I agree with the posters above that it is doubtful -- not impossible, but improbable -- NK hacked Sony. It is unlikely that a country with a thousand IP addresses has this kind of skill.
It is, however, possible that they paid some hackers (Lizard Squad?) to do it.
In either event, God help us if all it takes is some backward country and/or a bunch of hackers operating on the dark web to pull off something of this magnitude. We're at their mercy, i.e., screwed.
What next? Financial systems? Electrical grid? Weapons systems?
Can we please just cut off the Norks completely? Zero exceptions? Everything blocked.
Force his hand, end the war, and remove Korea as an economic challenge to the US. AND NO US MONEY SENT TO REBUILD THE COUNTRY.
We’re perpetuating crimes against humanity on the order of the Holodomor here. There’s no justification for allowing North Korea to continue to exist.
Time to watch Propaganda 2012...
Very clever way of putting a mirror up to the West. No, it isn't really from North Korea. But it does include some important facts that are rarely considered by Americans clamoring for war.
Just the fact that the USA killed millions of North Koreans should be enough to make calls for war grossly inappropriate. Want to understand why North Korea is the way North Korea is? Consider that a militarized state is very often fending off a much more powerful aggressor.
Stop criticizing other people's countries. That's their business. Start criticizing your own. The USA has plenty of faults to discuss and correct. No need to act like a Nazi with blind patriotism and bald assertions of the need for aggression against others by virtue of our ostensible superiority.
I agree with the posters above that it is doubtful -- not impossible, but improbable -- NK hacked Sony. It is unlikely that a country with a thousand IP addresses has this kind of skill.
It is, however, possible that they paid some hackers (Lizard Squad?) to do it.
In either event, God help us if all it takes is some backward country and/or a bunch of hackers operating on the dark web to pull off something of this magnitude. We're at their mercy, i.e., screwed.
What next? Financial systems? Electrical grid? Weapons systems?
I agree with everything you say. If I am not mistaken Nuclear power stations' safety systems have already been attacked.
As you say, it is just a matter of time before something nasty this way comes. How long before some country thinks another did a really bad cyber attack and retaliates with conventional weapons? We have to remember many countries that are not exactly stable have nukes.
What, in the Korean War? Gee, what are the odds that people would be killed in wartime.
Nice fallacies, by the way.
And a Godwin to round it out. Great going!
I'll remind you that your post called for a total blockade and questioned the right of North Korea to even exist. This hypocritical hubris could only come from an American. But watch Propaganda 2012. You'll like it.
I'll remind you that your post called for a total blockade and questioned the right of North Korea to even exist. This hypocritical hubris could only come from an American. But watch Propaganda 2012. You'll like it. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ptlXITZ_VQ&spfreload=10
Folks like TS wanting NK to 'cease to exist' is surely a metaphor for regime change, not the annihilation of the innocent inhabitants. What sane human would not wish the end of that regime? Do you support it?
BTW that video is way out of date. I'm not religious but the new Pope is no replica of most former Popes.
I agree with the posters above that it is doubtful -- not impossible, but improbable -- NK hacked Sony. It is unlikely that a country with a thousand IP addresses has this kind of skill.
It is, however, possible that they paid some hackers (Lizard Squad?) to do it.
In either event, God help us if all it takes is some backward country and/or a bunch of hackers operating on the dark web to pull off something of this magnitude. We're at their mercy, i.e., screwed.
What next? Financial systems? Electrical grid? Weapons systems?
I think there is a big misconception about North Korea. They do have the skills to carry out an attack like this. North Korea has thousands of hackers that have been trained in China. I'm sure this hack originated out of China, but was done by North Korean nationals. The North Koreans have already hacked financial systems in South Korea. They've shut down the financial systems there numerous times. I have no doubt in my mind the Sony hack was done by North Korea.
I think there is a big misconception about North Korea. They do have the skills to carry out an attack like this. North Korea has thousands of hackers that have been trained in China. I'm sure this hack originated out of China, but was done by North Korean nationals. The North Koreans have already hacked financial systems in South Korea. They've shut down the financial systems there numerous times. I have no doubt in my mind the Sony hack was done by North Korea.
I for sure don't know but if I had to bet my money is on your theory. They may well have obscured their tracks deliberately leading to the erudite article claiming they are innocent.
Sanction China. China keeps North Korea alive as a drain on our economy.
Let China have Korea. Withdraw our troops from Korea and save billions of taxpayer dollars each year.
Maybe then this useless Congress will spend some money on our crumbling infrastructure.
I think our consumers may argue against China having 'Korea.'
As would Japan/APAC allies.
Not that I disagree with you, I'm just saying, we're buying a lot of geo-political alignments in South Korea.
OTOH, South Korea is cutting their defense budget, but are 'paying' the U.S. $800MUSD for our military presence.
Methinks we should taking the stand that if Samsung et al, want the protections of the U.S. military, they should pay top $$ for the privilege (make our expeditionary forces a 'profit center,' not a 'cost center')
Folks like TS wanting NK to 'cease to exist' is surely a metaphor for regime change, not the annihilation of the innocent inhabitants
Ok, but the last time the USA tried that they ended up killing 3 million of them. Regime change usually means a blood bath.
The USA and the West do everything they can to strangle countries that attempt to avoid the social consequences of market economies, and then they point to these damaged states as failures. The Interview is political propaganda passed off as entertainment. And it is in bad taste, directed at a country who suffered massive casualties inflicted by our military. No reason to celebrate that.
I think our consumers may argue against China having 'Korea.'
As would Japan/APAC allies.
Not that I disagree with you, I'm just saying, we're buying a lot of geo-political alignments in South Korea.
OTOH, South Korea is cutting their defense budget, but are 'paying' the U.S. $800MUSD for our military presence.
Methinks we should taking the stand that if Samsung et al, want the protections of the U.S. military, they should pay top $$ for the privilege (make our expeditionary forces a 'profit center,' not a 'cost center')
Now there is an idea! But then I am biased against Samsung!
Folks like TS wanting NK to 'cease to exist' is surely a metaphor for regime change, not the annihilation of the innocent inhabitants. What sane human would not wish the end of that regime? Do you support it?
BTW that video is way out of date.
The lunch room conversation about NK and 'The Interview' was if the U.S. really wanted to get regime change in North Korea, fly a few drone controlled C141s full of Big Macs and Coke over the DMZ and carpetbomb the people with western decadentism.
You know the aphorism, "There has never been a war between 2 countries that have a McDonald's Franshised located in them."
Ok, but the last time the USA tried that they ended up killing 3 million of them. Regime change usually means a blood bath.
The USA and the West do everything they can to strangle countries that attempt to avoid the social consequences of market economies, and then they point to these damaged states as failures. The Interview is political propaganda passed off as entertainment. And it is in bad taste, directed at a country who suffered massive casualties inflicted by our military. No reason to celebrate that.
NK is something all countries on earth should do something about. It is a prison run by a lunatic. I simply cannot see comparing it to much else on the planet to be honest. It makes Cuba look like Disneyland.
This is sad since it's highly unlikely that NK even did the hack. The FBI used very old code that's been out in the public for some time now to determine that NK was behind it, and numerous experts have determined that NK did not hack Sony. My gut tells me the FBI blew this one and is now trying to keep from looking like idiots. They discounted a well-known security company's conclusions before they even saw the data behind it. I like Obama, but I think he missed it on this one and caved to public pressure. Unfortunate. There are lots of good reasons to hammer NK. This probably isn't one of them, and if it turns out they weren't behind the Sony hack it makes us look like morons.
Eh, you're reading too much into the data available to say it is 'highly unlikely'. What is 'highly unlikely' is that North Korea did it on their own. And it *is* possible that North Korea wasn't involved, but not 'highly unlikely'. What we do know is that there's room to question claims leveled by the FBI based on information they've released. With so much firmly in the 'unknown' or 'uncertain' category, you're drawing too many conclusions.
The lunch room conversation about NK and 'The Interview' was if the U.S. really wanted to get regime change in North Korea, fly a few drone controlled C141s full of Big Macs and Coke over the DMZ and carpetbomb the people with western decadentism.
You know the aphorism, "There has never been a war between 2 countries that have a McDonald's Franshised located in them."
Phew! Well that's good to know, Russia is no problem then
After your quote ... I guess I better acquiesce despite my usual taste in movies and rent the movie on iTunes ... it does sound funny.
I think there is a big misconception about North Korea. They do have the skills to carry out an attack like this. North Korea has thousands of hackers that have been trained in China. I'm sure this hack originated out of China, but was done by North Korean nationals. The North Koreans have already hacked financial systems in South Korea. They've shut down the financial systems there numerous times. I have no doubt in my mind the Sony hack was done by North Korea.
Can you cite any credible link to back up your claim that they have "thousands of hackers that [sic] have been trained in China"?
Moreover, what is the 'misconception' in my post? I said quite clearly that NK is likely behind it, but paid someone to do it. The larger point I was making was about the incredible vulnerability of our computer systems, including financial systems electrical grids, and weapons systems.
Eh, you're reading too much into the data available to say it is 'highly unlikely'. What is 'highly unlikely' is that North Korea did it on their own. And it *is* possible that North Korea wasn't involved, but not 'highly unlikely'. What we do know is that there's room to question claims leveled by the FBI based on information they've released. With so much firmly in the 'unknown' or 'uncertain' category, you're drawing too many conclusions.
I for sure don't know but if I had to bet my money is on your theory. They may well have obscured their tracks deliberately leading to the erudite article claiming they are innocent.
I actually have a family member who works for the FBI's Cyber Taskforce. I talked to him in depth over the holiday's regarding this and other things related to cyber attacks. From my understanding, the FBI is as confident as you can be the hack came from North Korea. Unfortunately the public won't see all the details how the FBI knows this because they are national security secrets. The NSA was also involved in the investigation. I definitely could be wrong, but I strongly believe it was North Korea. I don't know if my family member was involved with the investigation or not since he wouldn't tell me, which is understandable.
Can you cite any credible link to back up your claim that they have "thousands of hackers that [sic] have been trained in China"?
Moreover, what is the 'misconception' in my post? I said quite clearly that NK is likely behind it, but paid someone to do it. The larger point I was making was about the incredible vulnerability of our computer systems, including financial systems electrical grids, and weapons systems.
I actually have a family member who works for the FBI's Cyber Taskforce. I talked to him in depth over the holiday's regarding this and other things related to cyber attacks. From my understanding, the FBI is as confident as you can be the hack came from North Korea. Unfortunately the public won't see all the details how the FBI knows this because they are national security secrets. The NSA was also involved in the investigation. I definitely could be wrong, but I strongly believe it was North Korea. I don't know if my family member was involved with the investigation or not since he wouldn't tell me, which is understandable.
I tend towards believing this to be likely. On a tangent ... but I was watching the new Pierce Brosnan movie last night, rented from iTunes (good movie), and I could not help thinking ... it is a good job Russia doesn't take the attitude that spy movies insult mother Russia and get their knickers all in a twist! Can you imagine?
Weirdly, as only in the current polarized America can ... now the POTUS has made a stand, many will believe the opposite regardless of their beliefs a week ago. I say this as a neutral watching from a sofa with a Gin and tonic.
Comments
I agree with the posters above that it is doubtful -- not impossible, but improbable -- NK hacked Sony. It is unlikely that a country with a thousand IP addresses has this kind of skill.
It is, however, possible that they paid some hackers (Lizard Squad?) to do it.
In either event, God help us if all it takes is some backward country and/or a bunch of hackers operating on the dark web to pull off something of this magnitude. We're at their mercy, i.e., screwed.
What next? Financial systems? Electrical grid? Weapons systems?
Can we please just cut off the Norks completely? Zero exceptions? Everything blocked.
Force his hand, end the war, and remove Korea as an economic challenge to the US. AND NO US MONEY SENT TO REBUILD THE COUNTRY.
We’re perpetuating crimes against humanity on the order of the Holodomor here. There’s no justification for allowing North Korea to continue to exist.
Time to watch Propaganda 2012...
Very clever way of putting a mirror up to the West. No, it isn't really from North Korea. But it does include some important facts that are rarely considered by Americans clamoring for war.
Just the fact that the USA killed millions of North Koreans should be enough to make calls for war grossly inappropriate. Want to understand why North Korea is the way North Korea is? Consider that a militarized state is very often fending off a much more powerful aggressor.
Stop criticizing other people's countries. That's their business. Start criticizing your own. The USA has plenty of faults to discuss and correct. No need to act like a Nazi with blind patriotism and bald assertions of the need for aggression against others by virtue of our ostensible superiority.
Just the fact that the USA killed millions of North Koreans…
What, in the Korean War? Gee, what are the odds that people would be killed in wartime.
Stop criticizing other people's countries. That's their business. Start criticizing your own. The USA has plenty of faults to discuss and correct.
Nice fallacies, by the way.
And a Godwin to round it out. Great going!
I agree with everything you say. If I am not mistaken Nuclear power stations' safety systems have already been attacked.
As you say, it is just a matter of time before something nasty this way comes. How long before some country thinks another did a really bad cyber attack and retaliates with conventional weapons? We have to remember many countries that are not exactly stable have nukes.
What, in the Korean War? Gee, what are the odds that people would be killed in wartime.
Nice fallacies, by the way.
And a Godwin to round it out. Great going!
I'll remind you that your post called for a total blockade and questioned the right of North Korea to even exist. This hypocritical hubris could only come from an American. But watch Propaganda 2012. You'll like it.
Folks like TS wanting NK to 'cease to exist' is surely a metaphor for regime change, not the annihilation of the innocent inhabitants. What sane human would not wish the end of that regime? Do you support it?
BTW that video is way out of date. I'm not religious but the new Pope is no replica of most former Popes.
I agree with the posters above that it is doubtful -- not impossible, but improbable -- NK hacked Sony. It is unlikely that a country with a thousand IP addresses has this kind of skill.
It is, however, possible that they paid some hackers (Lizard Squad?) to do it.
In either event, God help us if all it takes is some backward country and/or a bunch of hackers operating on the dark web to pull off something of this magnitude. We're at their mercy, i.e., screwed.
What next? Financial systems? Electrical grid? Weapons systems?
I think there is a big misconception about North Korea. They do have the skills to carry out an attack like this. North Korea has thousands of hackers that have been trained in China. I'm sure this hack originated out of China, but was done by North Korean nationals. The North Koreans have already hacked financial systems in South Korea. They've shut down the financial systems there numerous times. I have no doubt in my mind the Sony hack was done by North Korea.
I for sure don't know but if I had to bet my money is on your theory. They may well have obscured their tracks deliberately leading to the erudite article claiming they are innocent.
Sanction China. China keeps North Korea alive as a drain on our economy.
Let China have Korea. Withdraw our troops from Korea and save billions of taxpayer dollars each year.
Maybe then this useless Congress will spend some money on our crumbling infrastructure.
I think our consumers may argue against China having 'Korea.'
As would Japan/APAC allies.
Not that I disagree with you, I'm just saying, we're buying a lot of geo-political alignments in South Korea.
OTOH, South Korea is cutting their defense budget, but are 'paying' the U.S. $800MUSD for our military presence.
Methinks we should taking the stand that if Samsung et al, want the protections of the U.S. military, they should pay top $$ for the privilege (make our expeditionary forces a 'profit center,' not a 'cost center')
Folks like TS wanting NK to 'cease to exist' is surely a metaphor for regime change, not the annihilation of the innocent inhabitants
Ok, but the last time the USA tried that they ended up killing 3 million of them. Regime change usually means a blood bath.
The USA and the West do everything they can to strangle countries that attempt to avoid the social consequences of market economies, and then they point to these damaged states as failures. The Interview is political propaganda passed off as entertainment. And it is in bad taste, directed at a country who suffered massive casualties inflicted by our military. No reason to celebrate that.
Now there is an idea! But then I am biased against Samsung!
Folks like TS wanting NK to 'cease to exist' is surely a metaphor for regime change, not the annihilation of the innocent inhabitants. What sane human would not wish the end of that regime? Do you support it?
BTW that video is way out of date.
The lunch room conversation about NK and 'The Interview' was if the U.S. really wanted to get regime change in North Korea, fly a few drone controlled C141s full of Big Macs and Coke over the DMZ and carpetbomb the people with western decadentism.
You know the aphorism, "There has never been a war between 2 countries that have a McDonald's Franshised located in them."
NK is something all countries on earth should do something about. It is a prison run by a lunatic. I simply cannot see comparing it to much else on the planet to be honest. It makes Cuba look like Disneyland.
Eh, you're reading too much into the data available to say it is 'highly unlikely'. What is 'highly unlikely' is that North Korea did it on their own. And it *is* possible that North Korea wasn't involved, but not 'highly unlikely'. What we do know is that there's room to question claims leveled by the FBI based on information they've released. With so much firmly in the 'unknown' or 'uncertain' category, you're drawing too many conclusions.
Here's a recent article on Ars Technica.
Phew! Well that's good to know, Russia is no problem then
After your quote ... I guess I better acquiesce despite my usual taste in movies and rent the movie on iTunes ... it does sound funny.
I think there is a big misconception about North Korea. They do have the skills to carry out an attack like this. North Korea has thousands of hackers that have been trained in China. I'm sure this hack originated out of China, but was done by North Korean nationals. The North Koreans have already hacked financial systems in South Korea. They've shut down the financial systems there numerous times. I have no doubt in my mind the Sony hack was done by North Korea.
You have "no doubt"? What about the numerous security professionals who think otherwise? What about the links between GoP (not the party, before the right-wing illiterates pile on) and the Lizard Squad?
Can you cite any credible link to back up your claim that they have "thousands of hackers that [sic] have been trained in China"?
Moreover, what is the 'misconception' in my post? I said quite clearly that NK is likely behind it, but paid someone to do it. The larger point I was making was about the incredible vulnerability of our computer systems, including financial systems electrical grids, and weapons systems.
This bunch are giving lizards a bad name. I like lizards!
I for sure don't know but if I had to bet my money is on your theory. They may well have obscured their tracks deliberately leading to the erudite article claiming they are innocent.
I actually have a family member who works for the FBI's Cyber Taskforce. I talked to him in depth over the holiday's regarding this and other things related to cyber attacks. From my understanding, the FBI is as confident as you can be the hack came from North Korea. Unfortunately the public won't see all the details how the FBI knows this because they are national security secrets. The NSA was also involved in the investigation. I definitely could be wrong, but I strongly believe it was North Korea. I don't know if my family member was involved with the investigation or not since he wouldn't tell me, which is understandable.
I think you two are roughly on the same page.
I tend towards believing this to be likely. On a tangent ... but I was watching the new Pierce Brosnan movie last night, rented from iTunes (good movie), and I could not help thinking ... it is a good job Russia doesn't take the attitude that spy movies insult mother Russia and get their knickers all in a twist! Can you imagine?
Weirdly, as only in the current polarized America can ... now the POTUS has made a stand, many will believe the opposite regardless of their beliefs a week ago. I say this as a neutral watching from a sofa with a Gin and tonic.