already manufacturing for other companies. They use the exact designs of what they are making for the non-China company, in most cases remove the original manufactures names and make the same product for themselves and sell in under a different name. If the trade name is important when selling the product they will keep the name, Beat headphone is a good example, you can buy the $300 original or the $30 knock off which looks identical.
Personally I have not see them knock off or copy a product which they are not already making in their country for another company. They appears to lack the real design and engineering know how to make it by looking at it or reverse engineering it.
Back in the day Japan knocked off lots of US products, but they were good at engineering so they usually made a better product since they could reverse engineer and see where the problems were.
Unfortunately, Samsung make very good chips and very good screens. No matter how much Apple want to move away to other manufacturers, we have seen the lower quality of these screens and the poor yield of the chips so inevitably, Apple have to return to Samsung.
If you want something done right, you have to do it yourself. Apple have 2 options, stick with Samsung or start their own chip business.
However, I don't understand why Samsung has posted low results. They make all of the chips for the 2 biggest mobile manufacturers in the world.
Now there you go again
You say you want your freedom
Well who am I to keep you down
It's only right that you should play it the way that you feel it
But listen carefully to the sound of your loneliness
Like a heartbeat, drives you mad
In the stillness of remembering
What you had, and what you lost
what you had, and what you lost
I'm not so sure the editors of AI are intellectually capable of knowing the difference. They frequently blend established fact, hearsay, and analyst opinion into a thick purée of beliefs and prop it up by citing "a new report" from one of their usual suspects. Then they say things like "Apple is widely believed to..." without attributing any source or subject.
Clickbait: it's where journalism is headed.
Clickbait: it's where journalism is headed.
Clickbait: The other white meat.
You guys aren't doing the proper headline:
You won't believe where journalism is heading!
Top 7 reasons why journalism is dead.
Click bait: should you worry?
4 out of 5 rumor sites prefer this.
According to the July 31 transcript, the 14nm process is not expected to ramp to full production until then end of 2015 for external customers. To my mind, Samsung has lost its way. Samsung talks of balancing production of their components based on market conditions and having the flexibility to change what the lines are producing. Samsung does not know where the 14nm production lines will be -- in Korea or Austin? Samsung is reacting to market conditions and competition in the low-mid tier mobile segment, being forced to compete with Chinese companies at the same time trying to compete with Apple in the upper tier. Samsung is not driving the market, but reacting to it.
What impressed me on reading the transcript is Samsung's top decision makers are quite confused. They really are split between being a foundry and creating finished products for consumers. This split may be necessary given NDAs between the divisions. Wasn't the product side of Samsung surprised by the nature of A7 chip even though Samsung's foundry side was manufacturing it?
Seems at some level (probably the top), Samsung is being poorly managed. Samsung is an extraordinarily excellent engineering firm -- that's why Apple uses them. Samsung needs to cut the engineering side loose.
Arh, I actually meant the A9. Yes 14nm from Samsung and 16nm+ from TSMC are all facing problems. I can see why the rumours now suggesting A9 will be going to TSMC too, where it was previously suggesting Samsung. May be Samsung over promised on 14nm. And the sudden move of "trying" 16nm+ by TSMC looks like a reaction to it.
I think Apple are waiting for the final minutes to decide which one to choose for A9 SoC.
You guys aren't doing the proper headline:
You won't believe where journalism is heading!
Top 7 reasons why journalism is dead.
Click bait: should you worry?
4 out of 5 rumor sites prefer this.
And don't forget:
One secret trick that never fails to generate page views!
And don't forget:
One secret trick that never fails to generate page views!
and brings in ad revenue
Or Apple's sticking with Samsung for the A8 while TSMC preps the chip for the watch everyone knows is coming. In which case both companies can truthfully say they have been tapped for big projects for Apple without any contradiction or weirdness.
Or the life they were living before the whole smartphone thingy took off.
Clickbait: It's what's for dinner
I nominate your post for 'Yet Another Tedious Pedant Making a Feeble Passive-Agressive Post.'
Yor welcm.
You have a secund imadginasian.