There's only rumors at this point (and too many of those are from DigiTimes) that Samsung and GF has the A9 at 14nm. Samsung had promised 20nm in the first half of 2013 and didn't deliver. 14nm in 2015 strikes me as iffy for full rate production in the numbers Apple and Qualcomm wants.
Imma thinking the meeting went something like this. "We're so very sorry Mr. Cook for not making our 20nm promise, but we were able to add some additional circuitry to make the SoC scream on speed benchmark tests...."
"Mr. Cook, why you frown smile...? You makee me skerred!!!"
Very amusing posts above, though I suspect that much like Intel there is a firm of 'Tick Tock' going on, and we'll see Samsung back for the 6S. I believe only Samsung have the 14nm fab capabilities at present. A lot can change in a year tho. I'll take the mocking at present, it kinda feels good in the short term
Someone's dialled up to 11! I'm just saying I'm enjoying the above, it's funny stuff, but I don't think Apple and Samsung are done yet.
I agree. Some say Samsung has another year of life left, I give them a bit longer... after all Blackberry's legs still manage to kick the air and they're supposed to have died already.
Oh, yes, because Intel contracts with AMD to make the ‘tock’ version of each of their processor families¡
You know, you must deliberately go out of your way to read things in the way that most enables you to pick some fault with it. You really are the worst person on these forums.
'Tick Tock' Refers to a pendulum or similar, or for the purposes of using it in a metaphore anything which does one thing and then another before repeating. In the case of Intel, this is major redesign, refinement of design, repeat. In my comment, it was my "suspicion" that they might do a similar thing: Samsung last year, someone else this year, Samsung next year etc etc...
But don't let me stop you getting kicks from criticising others. Carry on!
I agree. Some say Samsung has another year of life left, I give them a bit longer... after all Blackberry's legs still manage to kick the air and they're supposed to have died already.
Then of course we now hear from the horse's mouth 'Blackberry is not about phones anymore ..." Maybe that leg kicking is BB treading water.
With Apple putting so much money into it TSMC, they should be able to update their chips to the 14nm very easily. There getting way more and money to work with now. This is good news. Go Apple.
Yeah, and you’re basing this on absolutely nothing, ignoring the fact that Apple has been distancing itself from Samsung for the last six years.
But no, try to tell us again how it’ll “tock” back.
My suspicion != Telling you what will happen.
It may have escaped your attention that this is a "rumour" site, therefore any and all are free to think out loud as things that may, or may not, happen in the future. It was just my opinion. You know, those things that we all have that often differ, yeah?
I note you have no caustic response to my comment that you are essentially picking arguments for fun. Perhaps that's one opinion that is hard to argue against...
What is really going to be curious to see is if the S1 is going to be manufactured by TSMC also. If the S1 is indeed manufactured by TSMC (or another non-Samsung fabricator) then I'd get the sense that Samsung is done being a chip producer for Apple. What my gut is still telling me is that somewhere behind thick walls and big doors Apple is negotiating with Intel to produce Apple designed chips. Each year that passes I'm sure Intel continues to feel the squeeze of the shrinking "PC" market (including desktop and notebooks) as more consumers move to using "good enough" mobile devices like the iPhone & iPad. Eventually Intel will either need to make a very compelling chip design based on it's own architecture that is a major leap forward from competing ARM designs (including Apples) or continue to produce Intel architecture for more powerful needs like workstations and servers and become a partner fabricator for mobile devices like the iPhone, AppleWatch, etc.
It will be an interesting facet of the AppleWatch rollout early next year to see who is making the S1 for Apple.
Apple should easily move 150 million (or more) A8 powered devices by the time the A9 comes out. I wonder, what other OEM is going to order enough processors to fill that void? Does anyone see Samsung Galaxy devices suddenly tripling in sales? Or Motorola/LG/HTC?
The market for high-end mobile processors is only so large, and Apple has 50% of it with the iPhone/iPad. There's nobody to take up that slack, so this is a significant hit to Samsung Semiconductor.
Wow. Nothing like losing a few billion dollars in revenue and having them go straight into the pockets of a major competitor.
Will they really lose BILLIONS??
I wish we knew how much they will lose this generation.
Between the iPhone and iPad, Apple makes over 200m devices per year. Say each processor is $50, that's $10b revenue. Even if it's not 100% of the volume, it's still a few billion. Samsung makes over $300b revenue per year so it won't affect them much.
When you take into consideration the low profit margins on their phones, lost business with Apple, marketing fees ($14 billion plus for 2013), legal fees, money owed to Apple for said legal action, exactly how much did Samsung's Mobile division make in the last year or so?
It's a good thing their product portfolio is diversified.
At least, with Apple eating into their high-end handsets and Xiaomi about to eat into the low-end, the future is looking bright.
/ arcasm
After you take the low profit margins, marketing fees, legal fees, money owed etc into account Samsung made in the ballpark of $20 bil in profits from its phones. ($30 bil Sam Elec with @2/3 profit from phone division).
Their Apple manufacturing contract grossed them about 1/6 of their manufacturing, or around $10 bil in *revenues* With extremely low margins in chip manufacture, and even lower margins when dealing with Apple, they probably netted a profit of $1-2 bil from Apple.
Samsung losing its Apple business is bad news for Samsung, but in terms of how much people here *wish* it hurt Samsung the decision to be a smartphone maker vs being an 'Apple supplier' remains a no-brainer.
Comments
Imma thinking the meeting went something like this. "We're so very sorry Mr. Cook for not making our 20nm promise, but we were able to add some additional circuitry to make the SoC scream on speed benchmark tests...."
"Mr. Cook, why you frown smile...? You makee me skerred!!!"
I'll?
Are you, in any way, shape, or form associated with Samsung?
Someone's dialled up to 11! I'm just saying I'm enjoying the above, it's funny stuff, but I don't think Apple and Samsung are done yet.
I just hope their fabrication talents are better than their ability to design a corporate logo.
PS: Did Motorola copy them for the Moto 360 design?¡
Ice cream is a dish best served cold.
moto 270* FTFY
Particularly since their logo is backed with a processor wafer that apparently has a very high number of dead chips in it...
Oh, yes, because Intel contracts with AMD to make the ‘tock’ version of each of their processor families¡
The only form of tick tock going on here is this:
I agree. Some say Samsung has another year of life left, I give them a bit longer... after all Blackberry's legs still manage to kick the air and they're supposed to have died already.
Oh, yes, because Intel contracts with AMD to make the ‘tock’ version of each of their processor families¡
You know, you must deliberately go out of your way to read things in the way that most enables you to pick some fault with it. You really are the worst person on these forums.
'Tick Tock' Refers to a pendulum or similar, or for the purposes of using it in a metaphore anything which does one thing and then another before repeating. In the case of Intel, this is major redesign, refinement of design, repeat. In my comment, it was my "suspicion" that they might do a similar thing: Samsung last year, someone else this year, Samsung next year etc etc...
But don't let me stop you getting kicks from criticising others. Carry on!
In my comment, it was my "suspicion" that they might do a similar thing: Samsung last year, someone else this year, Samsung next year etc etc...
Yeah, and you’re basing this on absolutely nothing, ignoring the fact that Apple has been distancing itself from Samsung for the last six years.
But no, try to tell us again how it’ll “tock” back.
Then of course we now hear from the horse's mouth 'Blackberry is not about phones anymore ..." Maybe that leg kicking is BB treading water.
Yeah, and you’re basing this on absolutely nothing, ignoring the fact that Apple has been distancing itself from Samsung for the last six years.
But no, try to tell us again how it’ll “tock” back.
My suspicion != Telling you what will happen.
It may have escaped your attention that this is a "rumour" site, therefore any and all are free to think out loud as things that may, or may not, happen in the future. It was just my opinion. You know, those things that we all have that often differ, yeah?
I note you have no caustic response to my comment that you are essentially picking arguments for fun. Perhaps that's one opinion that is hard to argue against...
What is really going to be curious to see is if the S1 is going to be manufactured by TSMC also. If the S1 is indeed manufactured by TSMC (or another non-Samsung fabricator) then I'd get the sense that Samsung is done being a chip producer for Apple. What my gut is still telling me is that somewhere behind thick walls and big doors Apple is negotiating with Intel to produce Apple designed chips. Each year that passes I'm sure Intel continues to feel the squeeze of the shrinking "PC" market (including desktop and notebooks) as more consumers move to using "good enough" mobile devices like the iPhone & iPad. Eventually Intel will either need to make a very compelling chip design based on it's own architecture that is a major leap forward from competing ARM designs (including Apples) or continue to produce Intel architecture for more powerful needs like workstations and servers and become a partner fabricator for mobile devices like the iPhone, AppleWatch, etc.
It will be an interesting facet of the AppleWatch rollout early next year to see who is making the S1 for Apple.
-PopinFRESH
Apple should easily move 150 million (or more) A8 powered devices by the time the A9 comes out. I wonder, what other OEM is going to order enough processors to fill that void? Does anyone see Samsung Galaxy devices suddenly tripling in sales? Or Motorola/LG/HTC?
The market for high-end mobile processors is only so large, and Apple has 50% of it with the iPhone/iPad. There's nobody to take up that slack, so this is a significant hit to Samsung Semiconductor.
Will they really lose BILLIONS??
I wish we knew how much they will lose this generation.
I also heard they're still making some chips for Apple since the load is too large for TSMC alone.
Between the iPhone and iPad, Apple makes over 200m devices per year. Say each processor is $50, that's $10b revenue. Even if it's not 100% of the volume, it's still a few billion. Samsung makes over $300b revenue per year so it won't affect them much.
I wonder...
When you take into consideration the low profit margins on their phones, lost business with Apple, marketing fees ($14 billion plus for 2013), legal fees, money owed to Apple for said legal action, exactly how much did Samsung's Mobile division make in the last year or so?
It's a good thing their product portfolio is diversified.
At least, with Apple eating into their high-end handsets and Xiaomi about to eat into the low-end, the future is looking bright.
/
arcasm
After you take the low profit margins, marketing fees, legal fees, money owed etc into account Samsung made in the ballpark of $20 bil in profits from its phones. ($30 bil Sam Elec with @2/3 profit from phone division).
Their Apple manufacturing contract grossed them about 1/6 of their manufacturing, or around $10 bil in *revenues* With extremely low margins in chip manufacture, and even lower margins when dealing with Apple, they probably netted a profit of $1-2 bil from Apple.
Samsung losing its Apple business is bad news for Samsung, but in terms of how much people here *wish* it hurt Samsung the decision to be a smartphone maker vs being an 'Apple supplier' remains a no-brainer.