get an os and computer for whatever suits your needs, those who don't agree with your choice aren't under some RDF and you aren't the only one 'using' your computer.
my major complaint is loading times! Windows launched programs 1 billion times faster... I dread when I click on a PDF weblink or a word document just because of the load time! And this is on a 800 tower...
[quote] 6) The browser situation is a bad joke. My son's P3, running less than half the number of Mhz than my 450 Sawtooth is way faster when browsing, especially on complicated pages <hr></blockquote>
am i the only one who realizes this is a blatant lie? the PIII started at 450MHz, so there's no way his son's P3 is running at "half the number of Mhz" of his 450MHz sawtooth. and if he 'meant' his son's PII running at about 233MHz(?) runs "way faster" than his 450sawtooth, i simply don't believe it. sorry, but putting in a few lies for "color" simply makes the whole post worthless in my eyes...
am i the only one who realizes this is a blatant lie? the PIII started at 450MHz, so there's no way his son's P3 is running at "half the number of Mhz" of his 450MHz sawtooth. and if he 'meant' his son's PII running at about 233MHz(?) runs "way faster" than his 450sawtooth, i simply don't believe it. sorry, but putting in a few lies for "color" simply makes the whole post worthless in my eyes...</strong><hr></blockquote>
I don't know if that is true since I don't follow the Wintel world too closely, but I weill take your word on it. I can't wait to hear his reply on that! (My money says he doesn't reply!)
[quote]This is the only part about your last post that I really disagree with. You see, iTunes on my dual 500 NEVER skips, even during some extremely intense CPU load. I just tried this to prove my point: I can be rendering a 3d video (utilizing both procs in C4D), watching a QuickTime movie play, and type a letter in Word in Virtual PC... and iTunes still never skips a beat.
Something really must be wrong with your setup, man.
[edit] Oh, I forgot to add that in the background I also had running OmniWeb, Mozilla, Mail, Adium, TextEdit, GraphicConverter, Photoshop 7.0 beta, Terminal, Snapz Pro X, and Escape Velocity: Nova. These processes were using next to zero percent of the CPU, but it's still nice to note that on OSX none of these apps disrupt the work flow while not in use.
<hr></blockquote>
Talk about adding color... Hey starfleetx, so you've got all this stuff running at the same time and iTunes doesn't stutter...Uh huh.
Look people, I'm not dumping on Apple BUT, Steve Jobs whishes he had Bill Gates' dough. Bill Gates whishes he had Steve Jobs' charisma. Neither individual nor thier companies are warm and fuzzy.
I don't know if that is true since I don't follow the Wintel world too closely, but I weill take your word on it. I can't wait to hear his reply on that! (My money says he doesn't reply!)
</strong><hr></blockquote>
It is true. I am typing on the first PIII made. It's a 450!! By the way, I just ordered my very first Mac ever. I got the ibook. I figured it was cheap and portable so I couldn't go wrong. I can't wait. I have been an AIX programmer for some time, and like linux i am sure that gui stuff is kinda slower compared to windows, but command line kicks butt, plus I can write scripts to do whatever i want along with all the free open source stuff...man if OSX does catch on like the linux world the sky is the limit. I work for a large hospital and I have meetings all the time with IBM (we are big IBM shop) reps trying to sell us new stuff (shark, sans) and the biggestest selling point is linux compatability. OSX could be next one day!?! my 2 cents (probably no one cares though)
It is true. I am typing on the first PIII made. It's a 450!! By the way, I just ordered my very first Mac ever. I got the ibook. I figured it was cheap and portable so I couldn't go wrong. I can't wait. I have been an AIX programmer for some time, and like linux i am sure that gui stuff is kinda slower compared to windows, but command line kicks butt, plus I can write scripts to do whatever i want along with all the free open source stuff...man if OSX does catch on like the linux world the sky is the limit. I work for a large hospital and I have meetings all the time with IBM (we are big IBM shop) reps trying to sell us new stuff (shark, sans) and the biggestest selling point is linux compatability. OSX could be next one day!?! my 2 cents (probably no one cares though) </strong><hr></blockquote>
congrats. and have fun with the iBook. I've had several friends switch from being lifelong unix (and now linux) users, to loving every minute of OS X. hopefully you'll feel the same way.
check out these sites as starting points for fun in OS X:
congrats. and have fun with the iBook. I've had several friends switch from being lifelong unix (and now linux) users, to loving every minute of OS X. hopefully you'll feel the same way.
check out these sites as starting points for fun in OS X:
Thanks! By the way, this site was the one that convinced me to buy the Mac. Even the people complaining about there machines still stuck with them. Made me want to see what all the fuss was about! <img src="graemlins/lol.gif" border="0" alt="[Laughing]" />
concentricity, you sir, are very observant. Aye, there is no such a beastie. I went back to look at my original post. It's unintentionally misleading. I meant to say that I had 60 Gigs worth of 10,000rpm HD. I actually have two HDs. IBM Ultrastar 36.70 ultra 160's. They are not in a RAID configuration as Windows XP Home does not support that. XP Pro does. Cool...
Talk about adding color... Hey starfleetx, so you've got all this stuff running at the same time and iTunes doesn't stutter...Uh huh.
Look people, I'm not dumping on Apple BUT, Steve Jobs whishes he had Bill Gates' dough. Bill Gates whishes he had Steve Jobs' charisma. Neither individual nor thier companies are warm and fuzzy.
I haven't ever had iTunes skip on me on my iMac 600. Even when I am running iTunes, setiathome -nice 20, Maple 6 in classic, Word X, Excel X, Omniweb, and Quicktime, it still won't skip. I've even accidently had iTunes going when I have launched Quake 3 and iTunes still didn't skip.
I do agree with you though. Apple does need some way faster hardware. I wish I didn't have to wait until July get something new. I just want something that will give me PC comparable FPS on Quake III, and OS X 10.2.
First off Amorph, Respect! You have some valid points indeed though I happen to disaggree with most of what you say. I just feel compelled to comment on one thing you said.
[quote] 2) Macs are overpriced.
They have always been, and they will always be, more expensive than commodity PCs. Not without cause. Even in Apple's blackest days, when they were really overpriced, they still beat PCs for TCO. <hr></blockquote> If you go let's say 5 years back in time and compare Mac/PC Price/performance ratio and then do the same with todays Macs your results might be shocking. The Mac is getting further behind month by month, year by year. Why do you think SJ has stopped making his "Pentium Toasing" demonstrations on trade shows?
[quote]Originally posted by concentricity:
<strong>
am i the only one who realizes this is a blatant lie? the PIII started at 450MHz, so there's no way his son's P3 is running at "half the number of Mhz" of his 450MHz sawtooth. and if he 'meant' his son's PII running at about 233MHz(?) runs "way faster" than his 450sawtooth, i simply don't believe it. sorry, but putting in a few lies for "color" simply makes the whole post worthless in my eyes...</strong><hr></blockquote> Thank for correcting my typo. It is an IBM PII 233, 64mb. This of course makes Apple look even worse. However, if a single typo makes a post worthless in your opinion you actually may have problem finding worthy posts in here
<strong>Talk about adding color... Hey starfleetx, so you've got all this stuff running at the same time and iTunes doesn't stutter...Uh huh.</strong><hr></blockquote>I was and am totally serious.
Would you like me to do it again and whip out my video camera to post some proof? (I could use Snapz Pro X, but the system would be under such strain that it may just barely capture 1 fps with the audio)
The rdf is showing cracks. Do ya hear me Steve? Its falling down around your overpaid ears. And yes, quick to follow were the shameful apple apologists who have have even more than jobs to put apple in a perilous position. The lines are being drawn quite simply between the New era of mac users who don't take sh*t and the rose tinted brigade who would have you believe that a 1Ghz mac could outperform a parrallel processing supercomputer @ 400Ghz because of Altivec and OSX!
OSX is slow as hell - its bloody obvious. Yet even when the damn thing is flowing like molasses down the screen in front of them they shout "No it isn't, I think its rather snappy actually".
It just boils down to the fact that "Oh, my mac starts up and I can rip MP3 tracks, therefore it must be better than a PC" is enough for apple apologists. While this state of affairs remaisn there is no pressure on apple to see sense.
I've said thius many times. Steve Jobs by all accounts does not take cr*p. He allegedly screams, throws things, drops people and companies in fits of pique, fires people left right and center and always screams to get what he wants. This situation with MOTO would not exist if Steve did not want things this way.This situation with MOTO would not exist if Steve did not want things this way.
We are all being prepared for the time when apple stops making computers, merges with Disney, Dreamworks, AOL or some other sugary crappy non entity to become a kids content company.
STOP APOLOGISING and start telling apple that we want the best and nothing else is good enough to have the apple logo on it. We have stood by apple through thick and thin and have no wish to be cast aside now.
I just think it's hilarious how people blame the CEO of Apple for it's hardware.
You could blame Jon Rubenstein or Motorola, or perhaps even some of the Apple hardware engineers - if you knew who they were - but blaming Jobs just cracks me up.
I'm no Apple apologist but I think it's really stretching it to say that Jobs is going to 'bring Apple down'. I'd like to know who people who prefer be in the CEO spot. Also, what kind of indicator would it be to Wall St. if Jobs were to stand up and say, "I quit! I just can't do it". Jobs has his flaws, but he's got (as Amorph puts it) a crackerjack executive team. That's who really makes the decisions. Jobs is a front man. Sure, he probably has final say in a lot of things such as the design of the iMac - which he was right about BTW - but it was Ives and Rubenstein who figured out how to make the thing.
It's the software engineers that make OS X. If you feel it's slow, its there fault. I doubt Steve is in his office saying, "just let it be slow guys, it doesn't really matter, I'll just use my RDF and convince everyone it's faster.".
And I don't understand posts like Spooky's that refer to him as someone who lays people off left, right, front and center. Apple happens to be the company that hasn't laid off large amounts of people. That would be the CEO's of the large PC companies lately. Sure, Jobs did a lot of housecleaning when he came back...but that's history. We all have history.
Granted there is room for improvement in the hardware lineup - always will be. I just don't see how cussing out the CEO is making any kind of valid statement.
Oh, and I'm up for a Mac Genius position here in NYC (what the hell, working in a corporate office ain't my thing) so soon the guy may effectively be my boss. Who sticks up for their boss anyways?
<strong>Thank for correcting my typo. It is an IBM PII 233, 64mb. This of course makes Apple look even worse. However, if a single typo makes a post worthless in your opinion you actually may have problem finding worthy posts in here
[ 03-24-2002: Message edited by: kelib ]</strong><hr></blockquote>
The rdf is showing cracks. Do ya hear me Steve? Its falling down around your overpaid ears.</strong><hr></blockquote>
overpaid?!?!!??!
he's worked for a dollar every year he's been back, though he did get a jet and 43mil in stock options he did save the ****ing company. rdf? yes. overpaid? hardly.
<strong>I just think it's hilarious how people blame the CEO of Apple for it's hardware.
You could blame Jon Rubenstein or Motorola, or perhaps even some of the Apple hardware engineers - if you knew who they were - but blaming Jobs just cracks me up.
</strong><hr></blockquote> Funny statement. I do my business with Apple so it's Apple I hold accountable. From where Apple gets their components is non of my concern as long as they work. It's also SJ's job to make sure all departments of the company stay competitive
Comments
get an os and computer for whatever suits your needs, those who don't agree with your choice aren't under some RDF and you aren't the only one 'using' your computer.
am i the only one who realizes this is a blatant lie? the PIII started at 450MHz, so there's no way his son's P3 is running at "half the number of Mhz" of his 450MHz sawtooth. and if he 'meant' his son's PII running at about 233MHz(?) runs "way faster" than his 450sawtooth, i simply don't believe it. sorry, but putting in a few lies for "color" simply makes the whole post worthless in my eyes...
<strong>
am i the only one who realizes this is a blatant lie? the PIII started at 450MHz, so there's no way his son's P3 is running at "half the number of Mhz" of his 450MHz sawtooth. and if he 'meant' his son's PII running at about 233MHz(?) runs "way faster" than his 450sawtooth, i simply don't believe it. sorry, but putting in a few lies for "color" simply makes the whole post worthless in my eyes...</strong><hr></blockquote>
I don't know if that is true since I don't follow the Wintel world too closely, but I weill take your word on it. I can't wait to hear his reply on that! (My money says he doesn't reply!)
Something really must be wrong with your setup, man.
[edit] Oh, I forgot to add that in the background I also had running OmniWeb, Mozilla, Mail, Adium, TextEdit, GraphicConverter, Photoshop 7.0 beta, Terminal, Snapz Pro X, and Escape Velocity: Nova. These processes were using next to zero percent of the CPU, but it's still nice to note that on OSX none of these apps disrupt the work flow while not in use.
<hr></blockquote>
Talk about adding color...
Look people, I'm not dumping on Apple BUT, Steve Jobs whishes he had Bill Gates' dough. Bill Gates whishes he had Steve Jobs' charisma. Neither individual nor thier companies are warm and fuzzy.
[ 03-24-2002: Message edited by: breakskull ]</p>
not to nitpick, but where did you find a 60GB 10,000RPM drive? is it U160, or EIDE?
i don't know of a single company that makes one.
how about some more info?
thanks!
<img src="graemlins/oyvey.gif" border="0" alt="[No]" />
<strong>
I don't know if that is true since I don't follow the Wintel world too closely, but I weill take your word on it. I can't wait to hear his reply on that! (My money says he doesn't reply!)
It is true. I am typing on the first PIII made. It's a 450!! By the way, I just ordered my very first Mac ever. I got the ibook. I figured it was cheap and portable so I couldn't go wrong. I can't wait. I have been an AIX programmer for some time, and like linux i am sure that gui stuff is kinda slower compared to windows, but command line kicks butt, plus I can write scripts to do whatever i want along with all the free open source stuff...man if OSX does catch on like the linux world the sky is the limit. I work for a large hospital and I have meetings all the time with IBM (we are big IBM shop) reps trying to sell us new stuff (shark, sans) and the biggestest selling point is linux compatability. OSX could be next one day!?! my 2 cents (probably no one cares though)
<strong>
It is true. I am typing on the first PIII made. It's a 450!! By the way, I just ordered my very first Mac ever. I got the ibook. I figured it was cheap and portable so I couldn't go wrong. I can't wait. I have been an AIX programmer for some time, and like linux i am sure that gui stuff is kinda slower compared to windows, but command line kicks butt, plus I can write scripts to do whatever i want along with all the free open source stuff...man if OSX does catch on like the linux world the sky is the limit. I work for a large hospital and I have meetings all the time with IBM (we are big IBM shop) reps trying to sell us new stuff (shark, sans) and the biggestest selling point is linux compatability. OSX could be next one day!?! my 2 cents (probably no one cares though)
congrats. and have fun with the iBook. I've had several friends switch from being lifelong unix (and now linux) users, to loving every minute of OS X. hopefully you'll feel the same way.
check out these sites as starting points for fun in OS X:
<a href="http://www.darwin.org"; target="_blank">Darwin</a>
<a href="http://www.macosx.org"; target="_blank">MacOSX.org</a>
<a href="http://mrcla.com/XonX/"; target="_blank">XonX</a>
<strong>
congrats. and have fun with the iBook. I've had several friends switch from being lifelong unix (and now linux) users, to loving every minute of OS X. hopefully you'll feel the same way.
check out these sites as starting points for fun in OS X:
<a href="http://www.darwin.org"; target="_blank">Darwin</a>
<a href="http://www.macosx.org"; target="_blank">MacOSX.org</a>
<a href="http://mrcla.com/XonX/"; target="_blank">XonX</a></strong><hr></blockquote>
Thanks! By the way, this site was the one that convinced me to buy the Mac. Even the people complaining about there machines still stuck with them. Made me want to see what all the fuss was about! <img src="graemlins/lol.gif" border="0" alt="[Laughing]" />
<strong>
Talk about adding color...
Look people, I'm not dumping on Apple BUT, Steve Jobs whishes he had Bill Gates' dough. Bill Gates whishes he had Steve Jobs' charisma. Neither individual nor thier companies are warm and fuzzy.
[ 03-24-2002: Message edited by: breakskull ]</strong><hr></blockquote>
I haven't ever had iTunes skip on me on my iMac 600. Even when I am running iTunes, setiathome -nice 20, Maple 6 in classic, Word X, Excel X, Omniweb, and Quicktime, it still won't skip. I've even accidently had iTunes going when I have launched Quake 3 and iTunes still didn't skip.
I do agree with you though. Apple does need some way faster hardware. I wish I didn't have to wait until July get something new. I just want something that will give me PC comparable FPS on Quake III, and OS X 10.2.
[ 03-24-2002: Message edited by: Intelligent Dandy ]</p>
[quote] 2) Macs are overpriced.
They have always been, and they will always be, more expensive than commodity PCs. Not without cause. Even in Apple's blackest days, when they were really overpriced, they still beat PCs for TCO. <hr></blockquote> If you go let's say 5 years back in time and compare Mac/PC Price/performance ratio and then do the same with todays Macs your results might be shocking. The Mac is getting further behind month by month, year by year. Why do you think SJ has stopped making his "Pentium Toasing" demonstrations on trade shows?
[quote]Originally posted by concentricity:
<strong>
am i the only one who realizes this is a blatant lie? the PIII started at 450MHz, so there's no way his son's P3 is running at "half the number of Mhz" of his 450MHz sawtooth. and if he 'meant' his son's PII running at about 233MHz(?) runs "way faster" than his 450sawtooth, i simply don't believe it. sorry, but putting in a few lies for "color" simply makes the whole post worthless in my eyes...</strong><hr></blockquote> Thank for correcting my typo. It is an IBM PII 233, 64mb. This of course makes Apple look even worse. However, if a single typo makes a post worthless in your opinion you actually may have problem finding worthy posts in here
[ 03-24-2002: Message edited by: kelib ]</p>
<strong>Talk about adding color...
Would you like me to do it again and whip out my video camera to post some proof?
[ 03-24-2002: Message edited by: starfleetX ]</p>
[ 03-24-2002: Message edited by: kelib ]</p>
The rdf is showing cracks. Do ya hear me Steve? Its falling down around your overpaid ears. And yes, quick to follow were the shameful apple apologists who have have even more than jobs to put apple in a perilous position. The lines are being drawn quite simply between the New era of mac users who don't take sh*t and the rose tinted brigade who would have you believe that a 1Ghz mac could outperform a parrallel processing supercomputer @ 400Ghz because of Altivec and OSX!
OSX is slow as hell - its bloody obvious. Yet even when the damn thing is flowing like molasses down the screen in front of them they shout "No it isn't, I think its rather snappy actually".
It just boils down to the fact that "Oh, my mac starts up and I can rip MP3 tracks, therefore it must be better than a PC" is enough for apple apologists. While this state of affairs remaisn there is no pressure on apple to see sense.
I've said thius many times. Steve Jobs by all accounts does not take cr*p. He allegedly screams, throws things, drops people and companies in fits of pique, fires people left right and center and always screams to get what he wants. This situation with MOTO would not exist if Steve did not want things this way.This situation with MOTO would not exist if Steve did not want things this way.
We are all being prepared for the time when apple stops making computers, merges with Disney, Dreamworks, AOL or some other sugary crappy non entity to become a kids content company.
STOP APOLOGISING and start telling apple that we want the best and nothing else is good enough to have the apple logo on it. We have stood by apple through thick and thin and have no wish to be cast aside now.
You could blame Jon Rubenstein or Motorola, or perhaps even some of the Apple hardware engineers - if you knew who they were - but blaming Jobs just cracks me up.
I'm no Apple apologist but I think it's really stretching it to say that Jobs is going to 'bring Apple down'. I'd like to know who people who prefer be in the CEO spot. Also, what kind of indicator would it be to Wall St. if Jobs were to stand up and say, "I quit! I just can't do it". Jobs has his flaws, but he's got (as Amorph puts it) a crackerjack executive team. That's who really makes the decisions. Jobs is a front man. Sure, he probably has final say in a lot of things such as the design of the iMac - which he was right about BTW - but it was Ives and Rubenstein who figured out how to make the thing.
It's the software engineers that make OS X. If you feel it's slow, its there fault. I doubt Steve is in his office saying, "just let it be slow guys, it doesn't really matter, I'll just use my RDF and convince everyone it's faster.".
And I don't understand posts like Spooky's that refer to him as someone who lays people off left, right, front and center. Apple happens to be the company that hasn't laid off large amounts of people. That would be the CEO's of the large PC companies lately. Sure, Jobs did a lot of housecleaning when he came back...but that's history. We all have history.
Granted there is room for improvement in the hardware lineup - always will be. I just don't see how cussing out the CEO is making any kind of valid statement.
Oh, and I'm up for a Mac Genius position here in NYC (what the hell, working in a corporate office ain't my thing) so soon the guy may effectively be my boss.
<strong>Thank for correcting my typo. It is an IBM PII 233, 64mb. This of course makes Apple look even worse. However, if a single typo makes a post worthless in your opinion you actually may have problem finding worthy posts in here
[ 03-24-2002: Message edited by: kelib ]</strong><hr></blockquote>
yes.
<strong>FINALLY!
The rdf is showing cracks. Do ya hear me Steve? Its falling down around your overpaid ears.</strong><hr></blockquote>
overpaid?!?!!??!
he's worked for a dollar every year he's been back, though he did get a jet and 43mil in stock options he did save the ****ing company. rdf? yes. overpaid? hardly.
<strong>I just think it's hilarious how people blame the CEO of Apple for it's hardware.
You could blame Jon Rubenstein or Motorola, or perhaps even some of the Apple hardware engineers - if you knew who they were - but blaming Jobs just cracks me up.
</strong><hr></blockquote> Funny statement. I do my business with Apple so it's Apple I hold accountable. From where Apple gets their components is non of my concern as long as they work. It's also SJ's job to make sure all departments of the company stay competitive
[ 03-24-2002: Message edited by: Intelligent Dandy ]</p>