The comparison of college admissions (where 'diversity' is used as a policy tool in admissions) to the election of a President in a freely-functioning democracy where no one, by policy or practice or proscription or prescription is required to vote for anyone (or even vote, for that matter) is thoroughly stupid.
Let me put it simply: the election of Obama had nothing do with 'diversity.'
Yeah it did. White guilt is a thing. People feeling pressured to "prove" they weren't racist happened.
Also, we're not a democracy.
And I highly doubt Apple has been discriminatory, this is just how it has shaken out. Guess what? Men tend to work in the technology sector. Shocker.
Yeah it did. White guilt is a thing. People feeling pressured to "prove" they weren't racist happened.
Also, we're not a democracy.
And I highly doubt Apple has been discriminatory, this is just how it has shaken out. Guess what? Men tend to work in the technology sector. Shocker.
Given the history of your posts, I expected something slightly smarter.
'White guilt'?! Where did that come from in the US? Why in 2008? How come it wasn't evident for 43 white guys who got elected prior to that, before #44, a half-black guy, came along? (Blacks prior to Obama did, after all, run for President).
Who was "pressuring" whom? To "prove" they weren't racist!? To not vote for a non-white person is racist? Do you have any evidence at all for your assertion that people were pressured into distancing themselves from racism? Or did you hear that and form your opinions based on some nonsense you heard from some talk radio moron?
If your thesis is true, why don't we see a whole slew of black leaders in, say Europe, where people are far more left-leaning and liberal than in the US?
If the US is not a democracy, who is? (Btw, that would be news to a whole lot of people around the world). Unless you mean something else by the term 'democracy' -- care to define it for us?
I don’t want Apple hiring engineers because of their race or gender or any other politically correct reason. I want Apple to hire engineers who are the very best at their craft. I don’t care if they are women, little green men, or Al Sharpton himself. If they’re the best then hire them.
Actually, a team of the most brilliant engineers who are all of the same background is certainly going to perform - as a group - at a lower level than a team of slightly less qualified but more diverse engineers. That is a good part of why the USA kicks butt against mono-cultural Chinese or Japanese technology companies - the USA has a long history of being more inclusive in the workplace than most other countries.
Apple as an organization has a selfish interest in ensuring that their teams are as diverse as they can make them.
Tim Cook's legacy is going to be that of pandering to these types of people.
If that's the case, he has plenty of company: Page/Brin/Schmidt, Zuckerberg/Sanders and Nadella, for starters. Read the story. Apple is far from the only one. This is an issue that SV as a whole has had to address, for better or worse. It comes with the territory.
A lot of you on this board are sounding like a bunch of threatened WMs. You may not like it -- and I am not saying that I like all of it either -- but, times they're a'changing. You're going to have to get on board.
Tim Cook's legacy is going to be that of pandering to these types of people.
Tim Cook and Apple, for those us who listened and read their position and approach to diversity, has taken an appropriate approach to the issue. Apple is not out to hit some goal of this many employees from this group and that many from that group. Apple's stance on the matter is to assist those who have traditionally been excluded from the education and opportunities that lead to STEM jobs. To, in effect, enlarge the talent pool across all ethnicities and genders, so that all companies offering such jobs will have a more diverse pool of talent from which to hire. Seems a lot of folks here in this thread and likely in general are reading their own views of past diversity failures into what Apple has clearly stated regarding its approach to the issue.
Have been a supporter of feminism up till the past year. They are a radical lot and the young female teachers we get are bored with the feminist parade of terror and just role their eyes when I ask them about it.
In Toronto Warren Farrell was protested when he tried to speak on behalf of boys and their need for father’s guidance. Sick when the feminist only cares about the female child. The radical feminists were vicious, not letting people into the lecture. The police had to be called. The rad ladies looked like guys in drag, very poorly dressed drag.
But to point, I suspect Apple only hires the best but the numbers in the field of tech, in universities is mainly male. Go figger. Women make up 65% undergraduates in Canada and probably similar numbers in the US; so what’s the Squawk about.
More off topic
I don’t see protest for more male nurses, teachers (fewer and fewer are even in high school where they used to dominate) and other jobs women dominate. Surprised, Not!
These kind (radical fems) cannot ever be happy. It’s not in their political nature. Our national radio CBC has been destroyed by them. What once was a nation building force has become nothing but a propaganda platform for nasty people of the persuasion mentioned. Not three hours goes by with some digs or comments—twisted has become the organisation I once loved.
Given the history of your posts, I expected something slightly smarter.
'White guilt'?! Where did that come from in the US? Why in 2008? How come it wasn't evident for 43 white guys who got elected prior to that, before #44, a half-black guy, came along? (Blacks prior to Obama did, after all, run for President).
Who was "pressuring" whom? To "prove" they weren't racist!? To not vote for a non-white person is racist? Do you have any evidence at all for your assertion that people were pressured into distancing themselves from racism? Or did you hear that and form your opinions based on some nonsense you heard from some talk radio moron?
If your thesis is true, why don't we see a whole slew of black leaders in, say Europe, where people are far more left-leaning and liberal than in the US?
If the US is not a democracy, who is? (Btw, that would be news to a whole lot of people around the world). Unless you mean something else by the term 'democracy' -- care to define it for us?
That this common misconception has not been eradicated is a testament to the low quality of our educational system. We do not have a democracy. We literally do not. We have a constitutional representative republic. It may be described in other ways, but it is NOT a democracy.
There is intrinsic value in actively pursuing diversity in the workplace. Companies full of middle class, white men tend to make middle class, white men decisions. This has the potential to be a problem if your customer base is broader than just middle class, white men.
There is intrinsic value in actively pursuing diversity in the workplace. Companies full of middle class, white men tend to make middle class, white men decisions. This has the potential to be a problem if your customer base is broader than just middle class, white men.
You'd be right in theory, however under Apple's current workforce mix they've become the biggest company in the world, selling their products to every type of person. That indicates to me that what they've been doing is working.
I only hope that Apple's management does not become overconfident and confused about their core mission and mistake their current success for a permanent free pass.
But..but..but...DIVERSITY! And JESSE JACKSON! And WARM FUZZIES!
Yeah, this whole crusade Cook appears to be embarking on is not one of his high points. Perhaps he's never heard of Jacques Nasser...Ford did so well under his reign, especially when Nasser said he didn't like the "sea of white male faces" and started firing people to replace them with "more desirable" minorities.
"Crusade"? You make it sound as if Cook is fucking getting rid of all his employees and top executives and replacing them with random females. Yeah, the guy cares about these issues, we've seen that Cook is conscientious and actually deeply cares about many social. humanitarian causes. That does not equate to not hiring the best person for the job. There also isn't a shred of evidence that Cook is harming the company, quite the opposite, the fact that Apple seems to care about this stuff makes it a more attractive brand to many. Cook seems like an extremely rational, objective, and measured individual. Stop sensationalizing this stuff just based on your ideology. No fucking need to bring in Jesse Jackson every time equality is mentioned. Cook is not Jobs in terms of character traits, but there's no evidence that he's "fuzzy" when it comes to inter company leadership.
Btw, that would be news to a whole lot of people around the world
Yes, and they’re idiots. The United States has never been a democracy. That people have been tricked into thinking this is one of the greatest crimes of the modern age within this country.
If your thesis is true, why don't we see a whole slew of black leaders in, say Europe, where people are far more left-leaning and liberal than in the US?
You must be kidding! Europe talks the talk, but they don't walk the walk.
Europeans were all enthusiastic for Obama, because he wasn't going to be their leader! I've been to Europe plenty of times, and Europe is more racist than the USA by far! They don't actually like to elect darker skinned people over there. European liberals are all talk, all BS. And also, the more liberal that somebody is, the more racist they are likely to be, so it makes perfect sense that European liberal racists wouldn't actually vote for any darkies over there.
Comments
It would be interesting to see what the current pool of applicants looks like once broken down. Pick a sampling of, say 3 years.
Let's say that it exactly mirrors the proportion of, say, women that now work at Apple.
What would that tell you?
Yeah it did. White guilt is a thing. People feeling pressured to "prove" they weren't racist happened.
Also, we're not a democracy.
And I highly doubt Apple has been discriminatory, this is just how it has shaken out. Guess what? Men tend to work in the technology sector. Shocker.
Yeah it did. White guilt is a thing. People feeling pressured to "prove" they weren't racist happened.
Also, we're not a democracy.
And I highly doubt Apple has been discriminatory, this is just how it has shaken out. Guess what? Men tend to work in the technology sector. Shocker.
Given the history of your posts, I expected something slightly smarter.
'White guilt'?! Where did that come from in the US? Why in 2008? How come it wasn't evident for 43 white guys who got elected prior to that, before #44, a half-black guy, came along? (Blacks prior to Obama did, after all, run for President).
Who was "pressuring" whom? To "prove" they weren't racist!? To not vote for a non-white person is racist? Do you have any evidence at all for your assertion that people were pressured into distancing themselves from racism? Or did you hear that and form your opinions based on some nonsense you heard from some talk radio moron?
If your thesis is true, why don't we see a whole slew of black leaders in, say Europe, where people are far more left-leaning and liberal than in the US?
If the US is not a democracy, who is? (Btw, that would be news to a whole lot of people around the world). Unless you mean something else by the term 'democracy' -- care to define it for us?
Tim Cook's legacy is going to be that of pandering to these types of people.
Is Abby Normal your sister?
Apple as an organization has a selfish interest in ensuring that their teams are as diverse as they can make them.
Tim Cook's legacy is going to be that of pandering to these types of people.
If that's the case, he has plenty of company: Page/Brin/Schmidt, Zuckerberg/Sanders and Nadella, for starters. Read the story. Apple is far from the only one. This is an issue that SV as a whole has had to address, for better or worse. It comes with the territory.
A lot of you on this board are sounding like a bunch of threatened WMs. You may not like it -- and I am not saying that I like all of it either -- but, times they're a'changing. You're going to have to get on board.
Tim Cook and Apple, for those us who listened and read their position and approach to diversity, has taken an appropriate approach to the issue. Apple is not out to hit some goal of this many employees from this group and that many from that group. Apple's stance on the matter is to assist those who have traditionally been excluded from the education and opportunities that lead to STEM jobs. To, in effect, enlarge the talent pool across all ethnicities and genders, so that all companies offering such jobs will have a more diverse pool of talent from which to hire. Seems a lot of folks here in this thread and likely in general are reading their own views of past diversity failures into what Apple has clearly stated regarding its approach to the issue.
Have been a supporter of feminism up till the past year. They are a radical lot and the young female teachers we get are bored with the feminist parade of terror and just role their eyes when I ask them about it.
In Toronto Warren Farrell was protested when he tried to speak on behalf of boys and their need for father’s guidance. Sick when the feminist only cares about the female child. The radical feminists were vicious, not letting people into the lecture. The police had to be called. The rad ladies looked like guys in drag, very poorly dressed drag.
But to point, I suspect Apple only hires the best but the numbers in the field of tech, in universities is mainly male. Go figger. Women make up 65% undergraduates in Canada and probably similar numbers in the US; so what’s the Squawk about.
More off topic
I don’t see protest for more male nurses, teachers (fewer and fewer are even in high school where they used to dominate) and other jobs women dominate. Surprised, Not!
These kind (radical fems) cannot ever be happy. It’s not in their political nature. Our national radio CBC has been destroyed by them. What once was a nation building force has become nothing but a propaganda platform for nasty people of the persuasion mentioned. Not three hours goes by with some digs or comments—twisted has become the organisation I once loved.
Well, I feel better ????
Namaste,
mhikl
And that really all there is to say about that.
That this common misconception has not been eradicated is a testament to the low quality of our educational system. We do not have a democracy. We literally do not. We have a constitutional representative republic. It may be described in other ways, but it is NOT a democracy.
There is intrinsic value in actively pursuing diversity in the workplace. Companies full of middle class, white men tend to make middle class, white men decisions. This has the potential to be a problem if your customer base is broader than just middle class, white men.
You'd be right in theory, however under Apple's current workforce mix they've become the biggest company in the world, selling their products to every type of person. That indicates to me that what they've been doing is working.
I only hope that Apple's management does not become overconfident and confused about their core mission and mistake their current success for a permanent free pass.
But..but..but...DIVERSITY! And JESSE JACKSON! And WARM FUZZIES!
Yeah, this whole crusade Cook appears to be embarking on is not one of his high points. Perhaps he's never heard of Jacques Nasser...Ford did so well under his reign, especially when Nasser said he didn't like the "sea of white male faces" and started firing people to replace them with "more desirable" minorities.
"Crusade"? You make it sound as if Cook is fucking getting rid of all his employees and top executives and replacing them with random females. Yeah, the guy cares about these issues, we've seen that Cook is conscientious and actually deeply cares about many social. humanitarian causes. That does not equate to not hiring the best person for the job. There also isn't a shred of evidence that Cook is harming the company, quite the opposite, the fact that Apple seems to care about this stuff makes it a more attractive brand to many. Cook seems like an extremely rational, objective, and measured individual. Stop sensationalizing this stuff just based on your ideology. No fucking need to bring in Jesse Jackson every time equality is mentioned. Cook is not Jobs in terms of character traits, but there's no evidence that he's "fuzzy" when it comes to inter company leadership.
Yes, and they’re idiots. The United States has never been a democracy. That people have been tricked into thinking this is one of the greatest crimes of the modern age within this country.
If your thesis is true, why don't we see a whole slew of black leaders in, say Europe, where people are far more left-leaning and liberal than in the US?
You must be kidding! Europe talks the talk, but they don't walk the walk.
Europeans were all enthusiastic for Obama, because he wasn't going to be their leader! I've been to Europe plenty of times, and Europe is more racist than the USA by far! They don't actually like to elect darker skinned people over there. European liberals are all talk, all BS. And also, the more liberal that somebody is, the more racist they are likely to be, so it makes perfect sense that European liberal racists wouldn't actually vote for any darkies over there.
...they thought he was going to be able to take the US as far left as they are.
Just let it be. Who cares if fewer women join a tech company? Maybe they don’t want to be there. Don’t force them.
I don't think Apple's recruitment team is planning to force anyone to come to work at Apple.