I know we have all had this exact same conversation before many times recently but I reiterate my view that whatever Apple use be it 1, 2 or 100 GIGs they are using what they have, after a great deal of testing, found to be optimal not what will save money in production. It is impossible to compare Macs and iDevices with the other crap out there anymore and RAM is a classic example of where this is especially true. No other manufacturer controls so many aspects of the experience. Stating the obvious, Apple have the OS and hardware and with some products even CPUs in-house or of their own design. So, for armchair amateurs on blogs stating what amount of RAM they feel is required, is to say the least, as good as facing the wrong way in a strong wind while peeing.
If the iPhone 6 comes with 1GB people will want 2GB. If it comes with 2GB people would want 3GB... People are never satisfied and think they know the "ideal" specs - if so, start your own company and build a phone. I agree with digitaclips completely.
Hmm...then Apple needs to scold the developers of Safari.
I am curious how less RAM makes for a better experience on older devices. Care to enlighten me?
Older devices have less RAM. So a developer taking that into account and being careful with his RAM usage will make the app work better on the older devices that don't have the RAM
it's not an excuse, its physics. twice as much memory addresses to manage and electrons to store -- how could it not use more battery? apple isn't sitting here miserly dreaming up new ways to piss off online whiners....they think about practical effects of real world trade-offs.
but dont take my word for it -- take Microsoft’s Steven Sinofsky's:
You know what else is physics? Rubbing a balloon on my hair and creating electricity- but it isn't going to power a house. In the real world, Ram is a negligible part of the battery usage.
Again- please just keep ignoring my earlier post where Bloated crap inefficient android phones can be just as thin, have 2 gb of ram, and have the same battery life as Apple. Battery life isn't the issue- again- make another excuse.
While we're on excuse making- you're telling me that when I'm on my iPad Air or iPhone 5S that it's in my best interest to reload every damned tab on safari every time I switch to a different one? I'm not clamoring for more ram so I can play freakin' crysis on my iPad!
I had certainly hoped that they'd have 2GB of ram, one of the biggest reasons stated for certain devices not getting the latest iOS update is due to lack of Ram. 2GB would almost guarantee an extra year of support.
Which is probably why it will only have 1GB. It is not because of battery life, it is because it helps keeps people on the hardware upgrade cycle.
I don't care about CPU specs and most of that other nonsense since that is where using what you have efficiently comes into play. iOS is just better coded than Android. But at this point, RAM really is a bottleneck, especially when eyeing future updates to iOS in a couple years; no one wants their phone to start choking and slowing down. If 1 GB really is true I will probably just sit on my current phone an extra year until the 6S is out.
as far i know Ive is in charge of design, not hardware (electrical) engineering, not has he ever been.
guess what? more ram uses more battery. so which do you want more of on your phone -- ram, or battery?
Guess what, ram and battery aren't mutually exclusive. They are making the devices thinner yet again, despite the current generation of stuff already being thin enough. This is form winning over function and design handcuffing engineering, making the device both more fragile and less able to have a big battery due to limited internal volume. They could instead keep the same thickness as the current generation of devices, and fill that space with much more battery (and thus more ram, especially since its battery requirements are negligible compared to the screen), and with a camera housing that doesn't protrude from the device.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kpluck
Which is probably why it will only have 1GB. It is not because of battery life, it is because it helps keeps people on the hardware upgrade cycle.
-kpluck
So literally planned obsolescence? Cynical, but likely true if it actually does hit with only 1 GB installed. I guess we'll see in a few hours. Here's hoping the report is wrong~
If you have good phone then you must have good connect i have my friend told me about this i personally have good experience of this. that is xxsim card it can improve you confidence for keep such good phone.
Guess what, ram and battery aren't mutually exclusive. They are making the devices thinner yet again, despite the current generation of stuff already being thin enough. This is form winning over function and design handcuffing engineering, making the device both more fragile and less able to have a big battery due to limited internal volume. They could instead keep the same thickness as the current generation of devices, and fill that space with much more battery (and thus more ram, especially since its battery requirements are negligible compared to the screen), and with a camera housing that doesn't protrude from the device.
So literally planned obsolescence? Cynical, but likely true if it actually does hit with only 1 GB installed. I guess we'll see in a few hours. Here's hoping the report is wrong~
Still a rumor Fuzzy- we won't know until someone gets their hands on a -known- real one. It could still have more ram. In that case, Nola will be backpedaling and not have a leg to stand on.
Digital- Rogi is right. I'm on an air- but what is the point of having multiple tabs if they have to reload anytime you go back and forth. As long as no "new" browsing occurs, you can go back to the other tab, but as soon as you click one thing, you're back to square one. It's kinda sad at this point.
With a 5.5" device, you're reaching the threshold on a phone too, since you're bordering on tablet territory.
I know we hear the battery life excuse, but these android bloat ware pieces of garbage still manage to have substantial battery life with 2gb+ ram while staying at a similar thinness as the iPhone.
What is an extra .5gb really gonna do to battery life?
Ok, well I said it was just my opinion. In Macs I always max out so I guess I am contradicting my own actions. It just seems add that soooo much work goes into the details of iPhone design that for Apple to save a few $s on a bit of RAM if it is so crucial seems counterintuitive to me. I also said whatever Apple add, I wasn't saying it should be 1 GIG, I half expect more.
You know what else is physics? Rubbing a balloon on my hair and creating electricity- but it isn't going to power a house. In the real world, Ram is a negligible part of the battery usage.
Again- please just keep ignoring my earlier post where Bloated crap inefficient android phones can be just as thin, have 2 gb of ram, and have the same battery life as Apple. Battery life isn't the issue- again- make another excuse.
While we're on excuse making- you're telling me that when I'm on my iPad Air or iPhone 5S that it's in my best interest to reload every damned tab on safari every time I switch to a different one? I'm not clamoring for more ram so I can play freakin' crysis on my iPad!
yeah, dude, you know more than building mobile computers than Steven Sinofsky! thats why he's a computing rockstar.
stop trying to bring up iPads. nobody's talking about iPads. this is an iPhone thread.
i dont know of any bloated, inefficient android phones that have the same battery life of iPhone. maybe you'd care to link some very specific benchmarks that compare an iPhone to a bloated, inefficient android phone. either that, or you can keep getting red in the face about the grand Tim Cook conspiracy to devoid you on your birthright.
Still a rumor Fuzzy- we won't know until someone gets their hands on a -known- real one. It could still have more ram. In that case, Nola will be backpedaling and not have a leg to stand on, because he's a blind follower.
dear lord. once you get a drivers license and are able to leave your mom's trailer, you'll realize that not everybody who disagrees with you is a blind follower. especially when the person they're disagreeing with is a childish baby having a temper tantrum on a public forum.
"I WANT IT NOOOOOOOOOWWWWWWW! MOMMMMMEEEEEEYYYYY!!!! I WANT MY RAAAAAAAMM"
The new "A8" is said to be a dual-core 64-bit chip, just like its predecessor, tests with GeekBench 3 show.
If true, it sounds like the iPhone SoC tick-tock roadmap and industrial design tick-tock roadmap are staggered (at the moment.) All-new form factor one year (with more powerful SoC of similar architecture to previous year), major update to the SoC etc. the next year (with minor cosmetic changes to the enclosure.) For example: all-new form factor for iPhone 5 with A6 SoC, which is a faster version of the iPhone 4S A5 SoC. Followed by a major update to the A7 SoC for the iPhone 5S (64-bit, Touch ID, etc.) with minor cosmetic changes to the enclosure, etc.
Assuming these tests give the numbers of a last minute, optimized, phone, I'm disappointed. Whole I didn't really think Apple could again double specs, I did expect a good 50% improvement. Well, it's just a few minutes until the announcement, so we'll see what Apple claims. If they don't mention a number, then we'll know this is likely close. I hope that's not the case.
They seem to have gone for less battery use this year. Oh well, maybe next year. This new SoC doesn't get us any closer to the mythical ARM powered Mac.
I wonder about the GPU performance? Snapdragon 805 so far also disappoints. Tegra K1 is blazing on the other hand. Forgot phones. I'm all for the Shield Tablet LTE! Plans are cheaper anyway.
Comments
I know we have all had this exact same conversation before many times recently but I reiterate my view that whatever Apple use be it 1, 2 or 100 GIGs they are using what they have, after a great deal of testing, found to be optimal not what will save money in production. It is impossible to compare Macs and iDevices with the other crap out there anymore and RAM is a classic example of where this is especially true. No other manufacturer controls so many aspects of the experience. Stating the obvious, Apple have the OS and hardware and with some products even CPUs in-house or of their own design. So, for armchair amateurs on blogs stating what amount of RAM they feel is required, is to say the least, as good as facing the wrong way in a strong wind while peeing.
If the iPhone 6 comes with 1GB people will want 2GB. If it comes with 2GB people would want 3GB... People are never satisfied and think they know the "ideal" specs - if so, start your own company and build a phone. I agree with digitaclips completely.
Yes, Safari tabs indeed need more RAM. Even on 5S I get reloads sometimes.
Hmm...then Apple needs to scold the developers of Safari.
I am curious how less RAM makes for a better experience on older devices. Care to enlighten me?
Older devices have less RAM. So a developer taking that into account and being careful with his RAM usage will make the app work better on the older devices that don't have the RAM
it's not an excuse, its physics. twice as much memory addresses to manage and electrons to store -- how could it not use more battery? apple isn't sitting here miserly dreaming up new ways to piss off online whiners....they think about practical effects of real world trade-offs.
but dont take my word for it -- take Microsoft’s Steven Sinofsky's:
http://daringfireball.net/linked/2011/10/12/ram-energy
DUH!
You know what else is physics? Rubbing a balloon on my hair and creating electricity- but it isn't going to power a house. In the real world, Ram is a negligible part of the battery usage.
Again- please just keep ignoring my earlier post where Bloated crap inefficient android phones can be just as thin, have 2 gb of ram, and have the same battery life as Apple. Battery life isn't the issue- again- make another excuse.
While we're on excuse making- you're telling me that when I'm on my iPad Air or iPhone 5S that it's in my best interest to reload every damned tab on safari every time I switch to a different one? I'm not clamoring for more ram so I can play freakin' crysis on my iPad!
Hi Tim. Good luck today.
Thanks.
We'll be giving away free puppies to the first 100,000 iPhone 6 customers. That mysterious white building at De Anza College is a temporary kennel.
Enjoy the show.
I had certainly hoped that they'd have 2GB of ram, one of the biggest reasons stated for certain devices not getting the latest iOS update is due to lack of Ram. 2GB would almost guarantee an extra year of support.
Which is probably why it will only have 1GB. It is not because of battery life, it is because it helps keeps people on the hardware upgrade cycle.
-kpluck
doom! doooooom! DOOOOOM!!
as far i know Ive is in charge of design, not hardware (electrical) engineering, not has he ever been.
guess what? more ram uses more battery. so which do you want more of on your phone -- ram, or battery?
Guess what, ram and battery aren't mutually exclusive. They are making the devices thinner yet again, despite the current generation of stuff already being thin enough. This is form winning over function and design handcuffing engineering, making the device both more fragile and less able to have a big battery due to limited internal volume. They could instead keep the same thickness as the current generation of devices, and fill that space with much more battery (and thus more ram, especially since its battery requirements are negligible compared to the screen), and with a camera housing that doesn't protrude from the device.
Which is probably why it will only have 1GB. It is not because of battery life, it is because it helps keeps people on the hardware upgrade cycle.
-kpluck
So literally planned obsolescence? Cynical, but likely true if it actually does hit with only 1 GB installed. I guess we'll see in a few hours. Here's hoping the report is wrong~
If you have good phone then you must have good connect i have my friend told me about this i personally have good experience of this. that is xxsim card it can improve you confidence for keep such good phone.
Guess what, ram and battery aren't mutually exclusive. They are making the devices thinner yet again, despite the current generation of stuff already being thin enough. This is form winning over function and design handcuffing engineering, making the device both more fragile and less able to have a big battery due to limited internal volume. They could instead keep the same thickness as the current generation of devices, and fill that space with much more battery (and thus more ram, especially since its battery requirements are negligible compared to the screen), and with a camera housing that doesn't protrude from the device.
So literally planned obsolescence? Cynical, but likely true if it actually does hit with only 1 GB installed. I guess we'll see in a few hours. Here's hoping the report is wrong~
Still a rumor Fuzzy- we won't know until someone gets their hands on a -known- real one. It could still have more ram. In that case, Nola will be backpedaling and not have a leg to stand on.
Ok, well I said it was just my opinion. In Macs I always max out so I guess I am contradicting my own actions. It just seems add that soooo much work goes into the details of iPhone design that for Apple to save a few $s on a bit of RAM if it is so crucial seems counterintuitive to me. I also said whatever Apple add, I wasn't saying it should be 1 GIG, I half expect more.
DUH!
You know what else is physics? Rubbing a balloon on my hair and creating electricity- but it isn't going to power a house. In the real world, Ram is a negligible part of the battery usage.
Again- please just keep ignoring my earlier post where Bloated crap inefficient android phones can be just as thin, have 2 gb of ram, and have the same battery life as Apple. Battery life isn't the issue- again- make another excuse.
While we're on excuse making- you're telling me that when I'm on my iPad Air or iPhone 5S that it's in my best interest to reload every damned tab on safari every time I switch to a different one? I'm not clamoring for more ram so I can play freakin' crysis on my iPad!
yeah, dude, you know more than building mobile computers than Steven Sinofsky! thats why he's a computing rockstar.
stop trying to bring up iPads. nobody's talking about iPads. this is an iPhone thread.
i dont know of any bloated, inefficient android phones that have the same battery life of iPhone. maybe you'd care to link some very specific benchmarks that compare an iPhone to a bloated, inefficient android phone. either that, or you can keep getting red in the face about the grand Tim Cook conspiracy to devoid you on your birthright.
Still a rumor Fuzzy- we won't know until someone gets their hands on a -known- real one. It could still have more ram. In that case, Nola will be backpedaling and not have a leg to stand on, because he's a blind follower.
dear lord. once you get a drivers license and are able to leave your mom's trailer, you'll realize that not everybody who disagrees with you is a blind follower. especially when the person they're disagreeing with is a childish baby having a temper tantrum on a public forum.
"I WANT IT NOOOOOOOOOWWWWWWW! MOMMMMMEEEEEEYYYYY!!!! I WANT MY RAAAAAAAMM"
Which is probably why it will only have 1GB. It is not because of battery life, it is because it helps keeps people on the hardware upgrade cycle.
-kpluck
Wrong. Enticing customers to upgrade requires continually improving hardware, not continually offering the same low-performance hardware.
Not really.
lol.
The new "A8" is said to be a dual-core 64-bit chip, just like its predecessor, tests with GeekBench 3 show.
If true, it sounds like the iPhone SoC tick-tock roadmap and industrial design tick-tock roadmap are staggered (at the moment.) All-new form factor one year (with more powerful SoC of similar architecture to previous year), major update to the SoC etc. the next year (with minor cosmetic changes to the enclosure.) For example: all-new form factor for iPhone 5 with A6 SoC, which is a faster version of the iPhone 4S A5 SoC. Followed by a major update to the A7 SoC for the iPhone 5S (64-bit, Touch ID, etc.) with minor cosmetic changes to the enclosure, etc.
I wonder about the GPU performance? Snapdragon 805 so far also disappoints. Tegra K1 is blazing on the other hand. Forgot phones. I'm all for the Shield Tablet LTE! Plans are cheaper anyway.